Giving up dentistry for medicine

[whoknowswhen]

Hello everyone,

I have recently been accepted to 4 US dental schools with unconditional offer. I thought getting in was the hardest part, but it was not. The hardest part is paying for my tuition. As medical students you can probably imagine what the cost is for dental education. Basically, over 4 years I am expected to spend over 300k.

The problem is I am an international student who comes from a low income family. I can take out some loans from the bank but my family cannot pay for the difference in tuition and interest.

My parents have suggested to me that they were going to sell the house but I can't let that happen. I have siblings who are attending school and I would rather give up my dream than hurt their's.

Trust me when I say this, I have exhausted every feasible opportunity of financial help. I CANNOT afford dental tuition.

It makes me sad and want to blame the world for its system. But of course, reality is harsh and this is something I have to deal with.

With this situation, I thought of Caribbean medical school. I heard from my attending friends that Saba's tuition is less than 150k which now sounds much more affordable. This is a school that do not require the MCAT. I never wrote the MCAT because dentistry was always the thing for me. If I apply now, I'll probably get accepted with my states and start class in May.

Yes, dentistry was always in front of medicine but it was because I very much liked the hands-on experience. But my understanding of medical field is comprehensive and I believe I can also excel in medicine.

What do you guys think about this switch?
My friends have said to me that all that matters is your score on USMLE. And since the material tested is basic science, it doesn't matter what medical school you go to. It just depends on you.

My undergrad GPA is close to 3.8 and I scored 98th percetile on the DAT (Dental Admissions Test).

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[NickNaylor]

Medical school is not much cheaper. Since you're not a resident of any state, you're probably looking at $200k+ depending on where you end up.

 

[whoknowswhen]

That's why I said Caribbean medical school where tuition+living is less than 150k (Saba University).

 

[ACSurgeon]

Realize that it will be very difficult to get any residency (let alone the one of your choice) if you go to SABA. Also a good percent of students who start at SABA don't make it through so you're really gambling here.

Also, medical school followed by residency is 7+ years. If you go to dental school, your siblings might have a tough life, but in 4 years you'll be making 150-200k and that should help your sibs reach more significantly than staying in their current home...

 

[LuckyMD2b]

i empathize with your situation. but i would say DO NOT give up dental school, to do medicine.

while it may seem like the two fields are similar enough. If you truly want to be a dentist and would be happy with dentistry as a career I think there is a good chance that if you go to medical school you will be very disappointed over the next several years of your training.

There are branches of medicine that have similarities to the procedural/hands-on, and out-patient aspects of dentistry -- I think of ophthalmology, dermatology, hand surgery, ENT, urology. Medical school is no where near a practical as dental school.

upon graduation from dental school you will be able to go out into the real world and start paying back your loans. graduating from med school you will have very limited practical skill and will be required to undergo 4 to 8 more years of arduous training before you are where you want to be. furthermore during residency you will be significantly under-compensated for the amount of training you have and the work you provide.

definitely not worth it.

don't get me wrong i like what i do as a resident, but it is very challenging; and I personally would be very bitter and frustrated if i chose medicine as a back-up instead of what i wanted to do for as long as i can remember.

good luck

 

[LuckyMD2b]

.

 

[whoknowswhen]

I have proven to myself from past experiences that where ever I go, I will do well academically. Course work of medical school does not concern me one bit. In fact, the first 2 years of dental school is very similar to medical school. For example, in some schools like Case, dental and medical students share classes in the first year.

Yes, as a dentist I will make decent amount, but it's no where close to 150-200k especially right out of school. More likely, it will be around 100k.

Yes, it is harder to get a residency position as IMG, but if you are in top 20% of the class, I don't see think that will be the case. Especially if you want to be a family physician as a primary care giver I believe you will have NO problem.

Also, dental students who take out large loans take a LONG time to pay all that back. This is not to say that we have hard time, but it just takes long. Is this true for medical doctors as well? My dream may or may not work out but I will never let this happen to my siblings.

Thank you for all the feedback so far.

 

[MossPoh]

I think you have to find private loans for international schools, which can be risky. (I'm not positive on that though)

I'd apply for some US medical schools over just resigning yourself to the Caribbean. Keep in mind, the tuition may cost that much but that doesn't factor in flights to the island, the expenses on the island, the increased amount of residency programs you will most likely apply to for the same spots, etc. Also, when you are an IMG, academic success is only a part of it. Say you fall in love with ENT or some other tough specialty to get. Not only do you have to do BETTER than the US MD peers, but you also have to network right, apply to a ton of programs and then have a little bit of luck...and maybe a year or two of research.

I've encountered fantastic docs from those schools, but it is always an uphill battle for graduate medical training.

 

[Brigade4Radiant]

How much is tuition at the schools you were accepted to. I want specifics and how did you figure 300k?

 

[Mr hawkings]

I have proven to myself from past experiences that where ever I go, I will do well academically. Course work of medical school does not concern me one bit. In fact, the first 2 years of dental school is very similar to medical school. For example, in some schools like Case, dental and medical students share classes in the first year.

Yes, as a dentist I will make decent amount, but it's no where close to 150-200k especially right out of school. More likely, it will be around 100k.

Yes, it is harder to get a residency position as IMG, but if you are in top 20% of the class, I don't see think that will be the case. Especially if you want to be a family physician as a primary care giver I believe you will have NO problem.

Also, dental students who take out large loans take a LONG time to pay all that back. This is not to say that we have hard time, but it just takes long. Is this true for medical doctors as well? My dream may or may not work out but I will never let this happen to my siblings.

Thank you for all the feedback so far.

1. Thats a very big IF
2. Do a quick search for how much family practic physicians make. And remember that you have to do the residency so whatever that figure is, you wont be making it for a while.
3. Med students take a long time to pay off their loans for the same reasons.

Lastly, its not just about doing well academically. Every 6 months or so we see on this board a post about someone who is doing ok academically but thinking about quitting because he/she is miseable or someone in 4th year exploring non-clinical options because they just realized that life in the hospital is just not for them.
If you have always done well academically, theres a reason you chose Dental school. If it is what you wanted to do, the do it. Its better than coming to med school and finding out after you are $200k in debt and halfway through that you made the wrong choice and need to find a way to salvage it.

 

[whoknowswhen]

I only said caribbean b/c the semester can be started in May of 2011 and I do not need to take the MCAT. I have already used up one year applying/interviewing at dental schools so I don't want to wait another.

I said 20% because it is very doable. I will be competing with people who have below 28 in MCAT and low 3 GPA. This is not to sound errogant but I know how to study. Throughout my undergrad I received scholarships from a variety of sources and never was below top 10% of class except for calculus which I got raped in.

The reason why I don't want to go to US med school is simple: they are just as expensive as dental schools.


I have family relatives who are doctors and I am well aware of their lifestyle, work and responsibilities. I did shadow some doctors in highschool so I know what the job entails.

Seems like people don't like med schools in caribbean lol.

 

[ramseszerg]

I only said caribbean b/c the semester can be started in May of 2011 and I do not need to take the MCAT. I have already used up one year applying/interviewing at dental schools so I don't want to wait another.

I said 20% because it is very doable. I will be competing with people who have below 28 in MCAT and low 3 GPA. This is not to sound errogant but I know how to study. Throughout my undergrad I received scholarships from a variety of sources and never was below top 10% of class except for calculus which I got raped in.

The reason why I don't want to go to US med school is simple: they are just as expensive as dental schools.


I have family relatives who are doctors and I am well aware of their lifestyle, work and responsibilities. I did shadow some doctors in highschool so I know what the job entails.

Seems like people don't like med schools in caribbean lol.

Look into Canadian dental schools, some of them are much cheaper even for out of province students. Also, in order to figure 300K for dental school that's 65k a year, which are the most expensive private institutions.. why can't you go to your state school, you should have no trouble getting in?

 

[Munchy]

hmmmmm i know dentistry is expensive but don't give up!

 

[robu058]

Yes, as a dentist I will make decent amount, but it's no where close to 150-200k especially right out of school. More likely, it will be around 100k.

Fun fact: at my school, most of the students (myself including) are taking around 75K/year. Thus in 4 years, I gonna owe the bank $300K and that is w/o interest...and if it takes 30 years to pay them back, I would pay, yes you get it, at least 800K.

What do most of my friends do? Sign up for military service (i.e., navy, army, etc) where their loans will be paid in full plus monthly allowance.

With respect to your situation, i would also sign up for military service...and I believe they accept non-resident alien through a program call MAVNI..

Call them to inquire more if you are interested!!!!

 

[whoknowswhen]

Fun fact: at my school, most of the students (myself including) are taking around 75K/year. Thus in 4 years, I gonna owe the bank $300K and that is w/o interest...and if it takes 30 years to pay them back, I would pay, yes you get it, at least 800K.

What do most of my friends do? Sign up for military service (i.e., navy, army, etc) where their loans will be paid in full plus monthly allowance.

With respect to your situation, i would sign up also for military service...and I believe they accept non-resident alien...you may have to inquire more!!!

Military is an option for American citizen, not to an international student like myself.

I do not wait another year so US and Canadian MS will not work.

 

[robu058]

Military is an option for American citizen, not to an international student like myself.

I do not wait another year so US and Canadian MS will not work.

Did you bother to click on the link, the updated one?

 

[whoknowswhen]

Yes I did click on it but after reading these two sentences I thought, 'damn'.

"The MAVNI program is temporarily on hold"
"there is currently no defined re-start date."

But thank you for providing the link. I didn't know such program existed.

 

[robu058]

Yes I did click on it but after reading these two sentences I thought, 'damn'.

"The MAVNI program is temporarily on hold"
"there is currently no defined re-start date."

But thank you for providing the link. I didn't know such program existed.

Dude, call them and inquire when this program will be re-instated!!! It's a temporary hold to analyze the data! You never know!!!!

 

[robu058]

For Future Refence:

Basic Qualifications
1. The applicant must be in one of the following categories at time of enlistment
a. asylee, refugee, Temporary Protected Status (TPS), or
b. nonimmigrant categories E, F, H, I, J, K, L, M, O, P, Q, R, S, T, TC, TD, TN, U, or V
2. The applicant must have been in valid status in one of those categories for at least two years immediately prior to the enlistment date, but it does not have to be the same category as the one held on the date of enlistment; and
3. An applicant who may be eligible on the basis of a nonimmigrant category at time of enlistment (see 1b above) must not have had any single absence from the United States of more than 90 days during the two year period immediately preceding the date of enlistment.

Health Care Professionals
1.Applicants must fill medical specialties where the service has a shortfall
2. Applicants must meet all qualification criteria required for their medical specialty, and the criteria for foreign-trained DoD medical personnel recruited under other authorities
3. Applicants must demonstrate proficiency in English
4. Enlisted Individuals with Special Language and Culture Backgrounds
5. Applicants must commit to at least 3 years of active duty, or six years in the Selected Reserve
6. Applicants must possess specific language and culture capabilities in a language critical to DoD
7. Applicants must demonstrate a language proficiency
8. Applicants must meet all existing enlistment eligibility criteria
9. Applicants must enlist for at least 4 years of active duty

 

[switcheroo]

I would suggest talking to your prospective dental school before giving up on your dreams. I would suspect they would have programs in place to help excellent students whose only barrier is financial. If schools do this for undergrad students, I can't imagine why they wouldn't do it for professional students as well. Just a thought in case you haven't tried it yet.

 

[whoknowswhen]

I tried, but they basically said 'sry'.

But I have to accept the fact my stats are not AMAZING. How many dental/med students have 3.8? Quite a few.

I wish I had studied harder and got 4.0 lol...

 

[vanbamm]

follow your dreams. everything happens for a reason. and you owe it to urself and the ppl you will help in the future to be a dentist.

 

[avatarftw]

The debt is not that bad. Plug the numbers into a spreadsheet with your expected (likely) income and it is still pretty lucrative. I assume that the COA is 70,000 or so for your school but it is wildly overestimated. Or school assumed rent that is 2.5 times what I pay and food costs 3 times what I pay, for example.

Each year you delay training, you lose a year of income. THAT should be the primary focus. Also, tuition increases much more than inflation in that time...

Hello everyone,

I have recently been accepted to 4 US dental schools with unconditional offer. I thought getting in was the hardest part, but it was not. The hardest part is paying for my tuition. As medical students you can probably imagine what the cost is for dental education. Basically, over 4 years I am expected to spend over 300k.

The problem is I am an international student who comes from a low income family. I can take out some loans from the bank but my family cannot pay for the difference in tuition and interest.

My parents have suggested to me that they were going to sell the house but I can't let that happen. I have siblings who are attending school and I would rather give up my dream than hurt their's.

Trust me when I say this, I have exhausted every feasible opportunity of financial help. I CANNOT afford dental tuition.

It makes me sad and want to blame the world for its system. But of course, reality is harsh and this is something I have to deal with.

With this situation, I thought of Caribbean medical school. I heard from my attending friends that Saba's tuition is less than 150k which now sounds much more affordable. This is a school that do not require the MCAT. I never wrote the MCAT because dentistry was always the thing for me. If I apply now, I'll probably get accepted with my states and start class in May.

Yes, dentistry was always in front of medicine but it was because I very much liked the hands-on experience. But my understanding of medical field is comprehensive and I believe I can also excel in medicine.

What do you guys think about this switch?
My friends have said to me that all that matters is your score on USMLE. And since the material tested is basic science, it doesn't matter what medical school you go to. It just depends on you.

My undergrad GPA is close to 3.8 and I scored 98th percetile on the DAT (Dental Admissions Test).

 

[Mean Muggin]

everything happens for a reason.

not true.

 

[ramseszerg]

Military is an option for American citizen, not to an international student like myself.

I do not wait another year so US and Canadian MS will not work.

Really think about this.. You are going into medicine and not dentistry, which is what you really want, for the rest of your life because you do not want to wait 1 year. (And going to a carribean school to boot). I don't know about you but it sounds ridiculous to me.

 

[Melicopter]

After you get through school and are practicing as a dentist, you can buy your parents a very nice house. I'm sure they know this. Think ahead a little farther. When you're making money as a dentist, the rest of us will be starting residency, and our loans (which can no longer be deferred for residency) will be stacking up higher and higher.