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Gap Year Advice + other Q's

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by NateD, Sep 6, 2014.

  1. NateD

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    Hi SDN,
    Firstly, I know I don't have many posts, but I am a long time reader of the forum and want to note how helpful this forum has been for me just as a reader only. I am a rising sophomore this year and the time has come that I have questions and worries that I hope some of you more knowledgeable members can shed light on.

    My Gap Year question: As a student with sub par grades my freshman year, I was wondering when those of you who decided to take a Gap Year actually made the decision? Was it as early as sophomore year or generally later? Is this something I should even be considering this early?

    My other question: I attribute my lesser grades to playing an NCAA sport my freshman year, which I decided not to continue this year because of the time commitment. That being said, I don't have many EC's or hours of anything frankly. So my plan going forward this year is to firstly get my grades up. Secondly, get involved with some of the pre-med organizations on campus this year to get my foot in the door to volunteering and possibly shadowing. So my second question is, does this sound like a good idea? Should I being doing more or something different considering I am just beginning this process? Does anybody have anymore specific advice?

    Last question (thank you if you have read this far): continuing my "plan". Next summer (following sophomore year), I plan to obtain a CNA certification so I can use this to gain experience in a healthcare setting while earning some money. It is important to my family that I am working during my summers since I don't have classes and I fond the CNA particularly attractive since it allows me to work while getting some experience at the same time. I have read threads on CNA, but I still want to ask you all, is this a good idea in my particular situation? Should I spend that time doing something else? Are there better ways to go about a free summer in preparation of a medical school application?

    Thank you if you have taken the time to read this, I appreciate any advice you can give me about any of the questions I posed and appreciate this forum as a long time reader. I am at UCSD and would love to offer any advice to the younger crowd who may be choosing undergraduate schools. If any of you can point me to the right direction to do that, I would be more than happy.

    Thanks,
    Nate
     
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  3. kraskadva

    kraskadva ...
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    Generally speaking, yes it's too early to think about a gap year. Unless there's something super thrilling you want to do in that year off (travel around the world, etc.) or there's some terrible emergency you need to take time to deal with (like a personal or family health issue), you should probably stay the course.
    If by sub-par grades you mean below 3.0 avg, then a) do absolutely everything you can to fix that. Office hours, school tutoring center, online resourses, etc. etc. If the problem isn't improving by midterms, and you've been putting in the time (4-5 hrs outside class for every hour in class) and the effort (previous sentence), then seek help and perhaps get evaluated for learning disabilities.
    If by sub-par you mean just below the 3.5 range, then having more time free should fix that issue. And don't humble brag, it annoys everyone.
    Sure, sounds fine. Start with grades. This semester focus on fixing what ever issues you had before and make sure you know how to get As in everything. After that, start adding on other things one at a time.
    Though you don't need the clubs to get shadowing or volunteering. You can set up volunteering with a quick phone call, or there's likely an office on campus that would help you coordinate something. Same with shadowing often times, though for this I would also talk to whoever the pre-med advisor is - they should know who in the area has been receptive to shadowing requests from previous students.
    Meh. If you plan to really use it, then sure. And by use it I mean work at a hospital at least part time through at least your junior year. Otherwise it's just a piece of paper that doesn't mean squat. Same for EMT certs.
    hSDN board.
     
  4. NateD

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    Thank you kraskadva for your response,
    -To clarify, by sub par I mean 2.850. No humble bragging here. I do understand that it is just freshman year, but it is a hurdle to overcome. I am confident that the extra time to devote to academics will help me improve my grades. If anyone has anything to add to the grades discussion feel free.

    -To follow up on the CNA, I would plan to use this the remaining weeks of my summer after getting certified and possibly during school, but certainly full time if possible through my junior year summer. I'm aware of previous threads warning about collecting certifications then not using them, so I plan on getting the certification because I know it would go to good use. There seems to be a lot of job opportunities near where I live for CNA's. Thoughts?

    -Finally, a follow up question to the pre-med club advice. Is there a clear benefit to joining these clubs besides meeting people since I can organize volunteering and shadowing myself and through school advising? Is there negatives to joining clubs where a cut throat pre-med mentality is plentiful?
     
  5. Dr. Retractor

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    Definitely work on making sure you can do well in your classes before adding on ECs. A gap year might be a good idea in your case because you can report you senior grades which would (hopefully) boost your sGPA and cGPA. If you do well this semester, you should look into joining a community service oriented club (not necessarily pre-med or even health related) or start your own to get non-clinical volunteering. And you don't need a club to get your foot in the door for volunteering or shadowing. You just need to contact a few (or a lot of) physicians and ask about shadowing and contact volunteering departments of free clinics/hospitals/hospices and apply to be a volunteer. Also look into research, because you could work as a research assistant/technician during the summers. The CNA cert is helpful, as is an EMT cert, if you can get a job for more than just the summer. It's not the only way of getting clinical exposure and having a non-clinical job is not necessarily a bad thing. You can also be a scribe, although I think those are longer term than just a summer. Besides that, get some hobbies (or develop the ones you already have) and do stuff you enjoy to do outside of medicine to make yourself more well-rounded. Good luck!
     
  6. kraskadva

    kraskadva ...
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    Ok. A hurdle, yes. But fixable. Focus on this 1st.

    So long as you'll use it, sounds good.

    Nope. (to the bolded) At least not that I've ever seen. Though there is something to be said for the camaraderie (if it's the friendly type of club)
    Negatives can include @ssholes and rampant misinformation.
    I think you'd be better off using the time you'd put into that sort of club into volunteering. You're into sports- go mentor some kids or coach little league. Go work in a soup kitchen. Help out at the local animal shelter. Say 4 hrs a week * a couple years = a substantial thing you can put on your app. Bonus points if you actually enjoy it. Enthusiasm shines through.
    Ain't nobody enthusiastic about pre-med club.

    But first and foremost, get your study habits and grades in order.
    Best of luck.
     
  7. NateD

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    Great insight Dr. Retractor and also again kraskadva thank you. Before going on, it is clear that the grades are the most important thing here. I understand I need to get them up and these items I'm discussing below are contingent on a great first quarter and beyond.

    -I hadn't considered the GPA benefit of a gap year so I'm glad you pointed that out. Of course, I have to really wait and see how my much my grades actually change from having more time this year until I think seriously about a gap year.

    -Also, I like the idea of joining a solely volunteer based club, unrelated to medicine. Seems like a good way to meet people who are not all pre-meds, maybe less cut throat attitude as well. To your point about sports kraskadva, this summer wasn't entirely a zero. I worked at a sports training facility this summer (age group 6-11) and got a little over 50 hours.

    *More thoughts on these items are appreciated of course.

    Quick follow up: Is there a general consensus on EC's like research vs. CNA. Obviously the CNA takes training whereas the research does not, but it seems there aren't very many paid research positions, only volunteer. Am I not searching hard enough? Additionally, it seems like a CNA job would not only be more applicable, but also more exciting as you are actually interacting with patients. Maybe a good source of first hand examples for questions that arise during application time and interview time. Any thoughts on this position?
    A reminder that a paid position while not in school is particularly important in my family. Would it be more resourceful to find non clinical related job, then fill in any free time with volunteering for clinical versus obtaining a CNA and using that for employment+clinical?


    *To answer those comments about hobbies, I do enjoy sports, I love to barbecue, I make my own craft beer, like to read, etc. What I'm saying is I'm human and I understand your point to use my interests, sports especially, to my advantage when making decisions about EC's.
     
  8. mvenus929

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    For other alternatives to doing a CNA license over the summer (not saying it's a bad idea, just providing other options), there are a lot of research opportunities available to college students during the summer. Some are quite competitive and you need good grades for them, so they may not be an option for you right now, but it's something to look into, if only to check off that box on your application.

    Many offer a stipend.
     
  9. NateD

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    Thanks for the response mvenus929,
    It seems that most research opportunities require at least a 3.0 (Surely with applicants that easily exceed this cutoff) so I agree it is something to look at down the line. Maybe this is why the CNA seems so attractive to me at this point, because it is something I can attain and get a return on.
    Thanks for the insight, any additional comments on my above post concerning the idea to find a non health related job first, then fill in the extra time I have with unpaid clinical opportunities?

    Thanks for the responses,
    Nate
     
  10. kraskadva

    kraskadva ...
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    @NateD
    I think you're worrying about getting all your ducks in a row before you've even got the first one lined up (i.e. your grades).
    Absolutely, 100%, worry about grades first.

    Then, and only then, add in other things. And to that end (since you're not going to stop wondering anyway), here's a basic rubric...
    1) research is good, but not necessary.
    2) clinical experience (paid, volunteer, or shadowing) + volunteer experience is absolutely necessary.
    3) also necessary is something that makes you different. Cookie cutter applicants (high #s, clinical, volunteer) are a dime a dozen. Doesn't mean they can't get in, but if you're an adcom picking between 200 clones, who do you pick? The one that has that extra something, right?
    So get that extra something. And it can be a 2-fer. Say you spend a summer volunteering in an orphanage in South America. Or mentor an underprivileged kid from high school into a college athletic scholarship. Whatever. Just do something more.

    Also, clinical experience doesn't have to be unpaid (mine wasn't), nor does volunteering have to be clinical.
    Take a gander at some of the school specific threads for this year- check out the secondary prompts. Can you give an easy answer to them? If not, go look for an experience (that you would enjoy) that could help you fill in that blank.
     
  11. NateD

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    @kraskadva thank you for the clear cut advice. I too think that I am getting a little ahead of myself. Just part of my personality I guess, but I understand that grades come first. Thanks for taking the time to illustrate the rubric here. It appears I am worrying too much about the classification of "clinical" in my EC plans. So I will try to open up my options more to experiences that I enjoy which don't necessarily have to be clinical. I'll also take a browse around the school specific forums.

    *Any further thoughts and opinions are welcome if others wish. Otherwise thanks for your help and all the replies, I'm sure it won't be the last time I request it.

    -Nate
     
  12. Aerus

    Aerus Elemental Alchemist
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    Do not fall under the typical premed trap and think that you have to join "premed clubs". Join organizations whose mission and purpose match your passions and drive.

    Examples: Archery club, A capella groups, student government, intramural sports, dance crews, Student Sustainability Collective, Habitat for Humanity, student newspaper, social activist groups, etc. The list is endless!
     
  13. NateD

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    @Aerus I guess to me a logical move to complete EC's that I find "correct" was to join a premed club, when in reality it is not necessary. I think it's because I have never been involved in a "premed" community or have been in that mentality on campus and didn't know exactly how all this could be looked at differently, especially since I was involved in only sports my first year. I don't think I am falling into a trap, maybe just misinformed on the diverse opportunities that I have versus the fewer I thought were the right ones. Seems like what I'm taking away from this thread are a couple things:

    -I don't need to join a premed club to get my foot in the door to shadowing and clinical volunteering.
    - Not everything I do must be clinical nor paid, although it's a plus. Additionally, research is good, but not necessary.
    -Completing a CNA is a good idea if I'm going to use it
    -Get involved this upcoming year in clubs/organizations that I have a personal interest in (not necessarily clinical), but not before getting my grades in order. Also, trying to create experiences that separate myself from other applicants.

    -Are these fair statements? I'm open to even more advice if there is any. I think I'm going into this year trying to get my grades up and then get involved with some clubs/organizations on campus that I have a personal interest in to facilitate the volunteering I want to complete (regardless of whether this is clinical or not). Then next summer complete a CNA program if other opportunities haven't arisen. The gap year decision will come later I suppose depending on GPA this year.
    -Another question, since I don't know if I should take a gap year yet, should I plan on MCAT prep next summer in preparation to take it the spring of my junior year on schedule? I know it's early, just seems like without knowing baout the gap year, it would be hard to understand when to begin studying. When do traditional applicants begin studying versus gap year applicants?

    Any advice about the above is appreciated, thanks everyone who replied I appreciate the information.
    Nate
     
  14. Aerus

    Aerus Elemental Alchemist
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    Nope. Just a waste of time unless you're particularly fond of being involved in the leadership. But even then, you can lead other orgs.

    You just need SOMETHING clinical that deals directly with patients. Anything else is fluff.

    Yes, research shows scientific curiosity. You don't have to have it if you're not planning on applying to top schools. But it's always a plus.

    :thumbup:

    They don't even have to be clubs or organizations! But yes.

    As a future traditional applicant, I am going to be taking my MCAT in two weeks. :xf:

    You typically want to take it immediately after you're done studying. Do not leave a gap, since you'll forget a lot of that information quickly. Leaving the summer open to study is good, but take the test immediately after (August/September).
     
  15. NateD

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    @Aerus Thank you for clarifying my points and for being so helpful. I guess whether I take a gap year or not, it is important to take the test as close to the completion of studying as possible. I appreciate all this information especially enlightening me to the fact that I shouldn't feel pressured to have so much clinical experience at this point just as long as I complete some in the coming years. In the meantime I will pursue volunteering and activities of my interest.
    @Aerus Good luck on your MCAT and thanks for helping me out with the test so close. I'm sure I'll be using the forums more this coming academic year and I appreciate all the help I've already received from people like you.

    If anybody has anymore advice for me I welcome it with open arms. Otherwise...

    Final Question: Am I qualified to receive that slick H.SDN Alumni badge @Aerus ?
     
  16. Aerus

    Aerus Elemental Alchemist
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    No problem and definitely stick around. You become so informed on the whole process that life is really a lot easier, not having to stress about not doing something correctly.

    And yes, if you graduated high school, you can definitely get it. I don't remember exactly how I got mine (it's been awhile), but I imagine you get it the same way you get the hSDN badge.

    PS. How is your account 4 years old? Did you make your SDN account as a freshman in high school? :laugh:
     
  17. NateD

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    Okay I'll poke around the H.SDN forum to see if I can figure that out. And yes, I think it was maybe freshman summer or sophomore year. The career field is something I've been interested in for a long time, but not until now have I actually been able to put this into action. Sports (esp. college sports) had me very occupied until now, but I have decided to end that and focus on school since I believe I can do a lot better with more time.
    Like I said in my original post, I'm a long time reader of the forum, and when I typed that, I meant it! :laugh: So I actually have a pretty good understanding of how this all works, but decided to post to get some fresh insight into my specific situation as this has become more of a focus in my life now. And I plan to continue to post with great information from members like yourself @Aerus !
    Thanks again, I truly appreciate it. :thumbup:
     
  18. kraskadva

    kraskadva ...
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    As Aerus said, this all sounds like a good general plan.
    Just take it one step at a time and be willing to adjust as you go along.

    Also second the MCAT timeline. For example, I took mine in May this year. During the spring semester I was taking the last of the pre-reqs and also studying for the MCAT with 2 other people ~12-15hrs/week. This worked out pretty well for me- I'd had some classes they hadn't and vice versa, so we could fill each other in as we went through content review and then going through practice tests we could explain answers to each other that would have been mad frustrating otherwise.

    As to the gap year thing, I still don't know why you're terribly interested in this. It happens, but it's not all that common among the pool of applicants. Also there isn't necessarily a "typical" gap year scenario, so :shrug:
    There are general categories: taking a year in the middle of UG either to deal with something sh!tty or to do something awesome and then coming back to classes, taking a glide year (i.e. apply after your senior year and have the app year 'free'), or being completely non-trad.
    I'm a non-trad (graduated, moved overseas & taught English for 5 years, came back to do pre-reqs) but there are a thousand different ways to be non-trad, none of which I think you have in mind.
    All of us though, trad or non-trad, are best served by taking the MCAT as soon after the pre-reqs as possible and as close to the app date as possible.
     
  19. Dr. Retractor

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    I disagree with calling it a "glide" year. You should definitely do things that strengthen your app in case of having to apply again, if not have something different to talk about during interviews/secondaries. This may include volunteering, getting a job (clinical or otherwise), or doing research, interspersed with unique hobbies or travel. And it's actually fairly common, that's why the average age of matriculants isn't 22, which it would be if people went straight to med school after college.
     
  20. kraskadva

    kraskadva ...
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    I don't disagree with you, but 'glide year' is the common term for that.
     
  21. NateD

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    Thanks @Dr. Retractor and @kraskadva again.
    Gap Year
    *So let me kind of clarify these two posts here to make sure I have a proper sense of what you both are saying. Usually a gap year, it sounds like, would be taken if the applicant is going out of his/her way to do something non-trad and knows in advance that they are going to do it. OR if the applicant has extenuating circumstances that are out of their control and won't allow them to apply.

    -That being said, strategically speaking, a gap year can be beneficial for someone like myself because my transcripts will include a senior year GPA and hopefully an overall increase in the cGPA and sGPA. This benefit would have to be considered after this year although, because this way we will be able to see how much of a hike I will actually have from a 2.850. For example if I skyrocket, the benefit of possible GPA increase may not outweigh waiting another year to apply. On the other hand, a slow increase, each quarter let's say, would be more of a reason to take it slow, maybe take the gap year in order to really have the highest possible GPA on my app I can.
    How does this view of the situation look to you all? Basically on the right track here? What I'm saying is that this can't really be looked at fairly yet without at least two years under my belt. Yes?

    *Also, thanks for the MCAT info. I can clearly see the benefit of the group working on it versus doing it by myself, especially with classes hanging over my head.

    -To add my own current feeling about this: With a tough freshman year, it scares me to think that I would have to study for the MCAT while going to school at the same time (although this seems normal). Maybe that feeling will change when I have much more time this year, maybe I will feel I can do both in the future. But currently, it makes me feel like the best thing to do would to be to take next summer (sophomore summer), and use that class free time to study, then take it directly after that summer after classes begin, which would be sep/oct/nov 2015. How early is that for a 2016/2017 cycle? Or should I just accept that studying may bleed into the school year and I will have to be a big boy and do both for some time?

    Any help on the gap year clarification or the MCAT discussion above is appreciated.
    Thanks
     
  22. Dr. Retractor

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    You have a good idea about the gap year. If you get, say, a 3.8+ this quarter, your GPA will skyrocket but it will go up more slowly as you have more credits. And the benefit isn't just in grades, it's having a year between undergrad and med school which might help prevent burnout and allows you to do things you won't have time for for many years.

    As for the MCAT, it depends on if you find the right people and if you are a group worker. I cannot stand studying with others so that wouldn't work for me, but it would definitely work for others. Understand your learning styles first. Most people do as you describe and take the MCAT the summer after they finish their pre-reqs, usually one year before they apply, and study with no other commitments. I highly recommend that. So studying after spring semester and studying for 3-4 months, then taking the MCAT in August-September is your best bet.
     
  23. kraskadva

    kraskadva ...
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    Basically on the right track, yes.
    Having a so-called 'glide year' would likely be beneficial for you, both from the grade standpoint, being able to study for the MCAT over the summer after your junior year without the pressure of having a late app, and for the EC & life experience benefits that @Dr. Retractor mentioned.
    But these are just points to keep in mind. I wouldn't make a decision on this until you've gotten through at least the next year and seen what you can do grade-wise.
     
    Dr. Retractor likes this.
  24. NateD

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    @Dr. Retractor @kraskadva thanks again for the replies. I think you both have answered all my most pressing questions regarding my situation and how to go about it. Just got to wait and see how well I do this coming year to begin to think about things like a gap year more seriously. Especially when considering if I need to begin studying for the MCAT next summer or wait until junior year summer. Just depends I suppose.

    [email protected] Retractor you mentioned that you highly recommend studying during summer with no other commitments. So would working as a CNA during the summer )or getting certified) plus studying for the MCAT be too much in your opinion? Guess it matters how many hours I'm working I suppose? Do many applicants study with jobs? Or do a majority study with no other commitments?

    -Finally, it's clear I will be taking the new MCAT; any words of wisdom/ recommended study materials/ study plans for the new test? Should I browse the MCAT forum more deeply?

    Thanks again,
    Nate
     
  25. kraskadva

    kraskadva ...
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    YW.

    For MCAT (and any other serious things) best to get your baseline info from the horse's mouth (https://www.aamc.org/students/applying/mcat/)
    Then go take what you like from the MCAT forum. Do not reverse the order. There are varying amounts of salt needed when taking advice on the internet, and knowing the facts will help you judge how much.
     
  26. Dr. Retractor

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    Lots of people study while taking classes/working and stuff. It's not impossible. Some people would really not do well if they didn't focus all their time and energy into studying. It's highly individual-specific. As you add ECs to your courseload you'll get a better idea of your limitations and optimal conditions.

    Yes; take more psych classes than just gen psych and take biochem and some stats or research methods. Besides that it might be helpful to go through your remaining pre-reqs paying special attention to what will be on the MCAT (that's available on the aamc website) so you won't be doing more work than you need during your MCAT content review. When you start studying there should be something like the 30+ thread where you can get an idea of what others who did well did to study.
     
  27. NateD

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    @kraskadva I will visit aamc.org and do some reading to get a better idea for all those new MCAT questions.
    @Dr. Retractor as far as content, next quarter I will have completed my second psychology class and I'm planning to take sociology as well. Biochem is easy to fit in as it's my major. So hopefully these classes will pay off in the long run, study wise.

    Thank you both for your help in answering my pressing questions about all this. The blurry path in my head has become much more clear now and also I realize I can't get everything planned too early. The upcoming year will judge a lot of these plans.

    Thanks,
    Nate
     
  28. kraskadva

    kraskadva ...
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    You're welcome. And best of luck.

    Now go hit the books ;)
     

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