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Has this happened to anybody?

Discussion in 'Emergency Medicine' started by Back34, Dec 21, 2005.

  1. Back34

    Back34 Senior Member
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    I'm bringing this up because I'm a skeptical person by nature and just wanted to get some thoughts. I interviewed at my #1 choice, which happened to be where I did my audition rotation. The interview went well and was told by the program director that the attendings/residents I worked with had a pretty high opinion of my work habits, etc., and gave every indication that he'd be ranking me high, without actually saying so. Two days later, I got a letter from the program director telling me that they'd love to have the opportunity to train me.

    This may seem like a stupid post because, on the surface, I'm already there. But, again, I've been burned far too many times to take anything at face value. Has this happened to anybody else? What happened? Thanks.
     
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  3. BKN

    BKN Senior Member
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    Well, it sounds real good. Congrats. It seems to me that he sincerely likes you and would be happy to train you. It's not a guarantee. I certainly would be happy to train far more people than my program can fit. The following is a post I put on a Psych thread today. I think it's applicable.

    <Quote=poety>
    Originally Posted by Poety
    Yeah, I think its all generic, I'm starting to think every program is writing the same thing to every applicant but a different variation of it </Quote>



    <QUOTE=Atsai> Rather than suspect PDs of being disingenuous, I think it might be more productive to see them as trying to encourage qualified applicants to come to their program. Even the 'top' programs know that they will have to go down on their rank list to fill their spots, some deeper than others. If you have 10 spots, you're not going to limit your recruiting phone calls to the top 10 candidates, because many of them are going to pick other programs. There may be 50 candidates that you would be more than happy to have in your program. So you call all 50 and say "We'd love to have you here." And depending on how the market shakes out on Match Day, hopefully 10 of them will choose your program.

    Am I just being too naive? </QUOTE=Atsai>

    I think you're both right even though your posts seem to conflict.

    I would be happy to train almost every candidate I interview and I tell them that. I'm not being disingenuous, I'm giving them feedback that they seem to want. Having done this for a while, I'm pretty sure that most will match. If I'm of that opinion for a particular candidate, I say so.

    I don't make promises, tell her she's ranked to match or close a deal early, because we do our list after the last interview. But if a candidates application is so outstanding that I think it very likely that he'll be ranked above our traditional lowest matching slot, I'll tell him it's probably his choice whether he comes to our program. I can say this only to a small proportion of our interviewees.

    The reason I went to the trouble of writing this down is that the discussion on this forum seems much more angst ridden than on EM. I guess that's just the specialty "personality" since you guys are in the driver seat. EM candidates are not (neither are ED PDs).

    My reaction from what you report about your interviews is that the Psych PDs are doing much more recruiting because they need to. Good news for you. Even so, I think most PDs are honest and what they say is what they mean. If they say they like you, that means they like you, nothing more. I'd make a similar evaluation about "good fit" and "competitive" and "would be happy to train you" statements."

    Back to the game theory thing. It is to the PDs advantage to affect all of his candidates ranking of his program upwards. It is to your advantage to affect your ranking upwards on all or your programs lists. It to neither sides advantage to put their list in other than true order.

    My point is that even if you are told "you are ranked to match" by an honest PD, that shouldn't affect your list. All it should mean is that if none of the programs above love you, you're going to this place. Attempts to influence your decision, either by "love" or "guilt" should be seen as what they are, coercion. If you want to go there take the bait. If not, be noncommital.

    I also respectfully suggest that you stop trying to be junior shrinks and read things into the exact wording (this means you P). Sometimes an analysts cigar is just a cigar. The rest is silence.
     
  4. kungfufishing

    kungfufishing Senior Member
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    Having been through this process, and even interviewed with Dr. BKN, the above post is very accurate. The unknown aspect of the match can be so unsettling. As long as you dont allow your own anxiety to run your life or do stupid things you wouldnt normally do because of it, I would say it cant be helped. There is no way to know exactly what PDs mean when they write/ say nice things, but its pretty safe to assume they wouldnt say it if they werent interested. Could be a lot worse - they could be saying "thanks for playing, but we're not interviewing you...".
    I suspect there is more disingenous strategy on the applicant side of things than the faculty side, if for no other reason than the PD has probably been through this process a couple times before whereas the applicants are often new at it and probably a little less secure. Be flattered, and if you want to go there rank 'em first.
     
  5. tiene dolor?

    tiene dolor? ...for me to POOP on!
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    Sounds like University of Chicago, no?
     
  6. EctopicFetus

    EctopicFetus Keeping it funky enough
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    I doubt the OP will post the place on here for obvious reasons..
     
  7. LuvbugMD

    LuvbugMD Junior Member
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    This thread is so timely! I have finished my interviews and have begun my second look at some of the programs. I already know who I plan on ranking #1, but I do not know when to tell the PD. When is the best time? Now, in Jan/Feb before the rank list, wait to get a recruitment call from them to see if they are truly interested...? I received a large amount of good "feedback" during my interview and second look, but I am so uneasy with this whole match process. :confused:
     
  8. tiene dolor?

    tiene dolor? ...for me to POOP on!
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    Yeah, you're probably right. Regardless, it definitely sounds like Chicago. That is pretty much the exact wording of the letter that the U of C sent out last year. I don't think it is meant to be disingenuous at all - rather, they have a rep for being aggressive in recruiting people they like. :thumbup:
     
  9. EctopicFetus

    EctopicFetus Keeping it funky enough
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    Dolor do you happen to be at UCLA?
     
  10. tiene dolor?

    tiene dolor? ...for me to POOP on!
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    Nope. But not too far from there.
     
  11. Seaglass

    Seaglass Quantum Member
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    Just to echo what has been said above, you shouldn't put much stock in such comments, and they certainly shouldn't affect your rank list decisions.
     

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