How much do preclinical grades matter compared to boards scores?

[TheCruelOne]

I'm a 2nd year student and I'm hoping someone can give me a little advice about how much preclinical grades matter down the road when applying to residencies. I'm currently doing well in my pre-clinical courses with about B+ average in most classes and a few A-'s. We recently learned our cumulative class average was ~85% and I'm currently at an 88% average, however I honestly don't feel like I genuinely KNOW the information that we've learned. My memory is pretty horrible and I feel like I've forgotten a large portion of what we learned as M1s, and I even start forgetting a lot of info as soon as I finish taking an exam on that given subject.

After talking to some friends, we additionally feel like our school's exams don't really give us the best prep for boards compared to some other medical schools. We're tested on a lot of minutiae and when I study for tests, I feel like I'm just memorizing the points that I think each lecturer will test me on. My friend talked about the idea of purposely not focusing too much on lecture material and placing more emphasis on starting to study the board-relevant info as we continue through the systems.

I'm really conflicted because I feel like if I keep placing so much emphasis on our lectures, I'll actually be behind the game when it comes to learning what I need to for boards. At the same time, I'm scared to compromise my pre-clinical grades in favor of studying just the board-relevant stuff because I know our lecturers will test us on random details. I'm not sure if there's some kind of happy medium I can achieve where I learn the lecture content and still perform well on tests, but still learn and retain the board-relevant content as we keep going along through the systems.

If anyone has any advice or recommendations as to how I should proceed, I'd really appreciate it. If anyone was in a similar situation and can share their story, I'd really love that too. Thank you!

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[68PGunner]

Second year here. These are my numbers in term of preclinical grades and qbank %:

First year preclinical: 87% w/ qbank 40-50%
2nd year preclinical: 81% w/ qbank 70-85%

I'm perfectly fine w/ these #s. Will start Uworld in Jan. Aiming for 240+ here.

 

[IntheClouds4ever]

No one cares about preclinical grades as long as you passed first attempt and aren't "scraping by". Board scores trump everything. Period. If you are doing average in class +\- a few points then don't sweat it and start worrying about your long term retention. There will be some students who do well, but info dump, and others who do average and remember everything they learned. Find out which type you are and focus on your weaknesses during board prep

 

[DO2015CA]

Limit of negative infinity

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Just don't be in the bottom third. Board scores are more important by a long shot.

 

[getfat]

Second year here. These are my numbers in term of preclinical grades and qbank %:

First year preclinical: 87% w/ qbank 40-50%
2nd year preclinical: 81% w/ qbank 70-85%

I'm perfectly fine w/ these #s. Will start Uworld in Jan. Aiming for 240+ here.

When did you take these qbank questions during first year? Over break?

 

[68PGunner]

When did you take these qbank questions during first year? Over break?

Near the end of 1st and 2nd semester. I did about 40 quests at end of 1st semester and about another 100 quests at end of 2nd semester.

 

[SurgDoc95]

Near the end of 1st and 2nd semester. I did about 40 quests at end of 1st semester and about another 100 quests at end of 2nd semester.

What qbank did you use at the end of first semester of year one?

 

[68PGunner]

I used Kaplan for those quests. However, near the end of my second semester, I started taking board prep more seriously. I scored about 77% on all USMLERx quests for msk and about 70% for USMLERx quests for psych. This year, I used Kaplan as my first qbank while going through a block and then used USMLERx as my second qbank 1 week after I finish a block.

I have access to both Kaplan and USMLERx qbanks.

 

[KO_TV]

Lol sounds like we go to the same school....
Something I've always been confused on is this: The general consensus on SDN is that pre-clinical grades do not matter. However, if you look at NRMP PD Surveys, they rank class ranking/quartile relatively high across many specialties (at least 80% and higher in terms of importance). So doesn't that mean that pre-clinical grades are pretty important since they play a role in determining your rank? Or am I completely off base on this?

 

[IslandStyle808]

Lol sounds like we go to the same school....
Something I've always been confused on is this: The general consensus on SDN is that pre-clinical grades do not matter. However, if you look at NRMP PD Surveys, they rank class ranking/quartile relatively high across many specialties (at least 80% and higher in terms of importance). So doesn't that mean that pre-clinical grades are pretty important since they play a role in determining your rank? Or am I completely off base on this?

Correct. Its because grades don't give a full picture of how hard the curriculum is. You could go to one school where nearly 50% of the class gets A. Or you could go to another school where only 40% of the class gets Bs or better. This is why they use school rank to know how good of student you are. However, in the grand scheme of things board scores, ms III grades, and LORs will over shadow class rank (some school also boards into those into class ranks). We also don't have AOA for medical school (since we are accredited by COCA), so grades have even less relevance.

 

[Jinxapotato]

I think as long as you're above average you're totally fine. Focus on dat board tho, you NEED to be above average at least to look good, and by definition around half of us will fall below average.

 

[statlin98]

When do most students recommend starting to study for USMLE? I've heard some say don't even touch it first year then others say the opposite.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

When do most students recommend starting to study for USMLE? I've heard some say don't even touch it first year then others say the opposite.

Depends on how much of a gunner you are

 

[Jinxapotato]

When do most students recommend starting to study for USMLE? I've heard some say don't even touch it first year then others say the opposite.

I don't think studying during first year would help. I studied over the Summer, didn't remember jack when I started board review by 2nd year. Just take it easy the first year, and go ham the second year during board prep, 3-4 month of on and off studying + 6 weeks of focused dedicated time is all you need.

 

[68PGunner]

Lol sounds like we go to the same school....
Something I've always been confused on is this: The general consensus on SDN is that pre-clinical grades do not matter. However, if you look at NRMP PD Surveys, they rank class ranking/quartile relatively high across many specialties (at least 80% and higher in terms of importance). So doesn't that mean that pre-clinical grades are pretty important since they play a role in determining your rank? Or am I completely off base on this?

Why don't you put yourself in the shoes of a PD and think for a sec why you should give a damn about preclinical grades? Think about it... especially all the important stuff that you're looking for in a resident.

 

[IntheClouds4ever]

Why don't you put yourself in the shoes of a PD and think for a sec why you should give a damn about preclinical grades? Think about it... especially all the important stuff that you're looking for in a resident.

Step score shows your medical knowledge, LORs show you aren't a complete a**, and the audition is to show the residents/attending that they can tolerate you for ~60-80 hrs a week. The rest of the objective categories (preclinical grades/rank) have their place , but it's not going to make or break you unless you are wanting a extremely competitive residency (Ex. ENT requiring you to be in the top 20% of class, etc)

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Second year here. These are my numbers in term of preclinical grades and qbank %:

First year preclinical: 87% w/ qbank 40-50%
2nd year preclinical: 81% w/ qbank 70-85%

I'm perfectly fine w/ these #s. Will start Uworld in Jan. Aiming for 240+ here.

I think that's a pretty reasonable expectation. Overall I think everyone should look into a strong pathophysiology resource or something that explains path more, like Golijan or something. I think the FA + Pathoma combo is honestly just not enough. You'll end up spending just way too much time googling uworld path explainations otherwise.

 

[shadowlightfox]

Pre-clinical grades are about as important as your MCAT scores. They're for your own benefit to make use out of.

 

[IslandStyle808]

I think that's a pretty reasonable expectation. Overall I think everyone should look into a strong pathophysiology resource or something that explains path more, like Golijan or something. I think the FA + Pathoma combo is honestly just not enough. You'll end up spending just way too much time googling uworld path explainations otherwise.

Are there other examples beyond Golijan that you can think of?

 

[DO2015CA]

Are there other examples beyond Golijan that you can think of?

Pathoma is a god send. Right now golijan audio recording is starting to get dated. There is validity in the material but I feel the focus is changing. Pathoma and even sketchy pathoma I've heard good stuff about

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Pathoma is a god send. Right now golijan audio recording is starting to get dated. There is validity in the material but I feel the focus is changing. Pathoma and even sketchy pathoma I've heard good stuff about

I feel like Pathoma is not even remotely adequate. Sketchy is sufficient for micro and a strong resource for pharm. But I do believe that supplementing pathoma with a better and more concise resource ( if you're not in a Robbins curriculum) is honestly necessary.

Are there other examples beyond Golijan that you can think of?

Idk. I used DIT. I never used the primer videos however.

 

[DO2015CA]

I feel like Pathoma is not even remotely adequate. Sketchy is sufficient for micro and a strong resource for pharm. But I do believe that supplementing pathoma with a better and more concise resource ( if you're not in a Robbins curriculum) is honestly necessary.



Idk. I used DIT. I never used the primer videos however.

I would agree alone it is insufficient but for hammering out info it is clutch. I did DIT, sketchy, and pathoma/FA and was happy with the result

 

[IslandStyle808]

Pathoma is a god send. Right now golijan audio recording is starting to get dated. There is validity in the material but I feel the focus is changing. Pathoma and even sketchy pathoma I've heard good stuff about

Yep, I already have pathoma and am loving it (doesn't have enough board topics in some areas, but still very helpful). The dark horse that is starting to standout is B&B, and I'm like that too.

 

[Carbon090]

I might be an odd one, but I actually enjoy reading Robbins. I try to take the time to read it when I can.