Funding med school with a family

[dudeliness]

So I'm sure this has been discussed here before, but I'm on my phone so I can't really do a search.
Like many, I have a small family and I'm trying to figure out how to make ends meet while in school. I'm on the HPSP and because of everything that is getting paid for, my school says I am not eligible to take out any federal loans. Problem is, the monthly stipend that I'll be getting won't be enough to cover all our costs each month, no matter how much we try to trim our budget.

My question is, what other financing options exist out there? I've heard a lot about "private loans" but every bank website I've looked up only offers loans up to the Cost of Attendance estimated by the school minus any other financial aid received. By that reasoning, I can't get those loans either because of what the military is paying.
We know that somehow it's all going to work out, we just don't know where we would be able to secure extra funds. Any insights that you guys have would be most appreciated!

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[kimposibl]

If I'm not mistaken, the monthly stipend is like $2000.... Is your spouse working? Do you have other significant debt? If you're a homeowner I guess take out a mortgage on your home for the extra cash.

 

[dudeliness]

Stipend is currently set at $2122/month before taxes. My wife may or may not be able to work out there, depends on if she is able to get national certification for her current job. She currently is only certified in the state where we currently live.
We do not own a home, and rent where we are moving to isn't super cheap. The best we've been able to find (the best that's not a hole in the wall) is $1000/month including all utilities. Besides that, we'll have a car payment of $235, insurance of $55, any gas expenses, extra expenses such as clothing and toiletries, and good expenses. This will put us easily over what we'll be getting with the stipend, and that's not even including if I want to get health insurance for my wife and daughter, be able to go out on dates with my wife ever, etc.

 

[DrMidlife]

Food stamps and Medicaid for the kids' health insurance. Seriously, it's what people do to get through med school with a family. HPSP pays a good $700/mo more than the regular med school cost of attendance living expenses.

 

[dudeliness]

I was afraid of that. According to oregon's SNAP eligibility calculator we won't qualify for "food stamps" because the stipend puts our income over the monthly limit.
Medicaid or CHIP is probably doable though.
So stressful...

 

[kimposibl]

Do you have a place close to school? If you have to commute a little with cheaper rent, might be worth it. At least you'll have Medicaid. Sorry about the food stamps. Hopefully your wife will be able to find something. That will be your best bet.

 

[dudeliness]

Yeah, maybe we'll expand our housing search a little.
Does anyone here know of any private loans that allow you to borrow above the estimated COA that the school sets?

 

[TriagePreMed]

Food stamps and Medicaid for the kids' health insurance. Seriously, it's what people do to get through med school with a family. HPSP pays a good $700/mo more than the regular med school cost of attendance living expenses.

Food stamps? You can't qualify for food stamps if you're a full time student.

OP, tell your wife to get a job. If it's not in the field she's in, she's going to let her kids go hungry? As far as I know, McDonalds is still flipping burgers, so there's jobs to take.

 

[dudeliness]

Food stamps? You can't qualify for food stamps if you're a full time student.

OP, tell your wife to get a job. If it's not in the field she's in, she's going to let her kids go hungry? As far as I know, McDonalds is still flipping burgers, so there's jobs to take.

Are you married? Do you have any kids?

 

[sgemmell]

Food stamps? You can't qualify for food stamps if you're a full time student.

OP, tell your wife to get a job. If it's not in the field she's in, she's going to let her kids go hungry? As far as I know, McDonalds is still flipping burgers, so there's jobs to take.

Yes, you can qualify for food stamps as a full time student. It's based on income and number of people in the family. My boys and I are eligible for food stamps and medicaid for my kids as a 3rd year medical student. I can't wait until we no longer need these things - but I'm grateful to get them while in school.

OP, when (if) you apply for medicaid for your kids, go ahead and apply for food stamps also. Sometimes the online calculators aren't entirely accurate in determining eligibility, even if the calculator is through the state's website. Not saying you'll qualify, but you might. It sounds like your wife may need to get a job even if it's not in her field. She may have to do something different until she can find something in her field. Of course, then you have to look into daycare and weigh the cost of daycare against how much she would bring in on a paycheck.

 

[DrMidlife]

Food stamps? You can't qualify for food stamps if you're a full time student.

Incorrect. Income and assets are considered, so your car's value can make you ineligible, but your student status is not a factor. Depending on your state, student enrollment makes you more eligible.

http://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/applicant_recipients/eligibility.htm

 

[survivordo]

www.mrmoneymustache.com this guy will make you want to live more frugally you CAN cut costs more than you think!

Survivor DO

 

[matchb0x]

Didn't see this mentioned but I know for a fact that the MD school here in town (Omaha) has a listing of houses that are rented out by doctors to medical students (with and without families) for cheap. I would check with your school and see if there is such a thing for your school. I wouldnt be surprised if there was. It's worth a shot.

 

[dudeliness]

Some good ideas everyone. Thanks for the support. Even if we have to tighten our belts a lot and possibly take on work that we would otherwise eschew, I know we'll make it!

 

[TriagePreMed]

Are you married? Do you have any kids?

What does that have to do with your wife getting a job? What I'm hearing is that your wife wants to work only if it's the job she likes. If she's not willing to work, I don't see why our system should reward you with food stamps and medicaid.

 

[abolt18]

Food stamps? You can't qualify for food stamps if you're a full time student.

OP, tell your wife to get a job. If it's not in the field she's in, she's going to let her kids go hungry? As far as I know, McDonalds is still flipping burgers, so there's jobs to take.

Seriously? Why do you type things when you don't know what you're talking about?

www.mrmoneymustache.com this guy will make you want to live more frugally you CAN cut costs more than you think!

Survivor DO

I love this guy and his blog! It's given me some great ideas!

To the dude,
If your car payment is $235, I'd say you ought to consider either paying it off immediately with your signing bonus, or sell it and get a less expensive car. That's a lot of money that would help cover the cost of food. I know for my wife and I, we probably spend a total of $300 on food each month and that includes going out and baby food etc. I realize your little girl is bigger than mine and likely costs more to feed/clothe but I know every little thing helps! Personally, I just bought a bike and will sell my car next month so we'll only have 1 car. Figured 1) I can use the exercise and 2) I can use the money.

 

[Jumoke]

The thought of living on food stamps just to get through medschool terrifies me but equally as attractive . I am currently earning a 6figure salary, will be quitting soon for med-school + food-stamps and all the suffering that follows

Your future is bright dudeliness

 

[dudeliness]

Seriously? Why do you type things when you don't know what you're talking about?


I love this guy and his blog! It's given me some great ideas!

To the dude,
If your car payment is $235, I'd say you ought to consider either paying it off immediately with your signing bonus, or sell it and get a less expensive car. That's a lot of money that would help cover the cost of food. I know for my wife and I, we probably spend a total of $300 on food each month and that includes going out and baby food etc. I realize your little girl is bigger than mine and likely costs more to feed/clothe but I know every little thing helps! Personally, I just bought a bike and will sell my car next month so we'll only have 1 car. Figured 1) I can use the exercise and 2) I can use the money.

Yeah the sign on bonus will pay off the car. That extra $235 a month will really make a difference. I just wish they'd give that sign on bonus sooner! Lol
I'd be very interested to know how you guys make a $300/month food budget work. If you guys have a budget that you wouldn't mind sharing please PM me it or send it to me on Facebook. Maybe it will give us some ideas on how to cut back our expenses.

And to triage, if you don't have kids and aren't married I don't think that you have much place giving me or anyone else advice on how to raise kids or keep a marriage healthy. There is a LOT more to consider than pure finances.
Besides, why wouldn't you or society want to support me and my family for the next 4 years? We'll certainly be paying plenty back into society over the following 40 yrs.

tl;dr
Step off son
And I mean that in the nicest way possible.

 

[docelh]

Are you married? Do you have any kids?

I agree. TPM, your comments are completely inappropriate. Aside from the fact that his wife is willing to lose her job and follow him to let him pursue his dreams,

and regardless of 4,000+ posts, you have no business telling a man to instruct his wife to go work at McDonald's.


OP, outside of Seattle, the job market in the entire PNW is terrible. That you're in Lebanon, OR makes it even worse, but Portland is a terrible job market too. Upside is that Oregon is a cheap place to live, although I'm not sure relative to Utah.

 

[sgemmell]

There are a lot of ways you can make $300 go a long way for food - depending on the size of your family and dietary needs. I get considerably more in food stamps than that ($500/month) - but have no problem making it work with a teenage son and an elementary age child - and my kids and I all have different food allergies that require a lot of modifying of recipes and actually cooking dinner rather than buying pre-packaged foods. In reality, with a little innovation, making your meals is cheaper than buying pre-packaged meals.

I strongly agree with the suggestion to pay off or sell your car. That will help tremendously. I also agree with the suggestion to contact your school to see if they have a list of people that rent to their students on the cheap. My school actually owns an entire street of houses next to the school that they rent to students and residents for pretty cheap. I chose NOT to live in any of these houses because they were in a school district that I didn't want my kids to attend.

 

[NTF]

Did the HPSP not give you a signing bonus? When I started medical school they were giving 20k signing bonuses. You could at least pay off your car with that and get rid of $235/mo in bills.

I empathize with you, but despite TPM's inelegant way of putting it your wife may have to try to work some to bring in some extra money. Even a few hundred extra bucks a month can make all the difference. Unfortunately that's one of the downsides to the HPSP is that the stipend is considered income so you don't qualify for food stamps or cash assistance programs.

Also this is a cautionary tale to those behind you that it's crucial to try to eliminate all unsecured debt before starting medical school because you can't borrow for those costs.

Before I started medical school we made sure to pay off our car and CC debt. My wife stayed home with the 2 kids. We got Medicaid and foodstamps, lived in the boonies to cut down on rent. We made it work by living frugally and my wife didn't need to work. But it was tight.

If the IBR and PSLF programs survive congressional budget cutting, it really makes the HSPS a bum deal financially.

 

[sgemmell]

your wife may have to try to work some to bring in some extra money. Even a few hundred extra bucks a month can make all the difference

This really depends on the age of their daughter. If the OP's wife cannot find a descent paying job, her working may not actually help them at all. If their daughter is not in school yet, the cost of daycare can quickly eat up a paycheck of a mediocre or low-paying job.

 

[dudeliness]

This really depends on the age of their daughter. If the OP's wife cannot find a descent paying job, her working may not actually help them at all. If their daughter is not in school yet, the cost of daycare can quickly eat up a paycheck of a mediocre or low-paying job.

Yeah, this is really the issue. Our daughter is a little too young to start school just yet so any job will require some daycare arrangements, which isn't necessarily a deal-breaker for work, just doesn't make sense for work like...McDonald's?
My wife is hoping to get nationally certified in her profession in the next months so that she can hopefully get work in Oregon. If she can't do that, it will be difficult to find something that pays enough to make sense for her to work.

Yes, I am getting a sign on bonus, but it's a little closer to $12k after taxes and doesn't come in until we start school. I will be paying off the car with that, so at least we'll free up the funds from that monthly expense. I totally agree that the best thing for people to do before school (or at any stage in life) is to minimize debt and stay away from contracted payments like phone bills etc. Not having monthly financial obligations like that really free you up for tightening the budget or saving up and paying cash for things.

Anyway, thank you all for your advice and kind words. I am feeling better about our financial situation. Even if we have to scrimp and save for the next 4 years, after that we'll be making more money than we've ever made before.

 

[sgemmell]

Yeah, this is really the issue. Our daughter is a little too young to start school just yet so any job will require some daycare arrangements, which isn't necessarily a deal-breaker for work, just doesn't make sense for work like...McDonald's?
My wife is hoping to get nationally certified in her profession in the next months so that she can hopefully get work in Oregon. If she can't do that, it will be difficult to find something that pays enough to make sense for her to work.

Hopefully she will get the national certification. A lot of people that don't have kids don't realize how expensive daycare is - which is why they suggest things like McDonald's. I recently switched my son's before and after school care, but before that I was paying almost $200/week for about 2 1/2 hours of care a day 5 days a week. Though, even if her national certification doesn't go through, maybe she'll find something that will make it worth it.

 

[NTF]

This really depends on the age of their daughter. If the OP's wife cannot find a descent paying job, her working may not actually help them at all. If their daughter is not in school yet, the cost of daycare can quickly eat up a paycheck of a mediocre or low-paying job.

Unfortunately if you have a budget short-fall you have to be creative. When we had car repairs we couldn't afford my wife put an ad up to clean houses. She's college educated and she did it because that's what our family needed and she found people amenable to letting our kids just play with their kids while she cleaned. She brought the kids (3yo and infant at the time) and cleaned houses for several months to earn money. My wife has also bought and resold stuff via craigslist and ebay to make extra money for birthday presents, etc. She babysitted friends kids, did secret shopping and other things to pay for lessons and activities for our kids. I tutored M1's in biochem for money and worked in a lab. I pawned my guitar for interview travel expenses. The point being, you do what is needed. Fortunately for us these were only temporary measures as for the vast majority of months our student loans covered our expenses.

I'm not sure what the point of continuing to make excuses of why someone can't work is. If they have a budget shortfall they have to make it up somehow. The OP and his spouse are going to have to either beg, borrow or earn the difference.

 

[abolt18]

Yeah the sign on bonus will pay off the car. That extra $235 a month will really make a difference. I just wish they'd give that sign on bonus sooner! Lol
I'd be very interested to know how you guys make a $300/month food budget work. If you guys have a budget that you wouldn't mind sharing please PM me it or send it to me on Facebook. Maybe it will give us some ideas on how to cut back our expenses.

And to triage, if you don't have kids and aren't married I don't think that you have much place giving me or anyone else advice on how to raise kids or keep a marriage healthy. There is a LOT more to consider than pure finances.
Besides, why wouldn't you or society want to support me and my family for the next 4 years? We'll certainly be paying plenty back into society over the following 40 yrs.

tl;dr
Step off son
And I mean that in the nicest way possible.

Honestly, we just limit our eating out to once a week (and not expensive when we do) and after that, we plan cheap meals, buy reasonably inexpensive food, and eat a lot of the same things over and over haha. This is mostly because I work until 10pm every weekday so it's kind of pointless for her to prepare some big meal when neither of us likes to eat a lot that late. I learned to eat cheap on the mission. Spent between 25-35 euros a week is all. If you'd like I can write you on FB to give some examples of cheap meals and whatnot?

 

[sgemmell]

Unfortunately if you have a budget short-fall you have to be creative. When we had car repairs we couldn't afford my wife put an ad up to clean houses. She's college educated and she did it because that's what our family needed and she found people amenable to letting our kids just play with their kids while she cleaned. She brought the kids (3yo and infant at the time) and cleaned houses for several months to earn money. My wife has also bought and resold stuff via craigslist and ebay to make extra money for birthday presents, etc. She babysitted friends kids, did secret shopping and other things to pay for lessons and activities for our kids. I tutored M1's in biochem for money and worked in a lab. I pawned my guitar for interview travel expenses. The point being, you do what is needed. Fortunately for us these were only temporary measures as for the vast majority of months our student loans covered our expenses.

I'm not sure what the point of continuing to make excuses of why someone can't work is. If they have a budget shortfall they have to make it up somehow. The OP and his spouse are going to have to either beg, borrow or earn the difference.

Absolutely, people can be creative when necessary, I wasn't trying to say otherwise. However, how creative a person can be all depends on their individual circumstances (of which we aren't privy to). If someone cannot be lucky enough to find something they can take their kids with them or can't find something to work out of their home - then they have to find child care of some form - and it's not cheap.

 

[NTF]

http://www.budget101.com/ebooklet/ebooklet_fam4.pdf

My wife and I followed the above food budget loosely for the first 1/2 of M1. We were able to keep our food budget to <$300/mo. It wasn't a fun food budget but we made it work. Needless to say though we were very happy when we qualified for WIC and food stamps.

 

[NTF]

FYI most schools will let you increase your COA and take out staffords or grad plus for child care if your spouse works or goes to school full-time.

 

[sazerac]

This is probably gonna sound really stupid, but if daycare costs more than the net income from working at a real job (for instance, at McDonalds), why not open up a daycare facility? You could enroll your own children for free, and each and every additional child you enroll from your neighborhood would pay you more than a real job. Enroll five additional children, that's like having six or seven additional jobs! Win-win!

Like I say, I know there must be something wrong with my logic, but can somebody please explain what I'm doing wrong here?

 

[LaughingMan]

So I'm sure this has been discussed here before, but I'm on my phone so I can't really do a search.
Like many, I have a small family and I'm trying to figure out how to make ends meet while in school. I'm on the HPSP and because of everything that is getting paid for, my school says I am not eligible to take out any federal loans. Problem is, the monthly stipend that I'll be getting won't be enough to cover all our costs each month, no matter how much we try to trim our budget.

My question is, what other financing options exist out there? I've heard a lot about "private loans" but every bank website I've looked up only offers loans up to the Cost of Attendance estimated by the school minus any other financial aid received. By that reasoning, I can't get those loans either because of what the military is paying.
We know that somehow it's all going to work out, we just don't know where we would be able to secure extra funds. Any insights that you guys have would be most appreciated!

Took out the HPSP for TCOM?

 

[sgemmell]

This is probably gonna sound really stupid, but if daycare costs more than the net income from working at a real job (for instance, at McDonalds), why not open up a daycare facility? You could enroll your own children for free, and each and every additional child you enroll from your neighborhood would pay you more than a real job. Enroll five additional children, that's like having six or seven additional jobs! Win-win!

Like I say, I know there must be something wrong with my logic, but can somebody please explain what I'm doing wrong here?

This could potentially work - depending on rules and laws where they live. Sometimes leases prohibit people from running a business out of their home, It's something worth looking into - if his wife is the type of person that can actually do that kind of work - not everyone is cut out to run a daycare. They can be great parents, but not be able to tolerate watching other people's kids. Kids can be very difficult, and the job is very difficult from what I've seen. I wouldn't be able to do it - I love my kids dearly, and I like other kids,

 

[Goro]

The wife of one of my students did exactly that. There probably will be licensing and training requirements, but I still think this is doable. based on my own observations of my daughter's daycare provider, one person can probably handle three kids. Perhaps the wife of a fellow student can help out?


If you have fellow students with kids that need child care, given them a discount. My 2 cents! Good luck!

This is probably gonna sound really stupid, but if daycare costs more than the net income from working at a real job (for instance, at McDonalds), why not open up a daycare facility? You could enroll your own children for free, and each and every additional child you enroll from your neighborhood would pay you more than a real job. Enroll five additional children, that's like having six or seven additional jobs! Win-win!

Like I say, I know there must be something wrong with my logic, but can somebody please explain what I'm doing wrong here?

 

[shepherder88]

Are you married? Do you have any kids?

Ignore this fool "TriagePreMed". 5000+ posts of "advice" and snarky comments and isn't even a medical student.

Have you looked into USAA precommissioning loans? Last I saw, it was $25K at 2.99% and being on HPSP may qualify.

 

[dudeliness]

Took out the HPSP for TCOM?

No, western university. TCOM would be funny though for HPSP.

Ignore this fool "TriagePreMed". 5000+ posts of "advice" and snarky comments and isn't even a medical student.

Have you looked into USAA precommissioning loans? Last I saw, it was $25K at 2.99% and being on HPSP may qualify.

I hadn't heard of usaa pre commissioning loans. I'll look into that too. We're hoping that good budgeting and a job can make the difference, but a safety net would ease our minds.

Edit:
It looks like this loan is to be repaid over a five year term with a maximum of 6 months deferral. Might not be too useful during med school after all if you've just got to be paying it back each month.

 

[NCOldie]

This could potentially work - depending on rules and laws where they live. Sometimes leases prohibit people from running a business out of their home, It's something worth looking into - if his wife is the type of person that can actually do that kind of work - not everyone is cut out to run a daycare. They can be great parents, but not be able to tolerate watching other people's kids. Kids can be very difficult, and the job is very difficult from what I've seen. I wouldn't be able to do it - I love my kids dearly, and I like other kids,

Could be possible. Here's another idea:
I run a group on Meetup.com. We meet and create a daycare schedule that fits the needs of the group. We watch the children for free in exchange for the free daycare from another member.
If you can create a group such as this, perhaps your wife could work part-time?
It is sometimes difficult, especially now, to find a part time job with a regular schedule, but it's a thought.

 

[sgemmell]

Could be possible. Here's another idea:
I run a group on Meetup.com. We meet and create a daycare schedule that fits the needs of the group. We watch the children for free in exchange for the free daycare from another member.
If you can create a group such as this, perhaps your wife could work part-time?
It is sometimes difficult, especially now, to find a part time job with a regular schedule, but it's a thought.

This is also a good idea. Like someone else said earlier - when times are tough, you have to be creative. People are coming up with some really good ideas.

OP, Good luck! I'm sure you and your wife will figure out what will work best for you and your family.

 

[kimposibl]

OP, buy food in bulk. Get a Costco membership ($55/year) and you can buy huge thingys of food for less than what you'd spend at a grocery store (though you'll need a giant freezer). Also, your wife can apply for unemployment in the interim as she looks for a new job/gets certified.

And start looking up recipes now because YOU WILL BE COOKING. No more eating out.

 

[45408]

Food stamps? You can't qualify for food stamps if you're a full time student.

OP, tell your wife to get a job. If it's not in the field she's in, she's going to let her kids go hungry? As far as I know, McDonalds is still flipping burgers, so there's jobs to take.

What does that have to do with your wife getting a job? What I'm hearing is that your wife wants to work only if it's the job she likes. If she's not willing to work, I don't see why our system should reward you with food stamps and medicaid.

If you've ever paid for childcare, you'd know that a job flipping burgers would barely cover the cost of daycare for one child, and it would almost certainly not cover the cost for two. So she would be working for naught, and she wouldn't have time to care for her children to boot.

You should be glad that our system rewards people who will eventually pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in taxes, as opposed to the people who are receiving govt benefits and will hardly ever contribute anything themselves.

 

[534455]

This is one of my favorite topics.

It is doable. I am not on Food Stamps though my spouse continually asks me, "when are you going to apply for Food Stamps or do I have to do it?"

I dont want to do it.
We are not on Medicaid. We got an insurance policy through the school.
We sold the house.
We put everything in storage.
And we asked family and friends for their support.
We buy at Costco
Buy nutritious food only.
We see meals as something necessary for which to live as opposed to seeing meals as opportunity for gluttony, pleasure, or over indulging. If you see meals in the way I do, it can be rather inexpensive. Costco can be very expensive b/c of all of the garbage they unload on Americans. I don't buy any of it. Eggs, skim milk, Albacore Tuna, Granola, Fat Free Greek Yogurt, Chicken Breasts, Protein Bars, Protein Shakes, Frozen Vegetables, Frozen Fruit and lettuce etc. Eating healthy can be expensive, but having a list of things to buy at Costco and buying nothing else can save you alot of money. It does for us.

Do not underestimate the kindness of your family and friends. I have a few living "angels" who take care of my education and are continually offering more. One in particular I keep turning down. I know, however, that if I should run into an emergency, my angel is there waiting to endorse me. That is very comforting.

I have found in my life that the best investment one can make is relationships.

My relationships are investing in me today because I invested in them in the past. And when I finish medical school and Residency, they know I will be investing in them once again.

How are your investments? If they are good ones, they will believe in you as well. Some might even surprise you.

Ask them.

 

[TriagePreMed]

I agree. TPM, your comments are completely inappropriate. Aside from the fact that his wife is willing to lose her job and follow him to let him pursue his dreams,

and regardless of 4,000+ posts, you have no business telling a man to instruct his wife to go work at McDonald's.


OP, outside of Seattle, the job market in the entire PNW is terrible. That you're in Lebanon, OR makes it even worse, but Portland is a terrible job market too. Upside is that Oregon is a cheap place to live, although I'm not sure relative to Utah.

When did I said he needed to instruct his wife? I was saying that if you want to eat, that's your alternative. If she doesn't want to eat, then she can stay home because she doesn't have her preppy job. I'm also not buying the idea that if she worked at a low paying job it would be equivalent to day care. In an expensive area like I live it's $400 to $600. Flipping burgers at 6 bucks an hour is roughly $1080 a month, but she would likely make more. I live off what he makes in the bay area. He's going to live in TX where what I pay for rent would get me an entire home with a huge backyard and a pool. He can afford to live modestly in an apartment. If I had an added salary of 1k every month, it would be easy to get by. It just depends how much you're willing to sacrifice, and honestly, no sympathy for someone that didn't plan out his money when he has a child just to pursue medicine.

If you've ever paid for childcare, you'd know that a job flipping burgers would barely cover the cost of daycare for one child, and it would almost certainly not cover the cost for two. So she would be working for naught, and she wouldn't have time to care for her children to boot.

You should be glad that our system rewards people who will eventually pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in taxes, as opposed to the people who are receiving govt benefits and will hardly ever contribute anything themselves.

My understanding is that there is only one child. You don't break even. And no, if you can work and are unwilling, you don't deserve benefits. If it's a legitimate situation, I'm all for benefits. I needed help at one point and took it. Now I gladly pay my taxes for others that need it.

 

[xffan624]

No, western university. TCOM would be funny though for HPSP.



I hadn't heard of usaa pre commissioning loans. I'll look into that too. We're hoping that good budgeting and a job can make the difference, but a safety net would ease our minds.

Edit:
It looks like this loan is to be repaid over a five year term with a maximum of 6 months deferral. Might not be too useful during med school after all if you've just got to be paying it back each month.

It's a great deal. I used it to buy my car when I came in as a LT. USAA offers a 25k loan at 2% interest (5 year repayment term) to newly commissioned officers within six months of commissioning. Only requirement is you have to get a USAA bank account and make it your payment account (i.e. where you stipend/paycheck goes). USAA is a great company and at lot of service members use it for their bank, insurance, investing, etc., including me.

 

[Pons Asinorum]

When did I said he needed to instruct his wife? I was saying that if you want to eat, that's your alternative. If she doesn't want to eat, then she can stay home because she doesn't have her preppy job. I'm also not buying the idea that if she worked at a low paying job it would be equivalent to day care. In an expensive area like I live it's $400 to $600. Flipping burgers at 6 bucks an hour is roughly $1080 a month, but she would likely make more. I live off what he makes in the bay area. He's going to live in TX where what I pay for rent would get me an entire home with a huge backyard and a pool. He can afford to live modestly in an apartment. If I had an added salary of 1k every month, it would be easy to get by. It just depends how much you're willing to sacrifice, and honestly, no sympathy for someone that didn't plan out his money when he has a child just to pursue medicine.


My understanding is that there is only one child. You don't break even. And no, if you can work and are unwilling, you don't deserve benefits. If it's a legitimate situation, I'm all for benefits. I needed help at one point and took it. Now I gladly pay my taxes for others that need it.

I don't understand why you haven't abandoned this thread. You can neither comprehend what the OP's situation is nor offer anything helpful to them. Is it just to bash them for your feeling that they are some kind of moocher, or tell the OP their wife is lazy? I just don't know why you need to engage on this one. I don't get it.

 

[rain4venus]

I live off what he makes in the bay area... If I had an added salary of 1k every month, it would be easy to get by. It just depends how much you're willing to sacrifice, and honestly, no sympathy for someone that didn't plan out his money when he has a child just to pursue medicine.

You do realize 3>1, yes?
Also, I believe you forgot how to subtract, since the 1k number is assuming they don't have to pay for daycare (not to mention extra costs in gas to drive back and forth between daycare, work, and home)
Also, he's moving to Oregon, not Texas, big difference in terms of Cost of Living.
Also, you're very out of touch with reality if you think it's an easy task to get a full-time minimum wage job. I assume your math was $6/hr * 40 hr/wk * 4.5 wk/mo = $1080/month? Places like McDonalds almost never hire people full time, because then they're obliged to offer them benefits like healthcare. Not to mention min wage is $7.25. So instead the *maximum* she could expect to make is probably more like $7.25 * 29 * 4.4 = $925. More likely she'll probably get closer to 20-25 hours a week, so more like $730. And she'll probably spend $100 of that in extra gas costs. So now that $600 for daycare leaves her with approximately $30/month.
If you had the option to either work your butt off at McDonalds, or spend the day with your child (also working your butt off, but still...) for a difference of $30 a month, what would you choose?

My understanding is that there is only one child. You don't break even. And no, if you can work and are unwilling, you don't deserve benefits. If it's a legitimate situation, I'm all for benefits. I needed help at one point and took it. Now I gladly pay my taxes for others that need it.

I love how Triage knows how everyone should raise their children and handle their marriages. Not to mention how he's the decider on who does and doesn't deserve benefits. As far as I can tell it boils down to "I deserved help because I needed it but you don't because you're just being lazy doing nothing but raising a child"
What if they want to have another child. Is that allowed? Can she stay home then and apply for benefits or is that still breaking your rules?

 

[dudeliness]

You do realize 3>1, yes?
Also, I believe you forgot how to subtract, since the 1k number is assuming they don't have to pay for daycare (not to mention extra costs in gas to drive back and forth between daycare, work, and home)
Also, he's moving to Oregon, not Texas, big difference in terms of Cost of Living.
Also, you're very out of touch with reality if you think it's an easy task to get a full-time minimum wage job. I assume your math was $6/hr * 40 hr/wk * 4.5 wk/mo = $1080/month? Places like McDonalds almost never hire people full time, because then they're obliged to offer them benefits like healthcare. Not to mention min wage is $7.25. So instead the *maximum* she could expect to make is probably more like $7.25 * 29 * 4.4 = $925. More likely she'll probably get closer to 20-25 hours a week, so more like $730. And she'll probably spend $100 of that in extra gas costs. So now that $600 for daycare leaves her with approximately $30/month.
If you had the option to either work your butt off at McDonalds, or spend the day with your child (also working your butt off, but still...) for a difference of $30 a month, what would you choose?



I love how Triage knows how everyone should raise their children and handle their marriages. Not to mention how he's the decider on who does and doesn't deserve benefits. As far as I can tell it boils down to "I deserved help because I needed it but you don't because you're just being lazy doing nothing but raising a child"
What if they want to have another child. Is that allowed? Can she stay home then and apply for benefits or is that still breaking your rules?

Harsh, but true.
+1

 

[Weewee]

Are you or your wife at all attractive? I hear the local gentlemen's/madam's club is hiring.

Just kidding. I'm trying to figure out how to support myself could not imagine doing it with a family. Glad I don't have kids yet

Being a parent is a full-time, exhausting, under appreciated job. I get that. What I don't get is how med schools expect you to survive. Very tough for sure.

Please don't yell at me but...
Won't said child eventually go to some sort of preschool? If times get tight there may be a possibility that your wife could want to get a part-time gig and be very able to do so. I understand a parent needing to be there for the little dude, but I wouldn't attack triage for simply suggesting the possibility.

And she does not have to work at McDs. I worked at f-ing Nordstrom part-time and made anywhere from $9.60 to $35 an hour (commission draw based system) so there are some viable options. Any little bit of income can help!

Not telling her to get a job. I am just discussing an option.

 

[TriagePreMed]

You do realize 3>1, yes?
Also, I believe you forgot how to subtract, since the 1k number is assuming they don't have to pay for daycare (not to mention extra costs in gas to drive back and forth between daycare, work, and home)
Also, he's moving to Oregon, not Texas, big difference in terms of Cost of Living.
Also, you're very out of touch with reality if you think it's an easy task to get a full-time minimum wage job. I assume your math was $6/hr * 40 hr/wk * 4.5 wk/mo = $1080/month? Places like McDonalds almost never hire people full time, because then they're obliged to offer them benefits like healthcare. Not to mention min wage is $7.25. So instead the *maximum* she could expect to make is probably more like $7.25 * 29 * 4.4 = $925. More likely she'll probably get closer to 20-25 hours a week, so more like $730. And she'll probably spend $100 of that in extra gas costs. So now that $600 for daycare leaves her with approximately $30/month.
If you had the option to either work your butt off at McDonalds, or spend the day with your child (also working your butt off, but still...) for a difference of $30 a month, what would you choose?



I love how Triage knows how everyone should raise their children and handle their marriages. Not to mention how he's the decider on who does and doesn't deserve benefits. As far as I can tell it boils down to "I deserved help because I needed it but you don't because you're just being lazy doing nothing but raising a child"
What if they want to have another child. Is that allowed? Can she stay home then and apply for benefits or is that still breaking your rules?

How do you know that I'm just one person living off my salary? Hint: I'm not. I also like how you manipulate the scenario to help yourself. Obviously if it was 30 bucks I wouldn't tell him it's worth it. Stop pretending I'm here trying to be the absolute abhorrent extremist evil.

6 bucks is to give the absolute minimum of minimums. If you want to make the real argument, lets go with the $8.95 that minimum wage is in Oregon, so actually it's more around $1600 bucks a month. Talking about McDonalds is just one option. I also don't know what McDonalds you speak of. I just asked my friend that is a manager at one if they hire full-time people. He said yes. Either way, there are many places that are bottom rung that she can apply to work. Even with the cost of using public transportation, you still end up in the profit side.

Seriously, joint income of $3,600 a month is not enough? 43k a year is already a lot more than a ton of the country makes and lives well with.

I'm not telling this guy how to raise his kids or handle his marriage. He's welcome to do whatever he wants, but he doesn't get sympathy or deserve government benefits in my book. If they want another kid, they are dumb and irresponsible. You don't do that when you don't have the means. You're basically making an argument about how good it is to be a welfare queen; it's not.

 

[rain4venus]

I'm not telling this guy how to raise his kids or handle his marriage. He's welcome to do whatever he wants, but he doesn't get sympathy or deserve government benefits in my book. If they want another kid, they are dumb and irresponsible. You don't do that when you don't have the means. You're basically making an argument about how good it is to be a welfare queen; it's not.

Ah...so it's not just how to raise his kids, but how many he can have and when he can have them, even if he can expect a six figure income in the next few years. Nice.

(As for the min wage, you're right, but I accidentally looked up what it is in TX instead of OR because you for some reason said he was moving to TX)

I can't speak for the OP, but I know for my boyfriend and me, our choices are either a) have kids before he finishes up or b) not have children. B is not actually an option for either of us. Technically we might be able to adopt in our 40s, but since having children is pretty much the very most important thing for both of us, I don't intend to wait until I can no longer have biological children only to find out that I'm unable to adopt for whatever asinine reason they come up with.

You're on the nontrad forum, I doubt you'll find an overwhelming number of people agreeing that if you want to have kids, you better make sure you've graduated from med school before you turn 30.

 

[TriagePreMed]

Ah...so it's not just how to raise his kids, but how many he can have and when he can have them, even if he can expect a six figure income in the next few years. Nice.

(As for the min wage, you're right, but I accidentally looked up what it is in TX instead of OR because you for some reason said he was moving to TX)

I can't speak for the OP, but I know for my boyfriend and me, our choices are either a) have kids before he finishes up or b) not have children. B is not actually an option for either of us. Technically we might be able to adopt in our 40s, but since having children is pretty much the very most important thing for both of us, I don't intend to wait until I can no longer have biological children only to find out that I'm unable to adopt for whatever asinine reason they come up with.

You're on the nontrad forum, I doubt you'll find an overwhelming number of people agreeing that if you want to have kids, you better make sure you've graduated from med school before you turn 30.

Again, he can do whatever he wants.

Minimum wage of texas is $7.25. Stop pretending you were looking into it. I brought up $6 to show how even the lowest numbers work.

I'm a non-trad myself, and while I agree that having kids is important, I find it irresponsible to have kids when you can't afford them and expect the rest of us to foot the bill for you. Your selfish desire to pop out a human being does not supercede being responsible or should expect me to pay for it. Also, because you want to be a doctor, it doesn't mean the rest of people should sacrifice for you. Again, this guy gets no sympathy because he's irresponsible. He could have put his finances in order instead of going about it this way. He didn't choose to.

 

[rain4venus]

Again, he can do whatever he wants.

Minimum wage of texas is $7.25. Stop pretending you were looking into it. I brought up $6 to show how even the lowest numbers work.

Exactly, which is why I said $7.25. $6 isn't the lowest, because McDonalds isn't allowed to pay $6.

I recommend you look more into full-time employment opportunities for "unskilled" positions (I use quotes because his wife has skills, but since they're not related to what she would be doing, she might as well be a high school dropout. It's the exact situation I'm in.) It's extraordinarily difficult to find a full-time position in a field where you have no skills or experience. Almost all major companies hire twice as many people to do half as much work each because they get off cheaper that way. It's one of the unintended consequences from such regulation.
What's the point of taxes if not to provide you with government services? And besides, if the programs aren't intended for people in this kind of position, then med students wouldn't qualify for assistance in the first place.