How many of you actually trust your school?

[trepon]

I really liked my school the first year of med school but now after hearing and experiencing more of their terrible behavior - I don't trust them. They've really screwed over some of my classmates and now I'm dealing with it to a much lesser extent. I really dislike how we have to kiss their asses until we graduate instead of calling them out for their lack of organization or concern for their students.

For me, it is a love/hate relationship. I love med school but at the same time the administration's disorganization has really screwed me over. Others, the consequences of the school refusing to take responsibility have been much greater.

I feel as though they only take steps to help students when it puts the school in a bad light (someone goes public). They do the bare minimum and the administration seems to constantly drop the ball without any consequences. If they screw up they tend to place the entire responsibility of their mistake on the students without admitting to any wrong doing.

The administration seems so shady and untrustworthy. Anyone else secretly feel like this?

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[mk04447]

My guess is your classmates screwed themselves. You're probably only getting half of the story.

 

[oldanddone]

Welcome to med ed! The dark ages of education.

 

[Psai]

Don't worry, it gets worse in residency

 

[CherryRedDracul]

Welcome to administration in America. I can't comment on other countries.

 

[jeffk805dent]

if it makes you feel any better, dental schools aren't any better, regardless if its public or private. UNLV administrators/faculty were somewhat brass handed in my opinion.

Here was a day in dental school:

Professor: "Remember the patient comes first, money comes later."

Professor fails to teach us properly about pre-prosthetic surgical procedures (not something you can learn on your own) and goes off talking to other faculty nearby about his newly bought Mercedes. Double standard much?

 

[Cytarabine]

It's a confusing situation. I individually like / got good vibes from the majority of the administrators I've interacted with, but somewhere along the line when it comes to getting things done correctly, the ball just gets dropped. Example - students on a gap year lose access to their school email during that year, like they wouldn't need to know about scheduling classes for the coming year, information about vsas/eras, etc.

 

[FutureInternist]

Send an email from [email protected] or something to try to have them address it but don't screw yourself over since the rest of your career depends on these ****heads !!

 

[operaman]

I trusted mine and found them to be completely honest and forthcoming from the beginning of med school to the end. I can't honestly remember a single question or concern I had that wasn't answered as fully as possible, even if on occasion that answer wasn't what I wanted to hear at the time.

It's hard to speak to something so vague, but I would encourage you to consider things from your school's perspective. Imagine you were made the dean and consider what you would be able to do differently in reality given the same personnel and budget constraints. You could fire some people, but then who would you get to do those jobs? How long will that take and how much will it cost? Sure, maybe there's a professor who isn't the greatest; what would you do? Replace him/her? With whom? Do you have a name in mind? Is that person willing and available? Are they qualified? Etc. It doesn't take long to go down the real world rabbit hole to discover that making changes is a lot harder than it looks. Change takes time, especially in larger institutions. Definitely give constructive feedback to your administration when given the opportunity to do so, but realize they are working with hundreds of ongoing issues, serving over a hundred students with vastly different needs, with a limited budget, and with limited time.

There's also the reality that large institutions will always make some mistakes. Ideally these are few, but they are an outgrowth of highly complex systems run by fallible human beings. I can assure you that every institution out there has their own set of problems, and the best ones are working diligently to fix them even if the results of that work will only come to fruition long after you graduate.

 

[masaraksh]

I just finished my first year and I find the "career advice" from my "advisor " to be terrible. Basically a useless long-winded "don't worry about anything, you will be fine" response.

This is probably fine if I was interested in FM or psych, but if I'm interested in ortho onc /surg onc I'd appreciate a little more individual advising for the money we're paying. Now I just have to find mentors myself...

 

[jw3600]

if it makes you feel any better, dental schools aren't any better, regardless if its public or private.

It doesn't. Honestly what's worse for me is my clueless classmates who do not even understand that their medical school exists to turn profits and give people cushy jobs.

In my opinion, there is nothing inherently wrong with this, but I'm all for calling a spade a spade.

 

[mimelim]

No matter where you go to school, you will have incompetent people above you, below you and at your level. In addition to the baseline, people make mistakes, including you. Sometimes it significantly impacts others, sometimes it doesn't. The key is to learn how to pick your battles. You can't fix medical education from where you are and it is ill advised to try, at least at this point in your training. The problem of course is that by the time you get to a point that you can start to change things, you will be too tired to do so. But that is another topic entirely.

 

[Goro]

You're not alone. Faculty feel this way too.

I really liked my school the first year of med school but now after hearing and experiencing more of their terrible behavior - I don't trust them. They've really screwed over some of my classmates and now I'm dealing with it to a much lesser extent. I really dislike how we have to kiss their asses until we graduate instead of calling them out for their lack of organization or concern for their students.

For me, it is a love/hate relationship. I love med school but at the same time the administration's disorganization has really screwed me over. Others, the consequences of the school refusing to take responsibility have been much greater.

I feel as though they only take steps to help students when it puts the school in a bad light (someone goes public). They do the bare minimum and the administration seems to constantly drop the ball without any consequences. If they screw up they tend to place the entire responsibility of their mistake on the students without admitting to any wrong doing.

The administration seems so shady and untrustworthy. Anyone else secretly feel like this?

 

[charmiedermie]

I really liked my school the first year of med school but now after hearing and experiencing more of their terrible behavior - I don't trust them. They've really screwed over some of my classmates and now I'm dealing with it to a much lesser extent. I really dislike how we have to kiss their asses until we graduate instead of calling them out for their lack of organization or concern for their students.

For me, it is a love/hate relationship. I love med school but at the same time the administration's disorganization has really screwed me over. Others, the consequences of the school refusing to take responsibility have been much greater.

I feel as though they only take steps to help students when it puts the school in a bad light (someone goes public). They do the bare minimum and the administration seems to constantly drop the ball without any consequences. If they screw up they tend to place the entire responsibility of their mistake on the students without admitting to any wrong doing.

The administration seems so shady and untrustworthy. Anyone else secretly feel like this?

I was in the same circumstance you are. Our administration was also disorganized and I would also say willfully deceptive, whenever it was convenient for them. A lot of useless higher education degree types looking to climb up the medical school job ladder. Medicine and med school seems to be a jobs program for certain non-MD/non-healthcare majors and degrees. Absolutely no clue about the residency match process and what is involved in matching into certain specialties and as @masaraksh
mentioned, terrible when it came to specialty advising. Don't even get me started on curriculum issues. That being said, our class came together a lot more than it would have because it became an us vs. them type of relationship, so someone who was struggling, instead of letting them struggle and flail, we helped them.

But if I had actually listened and followed the advice my school gave, I would have either failed out of med school or gotten into some crappy specialty just to make their numbers look good. I'm just waiting for the day they ask me for donations.

Who knows, maybe top-tier med schools roll out the red carpet for their medical students.

 

[emraldragon]

I realize everyone wants to maintain anonymity here, and no one wants to take a giant **** on their medical schools, but if the feelings these people have about the schools their at were available to prospective applicants, there might be fewer of them. I am (perhaps naively) hoping that not all schools make people feel this kind of mistrust and I would have liked to know that's how people felt before I picked school X to apply at and give 100 bucks to for a secondary.

 

[slopes23]

I realize everyone wants to maintain anonymity here, and no one wants to take a giant **** on their medical schools, but if the feelings these people have about the schools their at were available to prospective applicants, there might be fewer of them. I am (perhaps naively) hoping that not all schools make people feel this kind of mistrust and I would have liked to know that's how people felt before I picked school X to apply at and give 100 bucks to for a secondary.

It would honestly be silly to make this sort of black list. These are people from the internet. If you would take one persons supposed bad experience at a medical school as a basis to not apply there then your judgement is very poor.

There surely do exist some schools that are problematic however surmising which those are by a "one user review" where you likely are not being given the whole picture of the situation (author bias) could effectively and inappropriately harm otherwise very reputable schools.

 

[Cytarabine]

I realize everyone wants to maintain anonymity here, and no one wants to take a giant **** on their medical schools, but if the feelings these people have about the schools their at were available to prospective applicants, there might be fewer of them. I am (perhaps naively) hoping that not all schools make people feel this kind of mistrust and I would have liked to know that's how people felt before I picked school X to apply at and give 100 bucks to for a secondary.

I went to medical school at HMS, Stanford, UCSF, Yale, and Penn. Awful administration at all of them, transferred repeatedly to try and find a good one and eventually just gave up. I'd blacklist them all.























(you're welcome gunner premeds)

 

[operaman]

Where did you study @operaman ? Sounds like a hidden gem?

Just my state school. It wasn't perfect, but I think they did a great job with the resources at hand and serving a large, diverse class of people. While they have all the problems that any large, complex organization has, I would never classify any of the administration as anything but honest and professional, at least toward me as a student. Granted, things didn't always go my way, but that's just life. There are things I think they could have done better, but I'm sure my thoughts were nothing new and novel and faculty would probably love to have a magic wand to change them too. Whenever I got bad advice, I think the person giving it probably felt it was good advice and it probably was good advice for some people.

I guess I'm just sympathetic having had some experience from the other side of complex organizations.

You really have to take matters into your own hands when it comes to your future. If you sit around expecting your school or anyone else to hold your hand through everything, you're in for some serious disappointment. If you're professional, proactive, and take initiative, I think you'll find most all schools more than willing to help you along the way.

 

[slopes23]

Where did you study @operaman ? Sounds like a hidden gem?

This comment relies on the underlying assumption that most medical schools run a malignant program, while not only a very pessimistic assumption it also happens to be overwhelmingly false.

 

[Kaustikos]

No matter where you go to school, you will have incompetent people above you, below you and at your level. In addition to the baseline, people make mistakes, including you. Sometimes it significantly impacts others, sometimes it doesn't. The key is to learn how to pick your battles. You can't fix medical education from where you are and it is ill advised to try, at least at this point in your training. The problem of course is that by the time you get to a point that you can start to change things, you will be too tired to do so. But that is another topic entirely.

Right. Just be a slave to the end. No matter how wrong it is.

 

[mimelim]

Right. Just be a slave to the end. No matter how wrong it is.

As someone who doesn't care a ton for authority and butts heads too much. It simply is not worth it. It is about picking your battles. Could you challenge things? Absolutely, but you already have very limited time to learn what you need in your medical school and residency. Spending half of your time fighting the man is not how you become a good physician.

 

[WhippleWhileWeWork]

My former school hired a general surgeon who had her license revoked for an arrest for public intoxication to be one of our anatomy teachers. She lectured us endlessly on "professionalism". One of her reviews online says she cut both vagus nerves of the patient b/c she did the surgery drunk and settled up.

I left med school so they can't touch me now, but when I was in med school people were literally afraid to even acknowledge that the above was true, even the first part which is public record.

That letter being slipped into your file, the one they tell you about on the first day of orientation, kept everyone in line. What an amazing fiefdom they have there.

 

[jw3600]

My former school hired a general surgeon who had her license revoked for an arrest for public intoxication to be one of our anatomy teachers. She lectured us endlessly on "professionalism". One of her reviews online says she cut both vagus nerves of the patient b/c she did the surgery drunk and settled up.

I left med school so they can't touch me now, but when I was in med school people were literally afraid to even acknowledge that the above was true, even the first part which is public record.

That letter being slipped into your file, the one they tell you about on the first day of orientation, kept everyone in line. What an amazing fiefdom they have there.

While that story is crazy, I'm sure the sentiment everyone felt was similar to many schools.

I thought you were a second year?

 

[WhippleWhileWeWork]

While that story is crazy, I'm sure the sentiment everyone felt was similar to many schools.

I thought you were a second year?

I withdrew, my family grew by one and it was time to go back to work.

 

[jw3600]

I withdrew, my family grew by one and it was time to go back to work.

****ty. Is it basically a leave of absence? Hoping to go back?

 

[charmiedermie]

As someone who doesn't care a ton for authority and butts heads too much. It simply is not worth it. It is about picking your battles. Could you challenge things? Absolutely, but you already have very limited time to learn what you need in your medical school and residency. Spending half of your time fighting the man is not how you become a good physician.

What you said can be said for anything then. Why even say anything? It's perceptions like yours which is why certain med schools have no desire to change and why certain residencies stay malignant. Most medical students are not complaining about too much sugar in their coffee. They complain about serious things, after working hard and being as proactive as they possibly can, after which they need guidance, advising, or want their school to be a little more on the ball so they don't get f'ed over. It's not too much to ask.

My former school hired a general surgeon who had her license revoked for an arrest for public intoxication to be one of our anatomy teachers. She lectured us endlessly on "professionalism". One of her reviews online says she cut both vagus nerves of the patient b/c she did the surgery drunk and settled up.

I left med school so they can't touch me now, but when I was in med school people were literally afraid to even acknowledge that the above was true, even the first part which is public record.

That letter being slipped into your file, the one they tell you about on the first day of orientation, kept everyone in line. What an amazing fiefdom they have there.

That is disgusting.

 

[Mad Jack]

No comment. Take that for what you will

 

[olivarynucleus]

My former school hired a general surgeon who had her license revoked for an arrest for public intoxication to be one of our anatomy teachers. She lectured us endlessly on "professionalism". One of her reviews online says she cut both vagus nerves of the patient b/c she did the surgery drunk and settled up.

I left med school so they can't touch me now, but when I was in med school people were literally afraid to even acknowledge that the above was true, even the first part which is public record.

That letter being slipped into your file, the one they tell you about on the first day of orientation, kept everyone in line. What an amazing fiefdom they have there.

Will she ever practice again? Or did she ef up before her probation was up?

 

[WhippleWhileWeWork]

****ty. Is it basically a leave of absence? Hoping to go back?

Na, had a good career before, now coming back it's a great career. 40 hrs a week, came back over 100k, should top out around 200k. No reason to go back to med school now that the luster and shine of being a "doctor" is all but vanished from my once naive mind. Alot changed in the years between starting my post-bacc and matriculating, priorities being the main ones.

 

[WhippleWhileWeWork]

Will she ever practice again? Or did she ef up before her probation was up?

I'm not sure, the language is legalese that I'm not well versed in. I tried to read it in between memorizing countless anatomy structures and couldn't get the full meaning or implications of the case.

 

[jw3600]

Na, had a good career before, now coming back it's a great career. 40 hrs a week, came back over 100k, should top out around 200k. No reason to go back to med school now that the luster and shine of being a "doctor" is all but vanished from my once naive mind. Alot changed in the years between starting my post-bacc and matriculating, priorities being the main ones.

Good luck. Hopefully not too much debt from the first 2 years.

 

[WhippleWhileWeWork]

Good luck. Hopefully not too much debt from the first 2 years.

Thanks, I actually left halfway through 2nd semester, turns out if you leave early enough in the semester you get almost 50% tuition back, so I only payed a semester and a half at a state school. Very manageable.

 

[DocVapor]

Thanks, I actually left halfway through 2nd semester, turns out if you leave early enough in the semester you get almost 50% tuition back, so I only payed a semester and a half at a state school. Very manageable.

Aww I didn't know all this. Best of luck to you!

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Thanks, I actually left halfway through 2nd semester, turns out if you leave early enough in the semester you get almost 50% tuition back, so I only payed a semester and a half at a state school. Very manageable.

I wish you the best!

 

[YankeeCandle1141]

Most schools have 10 students lined up for every seat offered. They have literally zero incentive to operate in the best interest of their students. You can complain all you want, but as a student you are the most replaceable part of the school.
You will notice that when it comes to marketable aspects, schools will definitely excell. Board pass rates, residency placement etc...

Just dont expect anything else to be done.

Example: our school "website for students" (not sure what its called, but every school has one) is literally unusable. Dead links, information over 10 years outdated, typos....
They update the school home page every 6 months, and the "applicant info" page every month, but the actual student stuff is never even touched

 

[repititionition]

Most schools have 10 students lined up for every seat offered. They have literally zero incentive to operate in the best interest of their students. You can complain all you want, but as a student you are the most replaceable part of the school.
You will notice that when it comes to marketable aspects, schools will definitely excell. Board pass rates, residency placement etc...

Just dont expect anything else to be done.

Example: our school "website for students" (not sure what its called, but every school has one) is literally unusable. Dead links, information over 10 years outdated, typos....
They update the school home page every 6 months, and the "applicant info" page every month, but the actual student stuff is never even touched

Either we're at the same school or this really is common.

 

[Kaustikos]

As someone who doesn't care a ton for authority and butts heads too much. It simply is not worth it. It is about picking your battles. Could you challenge things? Absolutely, but you already have very limited time to learn what you need in your medical school and residency. Spending half of your time fighting the man is not how you become a good physician.

Agreed. I wasn't saying you were wrong, more cynically adding my comments lol

 

[olivarynucleus]

Most schools have 10 students lined up for every seat offered. They have literally zero incentive to operate in the best interest of their students. You can complain all you want, but as a student you are the most replaceable part of the school.
You will notice that when it comes to marketable aspects, schools will definitely excell. Board pass rates, residency placement etc...

Just dont expect anything else to be done.

Example: our school "website for students" (not sure what its called, but every school has one) is literally unusable. Dead links, information over 10 years outdated, typos....
They update the school home page every 6 months, and the "applicant info" page every month, but the actual student stuff is never even touched

But once you've actually started classes, they have a vested interest in keeping you there because they can't just pull from the waitlist when you are 4- 6 months into M1, for example. They want to keep getting that tuition money. And like many institutions of higher learning they will want to be nice to students to encourage those alumni checks to come in. My undergrad treated me like crap, I haven't given one red dime to those suckers. The school I'm at now is Okay so far, if we students complain enough they usually change stuff, and we have somewhat of an influence in the way things are done around here.

 

[Dares Dareson]

OP I'd like to know what exactly happened. Super vague post.

 

[Kaustikos]

OP I'd like to know what exactly happened. Super vague post.

If it's anything like my schools recent revisions (plural) in the past year, I can see what the OP might be talking about. Got to the point this year that the student affairs department was shut down, student education got some of the employees but students were left high and dry. They gave no advance notice.
Current third years only know what their schedule is on a month to month basis (not even blocks)... Which is super aggravating when you work at three different hospital networks that require you to have EMR, security, orientation and scrub cards done when you start. And two of those takes a week. And you can't get yearly access to this stuff anymore. It's month by month. If you try to cheat, they'll screw you over. I had to basically give an orientation to these guys and help them settle because the administration didn't know anything.