Gen Surg Residency Lifestyle Questions and one away rotation question

[504196]

Soon to be MS4 plan on going into gen surg. I have a few questions about lifestyle during surg residency. I expect to work around or over 80 hours a week. Just wondering is it always 6 days a week in most programs for all 5 years? Are you ever on services where its 5 days a week? How many vacation days do you get each year? I've heard about 2 weeks per year?

Also I emailed a program to do an away at their institution (they are not on VSAS) and they said all spots are taken until November? Is November too late for an away? I figured I'd be starting interviews then and it would not be worth it.

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[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

Going to be variable within programs, but in general the schedule gets better as you move up. For us, interns almost always work 6/7 days. By the time you're a chief the schedule is generally working every other weekend. Working on a weekend as a chief is often better. You round, and then can leave but are on home call for any issues/ORs. I've had weelends where I've been in the hospital from Friday night until late Sunday on those weekends, but I've also had ones where I've spent a total of only 2 hours in house. While that means you can't travel, it still allows flexibility to do "normal" things. As for vacation, we have 3 weeks of vacation plus a 5 day holiday break.

November isn't necessarily too late. Too late for an LOR, but if the goal is to "audition" it will still work. All the caveats of aways being just as likely (or more likely) to do harm than good apply.

 

[argama]

I have a question on aways (also US MD student)....I will be doing my home Sub I for all of Sept, followed by one GS away (accepted) for 3 weeks in October and thinking of applying/doing a second GS away right after that will end Nov 7. Mainly because I have a decent Step 1 but a couple "red flags" in my M3 grades. Would this be really rough/burn out? Basically 3 surgery rotations back to back...

 

[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

Would this be really rough/burn out? Basically 3 surgery rotations back to back...

Also known as "25% through intern year".

Is it tough? Probably. But if you can't handle 3 months on surgery sub-Is, then you might reconsider whether surgery is right. Obviously there is more stress with moving, learning new systems...but it should be doable. The question is whether at the end you'll be performing better because of an immersive 3 months or worse due to being tired. The answer to that is not going to be the same for everyone.

 

[thedrjojo]

Highly variable on rotation/program/etc. Our VA our interns basically have at least 2 full weekends off a month. Other hospitals/rotations (like trauma) you are q3 so never have a full weekend off and your days off for the week may fall on a week day. If you are on a team with two interns, you can often decide to do golden weekends (ie work 12 straight days then get 2 off) OR splitting weekends. As was said, chief's control it a little more but also the dreaded home call. Makes it hard to make serious plans.

 

[TypeADissection]

Our program always gets you two full weekends off during a four-week rotation block. This is top down from chiefs to interns. Depending on vacation schedules and off-site rotations, you may end up working two weekends in a row which equates to a lot of days in a row in the hospital, but then you'll get two weekends off in a row. It is what it is. My mindset has always been that I can't learn to operate at home on my couch so whatever it takes for me to get good at this is what it takes.

 

[solitarius]

As an intern/resident, can you use all of your vacation or are you expected to forego some of it?

 

[deleted50541]

As an intern/resident, can you use all of your vacation or are you expected to forego some of it?

We got 4 weeks per year. In my program, interns were assigned their vacation schedule, receiving one month off at a time. But they could trade coverage with another intern pending chief approval.

As residents, we also had a 4 week block for vacation based on the schedule decided upon among our year group. Then we traded weeks for coverage to spread out vacation time.

We always used all our vacation. The only time someone had to forego vacation time was if they had a leave of absence in the prior year that exceeded 4 weeks, which they had to make up for later. All of your time in residency has to be accounted for when applying for boards.

 

[TypeADissection]

As an intern/resident, can you use all of your vacation or are you expected to forego some of it?

Are you kidding me?!?! Why would I want to miss all those cases?!?!

 

[evilbooyaa]

We got 4 weeks per year. In my program, interns were assigned their vacation schedule, receiving one month off at a time. But they could trade coverage with another intern pending chief approval.

As residents, we also had a 4 week block for vacation based on the schedule decided upon among our year group. Then we traded weeks for coverage to spread out vacation time.

We always used all our vacation. The only time someone had to forego vacation time was if they had a leave of absence in the prior year that exceeded 4 weeks, which they had to make up for later. All of your time in residency has to be accounted for when applying for boards.

Are you saying that you got a MONTH of vacation, all in one block, and no vacation the rest of the year?

 

[LucidSplash]

Are you saying that you got a MONTH of vacation, all in one block, and no vacation the rest of the year?

I know of a Gen Surg program does that for their intern vacation. My friend had August off her intern year. It made the scheduling easier I guess but it was such a ****ty deal.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Are you saying that you got a MONTH of vacation, all in one block, and no vacation the rest of the year?

Not common but certainly not unheard of.

 

[Apollyon]

Not common but certainly not unheard of.

When I did my IM prelim year, that's what we got. I had EM interviews, and I went to Tahiti. When I was at Duke, though, it was 4 discrete weeks, with one required at Christmas or New Year's. And, as an EM-3, my hard-ass PD said we had to use 1 of our weeks for ACEP. If we didn't go to ACEP, we would just forfeit that week.

 

[TeddyBoomBoom]

When I did my IM prelim year, that's what we got. I had EM interviews, and I went to Tahiti. When I was at Duke, though, it was 4 discrete weeks, with one required at Christmas or New Year's. And, as an EM-3, my hard-ass PD said we had to use 1 of our weeks for ACEP. If we didn't go to ACEP, we would just forfeit that week.

Yuck

 

[deleted50541]

Are you saying that you got a MONTH of vacation, all in one block, and no vacation the rest of the year?

Yes, it was an entire month off in one block as an intern. It had to do with the large number of interns we had (categorical, prelims, off-service rotators) and was apparently easier this way to schedule everyone. I think it's changed now.

It was disruptive to me being out that long, especially as a new intern. My vacation was in October, which wasn't ideal. But not as bad as having August off.