Grade 12 Student Needing some Advice

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Suhail_Patel

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Hi. I'm a 17 yr old grade 12 student (from Kanada), and I'm about to apply for university and I need your help. Right now im doing CO-OP for this semester at a university, basically allows me to gain some experiance and take some university courses as well (I'm heading back end of Jan). Anyways, I'm planning to go to Med School (surgeory), and I've decided to take engineering as my pre-med, I know it's going to be difficult and all, but I'm dedicated and I think I can do it. My grades aren't bad, I can achieve high 80's and some 90's through high school, and I'm willing to adapt to any change, I'm ready to give it 150% in university. I don't want to do an Arts or Science degree, I need a backup just in case, and an arts or science won't get you anywhere, maybe a research job, and besides, there are already too many people taking that as a pre-med, and med schools want some variety, someone with a unique application. I've been deciding to take Mechanical Engineering unil I found this new program at a local university called electrical and biomedical engineering, a 4 yr bachelors degree, and it claims to cover all the pre-req for med school. I heard alot of people are taking that and get readily accepted, but of course with good GPA's, MCAT, and volunteer expeiance, etc. This new program seems promising and I might stick with that, but I'm willing to hear everyone elses opinion as well. Thanks for your help.

You can take a look here if you like:

http://www.ece.mcmaster.ca/docs/biomed.doc (includes course schedule/info)
http://www.ece.mcmaster.ca/news/news.htm




Btw: can someone tell me if thats a Double Degree, I mean would I be able to get a job somewhere that doesn't make medical equipment, etc, like a normal Electrical Engineer??? Also, how difficult do you guys think it would be, easier then mechanical engineering?

Members don't see this ad.
 
one more thing, do you guys recommand me to take CO-OP (paid work) while studying, alot of engineering programs have a CO-Op option (12 months minimum) or is a requirement. I'd still have to do my volunteer work in clinics, hospitals, etc though, would it fit in nicely? I need the money, im poor :confused:
 
Here, I posted some info on the program, it at McMaster Univerrsity in Hamilton, Ontario (yes Kanada, and we don't live in igloos btw, ignorant americans :cough: :cough:)



----------------


The main features of the proposed programme are:

• A 4-year B.Eng degree in Electrical and Biomedical
Engineering, with an option of two (2) 600 level
courses.

• A 5th-year M Eng degree in Electrical and Biomedical
Engineering (6 courses at the 600 and 700 level +
project).

• Graduates of the programme will also have a full
“pre-med” qualification

• Graduates of the programme will have very broad
career opportunities in biological sciences,
engineering, and medical sciences, including entry to
medical schools.

The objectives of our proposed programme are:

To provide our students with a modern education,
consisting of:

• Depth, breadth, and creativity in the central areas
of biomedical engineering, its underlying sciences,
and related technologies,

• Effective communication, learning, and teamwork
skills that facilitate biomedical engineering
practice, continued professional advancement, research
and adaptation,

• A recognition of professional and social
responsibilities, including sensitivity to ethical and
health related issues.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Here, I posted some info on the program, it at McMaster Univerrsity in Hamilton, Ontario (yes Kanada, and we don't live in igloos btw, ignorant americans :cough: :cough:)



----------------


The main features of the proposed programme are:

• A 4-year B.Eng degree in Electrical and Biomedical
Engineering, with an option of two (2) 600 level
courses.

• A 5th-year M Eng degree in Electrical and Biomedical
Engineering (6 courses at the 600 and 700 level +
project).

• Graduates of the programme will also have a full
“pre-med” qualification

• Graduates of the programme will have very broad
career opportunities in biological sciences,
engineering, and medical sciences, including entry to
medical schools.

The objectives of our proposed programme are:

To provide our students with a modern education,
consisting of:

• Depth, breadth, and creativity in the central areas
of biomedical engineering, its underlying sciences,
and related technologies,

• Effective communication, learning, and teamwork
skills that facilitate biomedical engineering
practice, continued professional advancement, research
and adaptation,

• A recognition of professional and social
responsibilities, including sensitivity to ethical and
health related issues.

maybe im a dumb american but isn't canada spelled with a C and isnt kanada a region in india???
 
Hello,
I think that you are on the right track except for the fact that it seems like your rushing everything just a little to much! Relax finish High School adn enjoy the last days of your senior year, for which i didnt really have one since I graduated real early like 1 year in half earlier, because of that I used to wish i could go back and finish my Senior year because I used to regret it. And if you worry to to to much about college and try to speed it up a liitle that just might happen to you too. You said you wanna become a Surgeon huh? I dont doubt that you can't become one but if I were you I would worry about graduating High School first, besides even if you go to med school you need to know that 83% of the Medical Students change their minds atleast once about what they want to Specialize/Sub-Specialize in. But so you know you ARE on the right track if you want to major in Engineering thats fine and ofcourse you'll have a back-up later and on the Mcat's Engineer Major's tend to do better on the Pysics part of the Exam. So enjoy High School for now and just keep on the same track and in 4 yrs with good grades good amount of shadowing Competative gpa, Competative Mcat, and other extra cirricular's you should be on your way to becoming a doc in Med School..

Good Luck,
 
I'm an electrical/computer engineer + biomedical engineering major at one of the best engineering schools in the country and I completed all my pre-reqs for med school. It's definitely doable in 4 years and I applaud you for your courage! You'll have to be really good at managing your time (plan ahead for MCATs, courses, etc.), but if you're up for the challenge (and it's definitely a challenge), give it a shot. Keep in mind though, that GPA for med school is very important, so don't let that fall! I do wonder sometimes if I woulda been better with another major, but I think if engineering is something you really enjoy/want to do, you should go for it.

Good luck!
 
Kanada is also a place in ontario....

And...kid, OP, watch out, even if you give it 150% in engineering, you have to know that a lot of the time people can't get above a 3.5 gpa, because it's really hard. The application can be difficult, and even if you study super hard, it's all about how good you are at Math and hard sciences...just a pointer. So if engineering is what you really want to do, then do it. But if it starts giving you a bad taste in your mouth, switch out and don't let it ruin your chances of becoming a doc, if that's your life's dream.

:)

Feel it out, and see how you fare. Keep an open mind, and good luck to you.
 
Kanada is also a place in ontario....

And...kid, OP, watch out, even if you give it 150% in engineering, you have to know that a lot of the time people can't get above a 3.5 gpa, because it's really hard. The application can be difficult, and even if you study super hard, it's all about how good you are at Math and hard sciences...just a pointer. So if engineering is what you really want to do, then do it. But if it starts giving you a bad taste in your mouth, switch out and don't let it ruin your chances of becoming a doc, if that's your life's dream.

:)

Feel it out, and see how you fare. Keep an open mind, and good luck to you.

Agreed. Most traditional science majors like bio or chem are straight up can I memorize stuff or plug and chug - at least the first 2 years anyway (also depends on professor), but generally speaking this is true. Engineering is a different type of learning in college, usually everything is applicative from the first day.
 
ok...I couldn't find it either, but i swear I've heard of Kanada in Canada...LOL
 
thanks everyone for your help and supprt, it seems to me that I'm on the right path, though I'm going to keep reading on any potential majors I could do or any better opportunities that I come upon
 
Members don't see this ad :)
one more thing that hasn't been answered, I'm still wondering whether I should apply for CO-OP option for engineering, this would mean I wouldn't have 4 months off each year. Should I or should I not?
 
lol i don't know about not using your real name haha, i mean unless you have no sense of intengrity or say things you can't back up there is no real problem about using your name. i mean what can possibly happen.

To the OP: do the Co-OP even it will be a good experience, i mean you have nothing to loss except your previous free time, which your probably going to be like me and waste on playing games.
 
lol i don't know about not using your real name haha, i mean unless you have no sense of intengrity or say things you can't back up there is no real problem about using your name. i mean what can possibly happen.

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Hi. I'm a 17 yr old grade 12 student (from Kanada), and I'm about to apply for university and I need your help. Right now im doing CO-OP for this semester at a university, basically allows me to gain some experiance and take some university courses as well (I'm heading back end of Jan). Anyways, I'm planning to go to Med School (surgeory), and I've decided to take engineering as my pre-med, I know it's going to be difficult and all, but I'm dedicated and I think I can do it. My grades aren't bad, I can achieve high 80's and some 90's through high school, and I'm willing to adapt to any change, I'm ready to give it 150% in university. I don't want to do an Arts or Science degree, I need a backup just in case, and an arts or science won't get you anywhere, maybe a research job, and besides, there are already too many people taking that as a pre-med, and med schools want some variety, someone with a unique application. I've been deciding to take Mechanical Engineering unil I found this new program at a local university called electrical and biomedical engineering, a 4 yr bachelors degree, and it claims to cover all the pre-req for med school. I heard alot of people are taking that and get readily accepted, but of course with good GPA's, MCAT, and volunteer expeiance, etc. This new program seems promising and I might stick with that, but I'm willing to hear everyone elses opinion as well. Thanks for your help.

You can take a look here if you like:

http://www.ece.mcmaster.ca/docs/biomed.doc (includes course schedule/info)
http://www.ece.mcmaster.ca/news/news.htm




Btw: can someone tell me if thats a Double Degree, I mean would I be able to get a job somewhere that doesn't make medical equipment, etc, like a normal Electrical Engineer??? Also, how difficult do you guys think it would be, easier then mechanical engineering?

You really need to get ****in' laid bro.

What a geek...no...scratch that. What a homo.
:laugh:
 
uh...do what you will but, engineering is hard, and mostly not really a pre-med kinda thing to be taking. Well, I guess you can do biomech, but other than that, regular old engineering is really just a good way to kill your GPA.
 
I'm planning on joining the reserves during my time off (april-aug), might look good on my med school application, will this conflict with coop? I won't be allowed to take any months off, a min of 12 months of coop is required by McMaster.
 
As a Canadian I would STRONGLY advise you to rethink Engineering as pre-med.
1-It is a HARD programs, its rare to see someone pulling a 3.8 which is the cutoff for most medical schools.
2-Medical schools in Canada give NO preference to undergrad degrees. Sure they want variety but in PEOPLE not degrees. They could care less if you did basketweaving for 4 years as long as you have the 3.8 and made the MCAT cutoff your in.
3-Co-op that not something premeds do and medical schools actually don't like it. Check the websites of med. schools.

Note program is not that new.
 
Wow, while I'm reading the OPs posts I can actually hear his indian accent in my head. This is hilarious. Oh and to the OP, nobody here in the U.S. thinks "K"anadians live in igloos, just a heads up. Good luck :scared:
 
As a Canadian I would STRONGLY advise you to rethink Engineering as pre-med.
1-It is a HARD programs, its rare to see someone pulling a 3.8 which is the cutoff for most medical schools.
2-Medical schools in Canada give NO preference to undergrad degrees. Sure they want variety but in PEOPLE not degrees. They could care less if you did basketweaving for 4 years as long as you have the 3.8 and made the MCAT cutoff your in.
3-Co-op that not something premeds do and medical schools actually don't like it. Check the websites of med. schools.

Note program is not that new.


Why don't they like COOP?
 
Wow, while I'm reading the OPs posts I can actually hear his indian accent in my head. This is hilarious. Oh and to the OP, nobody here in the U.S. thinks "K"anadians live in igloos, just a heads up. Good luck :scared:

You'd be suprised, Rick Mercer's "Talking to Americans" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talking_to_Americans) seems to say otherwise :rolleyes:, not to mention your intelligent President
 
You'd be suprised, Rick Mercer's "Talking to Americans" seems to say otherwise :rolleyes:, not to mention your intelligent President
why would bush think otherwise? he must be pretty intelligent because he graduated from yale!
 
why would bush think otherwise? he must be pretty intelligent because he graduated from yale!

Indeed he did, must have been the drugs or his daddy must have bribed the administration.

Heres one of the many "Bushisms":


"Too many good docs are getting out of the business. Too many OB-GYNs aren't able to practice their love with women all across this country." —Poplar Bluff, Mo., Sept. 6, 2004

More here:

http://politicalhumor.about.com/cs/georgewbush/a/top10bushisms.htm
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/blbushdumbquotes.htm
http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=bushisms&btnG=Search&meta=


Very intelligent man :rolleyes:

Stupid or not, you decide, it doesn't take a neurosurgeon to know

---------------------------

Anyways I think we are getting offtopic, let's return to what we were discussing before
 
How many hours of volunteer service is enough?

I plan to volunteer:

100 hours in the hospital (talking to patients, etc)
100 hours in the clinic
100 hours of research
100 hours of shadowing a doc

and other extracurricular activities (clubs, etc)

I'm completing 170 hours right now while im at the university, helping a history prof write a book


would that be enough?
 
You really need to get ****in' laid bro.

What a geek...no...scratch that. What a homo.
:laugh:

that's exactly what i was thinking.. at age 17, i was far more concerned with getting wasted and sleeping with as many ladies as possible. suggestion- you need to get your effin jollies out now before college, my friend. it will all fall into place.

ps- this kid's parents are probably pushing him into medicine.. figure it out for yourself, chief.
 
that's exactly what i was thinking.. at age 17, i was far more concerned with getting wasted and sleeping with as many ladies as possible. suggestion- you need to get your effin jollies out now before college, my friend. it will all fall into place.

ps- this kid's parents are probably pushing him into medicine.. figure it out for yourself, chief.


Actually my parents couldn't give a damn about my education and I'm not much of a "partyer", I'm use to living like a "nerd" so don't worry about me
 
How many hours of volunteer service is enough?

I plan to volunteer:

100 hours in the hospital (talking to patients, etc)
100 hours in the clinic
100 hours of research
100 hours of shadowing a doc

and other extracurricular activities (clubs, etc)

I'm completing 170 hours right now while im at the university, helping a history prof write a book


would that be enough?

Take a Vike and go watch Sponge Bob or something.
 
Avoid using your real name as your screen name. Remember, the SDN Forums are read by students, faculty, advisors and administrators from around the world. Unless you want everyone to know who you are, keep your identity protected.

------

Hope this doesn't bite me in the @ss later on
 
They don't like co-op because your not taking tests and getting graded during co-op.
 
Another thing I forgot above. Its not about how much time you volunteer but how much effort you put into it.
 
How many hours of volunteer service is enough?

I plan to volunteer:

100 hours in the hospital (talking to patients, etc)
100 hours in the clinic
100 hours of research
100 hours of shadowing a doc

and other extracurricular activities (clubs, etc)

I'm completing 170 hours right now while im at the university, helping a history prof write a book


would that be enough?

If you are going to do bench research, I would recommend at a minimum, that you plan on one summer (350-400 hours) plus 10-15 hours/wk for the remainder of that year (Jan-May and Sept-Dec). That seems to be the least needed to really "do research".

Shadowing a doc can be cut to as little as 32 hours (8 hours each with 4 different docs or a week with one doc). If you have enough volunteer time in a clinic & hospital you are going to see what the doctors & nurses & other staff do anyway and shadowing is far less important.

Splitting between a hospital & a clinic is OK but do try to stay with one of the two places long enough to work your way up, perhaps, to a point where you can train or lead other volunteers. This is a good opportunity to show leadership skills and will often be mentioned favorably in a letter of recommendation.
 
Wow, while I'm reading the OPs posts I can actually hear his indian accent in my head. This is hilarious. Oh and to the OP, nobody here in the U.S. thinks "K"anadians live in igloos, just a heads up. Good luck :scared:

you're right... they live in log cabins
 
Planning for the future is not bad, but your plan must be realistic.
To the OP: Finish highschool and enjoy yourself while you can. Grade 12 is suppose to be about picking the right college or university not about picking the right medical school. Its great that you have some idea about what you want to do but try experiencing first year. I say this because I was exactly like you last year. I thought I could plan my life out in University before ever starting...boy that was a waste of time. I should have been partying because now I have no time to :(
 
maybe im a dumb american but isn't canada spelled with a C and isnt kanada a region in india???

He could very well be from India...he doesn't link some of his sentences like americans do.
 
ummm...I hope I don't see this guy down the road in some (if any) American schools. Oh, sorry,I mean Amerikan schools.
 
How many hours of volunteer service is enough?

I plan to volunteer:

100 hours in the hospital (talking to patients, etc)
100 hours in the clinic
100 hours of research
100 hours of shadowing a doc

and other extracurricular activities (clubs, etc)

I'm completing 170 hours right now while im at the university, helping a history prof write a book


would that be enough?
That's PERFECT. They'll see your exact 100 hours of everything and know how much of a phony tool you are. Go get 'em! :thumbup: :laugh:

PS - Don't forget the 100 hours of putting on bandaids at a medical clinic in Africa...I hear they really go for that.
 
That's about all the advice I need right now, thanks to everyone in this thread. If I have any more questions in the future, I'll post it here.
 
I'm pretty biased, because I did biomedical engineering for undergrad, but I really think it's a great field. I initially chose my major because I wasn't 100% sure I wanted to do medicine straight out of high school and engineering was my back-up choice in case I changed my mind/it didn't work out. By the end of my first year I was sure I was shooting for med school and I loved engineering so I decided to stay in the field.

My advice: do engineering only if you really think you will like the field. You can get into medical school with a background in any discipline, so long as you complete the premed requirements. If engineering interests you, go for it! Plus if you are willing to work 150% and get good grades, you will make a very aggressive applicant. Everyone knows engineering is considerably tougher than the bread and butter biology majors. I highly doubt that all of the many bio major premeds out there all chose the major because they just LOVE general biology. There's a lot more to biology than just human and even vertebrate biology, such as ecology and botany, etc. that is really not too exciting in my opinion. I venture to say that most people who go into bio do it because it is an easier major that covers all the premed reqs. Don't let this be your motivation...do something you like and may enjoy doing if for whatever reason you decide not to go into medicine. There isn't too much you can do with a bio degree if not medicine or research.

I agree that you shouldn't stress out too much since you are still in high school, but it is good to have a general idea of what you want to do. Don't let people discourage you from thinking ahead; just make sure you don't go beyond what you can handle. After all, your question is valid because you are in the process of applying to college and are worried about what to declare as your major. That makes sense.

Good luck in deciding and remember, if you are unhappy with your major after a couple of semesters, you can always change your course of study later on. Do whatever makes you happy.
 
Originally Posted by Suhail_Patel
How many hours of volunteer service is enough?

I plan to volunteer:

100 hours in the hospital (talking to patients, etc)
100 hours in the clinic
100 hours of research
100 hours of shadowing a doc

and other extracurricular activities (clubs, etc)

I'm completing 170 hours right now while im at the university, helping a history prof write a book


would that be enough?

be easy patel, be easy. you don't want an interviewer asking whether or not you have a life (I've seen someone post about this question before).
 
If you know now that you want to go into medicine while in high school, get accepted into a 7 or 8 year BS/MD or BS/DO program(if applying in u.s. of course). Securing a spot ahead of time is the best way to go if you know already that you want to study medicine. This way all you have to do is make the cutoff for GPA and MCAT and they have a seat waiting for you. No applying, no crapshoot, no praying to get accepted somewhere. Seriously consider this. Many of us wish we realized this earlier and applied for these programs straight out of college. You can have your MD or DO and be starting your residency at age 25 or so. That is awesome. :thumbup:
 
How many hours of volunteer service is enough?

I plan to volunteer:

100 hours in the hospital (talking to patients, etc)
100 hours in the clinic
100 hours of research
100 hours of shadowing a doc

and other extracurricular activities (clubs, etc)

I'm completing 170 hours right now while im at the university, helping a history prof write a book


would that be enough?
Enough for what?

It's not about the hours or the list of things you can put on your resume. It's not about that at all. It's about your accomplishments and what you got out of them. I think you're trying to follow some formula for getting into medical school, and there really isn't a formula beyond good MCAT and good grades.

Once you stop discussing MCAT scores and grades, it becomes about you -- not the number of hours you logged at a hospital or clinic. I admire your drive, but don't drive yourself crazy thinking about hours logged.

What you need to do is:

1) Get good grades
2) Get a good MCAT score
3) Decide why you want to become a doctor and explore that desire with EC's

I want to become a psychiatrist, so I work in a psychiatry lab and volunteer at a suicide hotline. And I love both activities. They're both rewarding to me. I don't worry about not being president of any clubs or anything like that.

What I do worry about is this: am I doing anything worthwhile?

So, good luck, and remember, it's about you.
 
Just thought I'd pop into the thread and thank Suhail_Patel.

I thought I'd seen the pinnacle of arrogance in abusive surgery attendings pimping MS3s.

But it took a 17 year old, worldly and wise not-yet-a-high-school-graduate Kanadian to poke her head in here, asking for advice yet flinging insults with the same breath - to remind me that there's a whole world of arrogance out there, waiting to be discovered.

I won't misunderestimate our igloo-dwelling neighbors again.
 
Enough for what?

It's not about the hours or the list of things you can put on your resume. It's not about that at all. It's about your accomplishments and what you got out of them. I think you're trying to follow some formula for getting into medical school, and there really isn't a formula beyond good MCAT and good grades.

Once you stop discussing MCAT scores and grades, it becomes about you -- not the number of hours you logged at a hospital or clinic. I admire your drive, but don't drive yourself crazy thinking about hours logged.
That's pretty much what I just said, only I was an dingus about it. I just can't stand the tools who follow a set pattern of activitites to fit the role of the "competitive applicant" instead of just being themselves and doing what compels and interests them. Hell, I'm not going to lie, I volunteer in the ED of a hospital myself, but I've done it for 300+ hours and don't plan on stopping at any set number that I decide is "enough". I enjoy it, and that is what counts.

At application time, the OP's kind of behavior really contrasts the genuine people from the fakes.
 
Just thought I'd pop into the thread and thank Suhail_Patel.

I thought I'd seen the pinnacle of arrogance in abusive surgery attendings pimping MS3s.

But it took a 17 year old, worldly and wise not-yet-a-high-school-graduate Kanadian to poke her head in here, asking for advice yet flinging insults with the same breath - to remind me that there's a whole world of arrogance out there, waiting to be discovered.

I won't misunderestimate our igloo-dwelling neighbors again.
Hey, we're not all bad...some of us may inexplicably call our own country Kanada, but at least we don't use words that George W. Bush invented like "misunderestimate". ;)
 
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