Help choosing jobs (also rate my jobs)

[Papamusk]

I am doing a cardiac fellowship and debating between these two jobs. Wondering if people can chime in what they think.

1. Midwest rural small town. Small private practice group. Salary around 700K +/- 50k (looked into the books, appear legit and stable). Vacation 3 weeks (this must be the catch?). Weekly hours around 50/week. Call frequency is 10 weekends and about 45 weekdays based on # of providers. ACT model. barebone benefits.

2. Midwest rural small town. Medium size private practice group. salary 500k +/- 50K. Vacation 12 weeks. 2 years partnership track (375k /year). Fair group. About 6 weekend calls and 27 weekday calls based on number of people available. Avg. hrs per week 45-50. Full spectrum anesthesia including cardiac. ACT model. barebone benefits as well.

What would you pick? Should I ask any other questions? Any red flags I am not seeing?

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[MirrorTodd]

I'm not currently searching as I'm in the Army, but 3 weeks vacation is less than we get in the military. What's the sense in making 700k if you can't use it to enjoy the world?

 

[IMGASMD]

You should start another rate my job thread. That generated a lot of discussions.

Are you doing any cardiac in the first job? When you say ACT, what’s the supervision ratio? Any partnership track buy ins for first job? Schedule? Blended unit? Who controls the schedule if it’s eat what you kill.

3 weeks is awfully little. On average, I’d say 6 weeks to start and up to 8 after full partner. I’d figure about 10-15k/week for salary. I’d value first job at 650 (700-15*3) rather than 700. Still better than 500, but you will be burned out soon. Maybe it’s good to make the money while the sun still shines.

I picked the lowest paying job when I first came out. But we had good benefit. Full insurance for family, maximum corporate contribution after a year, some business expanses, malpractice (not occurrence, the name escapes me).

I liked the location, I liked the schedule....
let us know!

 

[NICMAN]

The second job--No contest.

 

[GassYous]

3 weeks of vacation wtf?
3 weeks in a row is not enough
8 weeks minimum

My job is similar to job 2 and I am pretty happy.

 

[MirrorTodd]

What are people doing these days yo find jobs? Word of mouth? Cold call wherever you want to live? Gasworks? Recruiters?

 

[deleted162650]

What are people doing these days yo find jobs? Word of mouth? Cold call wherever you want to live? Gasworks? Recruiters?

Word of mouth/connections is almost always your best bet.

I’d imagine you’re pretty much just gonna get told where you’re working though right?

 

[MirrorTodd]

Word of mouth/connections is almost always your best bet.

I’d imagine you’re pretty much just gonna get told where you’re working though right?

Ya but I'm gettin out after 4 years unless medicine changes dramatically in that time. Plus I'm definitely gonna wanna moonlight asap.

 

[deleted162650]

Ya but I'm gettin out after 4 years unless medicine changes dramatically in that time. Plus I'm definitely gonna wanna moonlight asap.

How close will you be to retirement after you repay your 4? You’re prior enlisted right?

 

[jthedestroyr]

I am doing a cardiac fellowship and debating between these two jobs. Wondering if people can chime in what they think.

1. Midwest rural small town. Small private practice group. Salary around 700K +/- 50k (looked into the books, appear legit and stable). Vacation 3 weeks (this must be the catch?). Weekly hours around 50/week. Call frequency is 10 weekends and about 45 weekdays based on # of providers. ACT model. barebone benefits.

2. Midwest rural small town. Medium size private practice group. salary 500k +/- 50K. Vacation 12 weeks. 2 years partnership track (375k /year). Fair group. About 6 weekend calls and 27 weekday calls based on number of people available. Avg. hrs per week 45-50. Full spectrum anesthesia including cardiac. ACT model. barebone benefits as well.

What would you pick? Should I ask any other questions? Any red flags I am not seeing?

Trust me, the vacation is totally worth it.

Making that much and not having any vacation, you'll burn out.

 

[MirrorTodd]

How close will you be to retirement after you repay your 4? You’re prior enlisted right?

Like 9 years. My prior time was mostly reserves which doesn't translate over to active time unfortunately. Plus I'm out of the high 20/30 retirement system already.

 

[vector2]

I am doing a cardiac fellowship and debating between these two jobs. Wondering if people can chime in what they think.

1. Midwest rural small town. Small private practice group. Salary around 700K +/- 50k (looked into the books, appear legit and stable). Vacation 3 weeks (this must be the catch?). Weekly hours around 50/week. Call frequency is 10 weekends and about 45 weekdays based on # of providers. ACT model. barebone benefits.

2. Midwest rural small town. Medium size private practice group. salary 500k +/- 50K. Vacation 12 weeks. 2 years partnership track (375k /year). Fair group. About 6 weekend calls and 27 weekday calls based on number of people available. Avg. hrs per week 45-50. Full spectrum anesthesia including cardiac. ACT model. barebone benefits as well.

What would you pick? Should I ask any other questions? Any red flags I am not seeing?

#2 no question. If you are taking call and you actually gotta work during those calls, 6 weeks off is the bare, bare minimum you need for your sanity. Also with job 2, are you able to sell back some of those weeks of vaca and work if you want to?

 

[secretasianman]

Number 2 no brainer.

 

[AdmiralChz]

Job 2.

For Job 1... Also consider that although you can take 3 weeks PTO, the group is probably so tight that only 1 person gets off at a time. So you may not even really get a choice of which week you get off (certainly won’t get holidays as the newbie). Don’t be blinded by the money - they are making that much by being ultra lean (if they indeed are making that much at all). They may be a few bad pandemic days (forced staff quarantines) away from not being able to cover their contract.

 

[Papamusk]

You should start another rate my job thread. That generated a lot of discussions.

Are you doing any cardiac in the first job? When you say ACT, what’s the supervision ratio? Any partnership track buy ins for first job? Schedule? Blended unit? Who controls the schedule if it’s eat what you kill.

3 weeks is awfully little. On average, I’d say 6 weeks to start and up to 8 after full partner. I’d figure about 10-15k/week for salary. I’d value first job at 650 (700-15*3) rather than 700. Still better than 500, but you will be burned out soon. Maybe it’s good to make the money while the sun still shines.

I picked the lowest paying job when I first came out. But we had good benefit. Full insurance for family, maximum corporate contribution after a year, some business expanses, malpractice (not occurrence, the name escapes me).

I liked the location, I liked the schedule....
let us know!

Thank you. I am leaning more toward Job 2 because of hubby's family. As far as rating job goes, how would you rate job 1 and 2 on scale of 1 to 10?

 

[Papamusk]

Word of mouth/connections is almost always your best bet.

I’d imagine you’re pretty much just gonna get told where you’re working though right?

a couple PM me asking how i find these jobs ... yes it was all word of mouth. I have a good relationship with my upperclassman. and I kept in touch with them after they graduated. Academic attendings weren't as helpful with job search in terms of connection.

 

[Papamusk]

Job 2.

For Job 1... Also consider that although you can take 3 weeks PTO, the group is probably so tight that only 1 person gets off at a time. So you may not even really get a choice of which week you get off (certainly won’t get holidays as the newbie). Don’t be blinded by the money - they are making that much by being ultra lean (if they indeed are making that much at all). They may be a few bad pandemic days (forced staff quarantines) away from not being able to cover their contract.

I did have impression job 1 is super lean. Most partners only take vacation if schedule allows it. In either case If you have to rate job 2 (1 to 10) and its components (salary, vacation ect), how would u rate it?

 

[IMGASMD]

Thank you. I am leaning more toward Job 2 because of hubby's family. As far as rating job goes, how would you rate job 1 and 2 on scale of 1 to 10?

Are you making 700 right away? You have kids, family, hubby?
Supervision ratio? Is it one of those shops that will run QZ when you’re there?

One of my chiefs got a job, that started around 5 but goes up to whatever.... that runs qz to no end. BUT he get 12+ weeks of vacation. They work you, but at least they also value your time off....

Just with what you presented?
Job 1 3
Job 2 6

On the scale of 2-9

 

[Papamusk]

Are you making 700 right away? You have kids, family, hubby?
Supervision ratio? Is it one of those shops that will run QZ when you’re there?

One of my chiefs got a job, that started around 5 but goes up to whatever.... that runs qz to no end. BUT he get 12+ weeks of vacation. They work you, but at least they also value your time off....

Just with what you presented?
Job 1 3
Job 2 6

On the scale of 2-9

thanks. No kids married. Supervision ratio is 1:4 for both jobs.

 

[dabears505]

I would definitely do job 1 coming out of residency. You are already used to 3 weeks off at this point and those work hours. Keep that up 3 years and you will have a lot of freedom to do what you want having made that kind of money.

 

[Papamusk]

I would definitely do job 1 coming out of residency. You are already used to 3 weeks off at this point and those work hours. Keep that up 3 years and you will have a lot of freedom to do what you want having made that kind of money.

and then look for something like Job 2....

 

[vector2]

thanks. No kids married. Supervision ratio is 1:4 for both jobs.

What's the ratio when one of your rooms is a pump case?

 

[Papamusk]

What's the ratio when one of your rooms is a pump case?

For job 2, I believe 2 rooms supervision for cardiac. Normally pump case plus a cathlab or a slow room. For job 1, not sure.

 

[deleted126335]

For job 2, I believe 2 rooms supervision for cardiac. Normally pump case plus a cathlab or a slow room. For job 1, not sure.

If you are young, strong, and hungry and can suck up a few more tough years- job1 at least for a few years. Make hay while the sun shines.
Two points- make sure that the spouse is on board and you don’t expand your lifestyle too much. Make hay while the sun is shining. If you kinda feel like you have arrived and want to smell the roses a little bit- job 2.

 

[dhb]

Both jobs are pretty much the same : #1 i calculate 285$/h
#2 277$/h

280 for 4/1 is a bad deal 3/10 for both

 

[anbuitachi]

#2 hands down. 3 weeks is not enough.
even at 700k, once you break highest tier, taxes eat away most of it. just not worth it if you have no time to use the money.
if you choose job 1.. its likely to be a short term job (few years maybe)

 

[Papamusk]

Both jobs are pretty much the same : #1 i calculate 285$/h
#2 277$/h

280 for 4/1 is a bad deal 3/10 for both

Is it just me or this is really harsh? Can you describe your job? its helpful for us fresh grads when looking for a job to know what is a good job (more details the better). Thank you.

 

[dhb]

Is it just me or this is really harsh? Can you describe your job? its helpful for us fresh grads when looking for a job to know what is a good job (more details the better). Thank you.

I just wanted to put things in perspective since people are saying 2 is so much better that 1 when really they are same jobs with more or less vacation.
I was going to post mine in the private forum but roughly it's 25 on 27 off 350k (but i have some overhead) 45h/week in house, home call no OB.
So closer to 300€/h but i'm not supervising 4 rooms

 

[doctalaughs]

Not to derail the conversation but I was always curious what “12 weeks off” in a hospital based specialty like anesthesiology meant.

Does that mean 12 weeks x 7 days/week where you aren’t working a regular shift, on-call or post call? Or do you also get regular days/weekend days off on a normal basis?

Curious since I’m in a more 8-5 M-F specialty, so taking 4-5 weeks off per year is more the norm even amoung partners (since obviously “on” times are less taxing).

 

[Southpaw]

Not to derail the conversation but I was always curious what “12 weeks off” in a hospital based specialty like anesthesiology meant.

Does that mean 12 weeks x 7 days/week where you aren’t working a regular shift, on-call or post call? Or do you also get regular days/weekend days off on a normal basis?

Curious since I’m in a more 8-5 M-F specialty, so taking 4-5 weeks off per year is more the norm even amoung partners (since obviously “on” times are less taxing).

Typically means 12 weeks with both weekends bookended of no work responsibility. Days/weekends off vary but most people are not getting routine weekdays off unless they’re postcall. Most of us share weekend duty evenly in our group, and 1 weekend per every 4-8 weekends is probably fair/average. This is all assuming you’re in a call taking partner position in private practice.

 

[Southpaw]

I am doing a cardiac fellowship and debating between these two jobs. Wondering if people can chime in what they think.

1. Midwest rural small town. Small private practice group. Salary around 700K +/- 50k (looked into the books, appear legit and stable). Vacation 3 weeks (this must be the catch?). Weekly hours around 50/week. Call frequency is 10 weekends and about 45 weekdays based on # of providers. ACT model. barebone benefits.

2. Midwest rural small town. Medium size private practice group. salary 500k +/- 50K. Vacation 12 weeks. 2 years partnership track (375k /year). Fair group. About 6 weekend calls and 27 weekday calls based on number of people available. Avg. hrs per week 45-50. Full spectrum anesthesia including cardiac. ACT model. barebone benefits as well.

What would you pick? Should I ask any other questions? Any red flags I am not seeing?

I’d want to like #2 more. 1 seems like a grind unless I’m missing something.

 

[chocomorsel]

I just wanted to put things in perspective since people are saying 2 is so much better that 1 when really they are same jobs with more or less vacation.
I was going to post mine in the private forum but roughly it's 25 on 27 off 350k (but i have some overhead) 45h/week in house, home call no OB.
So closer to 300€/h but i'm not supervising 4 rooms

So you only work 25 weeks a year? If so, how many hours during those weeks?

 

[dhb]

So you only work 25 weeks a year? If so, how many hours during those weeks?

It's 26 on 26 off but technically nothing happens the 2 weeks of Christmas and New year. 45h in house