General Questions about Osteopathic Residency Opportunities

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Poisson

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Disclaimer, pre-med style questions, beware seasoned veteran:

How difficult is it to match into any ACGME residency from DO as compared to AOA residency in any specialty? Do the numbers need to be higher? In most cases is everybody on even keel?

How difficult is it for a DO to match into ACGME orthopaedic versus AOA orthopaedic?

I hear some complain about AOA residency on SDN, does it hurt any job opportunities?

Lets say a DO was an MD, and this MD tried to match into general surgery, would he not get into general surgery as an MD, but as a DO get into AOA general surgery? This means basically, does the AOA residency have very high numbers, even though it is a different exam?

I realize these questions seem a bit silly, but after talking to a residency director, and admissions board member, he mentioned things to me like well "if they are a top student at Des Moines, I'll take em." Then he mentioned things like he thinks the Caribbean schools are "really good." As a whole though, it seemed as though he thought if they were from good training facilities, and were sharp and hard working, he thought they were fit for his school. He told me things like as a DO it will be almost impossible to get ortho, but you probably would get general. I'm assuming he was meaning ACGME residencies? Maybe he is not aware that DOs have there own residencies too? Or maybe he was assuming everyone "is" on even keel and that typically the MD will score higher on the USMLE? As a whole I hear things like people going to ACGME fellowships from AOA residencies (don't know if this will continue). About the ortho thing, I dunno if its the added training in musculoskeletal, but maybe its just the schools I have looked at, but almost every residency in ortho has DOs, versus I look at tons of residencies in the other departments, and you won't see a DO as much. I guess this various from school to school, but it seems like DOs are more prevalent in ortho versus some other specialties, correct me if I'm wrong?
 

FrkyBgStok

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More prevalent in acgme ortho residencies? ACGME ortho likely isn't going to happen for a DO because ACGME ortho is super competitive and a DO won't stand a chance against his MD counterparts. This is mainly because the huge selection and the research opportunities. Still possible. I would also bet that if a DO is qualified for ortho, they will likely do their own match to get a guaranteed spot as that would be smart.

More importantly though, WOOOOO DMU!
 

NeuroLAX

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Take a look. This is from the "MD vs DO vs Caribbean. Hard Facts and Statistics" Thread

EDIT: Updated to include 2011 NRMP data (2/9/12)

EDIT: well, schucks. I spoke too soon. It's all updated now, DrHockey (4/18/11)

Since we're all too lazy to click, I went ahead and took screencaps of the relevant ones. NOTE: I'm not updating this if any info changes, so take it for what it's worth.

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Poisson

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More prevalent in acgme ortho residencies? ACGME ortho likely isn't going to happen for a DO because ACGME ortho is super competitive and a DO won't stand a chance against his MD counterparts. This is mainly because the huge selection and the research opportunities. Still possible. I would also bet that if a DO is qualified for ortho, they will likely do their own match to get a guaranteed spot as that would be smart.

More importantly though, WOOOOO DMU!

When you say "do their own match" what does that mean? Does that mean that, as I believe I have read somewhere, that people not in the "match" officially sometimes have lower numbers and get into the specialty they want? Why would doing your own match guarantee a spot versus doing "the match?" Well, something that I have seen at my school a lot, a state with not too many med schools, is people from the undergrad at that school and a DO degree elsewhere coming back to the same school for a competitive residency. Like for instance in plastics I remember matched students getting like 250, or whatever the competitive numbers were, but some getting in with about 200 (allopathic I'm assuming). Whether this is due to connections I don't know. Do connections work more in residencies than they do in medical school admissions? I feel like for medical school, you could know a board member, but there are a lot of extra hoops, and different sets of people looking at your app, where in residency it seemed more up to the director, correct me if I'm wrong.
 

FrkyBgStok

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I am referring to the AOA match, which is a month before the ACGME. If a DO matches in this they are automatically pulled from the ACGME match. So if someone is really interested in ortho as a DO, being that ACGME is ultra competitive, as a DO if you are qualified, would you rather match into one of the top DO ortho residencies or one of the bottom ACGME ortho residencies. Plus, an ortho DO would be smart enough to know that taking the sure bet with the AOA match is much smarter than taking a giant risk with the ACGME match.
 

Poisson

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I am referring to the AOA match, which is a month before the ACGME. If a DO matches in this they are automatically pulled from the ACGME match. So if someone is really interested in ortho as a DO, being that ACGME is ultra competitive, as a DO if you are qualified, would you rather match into one of the top DO ortho residencies or one of the bottom ACGME ortho residencies. Plus, an ortho DO would be smart enough to know that taking the sure bet with the AOA match is much smarter than taking a giant risk with the ACGME match.

Yes that is for sure a good bet. Do AOA orthos ever do spine fellowships (is there an AOA fellowship as well as an ACGME one?)? I heard that non-ACGME, or maybe meaning non-accredited programs are sometimes the best in the spine. Does this mean training under a top surgeon at his fellowship? Not necessarily a faculty / university thing?

From what I see, correct me if I am wrong, US IMG has a better chance at surgery and prelim surgery in ACGME match, but osteopathic has a better chance including both AOA and ACGME match, right?
 

cabinbuilder

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Yes that is for sure a good bet. Do AOA orthos ever do spine fellowships (is there an AOA fellowship as well as an ACGME one?)? I heard that non-ACGME, or maybe meaning non-accredited programs are sometimes the best in the spine. Does this mean training under a top surgeon at his fellowship? Not necessarily a faculty / university thing?

From what I see, correct me if I am wrong, US IMG has a better chance at surgery and prelim surgery in ACGME match, but osteopathic has a better chance including both AOA and ACGME match, right?

Don't you think you should worry about getting into medical school first?? Yikes..

Yes, DO ortho surgeons do spine fellowships. I have a friend who is a DO ortho and he did a fellowship. Does back surgery all the time.
 

donkeykong1

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Yes that is for sure a good bet. Do AOA orthos ever do spine fellowships (is there an AOA fellowship as well as an ACGME one?)? I heard that non-ACGME, or maybe meaning non-accredited programs are sometimes the best in the spine. Does this mean training under a top surgeon at his fellowship? Not necessarily a faculty / university thing?

From what I see, correct me if I am wrong, US IMG has a better chance at surgery and prelim surgery in ACGME match, but osteopathic has a better chance including both AOA and ACGME match, right?

sounds like you're unsure of the difference between matching prelim vs. categorical gen surg. And believe me there's a huge difference. I suggest you look into that first before jumping to any conclusions.
 

AlabamaPop

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If you've made connections with some program directors at away rotations in MD places, that you know you have a good chance of getting into the program, then I would say go for it, but as an average applicant, doing AOA ortho would be the better deal, otherwise you might be screwing yourself over.
 

surfactant

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If you've made connections with some program directors at away rotations in MD places, that you know you have a good chance of getting into the program, then I would say go for it, but as an average applicant, doing AOA ortho would be the better deal, otherwise you might be screwing yourself over.

So your saying that if you know the program directors you have a better chance of getting accepted. This is news to me :laugh:
 
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