Healthcare Reform

[blysssful]

An email from SUNY:
"BACKGROUND: The Senate is now debating and considering amendments to its version of national health care reform legislation. The bill seeks to expand health insurance coverage to tens of millions of uninsured Americans at a cost of $850 billion.

It's clear that there are improvements that need to be made to the Senate bill. It's also clear that groups opposed to Optometry - especially insurers and organized medicine - are more active than ever on Capitol Hill pushing their own priorities which seek to restrict access to optometric care and limit the type of care optometrists provide. That's why it's essential that ODs, students and patients take action to help ensure that Optometry will be treated fairly under any health care legislation that advances in Congress, particularly with regard to patient access, re-imbursement and full recognition in Federal health programs.

Last month, at the urging of the AOA, the U.S. House approved AOA-backed Ross Amendment (to ensure non-pre-emption of state patient protection / provider non-discrimination laws) and the AOA-backed Schakowsky Amendment (to recognize ODs as physicians in Medicaid). These were notable wins for the profession, but with a House-Senate conference that will produce a final health care bill still to come, likely in January, they are not yet final victories.

LATEST DEVELOPMENT: In spite of an aggressive lobbying campaign by the insurance industry earlier this year, the Senate's current bill, developed by Majority Leader Harry Reid, includes AOA-backed language that would make provider non-discrimination safeguards a key element of reform. Now, a national coalition of medical and surgery groups has mobilized and is actively working to strip this provision before a final Senate vote, likely before the end of this month. Over the last few days, these nineteen groups, which claiming to represent more than 240,000 surgeons and anesthesiologists from across the country, have formally joined together to contact Senator Reid and other Senate leaders to state their specific opposition to the provider non-discrimination safeguards in the bill and demand its removal. They claim that "[t]he so-called non-discrimination in health care provision...would create patient confusion over greatly differing levels of education, skills and training among health care professionals while inappropriately interjecting civil rights concepts into state scope of practice laws."

The AOA, with the involvement of individual ODs, students and patients from across the country, has worked - successfully, to this point - to overcome this type of opposition to make provider non-discrimination (that is, protections in the law to prevent insurers from restricting patient choice and access) a top priority in the Washington, DC debate over health care. With the endgame underway, every OD must step up to counter all the late and dishonest misinformation we can expect from organized medicine and insurers. At this critical moment, Optometry must speak out in support of its priorities with a unified and resolute voice."

So, for those of you more versed in the situation, a few questions:
1) I was under the impression that the AOA was simply asking to be INCLUDED in the verbiage of the bill, which would keep the national scope of practice to what it currently is. Is this incorrect? Is the AOA trying to use this bill to expand the current scope of practice for optometrists?

2) About the bolded part, are they saying that the so-called "confusion" would stem from ODs being labeled as physicians? Are dentists considered physicians? If so, they have the same "level of education" as ODs. Not to mention, with this bill or without it, nothing an OD does will require an anesthesiologist-- we would still have to refer out any surgical procedures... so why are they also "represented" in that category? An OMD isn't going to have an anesthesiologist on staff while performing any of the procedures that we deserve access to, so I don't understand how it even affects them.

3) Realistically, what can students do at this point other than sending out a couple letters to Senators?

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[RTM]

All this is so exhausting. I'm so tired of ophthalmology insecurities and greed.

1. I do not believe that the AOA is attempting to increase the scope of optometry through this bill. They only want to ensure that optometrists can bill for services rendered without the confusion of ophthalmologists trying to control our profession to financially further theirs.
2. Likely the coalition of OMDs and Anesthesia MDs stems not only from optometry but also from CRNAs (Nurse Aesthesia providers). Once again, my opinion is that this coalition stems from porsche payments being more important than patient care and access to care.
3. Students can write letters and work to educate others about our profession.
Also, you can work to excel in FULL SCOPE optometry with a full scope of knowledge of systemic and ocular disease. And you can do a residency to provide yourself with the necessary skills to lead by optometric example.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

All this is so exhausting. I'm so tired of ophthalmology insecurities and greed.

1. I do not believe that the AOA is attempting to increase the scope of optometry through this bill. They only want to ensure that optometrists can bill for services rendered without the confusion of ophthalmologists trying to control our profession to financially further theirs.
2. Likely the coalition of OMDs and Anesthesia MDs stems not only from optometry but also from CRNAs (Nurse Aesthesia providers). Once again, my opinion is that this coalition stems from porsche payments being more important than patient care and access to care.
3. Students can write letters and work to educate others about our profession.
Also, you can work to excel in FULL SCOPE optometry with a full scope of knowledge of systemic and ocular disease. And you can do a residency to provide yourself with the necessary skills to lead by optometric example.

I think your 2nd point is the likely one. Although, I would be curious about the breakdown of those 240,000 surgeons. If that includes non-ophtho people, why on earth would they care about what ODs can and cannot do? If that is just ophthalmologists, then I stand corrected and it is geared towards mainly you and the nurses.

 

[JeffChou]

I did some digging around to find out more about the bill and the ASA's position on provider nondiscrimination and found that they are concerned about, among other unrelated issues in HR 3962, potential confusion from the provider nondiscrimination section.

Here is the text of the ASA president's letter to congress along with some comments from some practitioners: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=8974170 (You can also find a PDF of his letter on the ASA website http://www.asahq.org/news/asanews121009.htm).

Here is the text of section 238 (http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3962/text)

SEC. 238. STATE PROHIBITIONS ON DISCRIMINATION AGAINST HEALTH CARE PROVIDERS.

This Act (and the amendments made by this Act) shall not be construed as superseding laws, as they now or hereinafter exist, of any State or jurisdiction designed to prohibit a qualified health benefits plan from discriminating with respect to participation, reimbursement, covered services, indemnification, or related requirements under such plan against a health care provider that is acting within the scope of that provider's license or certification under applicable State law.

I really don't see how this would confuse the delivery of health care. This would only maintain the state's rights in prohibiting discrimination among insurance plans. This does not change scope of practice.

 

[RTM]

I think your 2nd point is the likely one. Although, I would be curious about the breakdown of those 240,000 surgeons. If that includes non-ophtho people, why on earth would they care about what ODs can and cannot do? If that is just ophthalmologists, then I stand corrected and it is geared towards mainly you and the nurses.

I believe that some in medicine feel that allowing any non-MD specialty to tread on their turf sets a bad precedent for later potential legal changes in non-MD scope of practice. Further, I believe that this is motivated soley by money.
Frankly, not allowing non-MD specialties to practice to the level of their license threatens access to care in many non-urban areas.
Its all very complex, and the sad part is that the patients are caught in the middle in some cases.

 

[Framecontrol]

If you guys want to make a difference in the career of optometry then you should really consider contacting the senator of your state and expressing your opinion about health care reform.

I figured this was a little bit of a big deal for some students to coordinate while focusing on school, so I made it REALLLLY simple for everyone.

Follow this link and all of the instructions are inside. I will literally take you 3 minutes.

http://optometrystudents.com/optometry-needs-you/

 

[acidinmylegs]

Done.

If you guys want to make a difference in the career of optometry then you should really consider contacting the senator of your state and expressing your opinion about health care reform.

I figured this was a little bit of a big deal for some students to coordinate while focusing on school, so I made it REALLLLY simple for everyone.

Follow this link and all of the instructions are inside. I will literally take you 3 minutes.

http://optometrystudents.com/optometry-needs-you/

 

[Framecontrol]

Done.

Cool!

Were the instructions easy to follow?

These e-mail's really make a big difference for optometry so everyone should send one in.

 

[hurricaneuro]

Sent one too. Really easy.

 

[Framecontrol]

Sent one too. Really easy.

Great to hear! Spread the word if you can. Now is a really critical time according to the AOA.

I think that when the senators hear that students are getting involved this will sway their decision and let them know we are a powerful group!

http://optometrystudents.com/optometry-needs-you/

thats the link if anyone needs it!

 

[JAZZEYE]

If you guys want to make a difference in the career of optometry then you should really consider contacting the senator of your state and expressing your opinion about health care reform.

I figured this was a little bit of a big deal for some students to coordinate while focusing on school, so I made it REALLLLY simple for everyone.

Follow this link and all of the instructions are inside. I will literally take you 3 minutes.

http://optometrystudents.com/optometry-needs-you/

Framecontrol,
Might be a good idea to put this link in its own thread to get more attention

 

[opto2be]

So, with the health care reform that's been passed now, I'm curious whether all of you, especially the optometrists, think it's good or bad for optometry. Please share your opinions.

 

[KHE]

So, with the health care reform that's been passed now, I'm curious whether all of you, especially the optometrists, think it's good or bad for optometry. Please share your opinions.

Considering that there will be multiple congressional elections and a presidential election in between now and when the law takes effect, I think it's safe to say that we will likely see a final version that bears little resemblance to the one currently in effect.

However, if we go based on the current law:

1) To the extent that it bans provider discrimination be ERISA plans, it's a HUGE benefit to optometry.

2) To the extent that it provides coverage to millions of unisured, it's a mild benefit. Eyecare is not tremendously expensive and even people without insurance can generally afford some level of eye care.

3) If providers are reimbursed at medicare rates, it's great. If we are reimbursed and medicaid rates, it sucks.

 

[UAB2014]

This bill is an Obamination to say the least. I'm just glad that it's the oMDs who make over 250K who will providing most of the tax money to pay for those who do not choose to get jobs to support their 5 kids.

Sorry oMD's... it's really not fair to you!
Sorry America- welcome to France....

 

[ibalz]

This bill is an Obamination to say the least. I'm just glad that it's the oMDs who make over 250K who will providing most of the tax money to pay for those who do not choose to get jobs to support their 5 kids.

Sorry oMD's... it's really not fair to you!
Sorry America- welcome to France....

As a potential healthcare provider, you'd rather see fewer people receiving healthcare? Hmmm... that's disturbing. Good luck to your patients.

 

[UAB2014]

Totally missing the point - Yet... choosing to I believe... spoken like a true liberal:

What you and Olberman and Chris Mathews refuse to understand is that,

A system in which people can recieve care- no matter what, is great in theory, but impossible to implement without a severe breaking of the entire economy... not to mention another valid argument...Should EVERYONE recieve free care...even if they have no desires to work-no legal citizenship, and no ambition to put forth any effort whatsoever to add in any socially positive way to society. Now THAT is a sweet deal and quite the inncentive for people to get up off that couch, start promoting family-planning programs, and to add to American culture and American way don't ya think!!?? (Can you feel the sarcasm?)

Also, I just LOVE the idea that the U.S government will be able to penalize me for not attaining health care coverage... just another small baby step in the push for Obama's Socialist agenda... that "we are the government, and we know what's in your best interest because you are too stupid to make your own choices in life."

Like I said... "Welcome to France!!!"
Or Germany if ya like... "Guten Tag!!"

 

[ibalz]

Totally missing the point - Yet... choosing to I believe... spoken like a true liberal:

What you and Olberman and Chris Mathews refuse to understand is that,

A system in which people can recieve care- no matter what, is great in theory, but impossible to implement without a severe breaking of the entire economy... not to mention another valid argument...Should EVERYONE recieve free care...even if they have no desires to work-no legal citizenship, and no ambition to put forth any effort whatsoever to add in any socially positive way to society. Now THAT is a sweet deal and quite the inncentive for people to get up off that couch, start promoting family-planning programs, and to add to American culture and American way don't ya think!!?? (Can you feel the sarcasm?)

Also, I just LOVE the idea that the U.S government will be able to penalize me for not attaining health care coverage... just another small baby step in the push for Obama's Socialist agenda... that "we are the government, and we know what's in your best interest because you are too stupid to make your own choices in life."

Like I said... "Welcome to France!!!"
Or Germany if ya like... "Guten Tag!!"

Liberal & proud of it.

Don't worry - I'll see those patients.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Liberal & proud of it.

Don't worry - I'll see those patients.

We'll see how you feel in 4 years. If optometry school is anything like medical school, it tends to have a conservatising effect on students.

A big concern of mine (and much of medicine) is who is going to see these 37 million new patients. Luckily, y'all don't have the shortage of ODs that we have PCPs.

Maybe all those new OD school deans can see into the future

 

[eyepdesai]

Totally missing the point - Yet... choosing to I believe... spoken like a true liberal:

What you and Olberman and Chris Mathews refuse to understand is that,

A system in which people can recieve care- no matter what, is great in theory, but impossible to implement without a severe breaking of the entire economy... not to mention another valid argument...Should EVERYONE recieve free care...even if they have no desires to work-no legal citizenship, and no ambition to put forth any effort whatsoever to add in any socially positive way to society. Now THAT is a sweet deal and quite the inncentive for people to get up off that couch, start promoting family-planning programs, and to add to American culture and American way don't ya think!!?? (Can you feel the sarcasm?)

Also, I just LOVE the idea that the U.S government will be able to penalize me for not attaining health care coverage... just another small baby step in the push for Obama's Socialist agenda... that "we are the government, and we know what's in your best interest because you are too stupid to make your own choices in life."

Like I said... "Welcome to France!!!"
Or Germany if ya like... "Guten Tag!!"

It's not so much that these people are lazy and don't want to work. It's that they can't find work. The circumstances and the social environment (including racism, sexism, agism) which they were born into makes it extremely difficult to find work and move up on the social ladder. For instance, all those illegal immigrants that are here, are here for a reason. Because of the instability in Mexico resulting from the greed and lack of humanity by some of the American corporations in Mexico since NAFTA was passed. Many laborers there and around the world work in sweat shops and are heavily underpaid by AMERICAN companies. How sad is that.

Furthermore, these immigrants are the ones mowing our lawns, cleaning our houses, scrubbing our toilets and building our roads. But there is no room for them to move up the social ladder either because of prejudices. I can definitely tell you that scrubbing toilets was not how the Mexican immigrants dreamed El Norte would be like before they decided to cross the border. And yet they should not receive any sort of health care??? Really?

Don't get me wrong, capitalism is indeed a unique system of letting the population decide what products and services they want. But it's not democracy. Over the years, we have transformed into society who feel less and less responsible for others in our community, and we are guided by our own self-interests. Capitalism fuels our short-sighted self-interests. We are now defined by WHAT we possess and not WHO we really are. I'm not taking a stance against capitalism. I'm merely pointing out the fact that our capitalist system does not benefit everyone in our country, unfortunately. And we equate this capitalist system to "democracy." There's the flaw.

Although I don't agree with everything Obama is doing, I think that this health care bill is quite a success. For years and years since the 1930s, the Dems have been trying to get a nationalizedhealth care legislation passed. And now we have one that actually encourages capitalism, competition, etc, yet we are still complaining. Yes, medical doctors and solo optometry practicioners may be affected in terms of reimbursement. But if you're a doctor to make stacks of money, then you shouldn't ever have gone to medical/optometry school in the first place. Doctors back in the day were never filthy rich like they are today, because they focused on the PATIENT'S well-being, not the dollar bills. If you really wanna make money, go to business school and learn to trade derivatives, whatever those are.

For us optometrists, I don't see this bill affecting us much as a whole, as long as we keep up with our lobby and get our voices heard loud and clear in Washington! Solo practitioners may have to work longer hours, but on the up side, more and more people in our communities will be able to SEE!!! Eye exams are relatively affordable too. We also have an advantage with the retail side of optometry. I don't think many OMD's would invest capital to open up a eye boutique. Also, with Obamacare, reimbursment for primary care services may decrease to the point where ophthalmologists don't find it profitable to do "routine" eye exams, leaving the door open for optometrists. OMD's may start to concentrate more on surgery. But that's good, because if we have a patient walk in with a retinal detachment we're gonna need all you skilled OMDs!

P.S. Today's government does NOT think we are too stupid to make our own choices nor does it want to control us. Don't be silly. Why wouldn't you want health coverage for yourself or your family? The government simply wants to ensure that everyone can receive adequate health coverage so that there can be more healthy, happy productive members of society, thus leading to a more stable and stronger economy in the future.

 

[KHE]

Also, I just LOVE the idea that the U.S government will be able to penalize me for not attaining health care coverage... just another small baby step in the push for Obama's Socialist agenda... that "we are the government, and we know what's in your best interest because you are too stupid to make your own choices in life."

Like I said... "Welcome to France!!!"
Or Germany if ya like... "Guten Tag!!"

Sounds like Rush or Hannity to me. lol

In any event, I grew up in Canada and I live in the USA now. (No, I didn't leave Canada to escape the evil socialist regime....I married an American woman and she didn't want to live in Buffalo.)

I would point out that the Canadian system is not utopia in any way shape or form. They have some problems, no doubt.

However, contrary to what Hannity and El-Rushbo say, the streets of Canada are not littered with dead Canadians who died waiting for bypass surgery or cancer treatment.

There is no reason that we could not come up with a system that takes the best of both sides of the border, covers all people for at least catastrophic things, is affordable and sustainable, allows people to move from job to job without fear of losing insurance, and allows GM to not have to bankrupt on the backs of rising health care premiums if our poltical leaders had the will, which of course on either side of the aisle they do NOT.

The problem with the current system in the USA is that the people who are most screwed by it are NOT the poor, or the welfare queens. They have medicaid. They're covered. It's not great coverage, but it's something. The people most screwed are the WORKING poor. The guy who changes your oil. The small independent electrician. The daycare worker. The guy who owns the small printing shop. The diner owner.

It's THEM who get the shaft and it's them who always seem to have their picture on the side of some flyer at the corner store or at the gas station or on the church bulletin board trying to raise money by having a ziti fundraiser dinner to pay for their kidney transplant or their leukemia treatment. I'm as much of a free market guy as anyone but to me, there's something a bit morally bankrupt about a situation where we are living in the richest country in the world, and we have people selling ziti dinners to try to pay for a kidney transplant.

 

[KHE]

It's not so much that these people are lazy and don't want to work. It's that they can't find work. The circumstances and the social environment (including racism, sexism, agism) which they were born into makes it extremely difficult to find work and move up on the social ladder. For instance, all those illegal immigrants that are here, are here for a reason. Because of the instability in Mexico resulting from the greed and lack of humanity by some of the American corporations in Mexico since NAFTA was passed. Many laborers there and around the world work in sweat shops and are heavily underpaid by AMERICAN companies. How sad is that.

You think we didn't have millions of illegal immigrants here before NAFTA?

Furthermore, these immigrants are the ones mowing our lawns, cleaning our houses, scrubbing our toilets and building our roads. But there is no room for them to move up the social ladder either because of prejudices. I can definitely tell you that scrubbing toilets was not how the Mexican immigrants dreamed El Norte would be like before they decided to cross the border. And yet they should not receive any sort of health care??? Really?

They can certainly go back if they want.

Don't get me wrong, capitalism is indeed a unique system of letting the population decide what products and services they want. But it's not democracy. Over the years, we have transformed into society who feel less and less responsible for others in our community, and we are guided by our own self-interests. Capitalism fuels our short-sighted self-interests. We are now defined by WHAT we possess and not WHO we really are. I'm not taking a stance against capitalism. I'm merely pointing out the fact that our capitalist system does not benefit everyone in our country, unfortunately. And we equate this capitalist system to "democracy." There's the flaw.p

What system DOES benefit everyone? Cuba's?

Although I don't agree with everything Obama is doing, I think that this health care bill is quite a success. For years and years since the 1930s, the Dems have been trying to get a nationalizedhealth care legislation passed. And now we have one that actually encourages capitalism, competition, etc, yet we are still complaining. Yes, medical doctors and solo optometry practicioners may be affected in terms of reimbursement. But if you're a doctor to make stacks of money, then you shouldn't ever have gone to medical/optometry school in the first place. Doctors back in the day were never filthy rich like they are today, because they focused on the PATIENT'S well-being, not the dollar bills. If you really wanna make money, go to business school and learn to trade derivatives, whatever those are.

Can't speak for anyone else, but as an OD for 10 years I can assure you that I am NOT filthy rich and I also spent years and years and hundreds of thousands of dollars going to school and buying my practice. For all of that, I'm responsible for the visual welfare of the population. What is a reasonable expectation for a return on my investment, and for taking on that kind of responsibility?

For us optometrists, I don't see this bill affecting us much as a whole, as long as we keep up with our lobby and get our voices heard loud and clear in Washington! Solo practitioners may have to work longer hours, but on the up side, more and more people in our communities will be able to SEE!!!

You can get an eye exam in virtually all areas of the country within an hours drive and within two days for less than $50. There's places in every corner of the country where you can get two pairs of glasses for $99. How much more affordable does it have to be?

Eye exams are relatively affordable too. We also have an advantage with the retail side of optometry. I don't think many OMD's would invest capital to open up a eye boutique.

Are you kidding me? More and more ophthalmologists are adding opticals to their practices every day.

Also, with Obamacare, reimbursment for primary care services may decrease to the point where ophthalmologists don't find it profitable to do "routine" eye exams, leaving the door open for optometrists. OMD's may start to concentrate more on surgery. But that's good, because if we have a patient walk in with a retinal detachment we're gonna need all you skilled OMDs!

How much in your mind are primary eye care services worth?

P.S. Today's government does NOT think we are too stupid to make our own choices nor does it want to control us. Don't be silly. Why wouldn't you want health coverage for yourself or your family? The government simply wants to ensure that everyone can receive adequate health coverage so that there can be more healthy, happy productive members of society, thus leading to a more stable and stronger economy in the future.

Should routine eye exams be included in that coverage? Why doesn't State Farm cover my routine oil changes or maintainence on my car?

 

[UAB2014]

lol. I'm not saying that Hannity and Rush are right-I'm merely pointing to the fact that there's something to be said for taking responsibility for YOURSELF in this country. This wonderful country was built on good old American hard work, initiative and pride! Captitalism and competition have driven the U.S to become the leader of the world in QUALITY of health care. If the immigrants coming into this country illegally want that "quality" care- then they need to stop entering illegally, and apply for citizenship just like any other. It is NOT our responsibility to handle the millions of illegals health needs after they arrive here in an illegal fashion, nor should quality of care in the U.S be jeapordized because of this problem. Just the same-it's not the hard working people of this countries responsibility to take support the other millions of people out there who, are in EVER facet of the word, lazy. A major focus of health care reform should be to try and provide for those who actually "deserve" coverage-those who can prove that they are at least trying to find work; and have a past record of doing good things for society; and possibly a coverage for those under a certain age, such as our children, when the parents have done nothing to better themselves or their families.

Oh-and as for Canada-you don't have people lying around on the streets and dying on the streets because you have a population of about 32 million. Trying to nationalize a healthcare system in a large country over over 300 million like the U.S will no doubt have a devistating effect on not only the ecomony-but the quality of our great nation's care.

, Auf Weidersehen.

 

[ibalz]

:troll:

 

[KHE]

lol. I'm not saying that Hannity and Rush are right-I'm merely pointing to the fact that there's something to be said for taking responsibility for YOURSELF in this country. This wonderful country was built on good old American hard work, initiative and pride! Captitalism and competition have driven the U.S to become the leader of the world in QUALITY of health care.

Let's of nice slogans there.

If the immigrants coming into this country illegally want that "quality" care- then they need to stop entering illegally, and apply for citizenship just like any other.

Do you honestly have any clue as to what is involved in the immigration process, and what one has to do to come here legally?

It is NOT our responsibility to handle the millions of illegals health needs after they arrive here in an illegal fashion, nor should quality of care in the U.S be jeapordized because of this problem. Just the same-it's not the hard working people of this countries responsibility to take support the other millions of people out there who, are in EVER facet of the word, lazy. A major focus of health care reform should be to try and provide for those who actually "deserve" coverage-those who can prove that they are at least trying to find work; and have a past record of doing good things for society; and possibly a coverage for those under a certain age, such as our children, when the parents have done nothing to better themselves or their families.

Ummmm.....isn't that what it does? Doesn't it try to help out the WORKING poor, who as I pointed out earlier are the ones getting screwed in our current system? Or should we continue selling the ziti dinners to pay for our liver transplants and our leukemia treatments? I mean, that's good ol' American capitalism and initiative there, right?

Oh-and as for Canada-you don't have people lying around on the streets and dying on the streets because you have a population of about 32 million. Trying to nationalize a healthcare system in a large country over over 300 million like the U.S will no doubt have a devistating effect on not only the ecomony-but the quality of our great nation's care.

A couple of things:

1) Canada does NOT have a national health care system. That's a common misconception.

2) The fact that Canada has 32 million people vs 300 million has no bearing on whether a health care system would work or not.

USA has approximately 10 times the population but takes in waaay more than 10 times the tax revenues. So again, if they wanted to come up with an affordable, sustainable system that covers everyone for at least the catastrophic stuff so we don't have millions of uninsured and underinsured going bankrupt and selling ziti dinners, they could but of course, they don't have the political will.

 

[UAB2014]

Sorry KHE - I just don't agree with you. I appreciate your argument-and your desire to help people in need-but it's just my opinion that the administration in power right now is trying to "change" America for the worst; especially when it comes to health care.

As a future optometrist I have to start evaluating my future in our health care system ofcourse... and my perception as to what is good and in the best interest for my future patients. But-I guess there's one thing that we CAN agree on, that at least we are both in a country where it is legal for one to express their own opinion on matters like this! : )

At least for now ; )

Take care and good talk!

 

[ibalz]

Sorry KHE - I just don't agree with you. I appreciate your argument-and your desire to help people in need-but it's just my opinion that the administration in power right now is trying to "change" America for the worst; especially when it comes to health care.

As a future optometrist I have to start evaluating my future in our health care system ofcourse... and my perception as to what is good and in the best interest for my future patients. But-I guess there's one thing that we CAN agree on, that at least we are both in a country where it is legal for one to express their own opinion on matters like this! : )

At least for now ; )

Take care and good talk!

So....you're going to check their immigration/naturalization status before you examine your patients? WAY TO GO!! Turn 'em away if their illegal (and self-paying because they have no coverage) shoot yourself in the foot.

 

[UAB2014]

Maybe you should have been nicer Ibanez... because you want some facts that NO one can disagree with... then you got em'...I'm sorry-what are the prereq requirements for PUCO again?Are you guys accredited? and if so-could you tell me again why on earth a cummulative GPA 2.0 or better doc would be good for the patients in ANY country? I would rather send my son or daughter's eyes to the emergency room any day than walk in and see that certificate on my "docs" wall. A bit of truth- So play nice ok!?Just a thought... Take care and goodluck with your career! : )

 

[ibalz]

Maybe you should have been nicer Ibanez... because you want some facts that NO one can disagree with... then you got em'...I'm sorry-what are the prereq requirements for PUCO again?Are you guys accredited? and if so-could you tell me again why on earth a cummulative GPA 2.0 or better doc would be good for the patients in ANY country? I would rather send my son or daughter's eyes to the emergency room any day than walk in and see that certificate on my "docs" wall. A bit of truth- So play nice ok!?Just a thought... Take care and goodluck with your career! : )

Come on, now - did you have to stoop that low? Since you don't take your own advice to play nice, let me address your points. I never made any personal attacks, but I feel I need to defend myself.

"... facts that NO one can disagree with... then you got 'em"

First off, get the name right.

UAB's entering class stats are just about equal to PUCO's (+.1 GPA for UAB, +14 pt OAT AA, +20 pt TS for PUCO).

Let's see: According to opted.org, Anatomy & Physiology, Organic 2, and/or Biochem are required for PUCO. UAB only has a strong recommendation for those classes. Hmmm. I suppose they aren't that important at UAB.

Oh and UAB has only been around for only 40 years. PUCO has been around since 1921 (originally as the North Pacific College of Optometry and Pacific University College of Optometry in 1945). Hmm, by my calculations, next year will be its 90th anniversary. If you had bothered to look up facts, you'd know very well that PUCO was accredited.

If you even knew what ER docs did, you'd realize that they do not perform routine eye examinations. Good luck getting anywhere with that. (Besides, aren't all those uninsured illegals using the ER as their primary source of healthcare? But I digress... )

FYI, I'm coming into PUCO with a 3.69 cum GPA (3.96 prereq GPA) and a 320 OAT. What are you entering with?

According to your own post:
"OAT:

320: AA
320: TS

GPA:3.2
Pre-req GPA: 3.5"

Do you even realize how ridiculous your post was? Did you just mindlessly respond, or did you even take the time to compose a well-thought out, coherent response? From the looks of your grammar and punctuation, it was most likely the former.

Look, we're entitled to our opinions, but please refrain from the personal attacks. Oh - you might also want to get your facts straight before you make a fool of yourself in your narrow minded posts. If you did play nice in the first place, I wouldn't have come down so hard on you.

Good day, sir.

 

[UAB2014]

That was certainly quite a lashing you gave me! hehe

As for my GPA: I am 30 and started my college career with a 1.0 GPA for my first two years of school because partying was MUCH more fun than school at 18-20!! : ) I worked after that-then went back to school in 2005.. where for the next 4 years I did a little better at a 3.91. If I had not-believe me- UAB would have had nothing of it.

And as for UAB- the professors of optometry there have written over 80% of all texts used in optometry schools now-bet ya didn't know that (Not too bad for a bunch of southern bumpkins eh!? ha) They are also the #1 funded optometry school in the nation in research grants, have the highest entering freshman GPA in the nation, are one of the most competitive acceptance rate schools (with a class size of 40-45) ...etc..etc..etc...

And as for you: I truly thought that PUCO was the school in Puerto Rico-which is why you'd have such a love for third-world illegal aliens and their "rights". Sorry for mistaking your school and your amazing GPA!!

Just for all the trouble- I should send you a book on "the constitution" ... Maybe you could work up a book report on it?? Maybe you'd learn something about the rights given and not given to the federal government and the power of the states....


Good luck with your future as an optometrist and goodluck treating all of those illegals at Walmart my friend! : )

, Adios

 

[ibalz]

That was certainly quite a lashing you gave me! hehe

As for my GPA: I am 30 and started my college career with a 1.0 GPA for my first two years of school because partying was MUCH more fun than school at 18-20!! : ) I worked after that-then went back to school in 2005.. where for the next 4 years I did a little better at a 3.91. If I had not-believe me- UAB would have had nothing of it.

And as for UAB- the professors of optometry there have written over 80% of all texts used in optometry schools now-bet ya didn't know that (Not too bad for a bunch of southern bumpkins eh!? ha) They are also the #1 funded optometry school in the nation in research grants, have the highest entering freshman GPA in the nation, are one of the most competitive acceptance rate schools (with a class size of 40-45) ...etc..etc..etc...

And as for you: I truly thought that PUCO was the school in Puerto Rico-which is why you'd have such a love for third-world illegal aliens and their "rights". Sorry for mistaking your school and your amazing GPA!!

Just for all the trouble- I should send you a book on "the constitution" ... Maybe you could work up a book report on it?? Maybe you'd learn something about the rights given and not given to the federal government and the power of the states....


Good luck with your future as an optometrist and goodluck treating all of those illegals at Walmart my friend! : )

, Adios

Thank you for realizing your error. I didn't realize that you were under the impression that I was going to attend the school in P.R.

That aside - last time I checked, Puerto Rico is a protected United States territory, as is Guam. Puerto Ricans are citizens of the United States, not third world illegals. Again, you might want to check your facts.

I realize that this is going nowhere. No matter what I say, you won't stop watching Fox "News", or listening to that opiate addict Rush, or those idiots Beck, Hannity, & Levin.

Oh well. Guess we'll leave it at that.

 

[RTM]

A system in which people can recieve care- no matter what, is great in theory, but impossible to implement without a severe breaking of the entire economy... not to mention another valid argument...Should EVERYONE recieve free care...even if they have no desires to work-no legal citizenship, and no ambition to put forth any effort whatsoever to add in any socially positive way to society. Now THAT is a sweet deal and quite the inncentive for people to get up off that couch, start promoting family-planning programs, and to add to American culture and American way don't ya think!!?? (Can you feel the sarcasm?)

Also, I just LOVE the idea that the U.S government will be able to penalize me for not attaining health care coverage... just another small baby step in the push for Obama's Socialist agenda... that "we are the government, and we know what's in your best interest because you are too stupid to make your own choices in life."

lol. I'm not saying that Hannity and Rush are right-I'm merely pointing to the fact that there's something to be said for taking responsibility for YOURSELF in this country. This wonderful country was built on good old American hard work, initiative and pride! Captitalism and competition have driven the U.S to become the leader of the world in QUALITY of health care. If the immigrants coming into this country illegally want that "quality" care- then they need to stop entering illegally, and apply for citizenship just like any other. It is NOT our responsibility to handle the millions of illegals health needs after they arrive here in an illegal fashion, nor should quality of care in the U.S be jeapordized because of this problem. Just the same-it's not the hard working people of this countries responsibility to take support the other millions of people out there who, are in EVER facet of the word, lazy. A major focus of health care reform should be to try and provide for those who actually "deserve" coverage-those who can prove that they are at least trying to find work; and have a past record of doing good things for society; and possibly a coverage for those under a certain age, such as our children, when the parents have done nothing to better themselves or their families.

Oh-and as for Canada-you don't have people lying around on the streets and dying on the streets because you have a population of about 32 million. Trying to nationalize a healthcare system in a large country over over 300 million like the U.S will no doubt have a devistating effect on not only the ecomony-but the quality of our great nation's care.

, Auf Weidersehen.

Wow. When I was a student, I thought I knew everything too. I soon found out that I had a lot to learn.

 

[RTM]

That was certainly quite a lashing you gave me! hehe

As for my GPA: I am 30 and started my college career with a 1.0 GPA for my first two years of school because partying was MUCH more fun than school at 18-20!! : ) I worked after that-then went back to school in 2005.. where for the next 4 years I did a little better at a 3.91. If I had not-believe me- UAB would have had nothing of it.

And as for UAB- the professors of optometry there have written over 80% of all texts used in optometry schools now-bet ya didn't know that (Not too bad for a bunch of southern bumpkins eh!? ha) They are also the #1 funded optometry school in the nation in research grants, have the highest entering freshman GPA in the nation, are one of the most competitive acceptance rate schools (with a class size of 40-45) ...etc..etc..etc...

And as for you: I truly thought that PUCO was the school in Puerto Rico-which is why you'd have such a love for third-world illegal aliens and their "rights". Sorry for mistaking your school and your amazing GPA!!

Just for all the trouble- I should send you a book on "the constitution" ... Maybe you could work up a book report on it?? Maybe you'd learn something about the rights given and not given to the federal government and the power of the states....


Good luck with your future as an optometrist and goodluck treating all of those illegals at Walmart my friend! : )

, Adios

For such a nationalist, you sure utilize "alien" languages often.
?Ha viajado a sobre nuestra frontera? Creo que no. Ud. me averguenza. Gracias.

 

[JeffChou]

Also, I just LOVE the idea that the U.S government will be able to penalize me for not attaining health care coverage... just another small baby step in the push for Obama's Socialist agenda... that "we are the government, and we know what's in your best interest because you are too stupid to make your own choices in life."

Like I said... "Welcome to France!!!"
Or Germany if ya like... "Guten Tag!!"

I don't like the requirement for everyone to have health coverage, especially the penalties, but it seems like an entire industry of corporate insurer heels were skipping the moment Obama considered requiring all Americans to be covered. Nothing could please the private insurance industry more than for every American to be a potential customer, by force.

It seems like there are many benefits to the new healthcare bill. People with pre-existing conditions won't be dropped or denied the coverage they need most desperately. I'm all for the increased competition this may bring. The gov. is not shutting out all private insurers, it's just making insurance exchanges and ensuring portability so we have more choices. One of the biggest problems I see with health insurance is rising premiums, dropping policies retroactively, and denying coverage to people. It's absurd to think that the insurance you pay for year after year can just drop you when it decides you're too sick and unprofitable. Oh and the millions of people who don't or can't afford coverage that really just add up to about 10% of the US population will be able to get some sort of insurance.

Anyway, regarding your statement above, don't forget what the moral right has been trying to shove down everyone's throats time and time again. "We are the government and we know whats best for you because you are too immoral to make your own decision in life." (see prohibition, prop 8)

 

[achirum]

That was certainly quite a lashing you gave me! hehe

As for my GPA: I am 30 and started my college career with a 1.0 GPA for my first two years of school because partying was MUCH more fun than school at 18-20!! : ) I worked after that-then went back to school in 2005.. where for the next 4 years I did a little better at a 3.91. If I had not-believe me- UAB would have had nothing of it.

And as for UAB- the professors of optometry there have written over 80% of all texts used in optometry schools now-bet ya didn't know that (Not too bad for a bunch of southern bumpkins eh!? ha) They are also the #1 funded optometry school in the nation in research grants, have the highest entering freshman GPA in the nation, are one of the most competitive acceptance rate schools (with a class size of 40-45) ...etc..etc..etc...

And as for you: I truly thought that PUCO was the school in Puerto Rico-which is why you'd have such a love for third-world illegal aliens and their "rights". Sorry for mistaking your school and your amazing GPA!!

Just for all the trouble- I should send you a book on "the constitution" ... Maybe you could work up a book report on it?? Maybe you'd learn something about the rights given and not given to the federal government and the power of the states....


Good luck with your future as an optometrist and goodluck treating all of those illegals at Walmart my friend! : )

, Adios

Actually, no, they don't.

 

[KHE]

Sorry KHE - I just don't agree with you. I appreciate your argument-and your desire to help people in need-but it's just my opinion that the administration in power right now is trying to "change" America for the worst; especially when it comes to health care.

You're clearly not an Obama supporter. That's fine. I'm not either.

But right now, we have millions of people in our country not insured, or underinsured with many many more likely to be uninsured as premiums continue to skyrocket. Medical bills are by far and away the leading cause of bankruptcy. GM is destroyed, largely on the back of health insurance costs.

So then your suggestions are what?

 

[eyestrain]

You're clearly not an Obama supporter. That's fine. I'm not either.

But right now, we have millions of people in our country not insured, or underinsured with many many more likely to be uninsured as premiums continue to skyrocket. Medical bills are by far and away the leading cause of bankruptcy. GM is destroyed, largely on the back of health insurance costs.

So then your suggestions are what?

Lemme guess.....tort reform?

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Lemme guess.....tort reform?

That's part of it certainly. Controlling costs (which should include tort reform) won't fix everything, but its a nice start.

 

[opto2be]

Would tort reform help optometry? How expensive is malpractice insurance for optometrists?

 

[SSOPT]

Like many people, I dont know what the answer to health care reform is either. It is horrible when you hear about loved ones being let go because of their recently acquired illness.
And after going on school screenings and seeing elderly people who clearly needed to come to the clinic, telling me "no can do, dont have insurance", its upsetting.
That being said, on the other hand--- coming out of school with debt, and after working hard for undergrad, od school etc I want to make money and I dont want this bill to shape up in a way that now I am being reimbursed less and less because afterall WHO DO YOU THINK IS GOING TO PAY FOR ALL OF THESE PATIENTS? The money is going to come from somewhere. According to the bill if you make over 250k (combined household) your paying. And that is something I cant swallow. My parents came from food stamps and built their business from nothing, and now after decades of hard work they have to pay healthcare for the poor? I see way too many people, and know way too many people that are too lazy to get jobs, that are just riding the unemployment checks, but hey, thanks Obama, well pay for them to get healthcare too!
Its all too backwards.. I dont want to be a complainer nor do I want to really say NO HEALTHCARE FOR THE POOR BUT I think the "liberals" and the Obama fans need to get their heads outta the clouds and read between the lines.. this isnt all rainbows.

 

[KHE]

Like many people, I dont know what the answer to health care reform is either. It is horrible when you hear about loved ones being let go because of their recently acquired illness.
And after going on school screenings and seeing elderly people who clearly needed to come to the clinic, telling me "no can do, dont have insurance", its upsetting.
That being said, on the other hand--- coming out of school with debt, and after working hard for undergrad, od school etc I want to make money and I dont want this bill to shape up in a way that now I am being reimbursed less and less because afterall WHO DO YOU THINK IS GOING TO PAY FOR ALL OF THESE PATIENTS? The money is going to come from somewhere. According to the bill if you make over 250k (combined household) your paying. And that is something I cant swallow. My parents came from food stamps and built their business from nothing, and now after decades of hard work they have to pay healthcare for the poor? I see way too many people, and know way too many people that are too lazy to get jobs, that are just riding the unemployment checks, but hey, thanks Obama, well pay for them to get healthcare too!
Its all too backwards.. I dont want to be a complainer nor do I want to really say NO HEALTHCARE FOR THE POOR BUT I think the "liberals" and the Obama fans need to get their heads outta the clouds and read between the lines.. this isnt all rainbows.

Well now, wait a minute here.

Your parents came from "food stamps?" What is that, if not a government hand out? You taking out student loans? Sounds like another government program to me too.

Also, you say you know many people who are too lazy to get jobs and are just riding the unemployment checks but I would imagine that they've been doing it for longer than Obama's been in office.

I'm not an Obama supporter at all, but please....let's be a bit honest here. It's not as if we didn't have welfare queens or people abusing the system all throughout the Bush and Reagan years as well.

 

[dontlikephysics]

KHE, I think the point is that unmotivated people who sit around and do nothing all day are getting health care coverage and those that work and make a certain amount have to pay for it.
I think that the bill does not favor the hard working single parents who work double shifts and are do everything in their power to get by. These are the people who have my support and should get help, not the lazy people who don't try. If your not trying, then you wont get any sympathy from me.

 

[hiisociety]

KHE, I think the point is that unmotivated people who sit around and do nothing all day are getting health care coverage and those that work and make a certain amount have to pay for it.
I think that the bill does not favor the hard working single parents who work double shifts and are do everything in their power to get by. These are the people who have my support and should get help, not the lazy people who don't try. If your not trying, then you wont get any sympathy from me.

I concur; I'm tired of seeing folks who does nothing and take advantage of all the "benefits" that the system can offer them, then ask for more!!! And many families who are struggling to get by get no help whatsoever. =(