Got a DUI before starting residency, don't know what to do?

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Bobsyeruncle

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Hi. I screwed up big time last week. I was on my way home from a club when I bumped into the car in front of me after they slammed their brakes. There was no damage, but the other guy wanted to get the poice involved. When the police came they smelled alcohol on my breath and I ended up getting taken to the poice station, etc.... The charge is a misdemeanor.

This was my first offense of any kind. I have had no legal problems whatsoever before this. And needless to say...this was the last time I'll ever drink and drive (or drink at all for a while).

My problem is this....about a week before this happened I filled out all my applications for licensure as I am about to begin residency. I filled out the "no" section when asked if I have ever been charged or convicted of any alcohol related driving offense. At the time this was true. Now I'm worried that they will do a background check and I'll get screwed.

What should I do? Hope they don't do a thorough background check? Should I go ahead and tell them what happened and risk being denied my position?

I'm pretty worried about all this. Any advice would help big time.
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
What should I do? Hope they don't do a thorough background check? Should I go ahead and tell them what happened and risk being denied my position?

I'm pretty worried about all this. Any advice would help big time.
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DO NOT tell them anything yet. You have only been charged, and not convicted, and the court process can be lengthy. It is likely that anything you say will delay your licensing process until it is resolved. Assuming this is your first offense, you may even be granted community service or alternative sentence in exchange for a dismissal of your charges.

At the time you applied for your license, you were being truthful on your application. If they ask you, explain yourself, but I would not offer the information to them. The odds are they will not even notice it, but be prepare to discuss it if they do.
 
You should also probably discuss with legal counsel (ie lawyer who specializes in civil health law) to cover your bases. Someone else may be able to address this better than I, but I would think that they would do a BOP (Board of Probation) check or something similar after getting your paperwork which may show a criminal charge pending, so having legal counsel for the civil health (e.g. licensing) may be helpful.

Wook
 
To the OP, I hope that "Bob's your uncle"... (Are you Aussie?)
Best of luck,
 
if you are convicted, you'll need to tell them right away. I'd suggest you tell your residency program in advance though: it's best to be up-front; if you're convicted they'll find out anyway, if you're acquitted it's all good.
 
Hmmmnnn...... So what I'm hearing is don't say anything unless it comes up, and if it comes up they be truthful. I think that will pretty much be the plan.

Do you think that they could deny me my spot if they find out?

Oh yeah...and I talked to a lawyer who pretty much said I'm busted. And you cannot expunge DUIs in my state.
 
doc05 said:
if you are convicted, you'll need to tell them right away. I'd suggest you tell your residency program in advance though: it's best to be up-front; if you're convicted they'll find out anyway, if you're acquitted it's all good.
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You would be better off in telling your program everything. Being forthright never hurts. You are not the first person that this has happened to and will not be the last. Do not try to keep it from your program.

CambieMD
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
Oh yeah...and I talked to a lawyer who pretty much said I'm busted. And you cannot expunge DUIs in my state.
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I would talk to a another lawyer--the best lawyer in town, and do anything to make this go away. I hope you didn't blow. Good luck.
 
I agree. Do NOT say anything to anyone until you speak with a lawyer. This is too important of an issue to be asking for advice on an online forum. You need professional help.
 
Unfortunately I blew O.137. I wish I had asked for a blood test. I later found out that they have to call a tech from the hospital and it usually takes 1-2 hours to get them there. Oh well, can't do much about it now.

The lawyer said that if they have a reason to pull you over and if you blow >0.08 there is virtually no way of getting you off.

And I don't know about going ahead and telling my program before it comes up? I don't know if that is a good idea. I think that there is a good chance that they won't ever find out. Why get off to a bad start (first impressions are hard to change, right?). If they ask, I will be honest of course.
 
Sorry to hear about your DUI, I am sure you learned a painful lesson and hopefully will become a better person because of it.

I posted this as a respone on the reapplicant forum after someone was looking for med schools to specifically apply to that did not ask for arrest records. I feel that it would get more reading exposure here. Think of it as a public service reminder:

Please be aware that when you apply for state licensure after medical school this question pops up again. I remember reading online about one young doc who was denied North Carolina licensure after they found out he lied on his medical school application about a one time drug misdemeanor which he denied. There have been residents thrown out of residencies in the middle of their residencies in California because their licenses were denied (California requires state licensure in order to enter second year of residency). Just a word of warning to all to behave yourselves and be more careful and not do something stupid! BE THE PERFECT CITIZEN! Unless you live your life like Mother Theresa did, you are vulnerable. Think twice about driving home after having that ONE glass of wine during a summer barbecue with family (yes, one glass of wine can give you a DUI- just ask Tracy Gold) or getting caught with some joints in the airport (ask Whitney Houston) or sleeping with that prostitute (ask Hugh Grant) or engaging in public lewdness (ask George Michael) or inside trading on that stock tip (ask Martha Stewart- convicted felon). Yes, Tracy, Whitney, Hugh, George and Martha will all have heck to pay if they were applying to be medical professionals. Think twice about illegally downloading that new hit song from the Black Eyed peas. Think twice about going fourty in a thirty mile zone and you accidently hit a girl who runs in front of your car to get a ball. Think twice about sneaking that grape in Stop N Shop! Think twice about hiring that illegal alien from Mexico to clean your house or do yardwork. Think twice about commenting on how nice the file clerk's skirt looks. Ok, maybe I am getting carried away but I am just trying to hammer away a point here- THINK THINK THINK!!! In America we love to relish in seeing other people get busted- just visit thesmokinggun website and see for yourself. Once a felon- always a felon! The system has very little sympathy and shows no mercy to such offendors. In a competitive society such as ours, we will claw each other's eyes out to get ahead of one another. Except the competition clawed their own eyes out in these situations without bloodying our own hands. And worst of all, NEVER NEVER NEVER lie on an application!!! This is the kiss of death and will guarantee censure- background checks will find you and in the future when you apply to other states you will have to declare rejections from other states and how come. This is how one little cover up on your part can snowball. State medical boards need to protect themselves from the sue crazy public and will treat all physicians as potential convicts until proven not so (guilty until proven innocent to get that medical license).


DISCLAIMER: I do not have a criminal record but am aware of the process as I am a resident soon to be applying for licensure. I do believe people make mistakes and most deserve a second chance and it is sad to see how vindictive our society has become. However, I do believe in three strikes and you are out- one must learn from his mistakes.
 
How does this post help except rub the fact that he should have been a good citizen? Whatever, you're allowed to blow off steam every now and then. It's unfortunate that you got caught.

Consult another lawyer. Consult a few lawyers. Find someone who can make it happen for you.

Do NOT tell anyone until you speak to at least a few lawyers or until the thing has gone to court and you've been officially convicted of a crime.
 
that's totally the way google ads are supposed to work. that said, you probably shouldn't pick a lawyer who advertises, just like you probably shouldn't go to a doctor that advertises.
 
unknownMD said:
How does this post help except rub the fact that he should have been a good citizen? Whatever, you're allowed to blow off steam every now and then. It's unfortunate that you got caught.
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You are allowed to blow off steam? It is sad you got busted? It is ok to drive while drunk (and way over .08)? Look, it's tough for the OP that he/she was caught because of our profession, but DRINKING AND DRIVING IS WRONG! Too many people die because of it. This is a tough love situation, not an "aww shucks, sorry you got busted, dude", situation.
 
I would get it out in the open now. Be honest with your program - people make mistakes.

What will most likely happen is that you will be referred to the state impaired physician program who will make an assessment if you are in fact a problem drinker. If you are, you go away to treatment for several months. If you are not, then everything has been documented and your license procedes forward. I'm sure there will be a period of random urinalysises in your future, too - regardless of whether they have determined if you have a drinking problem or not.

Remember, the state medical boards have a duty to protect the public. If you were to later be accused of being impaired at work, with a history of a DUI and the state board did nothing about it in the first place, they too may be held culpable (I'm not a lawyer).

Also, once you start applying for permanent licensure, hospital priviledges and malpractice insurance, you will need to document that you in fact have been evaluated for alcohol dependence if you were convicted - as I indicated before - if this was just a fluke, then don't worry about it and all will be fine. If not, then maybe it was a good thing and thank god no one is hurt.

Incidently, I know of a resident who showed up late 2 days in a row (not in my program), the senior thought he may have an alcohol problem, reported it, he went away to an inpatient treatment center for a 5-day evaluation - was found that he did not have a drinking problem but STILL had to undergo random urinalysis 4 times monthly by the state for a period of at least 1 year.

So yes, this is a big thing.

Best of luck.
 
well, I guess technically, you have not lied since you signed your contract prior to being charged and you have yet to be convicted. I see some substqance abuse counseling and pretty close monitoring from your states medical board in yoru future though.
 
Definitely hire a lawyer. Not just for an office consult, but to represent you in court as well.

If you challenge this charge with a lawyer in court, you may beat the whole thing.

Don't just plead and take the penalty.
 
Don't tell them anything, and hire a lawyer. Be sure to let this lawyer know your situation and that your goal is to have either the charges dropped or EXPUNGED from your record through classes or what-have-you.
 
WilcoWorld said:
How odd/coincidental/creepy is it that http://www.santa-barbara-dui.com/ advertisement came up when I opened this thread? Or is that just the way those google ads work?
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according to that ad you may submit to a urine test...

so for the record (and i'm not saying go get drunk here's how to hide).....but, should one go for the blood test if given the option? or urine? which one would give one 'more' time??

as a side note...and i actually heard this from a lawyer (go figure, only they would come up with something like this to get around the law). if you are like the OP and got into a fender bender, this is wht the lawyer said to do (granted it requires having a bottle of something on board your car). But he said, after you hit the car, jump out with the bottle of rum (or whatever)...go into the middle of the street or somewhere where there are witnesses. exclaim and use all the expletives in the world and state how screwed you feel, etc. GULP the remainding bottle in front of the witnesses.

bottom line: cops cant prove if you were drunk before the accident or AFTER the accident. If after the incident, you werent driving and thus it's not a DUI. Your BAC will be sky high in either case and well i guess that's where the lawyers come in.

DISCLAIMER: i'm not advocating anyone do the above, and I'm definitely NOT a lawyer. But if any of you all know the law well or is a lawyer, could someone actually do this and get away? was this lawyer who told me this right?

unfortuntely or fortunately (whichever way you look at it) laws are always made so that someone can get around it....dont believe me, read up on how John Edwards 'evaded' taxes.....

😎
 
Hi there,
Two things to think about: You are going to be asked about being "convicted" of felonies on your residency/license application. If you have only been charged but not convicted, you do not have to mention this. By the time this comes to court, you may have already signed your contract and this will not affect your residency. This may come up on a background check but it will only show charges. Believe me, there have been worse things that have shown up on a background check.

The other thing: Don't lie about anything. As someone has said above, get a lawyer and try to find a legal way of avoiding conviction. Since this is a first infraction and you are heading for residency, you may not have much fallout from this. If the officer does not show up or did something wrong, you may have the charges totally dismissed. Get a good experienced lawyer and get this taken care of.

Good luck!
njbmd 🙂
 
Dude, when you get pulled over for drinking and driving, NEVER EVER blow in a breathalyzer, or let them take take urine or blood. Also NEVER EVER perform the field sobriety tests. Calmly put your hands behind you and let them take you to jail. Let them charge you with what ever they want and take away your drivers license. You can always get a work permit license the following week. By following the above advice and with a good lawyer you'll walk or get a reckless driving charge
 
Bob,

Be upfront with your residency program director... and hope that they are normal people who are willing to admit that they have made mistakes in life. You may need to notify your state board of your arrest and this is an area that your program may be able to guide you. IF THE STATE BOARD THINKS YOU ARE TRYING TO DECEIVE THEM YOU ARE TOAST. It is a far worse sin to lie (or even mislead) than to fess up. Your moral character is what medicine cares about; lawyers care about technicalities.

Also, when you apply for a state license, you will be asked if you have ever been arrested, or convicted, or offered deferred adjudication for any offense other than traffic violations. It does not matter if you get a lawyer and beat the rap (although a not guilty verdict looks far better), you must still report it. The only circumstance that I am aware that you would not have to report is if the offense was expunged.

Obviously, I speak from experience in this matter and I am proof that you can obtain a medical license with a few blemishes. However, my situation was different in that my offenses were remote and yours is fresh. However, by the time you complete your residency there will be some distance from this. But DO NOT get cited for any violation other than a traffic ticket from this point forward.

Best of luck
 
zippy2u said:
Dude, when you get pulled over for drinking and driving, NEVER EVER blow in a breathalyzer, or let them take take urine or blood. Also NEVER EVER perform the field sobriety tests. Calmly put your hands behind you and let them take you to jail. Let them charge you with what ever they want and take away your drivers license. You can always get a work permit license the following week. By following the above advice and with a good lawyer you'll walk or get a reckless driving charge
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I guess you are assuming someone is legally intoxicated. I have blown into several breathlyzers by a$$hole cops that watched me leave the bar. The bastards assume that you are drunk and pull you over (not even sure that this is legal on their part). They will make up a reason they pulled you over. I have been given field sobriety tests, and breathlyzers but they have never gotten me cause I drink a maximum of 2 beers.
 
I still don't see what the issue is. At the time the application was filled out, his statements were true. If he ever has to fill out another similar application, then you can worry about it.
 
Most places ask abt felonies. DUI is a misdemeanor. You should only answer as needed.

Don't think that just because you tell your residency abt your misdemeanor that they will treat you as an equal. Considering that you have not started residency yet, your mistake will surely be used as "ammunition" if for some reason some attending does not like your presence, ie using it as an excuse for disciplining you despite excellent clinical performance. Everyone makes mistakes: true. But in the residency/attending world you need to learn how to cover it up.

By the way, conducting a background check is not as thorough as you think. Lying abt big things: transcripts, diplomas, previous employment is a big no no. These are easily traced. As for others, it is somewhat if not alot harder.

Of course ethics is in question, but just letting you know the other side of the coin.
 
argh said:
that's totally the way google ads are supposed to work. that said, you probably shouldn't pick a lawyer who advertises, just like you probably shouldn't go to a doctor that advertises.
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Ridiculous....no advertising means less competition means higher prices...
 
unknownMD said:
... Whatever, you're allowed to blow off steam every now and then. It's unfortunate that you got caught. ... ...
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???

You can't be serious?? The OP is NOT allowed to blow off steam by drinking and driving. The OP is NOT allowed to do something where he could harm someone else.

What were you thinking when you typed that?
 
AzMichelle said:
???

You can't be serious?? The OP is NOT allowed to blow off steam by drinking and driving. The OP is NOT allowed to do something where he could harm someone else.

What were you thinking when you typed that?
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You tell it like it is!
 
does the fact that they ask about being arrested or charged or whatever for anything other than a traffic violation mean that since a dui is a traffic violation that you wouldn't have to report it? Flame away.
 
undecided05 said:
does the fact that they ask about being arrested or charged or whatever for anything other than a traffic violation mean that since a dui is a traffic violation that you wouldn't have to report it? Flame away.
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Depending on the state some DUIs are a felony. That's a big deal.

Sometimes people just have to grow up and take responsibility for their own actions.

And last but not least, just because someone disagrees with you does not mean they are flaming. It means they disagree.
 
Hate to revive a 2 year dead thread. I just was wondering how the OP fared out.
 
BlackSails said:
I know its old, but the first thing the OP should have done is stop being a ****ing idiot.
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True enough, but the self-righteousness of the people who always have to chime in with, "OH MY GOD! DUI IS JUST LIKE MURDER!" is incredibly annoying.
 
Tired said:
True enough, but the self-righteousness of the people who always have to chime in with, "OH MY GOD! DUI IS JUST LIKE MURDER!" is incredibly annoying.
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True, but look at it this way: Do you want to be woken up by a page at 3 AM to go down to the trauma bay and save this *******?
 
I do. All the time at a Level I Trauma Center in New York. One after another with deaths and usually the one that survives are the drunk drivers.

Again, going back to the original question, how is the OP doing?
 
Yeah, it's a sad truth that oftentimes in trauma, the drunk/high-as-a-kite scumbag patient survives horrific injuries, while the teenage bystander/passenger dies a horrific death. 🙁
 
BlackSails said:
True, but look at it this way: Do you want to be woken up by a page at 3 AM to go down to the trauma bay and save this *******?
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Actually yes, because I don't make character judgements about my patients based on single incidents, and I don't judge people's "worthiness for treatment" based on the circumstances of their injury. In a trauma bay, a gangbanger shot by the cops is as good as a church-going mother of five hit in a crosswalk. They're all just meat when they're in front of me, and I go balls-to-the-wall regardless of who they are.
 
Tired said:
Actually yes, because I don't make character judgements about my patients based on single incidents, and I don't judge people's "worthiness for treatment" based on the circumstances of their injury. In a trauma bay, a gangbanger shot by the cops is as good as a church-going mother of five hit in a crosswalk. They're all just meat when they're in front of me, and I go balls-to-the-wall regardless of who they are.
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This would be the PC answer I guess but doctors are still human.
 
Actually, PC is saying that everyone is equal and needs to be saved. The rule is: if you were committing a criminal act or were high or intoxicated you immediately become trash. Literal trash. You're wasting my time and you're wasting everyone else's money. The only thing you're good for is to have residents practice on you.
 
It is sad that you are starting residency and you are not smart enough to keep track of your alcohol and just plain stupid to not call a cab to get home. it is a shame common sense is not on the usmle.
 
wadigga33 said:
It is sad that you are starting residency and you are not smart enough to keep track of your alcohol and just plain stupid to not call a cab to get home. it is a shame common sense is not on the usmle.
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How is the view from that Ivory Tower you're living in?
 
BlackSails said:
True, but look at it this way: Do you want to be woken up by a page at 3 AM to go down to the trauma bay and save this *******?
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I interpreted this a little differently. To me he is asking if you as a back-up (or upper level) would appreciate having to come in at 3AM and "save him". As in help him out because no one is able to find him, or he has screwed up a procedure secondary to substance use.
 
wadigga33 said:
It is sad that you are starting residency and you are not smart enough to keep track of your alcohol and just plain stupid to not call a cab to get home. it is a shame common sense is not on the usmle.
Click to expand...

Something tells me people don't ask you come out for a few drinks unless they need a DD.
 
no they ask..but i know when to say when..and also when to not blow a .13..thanks..
 
for current or former residents who have filled out apps and/or signed contracts, how are these questions usually worded? ever been arrested? ever been convicted? ever been convicted of a felony? i'm currently going through a horrendous divorce and my husband had me arrested for harrassing communications on the basis of emails that i sent two months ago. this is a misdemeanor that i'm to hoping to beat, but if they ask whether or not i've even been arrested, i'm screwed.
 
cutiecake said:
for current or former residents who have filled out apps and/or signed contracts, how are these questions usually worded? ever been arrested? ever been convicted? ever been convicted of a felony? i'm currently going through a horrendous divorce and my husband had me arrested for harrassing communications on the basis of emails that i sent two months ago. this is a misdemeanor that i'm to hoping to beat, but if they ask whether or not i've even been arrested, i'm screwed.
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Sometimes the questions will ask whether you've been charged with any criminal offenses or whether you have charges pending against you, in addition to the questions of whether you've been convicted of anything.

You are required to attach an explanation to anything you indicate yes to which is where you can explain your circumstances and that these charges are related to a personal issue rather than a professional one.

Do not, however, lie about any of these questions. That's certainly going to be far more damaging than an honest explanation that demonstrates you have the "moral character" to be issued a license.
 
One reason the OP shouldn't bring this up with anyone...and really shouldn't be talking about it on a public board (as mentioned) is because if it goes to trial, anything he says "can and will be used against him." If he talked about it with his PD, they can depose the PD, etc. He shouldn't talk about this with ANYONE else until the court process is settled. Once he sees what he's in for - a plea "bargain" (nothing of the sort, ever), or a genuine trial - then he should make a decision about how and when to tell his residency.

People in trouble with the law love to tell their story over and over. In general, this plays into the prosecution's hands. The more witnesses they can get on the stand, the more probable they can make the defendant look as guilty as the Prince of Darkness.

Also, I think the OP answered his app questions truthfully. He's circumstantially lucky and can always defend those answers. Licensing might be an issue later, but not because he falsified anything, it'll be because of whatever conviction he now has.
 
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