how do i know which dental school is right for me thanks

[liked]

thanks

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[liked]

just changed from pre med btw

 

[510586]

just changed from pre med btw

It's not easy because the most exposure you get is from the interview day, their website, and word of mouth. Attending could be vastly different from expectations for all you know. And classmates are different every year so a testimonial such as "my classmates are all like teammates/family" may not apply every year.

 

[liked]

It's not easy because the most exposure you get is from the interview day, their website, and word of mouth. Attending could be vastly different from expectations for all you know. And classmates are different every year so a testimonial such as "my classmates are all like teammates/family" may not apply every year.

Would you say prestige is a big factor?

 

[Advance]

The cheapest one you get accepted to.

 

[liked]

thanks for the replies. so it seems price point is important here

 

[Advance]

thanks for the replies. so it seems price point is important here

It was the most important factor when I was choosing dental schools.

 

[WaveRace]

Price is the most important factor (if you have a state school, it should be your top choice). This can be a huge factor (1-200k difference).

Curriculum is another big point. Pass/fail vs letter grades. Integrated med school curriculum vs similar courses to medical students vs little biomedical curriculum (relatively speaking).

Geographical location is big for me (being close to all of my nieces and nephews, siblings, S.O.). Also, is it in a city or suburbs? What is the city life like? Safety? Cool places to explore? Backpacking, kayaking?

Is the school more focused on underserved care? Is it more academic/research based?

Schools do vary in important categories. That said, any dental school will make you into a competent dentist. Prestige isn't a huge thing like it is in medicine.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[P0W3RL1FT3R]

Price more so. But I heard upenn graduated 12/12 OMFS and harvard is near 100% matchrate, so if you're dead set on OMFS it could be worth it. OMFS on average make more than GP by a decent margin as of now (not sure in 10 years when people entering D school now become practicing OMFS if they got MD as well).

I just want to make sure you're aware of this... but UPenn has a class size of 120. So if you think just because you go to UPenn that you'll match OMFS, you're wrong. Those students were in the top ~10% of their class, which is no joke. If they're capable of that, I'd think that they would be capable of matching (and saving $$$) if they went to their state school.

 

[super frank]

I just want to make sure you're aware of this... but UPenn has a class size of 120. So if you think just because you go to UPenn that you'll match OMFS, you're wrong. Those students were in the top ~10% of their class, which is no joke. If they're capable of that, I'd think that they would be capable of matching (and saving $$$) if they went to their state school.

How do you know they were in the top ~10% of their class?

 

[P0W3RL1FT3R]

How do you know they were in the top ~10% of their class?

By top ~10%, I mean the top ~10% in terms of NBDE Part I / NBME scores, externships, research, extracurriculars, etc. etc. of the class. not just class rank. Sorry if you were looking for the exact numbers and got excited lol.
But you catch my drift. This isn't new knowledge, but I just want to stress that matching is hard af anywhere you go, and UPenn graduates plenty of students who once thought they'd specialize just to be a GP in an insane amount of debt.

I'm only stressing this because my friend thought he was a special snowflake, and after D2 he was burnt out, and realized that doing well on the DAT and being accepted into an Ivy League meant jack **** about your capacity to compete with the brightest students for a competitive program like OMFS.

 

[P0W3RL1FT3R]

Yea of course it's difficult, but if a school teaches according to the test moreso than others, and if grades aren't stressed as much (not penn but say Harvard or other P/F schools), clearly there's an advantage right? And still it's not necessarily top 10% in terms of those criteria you listed. That's like saying a dental applicant is top x% of all factors when they could just be great at DAT/GPA and have a smidgen of extracurriculars on the side. Not to mention from posts I've read on the dental boards, CBSE and GPA (which wouldn't be big at a P/F school) play the largest role. Not saying it's impossible to specialize from other schools, but it's definitely easier from a P/F school or one that teaches according to the CBSE and that competing with the "brightest students for a competitive program like OMFS" is easier with the right tools or setting. The OMFS resident I interviewed came from a state school, but he even acknowledged that an ivy would have made his life easier. He told me that if I worked real hard I'd be ok anywhere but that there's still an advg from a non ABC school or one that teaches more med related stuff.

Hey man, if you get into Harvard, you should be able to weigh the odds yourself. I just don't want people to waltz into one of the most expensive dental schools thinking everything will work out for them since they're Ivy League. If you think that the curriculum of a school that costs significantly more than your state school will prepare you better for a specialty program you decided you wanted to pursue before ever picking up a drill, go for it. I'm sure someone with a similar mindset will fill that seat if you dont, anyway.

 

[OoPredentoO]

I didn't apply OOS. Not even 100% set on specializing but seeing matchrates (12/12 Penn, 18/19 Columbia, 7/7 Harvard) and talking to the OMFS resident definitely made me regret not doing so. Even if I got into the schools I may not have attended (since the school I applied and got in was 1/2 the price), but I just wanted to list a few counterpoints to the whole "ivies don't give an advg, if you can specialize at ivy you can specialize anywhere" voice that's so prevalent.

gunners are attracted to ivy leagues like bugs are to a lightbulb at night. i can't say i'm surprised. these schools push their names so hard during interviews, and make every gunner think they're some kind of specialization mill. in reality, they want to attract the brightest students that want to specialize regardless of where they go to heighten the schools reputation. do yourself a $200k favor and go to your state school. worse comes to worse, you don't match, but you have the money to do a 1-2 year gpr to increase your production and make more $$ and be free of debt faster than the naive person who thought the name of their school mattered most in picking schools.

 

[rdub]

All the schools I was accepted to cost about the same, so price didn't really factor into my decision. I just followed my gut and ended up choosing the school that excited me most when I envisioned myself attending there.

 

[toothdoctor123]

By top ~10%, I mean the top ~10% in terms of NBDE Part I / NBME scores, externships, research, extracurriculars, etc. etc. of the class. not just class rank. Sorry if you were looking for the exact numbers and got excited lol.

And how do you know that? (Boards are pass/fail now, btw.) Maybe 10% of their class was interested in OMFS, and so they joined the OMFS club, did research, and took the appropriate externships. Now they are the most qualified for OMFS programs. It's not magic. (At Columbia, that number is 25%.)

It's not like everyone at Harvard, Penn, Columbia, etc. wants to go into OMFS, or that those who didn't choose that career path were not capable of doing it. A lot of my classmates are genuinely interested in GP, have a family practice to join, and have the money to blow on a private school. Some of them have children--maybe they don't want to spend 6 years in residency. Why can't these people also happen to get high grades? If anything, wouldn't you expect them to get higher grades in their DDS clinical courses, considering that they plan to make a career out of that type of work? And honestly, the students needing the highest class ranks are interested in ortho, not OMFS.

 

[OoPredentoO]

See I would agree with this gunner thing if the stats of penn were much higher. They aren't even as high as some state schools. And Yea I'm going to attend a state school for sure just offering a different view. I would say apply to both and think about how important specializing is to you before choosing though instead of applying only in state like I did.

i wouldn't rely on stats as an indicator of who is and is not going to be a tryhard in ds. i studied for 6 weeks while working full time, got a 21. how's this compare to someone who studied 3 months, 10 hours a day, and got a 23+? just addressing that...
but as i said, ivies will attract those who will put in the time to specialize. my friend at columbia says most people want to specialize from day 1. my friend at rutgers* says most people are pursuing gp. if you have a school filled with people wanting to specialize, and a school filled with people who want to go into gp, which school do you think will produce more people that match to a specialty?

 

[Advance]

Average stats still matter. Of course there are outliers who had no time to study for DAT and scored worse than normal, but averages still matter. But there are also people who studied 6 weeks and still scored 23+... Plus average GPA matters too since it's a 4 year thing so it shows consistency. Are we really going to argue that those at Upenn all wanted to specialize yet had the same DAT and GPA averages as state schools filled with people who want general only as your friend said? I would think those who want to specialize in general would also have higher ugrad stats since they are go getters from the start. There are plenty of people with high stats that want to specialize but go with state schools due to financial reasons.

The school with the highest stats would most likely have the most type A people who would most likely want to specialize if we are speaking of hypotheticals.

This isn't true whatsoever. There are plenty of people who barely made the cut stats wise that also want to specialize, there are also people that worked really hard to get in and had good stats but now have a C's get degrees mentality.

 

[Advance]

Which is why i said in general. It's like doe eyed premeds who want to do derm or neurosurgery before even entering med school will more likely have decent undergrad stats than the chill person who is fine with anything as long as they become a doctor. Wouldn't we say someone who wants to go to harvard or an ivy league undergrad institution would have better grades in middle and highschool than someone who just wants to go to any college in general? Whether they succeed or not is not guaranteed though. I'm not trying to glamorize a specialty as being better than general dentist, but people who want to specialize from the start would usually build a decent foundation at a younger age although of course there are always exceptions, such as someone barely getting into a school realizing they love a specialty or someone who's been doing well throughout life burning out and accepting C's.

I disagree, but what do I know?

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

There's much truth in this thread, and some take the truth to be hard. Since so many dental residencies charge tuition, don't forget to tack on another $100,000 to $300,000 to your dental school loans if you specialize. I went to a state school and my class had 100% Match rates for endo, ortho, pedo, perio, and pros, and a 75% rate for surgery. You can absolutely specialize from any school. Go to the cheapest school!

Big Hoss

 

[tyjacobs]

thanks

this is honestly a good question. Different schools offer different opportunities. What I suggest is that you first figure out what your progressional goals are. Do I want to be a general dentist? Or do I want to try to get into politics? Or do I want to be a specialist or a dental researcher?

Then you need to see what each school has to offer (look on website, try to talk to current students) and see if it lines up well with what you want professionally. You also get a really good feel for the school when you interview there.

Now about OMFS and Ivies,

let me set something very straight about columbia.

Columbia is a fantastic place to go to if you are interested in OMFS. We consistently year after year place many kids into OMFS programs, regardless of their class rank. Program directors know this. Our OMFS director was telling me how other program directors were emailing him/calling him jokingly saying how they should come to columbia to interview candidates rather than having the candidates come to them to interview because they interview so many columbia kids. Our biomedical curriculum puts us at a huge advantage for OMFS. Program directors like how we take med school courses for our basic science because it prepares us well for an OMFS residency and espeically for 6 year programs where you will have to go med school and pass step 1 and step 2. Also it puts us at a massive advantage for the CBSE since the CBSE is basically UMSLE step 1

think of it like this -- you are an 6 yr omfs director and you see one applicant who did well in their basic sciences at a state school (got As) but you see other applicant who came from columbia who got Pass on the columbia med courses. OMFS director is still inclined to take columbia applicant because the columbia curriculum prepares you much better for a 6 yr program than if coming for a state school (we get 35 lectures on cardiology, like 40 on renal, etc. -- you cant say the same coming from a state school with no med school curriculum)

Its not like every kid who comes to columbia wants to do OMFS. Definitely not true. If you want to do OMFS, go to columbia, do well on the CBSE, then you're pretty much golden.

As long as you score well on the CBSE, which you basically do since you had the entire columbia medical school basic sciences curriculum, you are essentially a shoe-in as long as you can interview well. You cannot say that about most other state schools (there are exceptions but that applies to the vast majority)

 

[#cariology]

I have a question for those who feel ivies are better for matching. How did state schools do this year in terms of the match %? Obviously the ivies produce a ton of specialists. They attract strong students who want to do everything possible to be successful. But how did Rutgers or the University of Iowa (random example) do this year in match % for OMFS and Ortho? For those willing to stick it out in those places, were they successful?

 

[super frank]

I have a question for those who feel ivies are better for matching. How did state schools do this year in terms of the match %? Obviously the ivies produce a ton of specialists. They attract strong students who want to do everything possible to be successful. But how did Rutgers or the University of Iowa (random example) do this year in match % for OMFS and Ortho? For those willing to stick it out in those places, were they successful?

I know Temple didn't match anyone into OMFS. Class size is 120... 0/3 matched. 1/4 matched the year prior.

 

[predental21250]

I know Temple didn't match anyone into OMFS. Class size is 120... 0/3 matched. 1/4 matched the year prior.

My oral surgeon graduated from temple!

 

[SnozzBerry]

I have a question for those who feel ivies are better for matching. How did state schools do this year in terms of the match %? Obviously the ivies produce a ton of specialists. They attract strong students who want to do everything possible to be successful. But how did Rutgers or the University of Iowa (random example) do this year in match % for OMFS and Ortho? For those willing to stick it out in those places, were they successful?

It really depends on the year. I know you said Iowa randomly but OMFS was rough this year... 1/3, ortho was 2/3 but honestly the person who didn't match ortho had no business applying. Pedo was 4/4. Last years class went 3/3 or 2/2 OMFS I believe.

 

[Likkriue]

Average stats still matter. Of course there are outliers who had no time to study for DAT and scored worse than normal, but averages still matter. But there are also people who studied 6 weeks and still scored 23+... Plus average GPA matters too since it's a 4 year thing so it shows consistency. Are we really going to argue that those at Upenn all wanted to specialize yet had the same DAT and GPA averages as state schools filled with people who want general only as your friend said? I would think those who want to specialize in general would also have higher ugrad stats since they are go getters from the start. There are plenty of people with high stats that want to specialize but go with state schools due to financial reasons.

The school with the highest stats would most likely have the most type A people who would most likely want to specialize if we are speaking of hypotheticals.

Upenns average sgpa is 3.60+ and a dat of 21.5+. How is that not considered impressive? I find it impressive they accept 120 students and still have better stats than most schools out there.
I know Harvard boasts a 3.87 and 23 dat but they also only have 35 students. Much easier to find 35 students with 3.8+ and 23 dats than 120.
I could bet you the top 35 students accepted into Upenn probably have an average close to if not matching Harvards average. So the point of "hey upenns averages are slightly lower than Columbia and Harvard must mean they don't attract as many gunners". There's only so many applicants with top 10% stats to pick from filling 120 seats with intense competition with other schools.

 

[Likkriue]

Their website said 3.59 and 21 for graduating class of 2019 I'm just basing it on that. A state school I applied and got in (but am not attending) had like 3.53 and 20... having .06 and +1 DAT for a school that attracts "the best and brightest" is not extremely impressive. You can compare medical ivies to state ivies and it's a vast difference in GPA and DAT range but not so with penn dental and state schools. And yea of course there are really smart upenn kids I just think you guys are exaggerating a lot by saying Penn attracts the brightest and they all want to specialize and would specialize at any school etc etc... If you want to say Upenn attracts as many gunners as other ivies, then let's just say almost all state schools attract as many because they're stats are so similar. Again, if there were that many people that were actually gunners, the stats would naturally rise along with it. The top 35 of a state school will probably have a bunch of 22+s too.

21 dat isn't impressive? Seriously? Is that why there are 54 schools with sub 21 dat averages and maybe 11 schools with an average of 21 and 5 schools slightly above a 21?

You are totally delusional about how numbers work. I don't know what state school you are referring to, but Upenn has 120 students. That is one of the largest classes out there. And they managed a 3.59 and 21 dat in 2019. In 2018 they had a 3.62 and 21.5. That is extremely impressive and shows the caliber of students they have. You nitpicked a single year for Upenn and claim they are not as good as other Ivies.

Well there are only 3 ivies right? Harvard is a complete anomaly, literally, 35 students. That leaves Columbia. Since you get to nitpick years I'll go ahead and nitpick one of Columbias years. 22 DAT and 3.5 gpa with a class size of 80. Oh WOW columbias sgpa is LESS than whatever state school you mentioned! This is class of..........2017?...OH wait.....columbia matched 18 out of 19 into OMFS this year..............How about that 3.53 sgpa school with ONLY a +2 dat difference. how many did they match into OMFS? Since the students there, according to your assumption are EVEN smarter or just as smart as those in Columbia since they have higher GPAs, this must mean they also matched 18/19. But obviously they didn't, cause that didn't happen.

Next, do you know how averages work? A +.06 difference and a +1 dat difference is HUGE when you consider averages. Lets play some statistics. Lets have a sample size of 120 and try to raise the gpa from 3.53 to 3.59 and a 20 dat to a 21 dat. Now lets use those exact same numbers and have a sample size of 80 and try to raise that gpa from 3.53 to a 3.59. The difference between raising those 2 numbers is huge.

To raise a 3.53 sgpa 20 dat average to a 3.59 and a 21 dat average with a class size of 80 you need to add 13 extra students with 4.0s and 27 dats.
To raise a 3.53 sgpa 20 dat average to a 3.59 and a 21 dat average with a class size of 120 you need to add 26 extra students with 4.0s and 27 dats.

Oh you only need to find a 13 to 26 students with a 4.0 and 27 dat? EASY right? I mean theres only maybe 50 of these people every year. Like seriously dude. I haven't even gotten into the different kinds of curves that can exist with averages. There is a reason UPenn has better statistics than 54 other schools. Sorry buddy, Upenn as a whole as far smarter kids than your average state school. So don't try and throw Stony brook or UCLA to try and say they are equally bright because I strictly said average.

 

[Likkriue]

There is a higher percentage of smarter kids at Ivy leagues and that is a fact. My argument isn't centered around if they were worth 200k more or not.

I was just annoyed you nitpicked Upenn out of all 3 ivies when Columbia had years where their averages weren't that much higher than Upenn either: Harvard in the beggining had pretty low stats as well in the 2000s, it only changed when d school got more competitive and because of their tiny class size they get to be more selective. A +.06 and a +1 dat is more significant than you kept implying. You mentioned the state school will have 3.0s and 18 dats dragging their averages down. Well that means those kids are not as smart as the ones in the Ivy leagues right? Proves my point.

The top students at state schools are just as smart as those at Ivy leagues, I never denied that. However I am disagreeing with you saying the average Upenn student is not more intelligent than the average state school student. The stats prove it. A +.06 and a +1 dat is significant.

Oh and I'm heading to Stony Brook not Upenn.

 

[Faefly]

The most important factors are what each school will offer you!
Will you be comfortable at that place or miserable!

 

[Likkriue]

I agree that spending 200k extra is asisine just to get a little boost in specializing.

 

[toothdoctor123]

I would say confidence would be the largest factor since potentially you can still match from anywhere

That's a really good point.

 

[x0jessmariex3]

If we were to assume someone was gunning for OMFS though, wouldn't you say it's worth to consider? OMFS make nearly double general dent by median salaries alone. Let's say general is 120-180 and OMFS is 300+. Then debt for the school would be paid off in 2-3 years right? But it would only be worth it if they 100% matched and there would be a small risk of nonmatching, and if they matched from a state school then it would be 200k+ extra in their bank. I would say confidence would be the largest factor since potentially you can still match from anywhere (except temple according to some posts above lol)

With 300k salary even how do you determine paying off the debt in 2-3 years by becoming OMFS?

 

[super frank]

With 300k salary even how do you determine paying off the debt in 2-3 years by becoming OMFS?

Live in your office.

 

[super frank]

What is unfortunate is that I'm not exceptionally confident, and I'm also not sure if specializing has a major positive over general dent as of now or the future. Let's say I enter D school this year. IF I was fortunate enough to specialize, the closest date of working probably would be in like 7-8 years for non OMFS and up to 10 years for MD OMFS. Who knows what's going to be worth it by then? Orthodontists are barely beating out general dentists according to the ADA report, and saturation + high cost residencies are taking away from that. The one thing I think that's great about med is they go in and have to go extremely hard from the getgo because ALL specialties are grade and test based, whereas general dental can look quite nice and, if you're fortunate, can reach specialty level pay with equal lifestyle. I feel like if you're not 100% set on what you want in dental, it's slightly harder to motivate yourself to get extremely high grades. And with salaries and statistics being quite under the radar (since people are private practice and don't need to report) or very low sample sizes (such as ADA specialist hrs/salary), things get muddied. Not to mention everyone knowing their local dentist who's succeeding much above the median and thinking they can all become that guy/girl.

Also before anyone says I keep talking money, what else can a predent think? We have 0 exposure to these fields other than shadowing, and shadowing does not give a super accurate picture of specialties/general dent compared to working. We can only look at the variables that are semitangiable to us, such as horus worked per week and pay. And of course we care about patients and service, or we wouldn't enter this profession at all. I just feel if you're not pretty set on specializing from the getgo, it's not easy to aim for extremely high grades without a goal in mind.

OMFS will always have their own corner.

 

[toothdoctor123]

I assume 2 years general dent = 150k*2 so 2 yrs OMFS 200-300k*2 you would have at least 100-300k more to put into debt if you live the same way as a general dentist. This is a very crude analysis, of course. And if the pay is not that much higher it's still a matter of 1 or 2 extra years. It's just like choosing general dentistry over engineering. You invest more money and time, but if the pay is that much higher (say 150k for dent over 100k chem E), eventually the investment is worth it and the debt becomes a temporary setback.

Actually, the average national salary for OMFS is higher-- $465,000 in 2015. Regionally, I think it is common enough for starting salaries in the Northeast to be close to that.
http://www.ada.org/en/publications/...-are-consistently-highest-earning-specialists

 

[x0jessmariex3]

I assume 2 years general dent = 150k*2 so 2 yrs OMFS 200-300k*2 you would have at least 100-300k more to put into debt if you live the same way as a general dentist. This is a very crude analysis, of course. And if the pay is not that much higher it's still a matter of 1 or 2 extra years. It's just like choosing general dentistry over engineering. You invest more money and time, but if the pay is that much higher (say 150k for dent over 100k chem E), eventually the investment is worth it and the debt becomes a temporary setback.

Right but that's salary pretax. Which is probably 30-40% in that tax bracket I believe. Then you also have to do 4-6 years residency during which interests is still acruing so its not really 300-400k in debt by the time you become a OMFS.

 

[super frank]

It's wishful thinking, but it would be nice if specialties in dentistry were as separated as med ones (obviously not THAT different since med have different body parts but in terms of who's allowed to do what). With general dentists doing implants, root canals, extractions, and invisalign, and other specialties (I believe prosth?) doing implants as well, who knows how big a factor T&T will be for OMFS in the future. What will endodontics look like in 8 years? What about saturation? There will always be residency positions in MD and hospitals to hire, but dental is slightly more rugged and varied. And hospital reimbursement of OMFS is definitely not worth it unless you only love the complicated face procedures and care very little about the pay.

You have to think about the journey to get to OMFS... I can't see it ever becoming that saturated simply because of how difficult it is to become an OMFS (and others don't want that kind of lifestyle as a resident, etc). I agree with the encroachment of other specialties to an extent, but still, OMFS are equipped with their own skills that make them capable of carrying out procedures that other specialities (and GP's) simply cannot. Other specialties are going to become less attractive in the coming years.

But then again, I'm still just a pre-dent.

 

[super frank]

The major drawback I think (as a lowly predent) is the 4-6 year thing. 4 years residency working 80 hour weeks up to 100 (unreported) according to the OMFS resident I was talking to, along with 2 years MD (which I hear/read is getting more popular now for OMFS). Unless you're extremely interested, will higher pay really cover that time and effort?

You're paid as a resident. Your floor is super high as an OMFS, with a great lifestyle (post-residency in private practice yanking third molars).

 

[Likkriue]

Right but that's salary pretax. Which is probably 30-40% in that tax bracket I believe. Then you also have to do 4-6 years residency during which interests is still acruing so its not really 300-400k in debt by the time you become a OMFS.

Jess is bringing on the heat, I like it.

 

[super frank]

yea and to play more devils advocate against omfs, the starting salary is DEFINITELY not 390-460. I've read many associates start at 180-200 for at least 2 years before the big bucks come.

Okay, well then it's two years until the big bucks, lol.

 

[toothdoctor123]

You're right. I guess I was going off median like in this post https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/latest-annual-net-income-of-specialists-enjoy.1238969/ . Would median be more accurate because it's an exact 50 percentile wheras average can be skewed? Either way this is further proof that people should not discount the ivies. If they increase your chances of making double or triple a starting general (provided you don't hate it), what's 200k more in debt? 18/19 is super for columbia, 12/12 penn, 7/7 harvard? And think about it- if you enter these schools, what makes you think you're suddenly not going to be one of those students? Lack of confidence? You would still be accepted so they clearly think you can handle the load.

Sure, those numbers work too. I forget where the paper is, but regardless of the national average/mean, it is important to note that the regional differences for OMFS are huge. And I think I read somewhere that a good chunk of the surgeons who responded to that survey work part time (apparently out of personal choice, not for lack of demand).

I agree with you about school choice for the most part. However, things can change when you're in dental school. Like, you can know now as a pre-dent whether you are intellectually capable of becoming an oral surgeon. But you won't know for sure what kind of handskills you will have, whether you would actually enjoy medical school, etc. And if you graduate with a half-million dollars of debt, general dentistry is no longer a good back-up option. That's the risk you take by choosing an Ivy League school, which is why I think you were right to say that self-confidence should be one of the biggest factors in making that decision. Gnothi seauton.

 

[predental21250]

I wonder if there are people so abysmal at hand skills no matter how much they work it's still terrible

I fear I will be in that boat lol

 

[toothdoctor123]

That is true. The OMFS resident talked of a dude who was a 4.0 and 25 DAT ugrad and had 4.0 up until clinical where he stumbled. Still got a residency as pediatric but had 1 gap year in between. Couldn't you go full on practice mode like grinding in a videogame on handskills? Given a lower talent couldn't you eventually work your way up with sheer effort? I wonder if there are people so abysmal at hand skills no matter how much they work it's still terrible

Considering that dental school dropout rates are generally very low and based on what my professors say (because I am only a D1), I would think that anyone who has the self-discipline to complete a pre-dental education is capable of acquiring the minimum requisite handskills to be a competent dentist, even if it requires putting in three-times the work of your classmates. (This is assuming that you don't have some kind of major medical condition that gives you hand tremors or something.) It might not be pretty though...you could become miserable in the process. Also, learning how to produce good work is one thing, but it's quite another to learn to do it fast enough to actually make money as a practicing dentist. A clinically perfect restoration is no good if it took you all day to do it.

 

[x0jessmariex3]

Also, learning how to produce good work is one thing, but it's quite another to learn to do it fast enough to actually make money as a practicing dentist. A clinically perfect restoration is no good if it took you all day to do it.

This!