High-ish Stats, few interviews. Need help honing in strategy for next cycle

[jmetaller]

Hey guys/gals, decided to apply last January and basically threw a hail mary this cycle. Tried to cram in studying for my MCAT, catching up on experience, and so on. Anyways, ended up graduating with a 3.81 in biochemistry and scoring 520 on my MCAT so grade-wise I think I'm pretty solid. However, I am completely deficient in just about everything else. I got really ill in 2014 and am just now recovered enough to start making a life for myself again. Problem was it destroyed my research project and any ambitions I had at the time. I've got a few volunteer things under my belt like home-building and some clinical experience abroad, but these were not long term. I have roughly 50-80 hours of shadowing in family medicine as well.

I've had two interviews so far, a lot of rejection letters and one waitlist interview. So I'm starting to prep for next cycle now. I've had some recommendations to look into medical scribing or become a certified nursing assistant. Anything paid is ideal, though certainly not a limitation for me. At the same time my wife just recently got employed full time so I'm trying to find strategies to get my foot in the door at my hometown med school (Emory).

So my thinking is to try and get one of these paid positions and supplement with volunteer work at the emory clinic, shadow tumor board (if possible), and some other specialties I'm interested in that would get my foot in the door of the hospital. I'm a patient of multiple specialties, so I have a pretty easy in. But I want to make sure I'm not wasting my time on the wrong things.

So, for someone in my position, does my plan sound solid? Or is there something else I should be doing?

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[thankthegodsforbessie]

imho, i would not reapply next cycle. many schools and wise sdn members recommend to take a year off between cycles to significantly improve your application. i know this isn't what you want to hear, but if you bolster your ECs you will get many interviews with that mcat and i'm sure emory would be one of them. since it appears you took your mcat in spring 2018, you can apply in the 2021 app year. i would do a clinical job like scribe and volunteer, ideally with underserved populations. you only need about 50 hours of shadowing so you are fine there.

since you got 2 interviews, it appears your LOR and essays were good. have you been rejected and waitlisted from the two interviews? your wording is not very clear. how many schools did you apply to and when did were you complete?

also, since you live in atlanta, piedmont heart institute has a program for people who want to go to med school. you are trained as a medical assistant and they place you within the heart institute system. you do not need a certification prior. i actually am in it now and i would 100% recommend it to anyone who wants a clinical job for a gap year. dm me for more details.

 

[jmetaller]

I mean, does it hurt my chances to apply next year and then the following if needed? If it's just an issue of money I don't mind. I can still rack up several hundred hours by then. If they're going to look at it unfavorably for the 2021 cycle then obviously that's something to keep in mind.

I have only been to one of the interviews recently and haven't heard back yet. The next one is in Feb. I should state, I sent my application a little late. Primary towards the end of July and secondaries all the way up through October. I applied to about 25 or so schools I think. I forget the exact number because I ended up not sending a few secondaries.

As for essays... I suspect they are somewhat love or hate. In many of them I described my experience with illness which paints a sort of negative view of the medical system naturally. Of course, I did not emphasize a negative attitude but tried rather to describe what I got from it and hope to address throughout my career. I still can't help but feel it may be a rather polarizing piece. But it's probably a big part of the reason I got those two interviews.

That is awesome about the piedmont program! Is it a paid or volunteer basis? I will look into that and definitely pm you if I need more info. Thanks!

 

[thankthegodsforbessie]

If you have made a significant change to bolster your app this year, like adding hundreds of volunteering hours, then I think you would be okay to apply next cycle so this June. Just make sure you apply early aka prewrite your secondaries and submit them by the end of July. The late app probably hurt you.

If you got 2 interviews then your essays seem good. the thing is there is a good chance you will get in to one school since you have two interviews. I wouldn't lose hope for this cycle. If you do not get an acceptance, then have someone read your essays. Also, did you use msar or sdn to generate your school list? maybe you applied to too many top schools or oos, etc.

the piedmont program is paid, actually very well for a cma job. I don't think they will hire new people until the end of spring/early summer though.

 

[jmetaller]

Ah bummer about the hiring cycle. I'll look into it anyways and see what comes of it. Really appreciate that tip.

Good tip on the secondaries. I don't know if they change year after year but I'll be keeping my eye out for the list of questions. I will certainly have my primary done before the cycle opens.

I might have to reapply even if I do get into one of the two schools I'm interviewed at unfortunately. When I applied my wife was working a job she loved but it was part time and unsustainable so it was time to move on. Then right after my secondaries they unexpectedly hired her full time with benefits so that kind of threw a wrench in things. She may still be open to moving, but I probably owe her an early app at Emory with sufficient volunteer/clinical experience before pulling us out of Atl.

As for my school list, I actually picked them mostly by location with a few top schools peppered in just to gauge my chances. Location mostly because of my wifes career interests. That really complicates things accounting for another person. I did use MSAR but there were only about 4 schools in the nation with higher median stats than mine and only by like a single MCAT point. Unfortunately... I don't have the many instate schools. Mercer and Emory. Moorhouse is historically black college and Augusta is so far it might as well be considered a different state. I tried to be pretty conscious about that and didn't send a secondary to any of the schools I later found out had slim OOS acceptance.

Anyways, it's been helpful to get some perspective so I appreciate your time. Best of luck on your own application!

 

[thankthegodsforbessie]

fyi, secondary prompts almost never change.

more importantly, if you receive an acceptance to a US MD school and decline it, you will basically have zero chance of being admitted to another school in the future. you have to disclose prior acceptances in amcas and having a declined acceptance will basically blacklist you. I think the only exception would be extreme medical issues where the schools could defer you start. this has been discussed many times on sdn so you can look up threads to see other senior/more wise sdn members giving their own advice but it is the same as what I am telling you now. I know that really complicates things but it is the reality.

 

[woggleswoggles]

imho, i would not reapply next cycle. many schools and wise sdn members recommend to take a year off between cycles to significantly improve your application. i know this isn't what you want to hear, but if you bolster your ECs you will get many interviews with that mcat and i'm sure emory would be one of them. since it appears you took your mcat in spring 2018, you can apply in the 2021 app year. i would do a clinical job like scribe and volunteer, ideally with underserved populations. you only need about 50 hours of shadowing so you are fine there.

since you got 2 interviews, it appears your LOR and essays were good. have you been rejected and waitlisted from the two interviews? your wording is not very clear. how many schools did you apply to and when did were you complete?

also, since you live in atlanta, piedmont heart institute has a program for people who want to go to med school. you are trained as a medical assistant and they place you within the heart institute system. you do not need a certification prior. i actually am in it now and i would 100% recommend it to anyone who wants a clinical job for a gap year. dm me for more details.

Hi would you mind sending me a link to get more information on the program at Piedmont? This sounds like something I would really be interested in exploring!

Thanks


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[woggleswoggles]

imho, i would not reapply next cycle. many schools and wise sdn members recommend to take a year off between cycles to significantly improve your application. i know this isn't what you want to hear, but if you bolster your ECs you will get many interviews with that mcat and i'm sure emory would be one of them. since it appears you took your mcat in spring 2018, you can apply in the 2021 app year. i would do a clinical job like scribe and volunteer, ideally with underserved populations. you only need about 50 hours of shadowing so you are fine there.

since you got 2 interviews, it appears your LOR and essays were good. have you been rejected and waitlisted from the two interviews? your wording is not very clear. how many schools did you apply to and when did were you complete?

also, since you live in atlanta, piedmont heart institute has a program for people who want to go to med school. you are trained as a medical assistant and they place you within the heart institute system. you do not need a certification prior. i actually am in it now and i would 100% recommend it to anyone who wants a clinical job for a gap year. dm me for more details.

Hi would you be willing to send me a link or a contact for the piedmont program? Apologize if you get this twice I wasn’t sure if my first post went thru successfully! Many thanks!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[jmetaller]

fyi, secondary prompts almost never change.

more importantly, if you receive an acceptance to a US MD school and decline it, you will basically have zero chance of being admitted to another school in the future. you have to disclose prior acceptances in amcas and having a declined acceptance will basically blacklist you. I think the only exception would be extreme medical issues where the schools could defer you start. this has been discussed many times on sdn so you can look up threads to see other senior/more wise sdn members giving their own advice but it is the same as what I am telling you now. I know that really complicates things but it is the reality.

What in the actual hell. I mean, So life circumstances aren't a valid excuse? You know like, things changed between when I sent my secondary and got my interview. That's insanity

 

[jmetaller]

If I had an interview at a school that I now know there is no possible way for me to attend and my acceptance is pending should I go ahead email them to withdraw? Now I'm kind of freaking out about the few interviews I got as they are the least practical schools I applied to.

 

[Goro]

Hey guys/gals, decided to apply last January and basically threw a hail mary this cycle. Tried to cram in studying for my MCAT, catching up on experience, and so on. Anyways, ended up graduating with a 3.81 in biochemistry and scoring 520 on my MCAT so grade-wise I think I'm pretty solid. However, I am completely deficient in just about everything else. I got really ill in 2014 and am just now recovered enough to start making a life for myself again. Problem was it destroyed my research project and any ambitions I had at the time. I've got a few volunteer things under my belt like home-building and some clinical experience abroad, but these were not long term. I have roughly 50-80 hours of shadowing in family medicine as well.

I've had two interviews so far, a lot of rejection letters and one waitlist interview. So I'm starting to prep for next cycle now. I've had some recommendations to look into medical scribing or become a certified nursing assistant. Anything paid is ideal, though certainly not a limitation for me. At the same time my wife just recently got employed full time so I'm trying to find strategies to get my foot in the door at my hometown med school (Emory).

So my thinking is to try and get one of these paid positions and supplement with volunteer work at the emory clinic, shadow tumor board (if possible), and some other specialties I'm interested in that would get my foot in the door of the hospital. I'm a patient of multiple specialties, so I have a pretty easy in. But I want to make sure I'm not wasting my time on the wrong things.

So, for someone in my position, does my plan sound solid? Or is there something else I should be doing?

You also need nonclinical volunteering, if you don't have that.
You don't need any more shadowing.

 

[jmetaller]

Cool, good to know. I have about a week long home build with habitat for humanity but that's it. Probably 60 or so hours. Can definitely look into adding some more.

 

[jmetaller]

If you have made a significant change to bolster your app this year, like adding hundreds of volunteering hours, then I think you would be okay to apply next cycle so this June. Just make sure you apply early aka prewrite your secondaries and submit them by the end of July. The late app probably hurt you.

If you got 2 interviews then your essays seem good. the thing is there is a good chance you will get in to one school since you have two interviews. I wouldn't lose hope for this cycle. If you do not get an acceptance, then have someone read your essays. Also, did you use msar or sdn to generate your school list? maybe you applied to too many top schools or oos, etc.

the piedmont program is paid, actually very well for a cma job. I don't think they will hire new people until the end of spring/early summer though.

Hey, I tried to send a PM but your profile is private. Or I'm just a dummy. Can't figure out how to do it though. If you don't mind sending me a PM with that CMA info that would be amazing. I wasn't able to find much on it.

 

[Gurby]

I sent my application a little late. Primary towards the end of July and secondaries all the way up through October.

That was dumb. Get your stuff in early next time. See below:

Planeblue's Interview Invite Tracker

I applied to about 25 or so schools I think.

Good that you applied to 25 schools. Post your school list, which schools you got II's from, and make a note of whether you were complete before Sept/Oct. You have a somewhat tricky app in that your stats are great but the rest of it may be lacking. You'll get yield protected at the lower tier schools, but the EC's may not be up to par for higher tier schools. If you applied primarily based on location, it's likely you got yield protected unless you wrote love letters to the schools explaining why you would go to their low ranked school over a top school.

If I had an interview at a school that I now know there is no possible way for me to attend and my acceptance is pending should I go ahead email them to withdraw? Now I'm kind of freaking out about the few interviews I got as they are the least practical schools I applied to.

Yep, you have to withdraw immediately - like today, right now - if you would not enroll there. The opportunity cost is basically $250k-500k if you delay your career by 1 year. How much does she like that job and how unique is it?

I feel like you can probably most likely go ahead and apply again this during the 2019-2020 cycle...

 

[jmetaller]

Not a matter of dumb lol. I just got my health on track to even begin considering a career. Made the decision to pursue medicine in Feb 2018 and frantically tried to get shadowing/clinical hours, study for my MCAT, and all that before the cycle started. I took a later MCAT date to prioritize my score over early application. I was taking a hit either way.

Interesting on the yield protection thing. I did consider that, but also thought my lack of EC's might make it self evident why I was applying to certain schools. A lot of secondaries asked about interest in the particular school as well. I don't have a final list written as I didn't send secondaries to everyone that I applied to on my AMCAS. But it was a pretty good spread from my state schools to top tier and others in between.

Unfortunately (or fortunately because I love my wife)... she loves her job. I would say it's pretty unique in that most people in her field are not hired full time with benefits and are forced to travel continuously. Before she got hired full time she was pretty much being forced into a career change which is why I applied to all these different places. Now that she is it's an absolute nightmare for my application because it means I either get into Emory or Morehouse (unlikely as they are a historically black college), divorce her to pursue my career, divorce my career to stick with her, or secretly hope she gets laid off which will leave me feeling like a turd. Fortunately Emory has an early admissions program and I'm trying to get some clinical volunteer with them so maybe I can get a foot in the door. But I still can't help but feel like my chances are slim. Emory is the ideal school for me specialty wise as well.

The opportunity cost isn't a concern to me as I'm fortunate to have some good financial padding, I'm just itching to get back to the books and do something meaningful with my life.

Also, I did end up requesting a withdrawal immediately after typing that. I have not heard back yet so hopefully they process it. I have another interview coming up and I'm kind of freaking out because it's too short notice to cancel and I would hate to go just to withdrawal. I was trying to leave my doors open in case something changes again, but not if leaving that door open means getting blacklisted in the likely scenario that I have to reapply in the future.

Once again, the advice and discussion is much appreciated. This process could stand to be less stressful lol.

 

[thankthegodsforbessie]

Hi would you be willing to send me a link or a contact for the piedmont program? Apologize if you get this twice I wasn’t sure if my first post went thru successfully! Many thanks!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

your profile is private and i cant start a conversation with you

 

[Gurby]

Not a matter of dumb lol. I just got my health on track to even begin considering a career. Made the decision to pursue medicine in Feb 2018 and frantically tried to get shadowing/clinical hours, study for my MCAT, and all that before the cycle started. I took a later MCAT date to prioritize my score over early application. I was taking a hit either way.

Interesting on the yield protection thing. I did consider that, but also thought my lack of EC's might make it self evident why I was applying to certain schools. A lot of secondaries asked about interest in the particular school as well. I don't have a final list written as I didn't send secondaries to everyone that I applied to on my AMCAS. But it was a pretty good spread from my state schools to top tier and others in between.

Unfortunately (or fortunately because I love my wife)... she loves her job. I would say it's pretty unique in that most people in her field are not hired full time with benefits and are forced to travel continuously. Before she got hired full time she was pretty much being forced into a career change which is why I applied to all these different places. Now that she is it's an absolute nightmare for my application because it means I either get into Emory or Morehouse (unlikely as they are a historically black college), divorce her to pursue my career, divorce my career to stick with her, or secretly hope she gets laid off which will leave me feeling like a turd. Fortunately Emory has an early admissions program and I'm trying to get some clinical volunteer with them so maybe I can get a foot in the door. But I still can't help but feel like my chances are slim. Emory is the ideal school for me specialty wise as well.

The opportunity cost isn't a concern to me as I'm fortunate to have some good financial padding, I'm just itching to get back to the books and do something meaningful with my life.

Also, I did end up requesting a withdrawal immediately after typing that. I have not heard back yet so hopefully they process it. I have another interview coming up and I'm kind of freaking out because it's too short notice to cancel and I would hate to go just to withdrawal. I was trying to leave my doors open in case something changes again, but not if leaving that door open means getting blacklisted in the likely scenario that I have to reapply in the future.

Once again, the advice and discussion is much appreciated. This process could stand to be less stressful lol.

Limiting yourself to 2 schools puts you at high risk of never becoming a doctor, as you are aware. It seems hard to justify this financially unless your wife is pulling in like >$150k at her new job. How resentful would you be if you withdrew from everywhere this year and then she got laid off? Is there no possible compromise on her part - ie she couldn't move with you and then find something part-time wherever you end up?

 

[woggleswoggles]

your profile is private and i cant start a conversation with you

Sorry!!! I’ve updated this!

 

[jmetaller]

Limiting yourself to 2 schools puts you at high risk of never becoming a doctor, as you are aware. It seems hard to justify this financially unless your wife is pulling in like >$150k at her new job. How resentful would you be if you withdrew from everywhere this year and then she got laid off? Is there no possible compromise on her part - ie she couldn't move with you and then find something part-time wherever you end up?

I don't know man. I just got her a professional tier camera for her birthday yesterday. She's been a hobbiest photographer her whole life and I'm kind of hoping she gets excited enough to make a career of it. In such a case she'd be self-employed anywhere. The problem is it's not just a cold calculated financial decision. It's also a question of her day to day happiness. She's an archaeologist. Hardly employable anywhere above minimum wage menial labor. The fact that she managed to snag a full time lab position with benefits and isn't spending her days trudging through the swamps of Louisiana avoiding gators and moccasins is a miracle. She's also hired at the same firm as all of her college friends so she's pretty content with it.

Finances are stressful and all but realistically we are ridiculously privileged in that sense. And it's not like I couldn't find something in Atl that would pay off our little 1200 sqft home. But, having been through severe health issues myself pathology/infectious disease is my calling and hers is basically where she's at at the moment. That's really what it's mostly about right now. My bliss vs hers. Will I be resentful? Yeah probably. But that's marriage for you. The amount of sacrifice it takes to share your life with another human, no matter how similar they are to yourself, is truly astounding. Of course it goes both ways and I just have no idea how that is going to play out. At least my MCAT is good for 2 more cycles, 3 at Emory. I don't think I did too hot at my last interview, and this next one is late in the cycle so I doubt I'm really blowing any chances at this point.

 

[deleted962973]

I don't know man. I just got her a professional tier camera for her birthday yesterday. She's been a hobbiest photographer her whole life and I'm kind of hoping she gets excited enough to make a career of it. In such a case she'd be self-employed anywhere. The problem is it's not just a cold calculated financial decision. It's also a question of her day to day happiness. She's an archaeologist. Hardly employable anywhere above minimum wage menial labor. The fact that she managed to snag a full time lab position with benefits and isn't spending her days trudging through the swamps of Louisiana avoiding gators and moccasins is a miracle. She's also hired at the same firm as all of her college friends so she's pretty content with it.

Finances are stressful and all but realistically we are ridiculously privileged in that sense. And it's not like I couldn't find something in Atl that would pay off our little 1200 sqft home. But, having been through severe health issues myself pathology/infectious disease is my calling and hers is basically where she's at at the moment. That's really what it's mostly about right now. My bliss vs hers. Will I be resentful? Yeah probably. But that's marriage for you. The amount of sacrifice it takes to share your life with another human, no matter how similar they are to yourself, is truly astounding. Of course it goes both ways and I just have no idea how that is going to play out. At least my MCAT is good for 2 more cycles, 3 at Emory. I don't think I did too hot at my last interview, and this next one is late in the cycle so I doubt I'm really blowing any chances at this point.

Would it realllly be so bad to go to med school in a neighboring state to Georgia? Long distance is really hard, I get it, but it’s also only 4 years out of hopefully decades of your marriage. You can visit them on the weekends, FaceTime them in the evenings, have date nights once a month— many many couples make serious long distance relationships work in med school. Albeit not married, I am one of them. There are no guarantees in med admissions and limiting yourself to just Emory is a very poor decision imo.

 

[Throwaway5129]

If you want to get into Morehouse you'd need a ton of volunteering with underserved communities. Emory you need more research. I'd skip next cycle. Maybe get a clinical job, volunteer in a productive research lab + volunteer with the underprivileged.

 

[jmetaller]

Would it realllly be so bad to go to med school in a neighboring state to Georgia? Long distance is really hard, I get it, but it’s also only 4 years out of hopefully decades of your marriage. You can visit them on the weekends, FaceTime them in the evenings, have date nights once a month— many many couples make serious long distance relationships work in med school. Albeit not married, I am one of them. There are no guarantees in med admissions and limiting yourself to just Emory is a very poor decision imo.

I have several answers. In short "yes" it would be bad. While I love my wife and visa versa, our marriage itself is constantly stressed due to her PTSD. I don't see it working long distance. I also have dogs I love that will possibly be dead before I finish and will no doubt stay with her (basically her therapy dogs). And lastly I am severely ill. I have made a lot of progress in this area. Enough to plan and work towards my future. But I am ill nonetheless. I have no more illusion of "decades" ahead of me. I have today, and tomorrow and whatever other day this body graciously gives me. The real mistake would be kicking "time for my loved ones" down the road and thinking I could pick up the pieces later.

All this really just comes down to a sense of mortality and prioritization of my family over my career. And don't get me wrong. I love medicine. My idea of fun on the weekend is reading bacteriology and pathology texts (I do other things, no worries). There is nothing I'd rather do than spend my work days doing medicine. But I will not spread myself thin for it. It won't make me a good husband and it won't make me a good doctor.

 

[jmetaller]

If you want to get into Morehouse you'd need a ton of volunteering with underserved communities. Emory you need more research. I'd skip next cycle. Maybe get a clinical job, volunteer in a productive research lab + volunteer with the underprivileged.

I'm thinking about doing my nonclinical with Atlanta Harm Reduction Coalition. I think that would be a good one as far as "underserved" goes and is definitely a topic of importance to me. Research is tough. I did some then got ill and fell off the wagon. It's kind of hard going back and repairing those relationships especially since I've graduated and have a lot of distance between me and the school. The CDC does some post-bachelors fellowhips though I could look into. Would be right up my alley in ID. Emory also has some paid research positions though they are hard to get.

Are researchers typically okay with taking students outside of their own school? For example, there is one Emory researcher who's work I'm familiar with and would be a really cool opportunity. I'm considering reaching out to her but I don't know if it's common to take on students from other schools.

Anyways, I appreciate the continued discussion. I promise I'm not trying to make things difficult. I may compromise on some of this as life continues to change. Just laying out the challenges to see if there are ways around them first.

 

[Walter Raleigh]

You don't have to disclose prior acceptances in AMCAS, but medical schools can see your previous acceptances, and it's a huge black mark to have turned down an acceptance previously.

 

[jmetaller]

Thanks for weighing in. I got a letter from my last interview today. Nearly had a panic attack because I had requested a withdraw last week thinking they hadn't reached a decision yet. Didn't realize one was in the mail. Fortunately I was waitlisted and my withdrawal was also processed today. PHEW.

 

[chlorocruorin]

Serve the underserved. Serve the underserved. Serve the underserved. Serve the underserved.

 

[jmetaller]

Serve the underserved. Serve the underserved. Serve the underserved. Serve the underserved.

Definitely. There's an organization I've been wanting to work with for years that would be perfect for this