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Help! I'm entering college this fall..which college: Umich, Northwestern, or UCSB?!?!

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by mv540, Aug 13, 2002.

  1. mv540

    mv540 Junior Member

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    Hi! I am a recent high school graduate in Michigan. I sent in SIR (deposits) to three schools: Northwestern, University of Michigan, and University of California-Santa Barbara. I was wondering which school I should attend if i were to do pre-med. I plan to major in Political Science, psych or econ. The problem is that I am afraid that the competition at Northwestern might be too hard and I might not obtain the GPA I would like. I believe I am in the bottom half of the entering class at NU. People might think if I got in, I must be smart enough to handle it. Honestly, people say that everybody worries about their abilities, but for me..i had to work three times as hard in high school in my ap classes to obtain a 3.6 gpa (low factoring in all the work I put into my studies). I think I burned myself out in high school trying to get into a prestigious college. Anyway, all that explanation is to show that my abilities is not up to NU standards. I know I won't fail out, but I'm afraid that I won't get that gpa of at least 3.6 there. I also don't want to burn myself out in college too. I know I have to work as a pre-med, but I don't want to be working 24/7 as in high school. I want to enjoy my experience. Now...I was thinking if I got to UCSB though, I could obtain a higher GPA and become higher class rank. Plus I would have a better quality of life there.I heard that gpa is really important and it doesn't matter what school you go to. I have done many research ( reading medical admissions book, talking to pre-med, my doctor, etc) and I still don't know what I should do. And also, I think UM would be a better fit for me (I like the school spirit and the atmosphere). But my friends that is attending NU this fall said that the reputation of NU is far better than UM. Other people I talk to feel its comparable. So does reputation count that much...if it does...is UM and NU about the same then? Anyway, these are my questions that are swirling in my head constantly (I have to make a choice soon-two weeks till UMich starts!). If you get a chance, would you guys mind helping me out? Thanks so much for everything!

    Sincerely,
    Mike
     
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  3. Adcadet

    Adcadet Long way from Gate 27
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    bla bla bla....

    where will you be happiest? Which school has the best environment for you to learn in?

    I was accepted to my dream college (U of Chicago), but turned it down for a small, private college because I knew I'd be much more confortable at the small private college. Do I regret it? Yes, every day. Perhaps if I had gone to U of Chicago I would have worked my ass off and pulled a 3.9 GPA at a school with a great reputation and gotten straight into med school (as oppsed to not getting into med schol the first try, and now have to reapply after doing an MPH in Epidemiology). But I'm happier I went the route I did.
     
  4. none

    none 1K Member
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    I think Santa Barbara is the most beautiful UC. I'm an SD grad...but SB, wow you're actually at the beach!
     
  5. pbehzad

    pbehzad Faddayy
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    michigan is extremely big, now if you can get to know profs well then go to mich. dont underestimate your abilities, but northwestern is a tough school but an extremely good school. i dont know much about ucsb.
    i think name will matter some. i think umich would be the best cause you are going to a great public school with a great college atmosphere. i dont think northwestern is all that much better than umich. umich is one of the top 5 public schools in nation.
    think for a sec ann arbor on a fall saturday afternoon, no place like the big house.
     
  6. matthew0126

    matthew0126 Anaheim Angels
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    UCSB is actually ranked in the top50 of universities nationwide (just looked it up -- #48, tied with U. Texas), but it has near zero name recognition I guess because it is overshadowed by the five more presitigious UC's.

    I know some people will disagree with me, but unfortunately reputation does make a difference when you are applying. Some medical schools not so much, other schools, a lot. You can definitely go to med school if you go to a lesser known school, but it's easier if you go to a upper-ranked school. so I'd go to umich or northwestern -- don't underestimate yourself. If you were accepted, that means you are qualified to excel at the school. Now it's up to you to put in the hard work.

    Good luck!
     
  7. exigente chica

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    Sorry that u regret your decision. I also turned down and ivy for a small private school and am loving every second:love:

    I think that you have to go where you are more comfortable and will be the happiest!! If you are happy, then the rest will fall into place. I think you should make your decision and no one else, be confident in yourself!! College is not that hard and you have lots of free time unlike HS

    Good Luck
     
  8. CoffeeCat

    CoffeeCat SDN Angel
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    Oh yes, and welcome to SDN and I PM'd you - go to "user cp" and then "private messages" or a special screen might pop up when you sign on.
     
  9. Lolly

    Lolly Junior Member
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    definitely go where you would be the happiest!!!! a happy person is a successful person. ask yourself: where was i the most comfortable with my surroundings? where did i see/meet people that i would enjoy being with? dont allow your insecurities to control your choices.

    thats my two cents :)
     
  10. ckent

    ckent Membership Revoked
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    I don't know anything about UCSB, but between Northwestern and Michigan, I would choose NOrthwestern only because I know Michigan was way too overcrowded when I visited there (6 yrs ago). Don't know if too much has changed, but just remember that your college won't get you into medical school, it will depend on your hard work. So if there is significant difference in financial aid, that might be something to consider as well.
     
  11. dara678

    dara678 Hello Kitty Fan
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    Hi there!

    I'm going to be a junior at Northwestern, and let me tell you it's pretty tough. Organic chem and bio are the toughest classes they have here, particularly because there are so many darn premeds. However, I think no matter where you go you have to work hard anyway, if you plan on being a doctor. If you have the drive and the dedication, it really shouldn't matter where you go. Being here at Northwestern, however, has challenged me to grow in so many ways ... in the end, something that challenges you may be more valuable than something that comes too easily. College is a whole lot different from high school, but no matter where you go you'll learn to be happy.

    Although, I must put in one plug for NU: Lake Michigan is AWESOME! The campus is so beautiful and there are lots of ducks waddling around. :)
     
  12. Ibrahim05

    Ibrahim05 Member
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    NU without a doubt, just dont be an engineer. And how did you get away with having deposit at 3 schools for this long?
     
  13. PrincessCKNY

    PrincessCKNY Crown Royal Member
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    For a good time, call UCSB. ;)
     
  14. WakeMedHeel

    WakeMedHeel Senior Member
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    Go to the college where you are going to have the most fun. You're only 18 to 22 once in your life...enjoy those years and quit worrying about grades so much.
     
  15. mv540

    mv540 Junior Member

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    hey y'all. THanks for your help so far.

    pbehzad- what do you mean "the big house"?
    Also, what factors of UM makes it better than NU? Is it the social scene? SO prestige and academics are about the same?

    Mathew0126- IF repuatation does matter..is UM and NU very similar or is both much higher than UCSB, but one of then is much higher than the other? also I also see that your are from so cal. Do you know anything about USC? I might mid-year transfer there.

    ckent- Do you also think NU would give me more personal attention and the professors would know me more for teacher recs?

    dara- Do you mind if I get your e-mail? I would like to talk more about NU. YOu can pm it.

    Ibrahim_ I just had to send in the money. I thought this was okay...is it not allowed or something.

    princess-why UCSB? DId you go there or know about it fairly well? Thanks!

    exigente, none,lolly,wake and adcadet- Thanks for your help

    coffeecat- I will be e-mailing you

    Thanks again for everybody helping me. THis is a cool and supporting community. Anybody else have any opinions too? Thanks again.
     
  16. Jonkst

    Jonkst Senior Member
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    I'm a premed at NU, and I would have to agree that Engineering is probably not the way to go if you're sure about Med school (Although I'm not sure of this, I haven't applied yet). Your GPA will be lower, but you also get the benefit of being engineering. Its great for those of us who would probably get the same (low) gpa regardless of our major. The social scene at NU is interesting, its a very greek school. I'm pretty familiar with UofM also, and its a great school, but easy to get lost in. Don't know anything about UCSB.

    Regardless, its a tough decision to make, and its hard to give advice since we don't really know you. You'll be fine wherever you go. There are a lot of slackers, even at the top schools, so coming in with a good work ethic can be a very beneficial (and rare) thing.

    Anyhow, feel free to PM me if you have any questions.
     
  17. laviddee

    laviddee Senior Member
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    Okay, i Have to stick up for my alma mater. so what if i'm biased! I went to michigan and will never ever regret it! I got accepted to both Northwestern and Michigan out of high school and chose Michigan. WhY???

    take a look at course offerings. Michigan has TONS of interesting and cool classes. I was able to double major in both Cell/molec bio as well as anthropology and took some of the coolest classes and interacted with leading professors out there. Michigan has probably the TOP GRAD SCHOOL programs in the nation which means you interact and learn from professors and grad students who are doing the latest and greatest research.

    TOO BIG??? i think that's the greatest strength. You can meet so many cool people from all over the world! But you can make the school small as well. I took a couple of advanced bio classes with less than 10 people in it! it's not a big deal. Sure there are large lectures for SOME of the classes like orgo or gen chem, but classes never get larger than the lecture hall. And you always have cool discussion groups and sections that make it smaller and more accessible.

    RESEARCH! Michigan has tons of more research opportunities than NOrthwestern. This is UNQUESTIONABLE. The medical campus and the undergrad campus are together, so you don't have to trek in order to get to the lab. And again, you can and will work with some of the greatest leaders in the field out there. I worked in the lab of the Director of the Cancer Center. You can bet that his recommendation has some weight. There scientific facilities are TOP NOTCH, i worked with high tech equipment and had the research money to INDEPENDENTLY do your own learning and research. This factor alone should make you want to go to michigan.

    Northwestern- yes it's pretty. but gosh, it's so small, that you just walk up and down that little strip of land to and from classes. Michigan is a CAMPUS. 3 dimensional, beautiful, ann arbor was ranked as the #5 place in all of america to live in. there are so many cool things to do!

    MiCHIGAN PRIDE! you will never see another school that fosters such great pride in its alumni. Many of my non michigan friends are sick to death of other michiganders who constantly hype about how great the school is. It's awesome that i can visit to NYC and an old couple will come up to me b/c i am wearing a Michigan shirt and will ask me when i graduated and will talk michigan football with me!

    REPUTATION- that guy who said NU has a far better reputation is obviously contained in a fishbowl and only concerned with his own reflection. Michigan is HIGHLY regarded EVERYWHERE and around the world. It's not something to worry about. If you think you're going to work harder at NU, you have no idea what michigan has in store for you. At michigan, there is ABSOLUTELY NO GRADE INFLATION. If you are average, you WILL GET A C. I pulled a lot of all nighters and definitely had to work. This ain't no private ivy league school, where once you get in, you get a B if you try hard.

    QUALITY OF LIFE. who cares most people say. but the breadth of people and the personalities you meet, combined with the vast array of programs, specialities, community interactions, and sports, makes michigan such a great place. Yeah so i'm biased, but being at michigan has been the best thing for me in my pursuits for med school. I'd definitely send and pay for all my kids to go there too just b/c i know they'd be happy there too.
     
  18. PrincessCKNY

    PrincessCKNY Crown Royal Member
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    I did not go to UCSB, but I can't help but be partial to all schools in California. Where else can you get access to the beaches, the mountains, and the desert?

    It doesn't really matter where you go. Choose where you will be happy. Whatever school you choose, make sure you tap every resource available to make your application to med school the best it can be.
     
  19. pcl

    pcl Senior Member
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    As another Michigan Alumnae, I would have to agree that there is no other school like it! Michigan does have an amazing network of people and connections which benefits you while in school, and after you finish. Whatever your interest, you can find it! After you finish, people know Michigan grads, it has the largest living alumni base of any school... and there is always a friendly alum around the corner when you least expect it... I heard "Oh you went to Michigan, great school!" at more than one interview.

    I enjoyed the "big school" atmosphere. There were always new people to meet. I didn't notice the cliques there, even in my program, as I do now in med school. I think mostly that is a function of size.

    Another factor which you should consider is cost. As an in-state student from michigan, the cost is so much more reasonable... You will have to take out big loans for medical school, why not save at least 60K and go instate. This doesn't seem like a big deal to you now, but I took out loans for undergrad and will take out 200K for med school... There is a big difference in what I would have had to take out to afford private undergraduate tuition...

    I would disagree that it is easy to get lost at Michigan... only if you want to get lost. I felt perfectly comfortable going to any professor and asking questions, etc. My classes became much smaller after my first year, and more like seminars. I usually knew about half of my class by my fourth year. I knew many of my professors and felt comfortable going to them and asking for letters even after working for a few years.

    The "Big House" is what we affectionately call our football stadium. It is the largest in the nation, and is an amazing place to spend a fall saturday with 110,000 other michigan fans.

    Michigan's Poli Sci program is pretty good also, according to my friendly poli sci major friends. I was an engineer, so I really don't know firsthand.

    Michigan also has the University Hospitals system within walking distance... and there are plenty of volunteer and research opportunities available. NU's medical campus is downtown chicago I believe, which makes it more difficult to easily volunteer.

    Congratulations and Good Luck with your choice. Pick where you will be happy.

    If you have questions about Michigan, please feel free to PM me.

    Go Blue!

    pcl
    CWRU-SOM MSII


     
  20. wgu

    wgu Senior Member
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    Okay so Ann Arbor's boring, but the school is still kickass in research.

    Pros
    -You should consider joining UROP in Residence for your first year if you're into medical research.
    -Also we have an excellent organic chemistry professor- http://www.umich.edu/%7Eurecord/0001/Mar26_01/2.htm look for Coppola. I had him for 2 semester and not only learned chemistry but techniques in learning itself. I swear if you stick with him for a year you won't have to worry about organic on the MCAT's. We went into some grad level stuff and physical organic chemistry.
    -There's also a neat introductory Engineering Biotechnology class if you're into BME.
    -If you're sticking with LSA Honors (I'm assuming you got into honors) it is pretty much considered Ivy level to the eyes of medical admissions. The honors stuff won't really hurt your GPA, it'll just give you more work.
    -Cheap as dirt education :D it is public and you're a michigan resident. Other people pay over 10 grand a year to come to Umich

    Cons
    The Umich hospital is overcrowded, don't expect to find a clinical position in there easily. You can volunteer though (if you don't mind)

    All in all I think Umich is the type of school for people who need to have room to expand. It is probably not as structured as a private school, but more hidden oppertunities await.
     
  21. torkd

    torkd New Member

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    i'm gonna be a jr at northwestern (chem major). i think attending nu is the best decision i've ever made.

    there are lots of reasons that i would say that, but the one that i'm most thankful for right now is the preparation i received for the mcat. the bio program is sooo difficult that you HAVE to study in order to get average, and you learn a hell of a lot. same goes for orgo, i didnt have to study orgo at all cause the chem major orgo class prepared me so well.

    i like the atmosphere here, its a nice sized school. you have the opportunity to meet alot of people that are at the same intellectual level, so its easier to relate to people in the dorm and such.

    and finally, i like the quarter system. altho sometimes i kinda feel overwhelmed (cause of the workload), i think its worth it, cause you have the opportunity to learn so much.

    so thats all i can think of and type right now.
     
  22. mv540

    mv540 Junior Member

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    Thanks so far

    hey for you guys went to UMich. lavidee said

    "At michigan, there is ABSOLUTELY NO GRADE INFLATION. If you are average, you WILL GET A C. I pulled a lot of all nighters and definitely had to work. This ain't no private ivy league school, where once you get in, you get a B if you try hard. "

    is this very true then? Would I have a more relaxed time at NOrthwestern then?

    hey wgu? NU sounds great so far..but do you think it compares to UMich social scene?

    So from the general feeling it seems like...
    -UMich would be more fun but
    -NU would be easier for me to get into med school
    and since it would be easier, it might be more fun for me personally since at Umich I might be constanly pulling all-nighters. Plus at NU I might get better academics because of small classes.
    - I like the town of ann arbor better but if NU will give me a better chance of getting into med school withougt stressing so much like the typical pre-emd, then should I just go to NU then? What do you michigan guys think (and everyone else)?

    Thanks so much for the help so far y'all!
     
  23. laviddee

    laviddee Senior Member
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    NO the name of NU vs Michigan will not get you a better chance into Med school. I promise you that. It's what you do in school that gets you in. I honestly believe that a 3.5 from Michigan has more weight than a 3.5 from NU. (but don't ask me for hard evidence :). Just a biased hunch! But the rest of the stuff I'll say is tight.

    I pulled all nighters b/c i wanted to do well. You can choose to do well or you can choose to slack off. that goes for any school. It's funny, I chose Michigan over NU precisely b/c i thought NU would worsen my chances at Med School. I went to NU for the overnight stay for admitted students, and a student told me how they weed out like crazy. They asked pre-med students to raise hands in one of the classes and said by the end of your 4 years, 3/4 of you will not be raising your hands. That made me want to go to michigan.

    Michigan is tough if you want it to be tough. It's easy if you want it to be easy. It's all about the classes you take. Just do well in the ones you have to do well in. You can always look at it from a lot of different angles and say, in sit A vs sit B, but seriously- go where you'll be happy.

    YOU WILL GET INTO MED SCHOOL if you want to go to med school. All it takes is dedication. in 30 years, when you're raking it in as a doctor, and you look back at what school you chose to go to, I guarantee that you will NEVER regret it if you choose Michigan. There's a spirit about Michigan and a pride in the Name that can't be taught in a classroom.

    even if you could care less about the 'spirit', go to michigan for the research. what's more important in med school admissions is WHAT YOU DO, NOT WHERE YOU GO. Why would you want to study in evanston and then commute an hour to the city to do medical research. The opportunities at michigan are plentiful if you take the initiative. The career center gives you tons of references and helps your path of medicine. they tell you what books to read, they video tape your practice interviews, look over personal statements, list out places to volunteer, and how to get hooked up with research.

    The guy who said NU prepared him for the mcat. That's great. but don't you think Michigan would too??? I could tell you my mcat score (>35) and shout that's the reason to go to Michigan over NU, but it shouldn't be the reason.
    Michigan teaches you how to learn and grow( I'm sure NU does too) . To fight the long nights and to work for the grade. If you're afraid of that, then don't go to michigan. Heck, if you're afraid of that, then you should perhaps reconsider a career in medicine.

    You know, go where you want. just don't choose something you think you'll regret. If you go to NU, just b/c you THINK the NAME will get you in, you are TOTALLY WRONG. and if you think that it's EASIER THERE... who knows.. an education is what you yourself make it. It's all based on what you put into it. you determine how hard or easy it will be.
    Can you learn at either school- yes. Can you get into med school from either school - yes. But you cannot get back what you may miss out in school culture, experience, and collegiate LIFE. If you choose based on these qualities, you won't have regrets. And that's why I'll say again, Go Blue.
     
  24. pbehzad

    pbehzad Faddayy
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    all this big 10 trash talkin between umich and nu. college football is definitely in the air. i dont go to umich or nu, but i can tell you 2 great schools. i think they both have top notch names. i think if you want a real college experience (which im not saying you cant get it at nu) umich is your best bet. i go to a "namey private" school and ill be a sophomore, but i think since i go to a private school im not as independent as i would be had i gone to my state school. both schools you are going to have to bust your butt to get good grades and i dont think nu is goin to be much easier than umich or vice versa. both schools have top students from around world.
    someone said that nu is "harvard of midwest", well im sure wash u-st.louis thinks the same thing. i know my school thinks its the "harvard of south". who cares that umich is public school and nu is private, they are both highly ranked and both highly prestigious schools. and though us news rankings should mean crap (though in reality they may actually mean something to the public) in the academic reputation part of the ranking, umich is 4.5 and nu is 4.4 based on 5.0 (this is 2000 ranking, so maybe changed). well good luck! :)
     
  25. DW

    DW Fix me some sandwiches
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    GO OHIO STATE!!! BUCKEYES RULE!!!!! WOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
     
  26. DW

    DW Fix me some sandwiches
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    no, actually emory is the "Duke of Georgia" :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
     
  27. Sweet Tea

    Sweet Tea Girl Next Door
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    hahaha!! gonna have to agree with DW on this one. duke is the "harvard of the south",unless you're a tarheel, in which case you call dook the university of new jersey at durham. no offense to you new jersey folks out there. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
     
  28. DW

    DW Fix me some sandwiches
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    i bet these people are emory admissions personnel/trustees :laugh:
    If you're looking for a true nickname, try "Coca Cola University"
     
  29. USeF

    USeF sunny L.A.
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    /me takes a deep breath

    ahhhh.. nothing like the smell of school competition in the air to get the football season started :D

    :clap: :clap: :clap:
     
  30. Sweet Tea

    Sweet Tea Girl Next Door
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    you just wait 'til basketball season. ;)
     
  31. laviddee

    laviddee Senior Member
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    well when basketball season comes around, i'm going to be staying quiet....

    my sister goes to duke, and gosh i rubbed it in the 1 year we beat duke... but haven't been saying much since then.

    since we're all making analogies to harvard...

    Shoot, i can't believe no one has said this one yet, "Harvard is the Michigan of the East." Perhaps it goes without saying!

    :)
     
  32. pbehzad

    pbehzad Faddayy
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    i was just looking at umich and nu football schedules, and this year they dont play each other. now thats a shame.
    coke university needs to get a football team, im thinking we could have a dome stadium. emory vs duke in the "harvard of the south" bowl.:D
     
  33. DW

    DW Fix me some sandwiches
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    LOL. that would be sweet. There could even be a little trophy at the end of the game, or the seniors on the winning team can ceremonially scratch the name of their school off their diplomas and write "Harvard" on it. My A league intramural flag football team senior year could give Duke's football team a good whooping. Basketball, thats a different story (they're allright. Not UNC, but they're respectable i guess).

    laviddee, if Harvard is the "Michigan of the East", there must be a "Ohio State of the east" (i.e. who does harvard regularly kick the crap out of?) ;)
     
  34. laviddee

    laviddee Senior Member
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    hey man,
    harvard is no big thing. As for them kicking the crap out of michigaN? I'm not sure where i've ever read of that happening. All i know is that i regularly kicked the crap out of the kid who did go to harvard at our high school.

    ok so now he's a ceo and i'm applying to med school. but that's beside the point.. haha.

    hey man, you doubt the prowess of michigan's top students.. check out this dorky website. National Champions at Quiz bowl baby!!! And both the Michigan A and Michigan B teams beat Harvard.
    http://www.naqt.com/Results/2002-ict-divi-results.html
    We won the Division I competition, and got second in Div II, and almost became the first school ever to win both championships.

    Ok, don't think I'm a total geek for posting that info, I didn't even know we had a good quiz bowl team, I just am PRO MICHIGAN. Heck I even know we won the National Championship for PING PONG when I was at School. Say it loud and say it proud. GO BLUE!

    Gosh I hope John Navarre is not our starting quarterback this year. PUT ME IN THE GAME COACH!
     
  35. DW

    DW Fix me some sandwiches
    Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    dude, you didn't get my joke. although I dont go there, I'm a big Wolverine fan (i used to a bigger fan, until my absolute fav team, penn state, moved to the big 10).

    re read:
    "laviddee, if Harvard is the "Michigan of the East", there must be a "Ohio State of the east" (i.e. who does harvard regularly kick the crap out of?) "

    i was making fun of the fact michigan beating up on ohio state in football, and whoever harvard beats up on must be there "ohio state" consequently. :)
     
  36. pbehzad

    pbehzad Faddayy
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    man laviddee all this propaganda for umich, makes me wanna go there. ;) really big wolverine fan, to bad though no natl championship this year. natl championship runs through norman. Sooners taking it this year (i got to put in a word for my team).
    dw, did you guys win im championship your senior year? last year my freshman hall we went 1-3 but i bet we couldve given duke a run for their money. bball we did decently but i sucked it up last game and we didnt get into playoffs :mad:. bball we would have def. torn duke apart. j williams cant hold me.
     
  37. pcl

    pcl Senior Member
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    Clearly, there is only one place for football in this group... Can't
    wait for the season to start! I finally got tickets after graduating in '98...

    As for the name game... Both are well respected schools, imho, comparable in reputation. Applying with either name on your application should not hurt you, however, you must do well for it to help you. If you get a 2.0, you aren't going to med school.

    As for grade inflation: It is not easy to get an A in Ann Arbor. You work for your grades. Your classmates will amaze you. They are smart, and every bit as determined as you are to do well. The orgo is tough, but doable. However, NU wouldn't be a cakewalk either.

    I think the question becomes about fit and finances... where will you be happy, where do you feel at home, where do you think you can grow? do you have financial considerations that guide your decision or is money no object?

    Looking back, I wouldn't change my choice for anything, but everyone is different. Do what is right for you...

    Good Luck, Go Blue!

    pcl, MSII
    CWRU-SOM
     
  38. pcl

    pcl Senior Member
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    i think we won solar car and the cement boat enginerding contests when i was in school... way geekier than quiz bowl...

    You have to give navarre a chance... we used to diss Brady and Greise, and they turned out OK... Hopefully he will step up to the standards of those before him... I just can't wait to be back in the Big House!

    Go Blue!

     
  39. laviddee

    laviddee Senior Member
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    OH MY!

    PLEASE.

    PLEASE... Let's all be honest here. Ok you're selecting from a pool of students that perhaps is a fourth of the size of Michigan's pool. Do you really think that you'll have better selection at NU?

    all you've established is that the women at NU are more desperate??? Which, i admit isn't a bad argument at all, but you might find yourself often reaching to turn off the lights. ok i'm only joking...

    but hey, michigan women are awesome.

    too bad they didn't recognize me- the self proclaimed "Brad Pitt of Michigan"

    hahaha
     

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