For those who switched from surgery to Anesthesia

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
D

docr3

Full Member
7+ Year Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2014
Messages
169
Reaction score
287
Why did you decide to make the change? Was it the work or the lifestyle? Looking back at it, are you happy with your choice ? I’m interested in pursuing ortho or anesthesia, but I find it very interesting that many people switch from surgery to anesthesia, but usually not the other way around
Members don't see this ad.
 
I know a person who switched in the fourth year, and she is very happy.

Sorry, but I don’t know the exact reasons, but it’s patently obvious to me why a nice person wouldn’t want to become a surgeon and would rather be an anesthesiologist.:)
 
  • Like
Reactions: 5 users
Disclosure: I am early in my residency training so take this with a grain of salt

I really struggled with this as well. This may sound dumb, but I think the biggest question is: Do you want to do maximally invasive procedures to treat your patients? If yes, then you have to do surgery. All the central lines and blocks in the world aren't going to cut it for you if that's what you really want. Personally I think anesthesia should do more invasive airway, ie trachs or at least perc trachs, but that's pretty uncommon from what I understand, and there is no guarantee you will ever get to do that in practice.

If you don't really care about that, and instead want to use internal medicine, pharm, etc. to treat your patients, anesthesia could be a good fit. It's also fast paced and is more often intense than say internal medicine, so that's why I think it attracts some of the surgery types.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Members don't see this ad :)
After two years of surgery training, I switched to anesthesiology because the surgeons I worked with were absolutely the most miserable, crass, hostile, arrogant creatures on the planet. Their lifestyles sucked, 2/3 were divorced, hours were pathetic, and they treated everyone like dirt. No thank you. I was much happier after switching to anesthesia, and in doing pain procedures spinal cord stim implants, endoscopic spine surgery, intrathecal pump implants, and radiofrequency/laser procedures, I was quite satisfied in having enough surgery to fill my plate.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 8 users
algosdoc said:
After two years of surgery training, I switched to anesthesiology because the surgeons I worked with were absolutely the most miserable, crass, hostile, arrogant creatures on the planet. Their lifestyles sucked, 2/3 were divorced, hours were pathetic, and they treated everyone like dirt. No thank you. I was much happier after switching to anesthesia, and in doing pain procedures spinal cord stim implants, endoscopic spine surgery, intrathecal pump implants, and radiofrequency/laser procedures, I was quite satisfied in having enough surgery to fill my plate.
Click to expand...
Was that general surgery? And are you a practicing pain management physician now?
 
Anecdotally, I've had the opposite experience. It seems like many on the anesthesia team talk about either wishing they went the surgery route or switched from surgery to anesthesia 20 years ago and regret the switch. Personally, I'm happy where I'm at and by observing the long surgeries where the surgeon is bent over an OR table constantly working with their hands sweating in their garb I couldn't see myself being happy in that until I'm 70.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 3 users
My route was through general surgery. I practice pain half time and OR anesthesia half time now.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I think a lot depends on personal goals and lifestyle.

algosdoc said:
After two years of surgery training, I switched to anesthesiology because the surgeons I worked with were absolutely the most miserable, crass, hostile, arrogant creatures on the planet. Their lifestyles sucked, 2/3 were divorced, hours were pathetic, and they treated everyone like dirt. No thank you. I was much happier after switching to anesthesia, and in doing pain procedures spinal cord stim implants, endoscopic spine surgery, intrathecal pump implants, and radiofrequency/laser procedures, I was quite satisfied in having enough surgery to fill my plate.
Click to expand...

There's validity in this quote but I also think it depends on what surgical specialty vs general surgery you choose. I did a surgical internship as an experiment to see if I really wanted to be a surgeon. As interns we actually got a significant amount of OR time so it wasn't just rounding, writing notes, and doing scut. TBH in the end it's clinic that killed me and there's no what in hell I'd become a trauma surgeon. Most people who choose anethesiology obviously like "doing stuff" vs rounds/notes but we also don't want to be stuck in a clinic all day and those that don't mind that usually do pain and mix that into their practice (again, as above).

To go into surgery requires DEDICATION to surgery. This may sound bad, but you don't need that type of dedication to do anesthesia. The surgeons who aren't dedicated to surgery, are terrible surgeons.

I personally wanted flexibility with my life. If it wasn't anesthesiology the next move was probably radiology. I think it's much more difficult to have the flexibility we have and be a surgeon.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 9 users
algosdoc said:
My route was through general surgery. I practice pain half time and OR anesthesia half time now.
Click to expand...
Wow that sounds amazing, maybe a way I could satisfy both interests and be happy. Do you like one practice more than the other ?
 
It seems like most people switch because surgery residency is worse than anesthesia residency in general. But afterwards as attendings who knows. I never hear of attending surgeons switching to anesthesia... i think attending surgeons lifestyle can drastically improve compared to residents lifestyle. Those who work a lot often choose to work a lot.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
anbuitachi said:
It seems like most people switch because surgery residency is worse than anesthesia residency in general. But afterwards as attendings who knows. I never hear of attending surgeons switching to anesthesia... i think attending surgeons lifestyle can drastically improve compared to residents lifestyle. Those who work a lot often choose to work a lot.
Click to expand...
Yea I mean who’s gonna go back to do another 3 year residency after doing a 5 year residency. If people switch it would most likely be during residency I’m sure. You can make your lifestyle as you’d like as an ortho attending doing PP but you’ll also get paid less. If I can’t even workout during residency it’s not worth it to me. Not gonna sacrifice my health and well being
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
A scary thing is that many gen surg residencies are even longer than 5 years, with 1-2 years of required research built in. That and the newest generations of "general" surgeons are often expected to do a fellowship - even if it's a one year (MIS, breast, etc).

Some of the newer integrated programs like thoracic or vascular could be cool though. Or ENT/ortho of course.

But yeah overall any of the surgery routes seem rough unless you're really, really in it for the long haul.

In anesthesiology we have at least an ok deal as far as all medical specialities go. Until the midlevels subsume us in 10 years. And it's irritating to know that previous generations had no/minimal med school debt, got paid way more for less work, had less administrator smack down, had midlevels actually follow orders, and had cheaper housing prices. Alas.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
Members don't see this ad :)
kidthor said:
A scary thing is that many gen surg residencies are even longer than 5 years, with 1-2 years of required research built in. That and the newest generations of "general" surgeons are often expected to do a fellowship - even if it's a one year one (MIS, breast, etc).

Some of the newer integrated programs like thoracic or vascular could be cool though. Or ENT/ortho of course.

But yeah overall any of the surgery routes seem rough unless you're really, really in it for the long haul.

In anesthesiology we have at least an ok deal as far as all medical specialities go. Until the midlevels subsume us in 10 years. And it's irritating to know that previous generations had no/minimal med school debt, got paid way more for less work, had less administrator smack down, had midlevels actually follow orders, and had cheaper housing prices. Alas.
Click to expand...

Yea man, if I was gonna do surgery I think it would be ortho or optho honestly I would never apply gen surgery, your absolutely right about the next generation of gen surgeons and what they’re training requires. If I do anesthesia, I’ll do either a pain fellowship or a combined critical care/cards fellowship to ensure job security. That much I would figure out once I’m in the world of anesthesia.
 
Do any of you that switched feel like if you worked the same hours in both fields as an attending that you would choose surgery instead? I understand there are other factors at play (clinic...), but sometimes I worry about choosing something "easier" that bites me in the ass in the end. I know some FM docs working 60 something hours a week and it makes me wonder if they ever wish they chose something harder but more enjoyable if they knew they would be working that hard anyways. Do people in anesthesia ever feel that way considering a lot of anesthesia docs work hard as an attending?

I just want to be clear that I'm not saying anesthesia is a second choice for everyone or something like that and everyone would rather be surgeons but couldn't cut it. I do feel like people in anesthesia/radiology/EM seem to share some traits in attitudes toward work/life/decision making/hating clinic.
 
Well, I am an anesthesia resident in my country and I almost went the surgery route very recently. I think I actually could maybe enjoy it more than anesthesia because a surgeons hard work to master the techniques/literature seems to have a little more impact on patient management. I just enjoy perfecting what I do, and things often get too blurry in anesthesia if you go deep into the existing knowledge (but maybe this is true in surgery as well). Also, the culture seems to be changing for the better from my experiences in the US. That said, I am a FMG and if I went the surgery route, I would realistically only be able to go to the most malignant programs out there just for that reason, so anesthesia is an easy choice for me.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
docr3 said:
Yea I mean who’s gonna go back to do another 3 year residency after doing a 5 year residency. If people switch it would most likely be during residency I’m sure. You can make your lifestyle as you’d like as an ortho attending doing PP but you’ll also get paid less. If I can’t even workout during residency it’s not worth it to me. Not gonna sacrifice my health and well being
Click to expand...

This isn't terribly related to the conversation, but just something I thought of while reading this comment. My electrophysiologist did a general surgery residency and then decided he wanted to cards instead. So he then did a research year, an IM residency, cards, and EP. So by my math he did 14 years of postgraduate training. At pretty high powered places like UCSF, MGH and Deaconess. I remember asking him about all of his training while he was doing my generator change and he basically just said he didn't wanna be stuck doing something he didn't like for the rest of his life. I'm not sure how he ended up in the Midwest with that kind of pedigree, but I'm guessing he wasn't making peanuts, so that probably had something to do with it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I switched to anesthesiology after two years of general surgery. That was about 10 years ago. It was one of the top three decisions which I made in life. Now that my wife and I have children, I am so thankful that I made that decision years ago. I do not want to give the impression that I have an easy lifestyle. There are still things with my wife and kids that I miss, but my lifestyle is much better than it would have been in surgery. I have realized no matter what, a job is a job. I am lucky in that I love what I do (I did an ICU fellowship and practice 100% ICU), but most days that my alarm goes off...I would rather snooze and hang out with my wife and kids. As a surgical resident, I realized that even on days when I was operating, when my alarm went off...I wanted to snooze and not go to work. I cannot speak for everyone, but anesthesiology and for me, especially ICU, have enough variety, intellectual challenges, intensity, and procedures that I am never bored. Do I miss big operative procedures? Absolutely! But there are a thousand other things which I miss in life...playing sports in high school and college, 12 o'clock classes in college, opening presents as a child on Christmas, etc. Does that mean that I want to go back and be/do any of those things...no. Am I less happy because I no longer play competitive sports...no. That was my past. In my mind, those two years of surgical residency are a memory like any other memory in life. There were some good times and bad times in surgery.
I have a neighbor who is a surgeon. He works all of the time and gets paid terrible money for the hours he puts in. He never sees his children. He is miserable. His wife is miserable. When I go to their house, his little kids think that I am dad. I try to put myself in his shoes sometimes. I cannot imagine that life anymore. There is no procedure which would satisfy me enough to wake up when my kids are teenagers and realize that I missed their childhood.
As to the person who mentioned anesthesiologists who wish they had done a surgery residency, I too met a few of those. Of those people, though, not one had actually done a surgical residency. I have met quite a few people who switched from surgery to anesthesiology and not one has ever regretted the decision. I have met many many unhappy surgeons, though who never see their kids and lament the pay for hours worked.
If you are even thinking of making the switch...make the switch. You will not regret it.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 16 users
adempsey22 said:
I switched to anesthesiology after two years of general surgery. That was about 10 years ago. It was one of the top three decisions which I made in life. Now that my wife and I have children, I am so thankful that I made that decision years ago. I do not want to give the impression that I have an easy lifestyle. There are still things with my wife and kids that I miss, but my lifestyle is much better than it would have been in surgery. I have realized no matter what, a job is a job. I am lucky in that I love what I do (I did an ICU fellowship and practice 100% ICU), but most days that my alarm goes off...I would rather snooze and hang out with my wife and kids. As a surgical resident, I realized that even on days when I was operating, when my alarm went off...I wanted to snooze and not go to work. I cannot speak for everyone, but anesthesiology and for me, especially ICU, have enough variety, intellectual challenges, intensity, and procedures that I am never bored. Do I miss big operative procedures? Absolutely! But there are a thousand other things which I miss in life...playing sports in high school and college, 12 o'clock classes in college, opening presents as a child on Christmas, etc. Does that mean that I want to go back and be/do any of those things...no. Am I less happy because I no longer play competitive sports...no. That was my past. In my mind, those two years of surgical residency are a memory like any other memory in life. There were some good times and bad times in surgery.
I have a neighbor who is a surgeon. He works all of the time and gets paid terrible money for the hours he puts in. He never sees his children. He is miserable. His wife is miserable. When I go to their house, his little kids think that I am dad. I try to put myself in his shoes sometimes. I cannot imagine that life anymore. There is no procedure which would satisfy me enough to wake up when my kids are teenagers and realize that I missed their childhood.
As to the person who mentioned anesthesiologists who wish they had done a surgery residency, I too met a few of those. Of those people, though, not one had actually done a surgical residency. I have met quite a few people who switched from anesthesiology to surgery, and not one has ever regretted the decision. I have met many many unhappy surgeons, though who never see their kids and lament the pay for hours worked.
If you are even thinking of making the switch...make the switch. You will not regret it.
Click to expand...
Did you mean people who switched from surgery to anesthesiology?
 
kidthor said:
A scary thing is that many gen surg residencies are even longer than 5 years, with 1-2 years of required research built in. That and the newest generations of "general" surgeons are often expected to do a fellowship - even if it's a one year (MIS, breast, etc).
Click to expand...

My fiancee is applying for peds surgery fellowship right now. If she actually matches (50% match rate), she will have done 5 years of gen surg, 2 of research, and 2 of fellowship. Totally insane.
 
  • Like
  • Wow
Reactions: 4 users
adempsey22 said:
He works all of the time and gets paid terrible money for the hours he puts in
Click to expand...

Well i met a (good) general surgeon in France who strait up told me he was making 1.2mil/year.
So if a US surgeon isn't banking 7 figures i would seriously question his ability.
 
dhb said:
Well i met a (good) general surgeon in France who strait up told me he was making 1.2mil/year.
So if a US surgeon isn't banking 7 figures i would seriously question his ability.
Click to expand...

I think you really, really overestimate how much our surgical colleagues make. I am sure some make 7 figures, but it’s the minority.

Or some are like my neighbor who makes something like $1.3 doing Neuro spine, but is on his 3rd wife, has wicked alimony payments and tells everyone who will listen to avoid surgery at all costs unless you absolutely must do it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
dhb said:
Well i met a (good) general surgeon in France who strait up told me he was making 1.2mil/year.
So if a US surgeon isn't banking 7 figures i would seriously question his ability.
Click to expand...
Why do you think Franch doctors make less money than the US counterparts? I work in a country with a public health system, and people abuse it left and right to make their salaries higher. Sometimes it’s a simple matter of earning money and not working, other times they are able to profit a lot from them. There is a hospital nearby where there are like 10 anesthesia attendings being paid, yet only 3 go to work everyday. My hospital is private and that seems to happen to a much lesser extent.
 
adempsey22 said:
I switched to anesthesiology after two years of general surgery. That was about 10 years ago. It was one of the top three decisions which I made in life. Now that my wife and I have children, I am so thankful that I made that decision years ago. I do not want to give the impression that I have an easy lifestyle. There are still things with my wife and kids that I miss, but my lifestyle is much better than it would have been in surgery. I have realized no matter what, a job is a job. I am lucky in that I love what I do (I did an ICU fellowship and practice 100% ICU), but most days that my alarm goes off...I would rather snooze and hang out with my wife and kids. As a surgical resident, I realized that even on days when I was operating, when my alarm went off...I wanted to snooze and not go to work. I cannot speak for everyone, but anesthesiology and for me, especially ICU, have enough variety, intellectual challenges, intensity, and procedures that I am never bored. Do I miss big operative procedures? Absolutely! But there are a thousand other things which I miss in life...playing sports in high school and college, 12 o'clock classes in college, opening presents as a child on Christmas, etc. Does that mean that I want to go back and be/do any of those things...no. Am I less happy because I no longer play competitive sports...no. That was my past. In my mind, those two years of surgical residency are a memory like any other memory in life. There were some good times and bad times in surgery.
I have a neighbor who is a surgeon. He works all of the time and gets paid terrible money for the hours he puts in. He never sees his children. He is miserable. His wife is miserable. When I go to their house, his little kids think that I am dad. I try to put myself in his shoes sometimes. I cannot imagine that life anymore. There is no procedure which would satisfy me enough to wake up when my kids are teenagers and realize that I missed their childhood.
As to the person who mentioned anesthesiologists who wish they had done a surgery residency, I too met a few of those. Of those people, though, not one had actually done a surgical residency. I have met quite a few people who switched from surgery to anesthesiology and not one has ever regretted the decision. I have met many many unhappy surgeons, though who never see their kids and lament the pay for hours worked.
If you are even thinking of making the switch...make the switch. You will not regret it.
Click to expand...
I just want to point out that you did not switch to anesthesia. You switched to critical care, the same way somebody else on this thread switched to pain. Big difference. ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
FFP said:
I just want to point out that you did not switch to anesthesia. You switched to critical care, the same way somebody else on this thread switched to pain. Big difference. ;)
Click to expand...

I gotta be honest, I never really understood those whom switched from surgery to anesthesia and then pursued pain.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Nivens said:
I gotta be honest, I never really understood those whom switched from surgery to anesthesia and then pursued pain.
Click to expand...

There's a fine line in the gray area of not wanting a "surgeon's lifestyle", being an anesthesiologists, but not dealing with the anesthesiology crap. The line is very thing and the area is very small but I think that's where those who do pain from anesthesia fall into.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Aether2000 said:
After two years of surgery training, I switched to anesthesiology because the surgeons I worked with were absolutely the most miserable, crass, hostile, arrogant creatures on the planet. Their lifestyles sucked, 2/3 were divorced, hours were pathetic, and they treated everyone like dirt. No thank you. I was much happier after switching to anesthesia, and in doing pain procedures spinal cord stim implants, endoscopic spine surgery, intrathecal pump implants, and radiofrequency/laser procedures, I was quite satisfied in having enough surgery to fill my plate.
Click to expand...
How did you get letters to be able to switch?
 
That was eons ago.....1985
The world is probably a different place now, but I was up all night last night doing cases with a surgeon who is miserable in life and was in the OR solid from 7am yesterday until noon today. No thank you.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Aether2000 said:
That was eons ago.....1985
The world is probably a different place now, but I was up all night last night doing cases with a surgeon who is miserable in life and was in the OR solid from 7am yesterday until noon today. No thank you.
Click to expand...

How many of those middle of the night cases actually had to go in the middle of the night
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
I think many on here underestimate production pressures that exist on surgeons. Maybe there are the private guys that just do what fits their schedule. But there's quite a few that have to hustle to meet RVUs and keep referrals coming.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
most leave surgery cause theyre soft as ****
 
  • Haha
Reactions: 1 user
anbuitachi said:
It seems like most people switch because surgery residency is worse than anesthesia residency in general. But afterwards as attendings who knows. I never hear of attending surgeons switching to anesthesia... i think attending surgeons lifestyle can drastically improve compared to residents lifestyle. Those who work a lot often choose to work a lot.
Click to expand...

I know a boarded and practicing surgeon who went back to residency in anesthesiology.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
coffeebythelake said:
I know a boarded and practicing surgeon who went back to residency in anesthesiology.
Click to expand...
Out of curiosity, would you be able to explain a little more about this? How long was this surgeon practicing before switching? And what was the primary reason for doing so?
 
kidthor said:
A scary thing is that many gen surg residencies are even longer than 5 years, with 1-2 years of required research built in. That and the newest generations of "general" surgeons are often expected to do a fellowship - even if it's a one year (MIS, breast, etc).
Click to expand...
It's really eye-opening that US doctors think a 5+ year residency is long. In Australia the absolute savants with research already done can get into an accredited surgical training program PGY4 at the earliest, other exceptional candidates at PGY5. Most don't get a sniff until PGY6+, and then they have at absolute minimum 5 years of they power through training... plus fellowships etc to go after that point. To get a consultant job in a public/University Hospital you often have to do a PhD somewhere in there as well.

Anaesthesia is easy mode. Great candidates get in at PGY3, good at PGY4, then it's 5 years and fellowship
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
woopedazz said:
It's really eye-opening that US doctors think a 5+ year residency is long. In Australia the absolute savants with research already done can get into an accredited surgical training program PGY4 at the earliest, other exceptional candidates at PGY5. Most don't get a sniff until PGY6+, and then they have at absolute minimum 5 years of they power through training... plus fellowships etc to go after that point. To get a consultant job in a public/University Hospital you often have to do a PhD somewhere in there as well.

Anaesthesia is easy mode. Great candidates get in at PGY3, good at PGY4, then it's 5 years and fellowship
Click to expand...

How many hours a week do they work
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
GassYous said:
How many hours a week do they work
Click to expand...
Anaesthesia is much less than US. 40-45 per week. So our overall training hours are probably pretty similar?

Surgery is surgery. I think it would be 60-80 per week depending on how many overnight callbacks they get
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
woopedazz said:
It's really eye-opening that US doctors think a 5+ year residency is long. In Australia the absolute savants with research already done can get into an accredited surgical training program PGY4 at the earliest, other exceptional candidates at PGY5. Most don't get a sniff until PGY6+, and then they have at absolute minimum 5 years of they power through training... plus fellowships etc to go after that point. To get a consultant job in a public/University Hospital you often have to do a PhD somewhere in there as well.

Anaesthesia is easy mode. Great candidates get in at PGY3, good at PGY4, then it's 5 years and fellowship
Click to expand...
Yeah but in Australia you're working more reasonable hours during your training or residency and also you get paid fairly well as a registrar ($100k+ and you get paid extra for overtime and weekends and holidays, don't you?) unlike here in the US where we get like $50k per year during residency. And you have minimal student loans to pay back whereas most of us have literally hundreds of thousands of dollars to pay back in student loans. That's why we want to be done with residency sooner than later and 5+ years is a lot for us.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
Had an attending in residency who was a cardiothoracic surgeon in his former life and did anesthesia residency in his probably early 50s, seriously smartest guy you could work with. He was our associate program director and surprisingly down to earth for a former cardiac surgeon too lol
 
2Fast2Des said:
Had an attending in residency who was a cardiothoracic surgeon in his former life and did anesthesia residency in his probably early 50s, seriously smartest guy you could work with. He was our associate program director and surprisingly down to earth for a former cardiac surgeon too lol
Click to expand...
Was that Gene Hessel?
 
Last edited:
2Fast2Des said:
Had an attending in residency who was a cardiothoracic surgeon in his former life and did anesthesia residency in his probably early 50s, seriously smartest guy you could work with. He was our associate program director and surprisingly down to earth for a former cardiac surgeon too lol
Click to expand...
Wow. Did he also do it for lifestyle purposes?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Next unread thread

Similar threads

whatsthepoint
  • Locked
IM categorical or EM for applying to Anesthesia
Replies
23
Views
1K
eyeeye_captain
eyeeye_captain
D
Transferring to Anesthesia? Looking for Advice
Replies
21
Views
2K
Test Boy
T
luster
  • Locked
Peds Cardiac Anesthesia Apprenticeship?
Replies
17
Views
1K
Arch Guillotti
Arch Guillotti
epidural man
Who did the anesthesia on these guys?
Replies
13
Views
2K
ProwlerturnGas
ProwlerturnGas
C
  • Question
Can I match at top 30 program for anesthesia?
Replies
9
Views
1K
DaTruMD
D
Top