muffeoniv

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How many applicants have 1,000+ VOLUNTEER clinical :laugh:hours? what percent?
 
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BeachBlondie

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I will when I apply. But, it's unavoidable as it's a job. I'd say the percentage is relatively low as the only applicants with that much time to dedicate are usually post-bacc students.
 

jvesco22

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inb4 posters come in (apumic/familyaerospace) and boast their awesome stats!!!...:smuggrin:

OP rephrase it to "volunteer" clinical hours so we can single out the altruistic diehards!
 

libraryismyhome

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I have about 500 hours including high school ones. College is just 400. Combining with mission trip then it is 600 hours.

Combining with nonmedical volunteering then it would be close to 700 hours.
 

getright

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I'll probably only have about 500 by the time I apply next June.
 

libraryismyhome

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Unfortunately, according to my friend whose parents are doctors, volunteering is just a check mark, and beyond 100 hours is only causing diminishing returns. :(
 

GoodmanBrown

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Unfortunately, according to my friend whose parents are doctors, volunteering is just a check mark, and beyond 100 hours is only causing diminishing returns. :(
Yeah, sorry to break it to you, but I don't think anything above 200 is really going to help your application that much...
 

CougarMD

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Yeah, sorry to break it to you, but I don't think anything above 200 is really going to help your application that much...
I totally agree with that as far as sheer numbers go; I have way over 1000 and no one seems to care about the volume; I've attended 8/10 interviews so far and no one has mentioned it:)

However, I disagree in that the more hours you have, the more chances you have to amass great stories and talking points. Secondaries are a lot easier if you have interesting things to talk about, learning experiences, and good old passion. You're more likely to have passion about an experience that you have gotten really deep into. And you will hopefully have more to talk about too instead of repeating the same two stories over and over.
 

TTigers70

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As a volunteer EMT I'm probably up there although never really thought about it until now. Figuring just for the summer when I'm home from school: ~2 hours per call (from out the door when I get paged to restocking the rig etc) and I average 2 calls a day. For easy numbers thats 20 hours in a 5 day week plus my 10 hour duty shift puts it at 30 hours. I'll leave out Sunday to make up for inconsistencies in the averages. At ~14 weeks of summer that'd put me just over 400 hours a summer and I've been doing it for 3 years.

I really don't like the hours slots on the app. It's hard to explain my hours if something is predominately seasonal, etc.
 
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the entirety of my ECs consist of 129.75 hours in the er...should probably work on that :oops:
 

apumic

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Above around 200 volunteer and 500 clinical won't do you much good. Really, once you get above 500 or so, talking about "hours" is pretty silly.

As for volunteer hrs, not sure if I have more than 1000 clinical. In reality, I probably do but I don't count 'em all. The ones I have kept track of for AMCAS total around 600.
 
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Diggidy

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1500+ hours volunteer EMT
1-200 hours shadowing various docs
50-100 hours hospital volunteer

I don't think my clinical experience will be a weakness of mine.
 

hiphopapotamous

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How many applicants have 1,000+ VOLUNTEER clinical :laugh:hours? what percent?
I volunteer as an EMT 12 hours a week, so 1000 hours is not that hard. I've done it for over a year now, so about 40 weeks (around 30 weeks in a school year considering breaks and etc.) * 12 hrs = 480 hours. I'll have 30*2*12 hrs = 720 hours when I apply

3 years of volunteering at a hospital = 30*3*3 hrs = 270 hours

So just those two alone will be 990 hours, and I have other volunteer experiences.
 

Avoidthetiger

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I fail at accumulating volunteering hours.

Less than a 100 clinical volunteering... and none of it very meaningful or even mentioned during interviews.

Good thing I have other awesome ECs
 
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hiphopapotamous

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1500+ hours volunteer EMT
1-200 hours shadowing various docs
50-100 hours hospital volunteer

I don't think my clinical experience will be a weakness of mine.
Really, 1500+? 3 years, 43 weeks a year of 12 hr/week shifts? Do you live near your squad and volunteer during breaks? I mean, I'm sure your spring break + Thanksgiving break + winter break + summer break add up to more than 9 weeks a year.
 
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what do you mean how many people have 1000+ clinical hours? We all do; didn't you know it's a prereq? :p

Now that I think about it I probably have about 1000 research hours but nowhere near that many clinical hours. Maybe 100? I think with clinical experience it's quality over quantity...10 hours spend actively shadowing a physician--i.e. listening in on rounds, asking questions, discussing patients--trumps 100 hours sitting in the corner and being ignored.
 

apumic

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what do you mean how many people have 1000+ clinical hours? We all do; didn't you know it's a prereq? :p

Now that I think about it I probably have about 1000 research hours but nowhere near that many clinical hours. Maybe 100? I think with clinical experience it's quality over quantity...10 hours spend actively shadowing a physician--i.e. listening in on rounds, asking questions, discussing patients--trumps 100 hours sitting in the corner and being ignored.
If that's your volunteer experience, it's all for naught.

My in-clinic volunteer hours have been pretty much constant initial assessments of pts at admit and v/s on follow-ups, translating (English-Spanish) for the docs, looking up drugs for the doc/NP/PA, writing lab orders (per physician orders), conversing about healthcare issues with RNs, precepting new clinical volunteers, administering in-house labs (urine mostly + a couple blood) and reporting significant results to the doc (per orders), playing pharm tech (w/ a Pharm.D.'s close supervision), prepping (and sometimes performing with physician supervision) minor procedures (e.g., removing sutures or a cyst or minor wound care), setting up of EKGs and reporting significant findings to the doc or printing off the results (depending upon what the doc orders), etc. -- more or less the scope of practice of an ED Tech. In my EMS volunteer hours I do everything an EMT-B does on the field (incl. IV starts & drug administration within my scope)....

When I get pre-meds without any kind of cert/license, I can still precept them to do v/s, initial assessments, exam rm prep, etc. Sometimes, the docs will allow them to do a fair amount beyond that (surgical prep, lab orders, pharm tech if nobody's available, chart prep, etc.). They can also assist in a variety of related duties w/o clinical trng, such as prescription assistance (i.e., getting free meds) & eligibility (i.e., getting cleared to come to our clinic under state law). I'm allowed to do what I can b/c of my EMT license and experience as an ED Tech and such as well as having been there and having built trust with the RNs and MDs. They're wiling to allow me to get my hands dirty. The fact that it's a free clinic doing a ton of primary care also contributes enormously to that. That's why I advocate so much for people to go volunteer in free clinics over hospitals. They (free clinics) actually need you, so they'll utilize whatever skills you do have to a much larger extent and give you ridiculous amounts of informal/on-the-job training to get you up to speed in other areas so you can be maximally useful. In a free clinic setting, it's also much more encouraged to show your colleagues how to do new skills. It really is a great place to learn. I've also had some truly awesome shadowing experiences on nights where we've had too many nurses & techs and so I've shadowed one of our docs. One, in particular, is a clinical professor at one of the elite medical schools. As a volunteer under her, she is esp. tough when being shadowed. The questions she asked of me required knowledge quite a bit beyond that of a premedical student, which was intimidating, but it also meant I learned a lot that night and on subsequent evenings working with her.
 
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jvesco22

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Wow man, it's like you're already a doctor!
 

Narmerguy

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Always love how these threads turn into a wang-measuring contest.
 

apumic

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Well, the OP basically asked "how many of you have wangs longer than 10 inches?" What type of responses do you expect lol.
Does anyone ever actually take these threads seriously? I mean, really?! Who gives a **** if you, I, or some other kid has the most hours or did more? It's all about how you present it in an interview. If people ask what others have done, you give an answer. If that answer is impressive or not... who really cares? I, for one, don't. If you're that focused on what "the competition" is doing, you're going to lose every time. Now if you learn from them, that's great, but you're best off focusing on your own work and accomplishments.
 

normtheniner

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I have like 500 hours in a free clinic getting vitals, taking CC/HPI, updating drug charts, stuff like that. More recently I've started teaching the newer volunteers how to do this.

I have like 200 hours shadowing various docs which was pretty fun, but I think you get to a point where shadowing just makes you cranky because you're ready to just start med school.

I'm also an emergency medicine scribe... no idea how many hours I have here...

Ultimately I think it comes down to the qualitative things you've acquired from all this and the more you do, the less quantitative things like hours matter.

In my last interview they asked me how many hours of each activity I had (it was a blind interview), but they seemed more interested in what I gained from the experience (he asked me for specific situations that were memorable to me).
 

Lunasly

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Oh wow I never knew this. I understand the term quality over quantity, but doesn't 1000 hours of volunteer service at any one organization show quality? I always thought quantity mean't having many smaller EC's as opposed to a few longer term ones.

Would it be then better to find a medium and volunteer at say 6 different organization bi-weekly as opposed to 3 every week?

Thanks.
 

hiphopapotamous

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Oh wow I never knew this. I understand the term quality over quantity, but doesn't 1000 hours of volunteer service at any one organization show quality? I always thought quantity mean't having many smaller EC's as opposed to a few longer term ones.

Would it be then better to find a medium and volunteer at say 6 different organization bi-weekly as opposed to 3 every week?

Thanks.
Mean't?... Mea not?
 

apumic

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I have like 500 hours in a free clinic getting vitals, taking CC/HPI, updating drug charts, stuff like that. More recently I've started teaching the newer volunteers how to do this.

I have like 200 hours shadowing various docs which was pretty fun, but I think you get to a point where shadowing just makes you cranky because you're ready to just start med school.

I'm also an emergency medicine scribe... no idea how many hours I have here...

Ultimately I think it comes down to the qualitative things you've acquired from all this and the more you do, the less quantitative things like hours matter.

In my last interview they asked me how many hours of each activity I had (it was a blind interview), but they seemed more interested in what I gained from the experience (he asked me for specific situations that were memorable to me).
Your experience reminds me of STAR behavioral interviewing and is a lot like what I've experienced on school interviews. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if they were using this interview method (which seems to be quite popular amongst HR depts at a number of health organizations these days).

Oh wow I never knew this. I understand the term quality over quantity, but doesn't 1000 hours of volunteer service at any one organization show quality? I always thought quantity mean't having many smaller EC's as opposed to a few longer term ones.

Would it be then better to find a medium and volunteer at say 6 different organization bi-weekly as opposed to 3 every week?

Thanks.

Quality:

Direct Pt care
Responsibility for Pt outcomes
Working closely w/ the rest of the healthcare team (esp. MDs/DOs & RNs)
Strength of LORs rec'd
Length of commitment as evidenced by development and demonstration of leadership within the organization

Quantity:
# hrs
Length of commitment (at least 9-12 mos; beyond 2-3 yrs sees extreme diminishing returns)


Quality>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Quantity

# of hours is virtually meaningless. Keep in mind that most organizations consider anyone w/ less than ~500 hrs (90 days FTE) to be a probationary employee (i.e., still in training/orientation). The typical volunteer never gets beyond those initial 500 hrs. In other words, the number of hrs you put in is basically insignificant. You cannot even begin to be compared to someone who is employed in healthcare by hrs, so you must be compared in other ways (e.g., quality of experience). Additionally, quality of experience varies greatly. Someone with 2000 hours sitting behind a desk pulling files and transferring calls to pts' rooms has gotten FAR less pt care experience (and probably learned FAR, FAR less about Pt care) than someone with 400 hrs helping the techs triage Pts in a busy ED (e.g., taking vitals, pushing wheelchairs, responding to call lights at busy times to assist the techs, etc.).


As for volunteering at multiple places...I'd just start with one. I am volunteering at multiple due to limited hrs available at one of them and an interest in emergency medicine. Each site offers different experiences and opportunities, so I got involved with 2. As things go, I probably will end up picking up some occasional time at a third helping to develop an on-site EMS program for another organization because of my experience and background.
 

wanderer

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I had something like a little bit over 400 clinical volunteer hours, and several of my interviewers told me they were very impressed with the amount I did, so quantity does matter, though it probably shouldn't. I think that anything more than 300-400 is unnecessary though. I didn't really set any goals, it was just something I did every week and when I calculated the hours that's what it came out to.
 

normtheniner

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Oh wow I never knew this. I understand the term quality over quantity, but doesn't 1000 hours of volunteer service at any one organization show quality? I always thought quantity mean't having many smaller EC's as opposed to a few longer term ones.

Would it be then better to find a medium and volunteer at say 6 different organization bi-weekly as opposed to 3 every week?

Thanks.
Don't get me wrong 1000 hours says a lot on its own. Assuming you're in school while accumulating these hours says something about your ability manage your time.

Personally I think having fewer activities and really committing to something like a free clinic would look pretty good. For me volunteering at the free clinic has had a great impact on me and its taught me a lot.

Prior to volunteering there I had never been alone one-on-one with a patient (I had only shadowed) and working with patients is a unique (and often rewarding) experience.
 
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1500+ hours volunteer EMT
1-200 hours shadowing various docs
50-100 hours hospital volunteer

I don't think my clinical experience will be a weakness of mine.
as in 1.00 to 200.00 hours? Hmm, that's quite the difference you've got there.
 

PreMedder

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As a volunteer EMT I'm probably up there although never really thought about it until now. Figuring just for the summer when I'm home from school: ~2 hours per call (from out the door when I get paged to restocking the rig etc) and I average 2 calls a day. For easy numbers thats 20 hours in a 5 day week plus my 10 hour duty shift puts it at 30 hours. I'll leave out Sunday to make up for inconsistencies in the averages. At ~14 weeks of summer that'd put me just over 400 hours a summer and I've been doing it for 3 years.

I really don't like the hours slots on the app. It's hard to explain my hours if something is predominately seasonal, etc.
what the hell are you doing for 2 hours per call?
 

apumic

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what the hell are you doing for 2 hours per call?
Maybe he gets "2 hrs of credit" per time he's called in as an on-call volunteer or something weird like that. If it's taking you 2 hrs to get a call done, though... I hope at least a few of your pts survive until they get to the ED! :laugh:
 

hiphopapotamous

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what the hell are you doing for 2 hours per call?
Here's a typical call (copied and pasted most of these times from an actual call):
02:49 - dispatched (additional crew member leaves for squad building)
02:55 - responding from quarters
03:13 - arrived on scene
03:24 - departure for hospital
03:38 - arrived at hospital
03:54 - clear and available
04:16 - back at quarters
(let's say it takes 5 minutes to restock and only 15 minutes to fill the chart, then the additional crew member leaves around 04:36 and gets back home around 04:43, about 2 hours later)
 

apumic

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^Is this fire? I'm guessing it's not a devoted EMS service?

When I've gone w/ AMR, it typically looks more like (T=0 min is time of dispatch following or during 911 call):

0 -- instructions rec'd from Dispatch
1 -- leave from nearest post
10 -- arrive on-scene
25 -- leave scene, en route to ED
40 -- arrive at hospital, pt handoff to RN
50 -- Finished hand-off; finish Run Rpt
60 -- Have rec'd next dispatch

Trucks are prepped at the beginning of a shift.
 

Doctor246853

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Mean't?... Mea not?
Dang. Why do people act like word nazis on the internet. You know what they "mean't". Its not like they are talking like that at their interview of something. Chill out.:mad:
 

ElChamaco

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I'd be more interested in hearing about people with interesting clinical experiences that are unique in either their settings or responsibilities etc.

I'm sure some people have had fascinating experiences that changed the way they look at the practice of medicine or the world in general. Accounts of those experiences would be more interesting to read than the number of "clinical hours" accumulated.
 
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How many applicants have 1,000+ VOLUNTEER clinical :laugh:hours? what percent?
Well, if you volunteer as an EMT, or work in a clinical environment, those hours would rack up pretty quickly. I have well over 5,000 volunteering as a Paramedic for over three years. Does that make me special? NO. No one cares beyond a certain threshold. (As in, once you reach 200 or so, it hardly matters how much you have.)
 

Lunasly

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Your experience reminds me of STAR behavioral interviewing and is a lot like what I've experienced on school interviews. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if they were using this interview method (which seems to be quite popular amongst HR depts at a number of health organizations these days).




Quality:

Direct Pt care
Responsibility for Pt outcomes
Working closely w/ the rest of the healthcare team (esp. MDs/DOs & RNs)
Strength of LORs rec'd
Length of commitment as evidenced by development and demonstration of leadership within the organization

Quantity:
# hrs
Length of commitment (at least 9-12 mos; beyond 2-3 yrs sees extreme diminishing returns)


Quality>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Quantity

# of hours is virtually meaningless. Keep in mind that most organizations consider anyone w/ less than ~500 hrs (90 days FTE) to be a probationary employee (i.e., still in training/orientation). The typical volunteer never gets beyond those initial 500 hrs. In other words, the number of hrs you put in is basically insignificant. You cannot even begin to be compared to someone who is employed in healthcare by hrs, so you must be compared in other ways (e.g., quality of experience). Additionally, quality of experience varies greatly. Someone with 2000 hours sitting behind a desk pulling files and transferring calls to pts' rooms has gotten FAR less pt care experience (and probably learned FAR, FAR less about Pt care) than someone with 400 hrs helping the techs triage Pts in a busy ED (e.g., taking vitals, pushing wheelchairs, responding to call lights at busy times to assist the techs, etc.).


As for volunteering at multiple places...I'd just start with one. I am volunteering at multiple due to limited hrs available at one of them and an interest in emergency medicine. Each site offers different experiences and opportunities, so I got involved with 2. As things go, I probably will end up picking up some occasional time at a third helping to develop an on-site EMS program for another organization because of my experience and background.
Well I currently volunteer at an ER and there are a lot of things that we can’t do because they are in not in our scope or practice. For example, I can push a patient around in a wheelchair, but I can’t do any sort of work that would be meant for a staff member. So I guess in the end the quality of my services would never be excellent. I live in Canada, however, and even here things like shadowing a physician is illegal because it violates doctor-patient confidentiality.
 

apumic

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Well I currently volunteer at an ER and there are a lot of things that we can’t do because they are in not in our scope or practice. For example, I can push a patient around in a wheelchair, but I can’t do any sort of work that would be meant for a staff member. So I guess in the end the quality of my services would never be excellent. I live in Canada, however, and even here things like shadowing a physician is illegal because it violates doctor-patient confidentiality.
This is why I strongly suggest people (yourself included) move away from hospital volunteering. Granted, due to socialized healthcare, I'm not sure if you have the kinds of free clinics we have here in the States. If you do, I'd try volunteering at one of them.
 
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I live in Canada, however, and even here things like shadowing a physician is illegal because it violates doctor-patient confidentiality.
Socialism at its finest. After Western Europe and Massachusetts, of course.
 

Lunasly

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This is why I strongly suggest people (yourself included) move away from hospital volunteering. Granted, due to socialized healthcare, I'm not sure if you have the kinds of free clinics we have here in the States. If you do, I'd try volunteering at one of them.
Unfortunately for those in Canada, volunteering in a hospital is the most clinical exposure anyone is going to get. I went to many clinics and none of the physicians would allow me to shadow or volunteer and they would always redirect me to the hospital.
 

familyaerospace

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Since someone mentioned my name, I figure I might as well respond. I don't particularly think I have awesome stats regarding volunteering.

For clinical volunteering, I should be around ~400 hours by May 2011. I have just under 270 now I think. I didn't check my numbers yesterday, but I know where I was a few weeks ago. These numbers come from one year and one month of volunteering and if I continue at 4 to 5 hours a week, I should get at least another 100 hours before I send my application. Just think it is not a lot. 1 year volunteering at 4 hours a week would be 208 hours. 1 week of volunteering at 5 hours a week would be 260. One of my friends who is applying this cycle probably has 1000 hours of clinical volunteering as he volunteered at two hospitals, plus he also works in medicine as a transporter. I was trying to get another clinical volunteering position doing something different at an HIV clinic, but assuming that happens, I will not be able to do it before application. My doctor wanted me involved in another project that would have been mostly medical volunteering which would have easily pushed me over 1000, but that is unlikely to occur because I think he has some form of executive dysfunction.

My shadowing is 150+ hours. I'm enjoying it, so I continue to do it even though I am likely well past the point of diminishing returns as far as applications go. (I love the attending I am shadowing now. I think I would superglue myself to him and come everyday if he would let me.)

My non-medical volunteering just for the main space advocacy organization I volunteered with as a science editor and writer would be over 1500 hours. I did it over a course of 3 years. I had that type of time, plus the president had known me for years so he trusted me more than others. I'm being conservative with those numbers since I didn't include any of his panicked late night calls that you would think the world was exploding, or the trips I had to go on for him, or all the interviews I had to do on his behalf. When I was in undergrad, I knew many undergrads who pulled off much higher volunteering rates. I knew people who literally pulled off a thousand community service hours a year. I don't know how they had the time, unless they did the bulk over breaks, but I know they did it. I did all of mine after graduate school.

Remember it's not the quantity of hours, but the quality of hours. I'm sure a lot of people with a lot fewer hours have had a much better quality of experience.

Also, under no circumstance was I ever trying to collect hours just to fulfill a check box. I started volunteering and started shadowing as part of my desensitization therapy for my medical phobia. The goal was at least 100 hours of hospital volunteering (more if I was still visibly uncomfortable) and as many hours as I could stand watching procedures. I'm now doing everything because I honestly want to do it. It just happened to be when I was in process that a life changing experience happened (had nothing to do with the volunteering or shadowing) and I realized that I really wanted to go into medicine. A few weeks later, I joined SDN and learned that shadowing and hospital volunteering could be used for medical school as well.
 

PreMedder

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inb4 posters come in (apumic/familyaerospace) and boast their awesome stats!!!...:smuggrin:

OP rephrase it to "volunteer" clinical hours so we can single out the altruistic diehards!
haha i actually just read this thread and saw this. then #17... then #40.

rep'd