Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
I am a pre med junior studying Microbiology and due to fortunate circumstances and a head start, I will have acquired my bachelors degree a year early. Thanks to some connections I have, I had the opportunity to write a case report with a gastroenterologist and I am getting it published in the American Journal of Gastroenterology. I have the opportunity to write more with him and a pediatric cardiologist. Furthermore, I am going to be participating in clinical research and basic research. How much will this factor into medical school acceptance??? I ask because I'm a full time student, preparing for my MCAT and while I can manage doing this as well, I have to know that its actually worth it-- med school acceptance-wise.

Thoughts please. Thanksl.
 
OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
I hope so! I am also hoping that if I do a lot of research and publications I won't have to worry about other tedious extracurricular activities (and maybe not worry about having the highest MCAT grade :p)
 

MalibuPreMD

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Oct 30, 2006
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Adcoms look for leadership and clinical experience, do not skip out on these even if you think you have great research. MCAT/GPA>>>>research, 3-4 publications with a 30 MCAT ain't gettin' you in to a top 40 school.
 
Oct 27, 2013
527
193
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Pre-Medical
All that research and publications look great, but no one cares that you graduated within three years. It's debatable to think med schools prefer more experienced (aka older) students, but you may want to reconsider graduating early. This could be the opportunity to acquire other factors that also make a difference: leadership, clinical experience, community/volunteering. Some of those tedious ECs may actually be worthwhile.
 
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OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
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Pre-Medical
All that research and publications look great, but no one cares that you graduated within three years. It's debatable to think med schools prefer more experienced (aka older) students, but you may want to reconsider graduating early. This could be the opportunity to acquire other factors that also make a difference: leadership, clinical experience, community/volunteering. Some of those tedious ECs may actually be worthwhile.
Maybe. But it can also be said that graduating at a young age with a plethora of credit hours, research/publications, and a decent MCAT score is proof of talent.
 
OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
Adcoms look for leadership and clinical experience, do not skip out on these even if you think you have great research. MCAT/GPA>>>>research, 3-4 publications with a 30 MCAT ain't gettin' you in to a top 40 school.
What do you think is leadership experience? Examples? "leadership experience" is just such a vague term to me. I've volunteered three years in a hospital and held a job as a sales associate but thats about it. Also, I don't understand how leadership plays in when you have been a student and are going to be a student for the next 7 years minimum. Leadership doesn't play in until after that period of time.
 
Oct 27, 2013
527
193
Status
Pre-Medical
Maybe. But it can also be said that graduating at a young age with a plethora of credit hours, research/publications, and a decent MCAT score is proof of talent.
Those components you mentioned requires an adcoms to infer something about you that may not be there. ECs are proof. Let's take leadership: you could help to run a freshman orientation program or be an RA. Let's say you're asked in the secondaries which type of community activities had most meaning. Saying you have done nothing outside of academics and research doesn't cut it. How does your plethora of credit hours (that you got because your college accepts an unlimited number of APs) compare to someone who has two majors and a masters? My point is, you need to differentiate yourself and oftentimes, the ECs help.

You asked how much your research will help, and it will. But that's not the only thing that gets you into medical school.
 

Ace Khalifa

I am the definition of awesomeness
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Those components you mentioned requires an adcoms to infer something about you that may not be there. ECs are proof. Let's take leadership: you could help to run a freshman orientation program or be an RA. Let's say you're asked in the secondaries which type of community activities had most meaning. Saying you have done nothing outside of academics and research doesn't cut it. How does your plethora of credit hours (that you got because your college accepts an unlimited number of APs) compare to someone who has two majors and a masters? My point is, you need to differentiate yourself and oftentimes, the ECs help.

You asked how much your research will help, and it will. But that's not the only thing that gets you into medical school.
I absolutely agree with @ThisCouldBeYou. Med schools don't want research robots. They want kind, caring, genuine, passionate people. EC's aren't something to just check off; they're for you to do because you enjoy doing them and have supposedly grown and learned from. Sure, your research helps, but you still need adequate clinical exposure and volunteering/service as well as leadership.

Also, don't assume you're hot stuff just because you're going to graduate early with a lot of credits and a lot of research. There will be many applicants who have done as much or more research than you but will have managed to have extensive clinical experience, proven leadership ability, and a well-rounded personality.

Lastly, leadership is important because physicians are leaders in the healthcare field. They are the ones who have the ultimate say in how a patient's care will be conducted, while still working as a key team player with nurses, lab techs, CI's, etc. and listening to their input as well. I've seen this on a daily basis in the ER in my work as a scribe. Nurses do most of the direct patient care, but they always come to the doctor before doing something that could significantly impact a patient's care (e.g. how much epi to give to a pt whose BP has been decreasing steadily since the initial encounter). It also holds true especially for surgery. My ortho friend/mentor who I shadowed told me that no matter what your personality is, you need to be a leader when you and your team are in the OR.
 

Blizzard18

5+ Year Member
Jul 2, 2013
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I don't want to sound like an ass, I think it's obvious that this is going to look good on your resume.
Reminds me of my buddy that asks professors questions and then answers them after he ask them and waits with his tail wagging hoping the professor will rub his belly. Get over needing everyone's approval, makes med school much more difficult, and life in general. Because we both know that you know your resume is impressive.
-current M1
 
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xffan624

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Jan 6, 2013
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What do you think is leadership experience? Examples? "leadership experience" is just such a vague term to me. I've volunteered three years in a hospital and held a job as a sales associate but thats about it. Also, I don't understand how leadership plays in when you have been a student and are going to be a student for the next 7 years minimum. Leadership doesn't play in until after that period of time.
Do you think ADCOM's are looking for good students or good doctors? Your screen name and comments indicates you think it's the former.

You will have be a leader as a resident so you might want to shave a couple years off your student years. You may have a team of medical students under you or you will have to coordinate the care of a patient using a team of other health professionals. Honestly your attitude is a bit concerning and immature and if I heard those words come out of your mouth as an ADCOM, no matter how many publications you had, you'd be an automatic reject.

Research jockeys go to PhD school. ADCOM's want well rounded students who understand what they're actually training to become (i.e. a doctor and leader of a healthcare team).
 
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NickNaylor

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Maybe. But it can also be said that graduating at a young age with a plethora of credit hours, research/publications, and a decent MCAT score is proof of talent.
Yes, it does demonstrate "proof of talent," but here's the problem: there are more than enough students that have "proof of talent" than there are spots in medical schools. Contrary to what you might believe, medical schools would have absolutely no problem filling their classes with people that will not only get through the medical curriculum without difficulty but will excel in that environment.

Academic prowess and excellence is only one aspect of who you are, and the reality is that, in the long-run, that aspect of yourself really isn't that important. What's important is your ability to work well with your peers and superiors, your interest in the actual work of being a physician, having the character qualities that will make you caring, compassionate, and dedicated, and just generally not being a pain in the ass.

I serve on my school's admissions committee, and just a couple of weeks ago we discussed an applicant that was an academic all-star (4.0, 40+ MCAT, multiple pubs, etc. etc.) but who couldn't interview his way out of a paper bag. He ultimately received bad scores from the committee and will not be getting an acceptance. While it's important to be academically talented, thinking that alone is going to distinguish you from other applicants, particularly at the top schools, is misguided.
 

640936

Internally driven
Sep 17, 2014
48
14
Status
Pre-Medical
I am a pre med junior studying Microbiology and due to fortunate circumstances and a head start, I will have acquired my bachelors degree a year early. Thanks to some connections I have, I had the opportunity to write a case report with a gastroenterologist and I am getting it published in the American Journal of Gastroenterology. I have the opportunity to write more with him and a pediatric cardiologist. Furthermore, I am going to be participating in clinical research and basic research. How much will this factor into medical school acceptance??? I ask because I'm a full time student, preparing for my MCAT and while I can manage doing this as well, I have to know that its actually worth it-- med school acceptance-wise.

Thoughts please. Thanksl.
You sound like my twin! Year-ahead research microbio majors for the win!
 
Aug 22, 2014
23
23
Status
Pre-Medical
I am a pre-med junior and will be graduating a year early, published work, plus other research and clinical research. How detrimental is this to my life? Should I just go ahead and go Caribbean?

Thoughts please. Thanksl.
FTFY...


...Seriously this is the dumbest sh!t I have ever read on SDN. Get a life.
 
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Mar 18, 2013
85
94
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Pre-Medical
I hope so! I am also hoping that if I do a lot of research and publications I won't have to worry about other tedious extracurricular activities (and maybe not worry about having the highest MCAT grade :p)
I suggest you do some extracurricular activities to round yourself out or you run the risk of sounding extremely boring on paper.
 
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OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
Those components you mentioned requires an adcoms to infer something about you that may not be there. ECs are proof. Let's take leadership: you could help to run a freshman orientation program or be an RA. Let's say you're asked in the secondaries which type of community activities had most meaning. Saying you have done nothing outside of academics and research doesn't cut it. How does your plethora of credit hours (that you got because your college accepts an unlimited number of APs) compare to someone who has two majors and a masters? My point is, you need to differentiate yourself and oftentimes, the ECs help.

You asked how much your research will help, and it will. But that's not the only thing that gets you into medical school.
I suppose you're right. I guess I'll just take up anything that'd help demonstrate leadership ability...not that I consider myself a leader honestly
 
OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
I absolutely agree with @ThisCouldBeYou. Med schools don't want research robots. They want kind, caring, genuine, passionate people. EC's aren't something to just check off; they're for you to do because you enjoy doing them and have supposedly grown and learned from. Sure, your research helps, but you still need adequate clinical exposure and volunteering/service as well as leadership.

Also, don't assume you're hot stuff just because you're going to graduate early with a lot of credits and a lot of research. There will be many applicants who have done as much or more research than you but will have managed to have extensive clinical experience, proven leadership ability, and a well-rounded personality.

Lastly, leadership is important because physicians are leaders in the healthcare field. They are the ones who have the ultimate say in how a patient's care will be conducted, while still working as a key team player with nurses, lab techs, CI's, etc. and listening to their input as well. I've seen this on a daily basis in the ER in my work as a scribe. Nurses do most of the direct patient care, but they always come to the doctor before doing something that could significantly impact a patient's care (e.g. how much epi to give to a pt whose BP has been decreasing steadily since the initial encounter). It also holds true especially for surgery. My ortho friend/mentor who I shadowed told me that no matter what your personality is, you need to be a leader when you and your team are in the OR.
I see. I'm beginning to understand more about this leadership business though I'm sure it's something that comes with the massive training you receive in med school. Either way, i think you guys have a point. For the record, I have shadowed about 10 doctors and volunteered at a hospital for three years but I just don't see that as "leadership" abilities since that word holds a strong conotation so to speak. One more thing, do they care about that caring personality if you are striving towards being an academician? Does bedside manner matter at that point? I mean I am a textbook warrior after all ;)
 
OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
Reminds me of my buddy that asks professors questions and then answers them after he ask them and waits with his tail wagging hoping the professor will rub his belly. Get over needing everyone's approval, makes med school much more difficult, and life in general. Because we both know that you know your resume is impressive.
-current M1
Actually according to a lot of the people that posted here, it doesn't seem to be enough. I know it will look good. I'm asking if it is adequate enough as to avoid doing other extracurriculars. Read the question first pal.
 
OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
Do you think ADCOM's are looking for good students or good doctors? Your screen name and comments indicates you think it's the former.

You will have be a leader as a resident so you might want to shave a couple years off your student years. You may have a team of medical students under you or you will have to coordinate the care of a patient using a team of other health professionals. Honestly your attitude is a bit concerning and immature and if I heard those words come out of your mouth as an ADCOM, no matter how many publications you had, you'd be an automatic reject.

Research jockeys go to PhD school. ADCOM's want well rounded students who understand what they're actually training to become (i.e. a doctor and leader of a healthcare team).
Thank you for the advice. I had always thought that academics takes precedence over everything else. I guess I'll have to expand.
 
OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
Yes, it does demonstrate "proof of talent," but here's the problem: there are more than enough students that have "proof of talent" than there are spots in medical schools. Contrary to what you might believe, medical schools would have absolutely no problem filling their classes with people that will not only get through the medical curriculum without difficulty but will excel in that environment.

Academic prowess and excellence is only one aspect of who you are, and the reality is that, in the long-run, that aspect of yourself really isn't that important. What's important is your ability to work well with your peers and superiors, your interest in the actual work of being a physician, having the character qualities that will make you caring, compassionate, and dedicated, and just generally not being a pain in the ass.

I serve on my school's admissions committee, and just a couple of weeks ago we discussed an applicant that was an academic all-star (4.0, 40+ MCAT, multiple pubs, etc. etc.) but who couldn't interview his way out of a paper bag. He ultimately received bad scores from the committee and will not be getting an acceptance. While it's important to be academically talented, thinking that alone is going to distinguish you from other applicants, particularly at the top schools, is misguided.
Oh that is scary. That guy definitely sounds like me. I guess I have some work to do.
 

Ace Khalifa

I am the definition of awesomeness
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I see. I'm beginning to understand more about this leadership business though I'm sure it's something that comes with the massive training you receive in med school. Either way, i think you guys have a point. For the record, I have shadowed about 10 doctors and volunteered at a hospital for three years but I just don't see that as "leadership" abilities since that word holds a strong conotation so to speak. One more thing, do they care about that caring personality if you are striving towards being an academician? Does bedside manner matter at that point? I mean I am a textbook warrior after all ;)
Yes, they still care. From my limited understanding (I'm not going for MD/PhD), you will still see patients as an academic doc, just not nearly as much as an MD. That being said, you will still have to go thru the same training as MD students, which includes learning professionalism and exposure to patients.

If you aren't going for MD/PhD, then it's even more important for you to be a caring, compassionate individual. From my experience in the ER, it's the most caring doctors who patients love the most, not those who think so highly of themselves and only care about academics.
 

xffan624

5+ Year Member
Jan 6, 2013
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Thank you for the advice. I had always thought that academics takes precedence over everything else. I guess I'll have to expand.
Academics is a means to an end. What do you think the end is?



Hint: It's not entry into medical school or a competitive residency.
 
OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
Yes, they still care. From my limited understanding (I'm not going for MD/PhD), you will still see patients as an academic doc, just not nearly as much as an MD. That being said, you will still have to go thru the same training as MD students, which includes learning professionalism and exposure to patients.

If you aren't going for MD/PhD, then it's even more important for you to be a caring, compassionate individual. From my experience in the ER, it's the most caring doctors who patients love the most, not those who think so highly of themselves and only care about academics.
I don't know why but I've never envisioned medicine as a humanitarian profession. Its just another job that plays into the whole which is society. A doctor, in my eyes, is just as important as a farmer who grows the food we eat but I dunno it doesn't seem like a farmer is the most humanitarian to me. Frankly, the reason I've always been interested in medicine ever since I stumbled upon my father's library when I was a kid was because of academics. I love medical knowledge and I want to contribute to the field. While I understand professionalism and patient care, I still feel like medicine is about academics...Is my thinking wrong? Am I in the wrogn place?? I really don't know.
 
OP
T
Sep 24, 2014
25
2
Status
Pre-Medical
Academics is a means to an end. What do you think the end is?



Hint: It's not entry into medical school or a competitive residency.
I really don't know. You tell me. My whole life I've been brought up by a family of doctors who taught me that academics is everything. Knowledge is power. I followed the path of the textbook and I've never been misguided. Everything I ever wanted, I got through the textbook. Maybe I'm wrong but it just seems to me that medicine is a profession that should be based solely off academia? Do I throw away academic prowess somewhere down the line? I'm confused..What is the end?
 

xffan624

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Jan 6, 2013
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I really don't know. You tell me. My whole life I've been brought up by a family of doctors who taught me that academics is everything. Knowledge is power. I followed the path of the textbook and I've never been misguided. Everything I ever wanted, I got through the textbook. Maybe I'm wrong but it just seems to me that medicine is a profession that should be based solely off academia? Do I throw away academic prowess somewhere down the line? I'm confused..What is the end?
The end is being a good doctor. You can't find that solely in a textbook.
 
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Ace Khalifa

I am the definition of awesomeness
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I don't know why but I've never envisioned medicine as a humanitarian profession. Its just another job that plays into the whole which is society. A doctor, in my eyes, is just as important as a farmer who grows the food we eat but I dunno it doesn't seem like a farmer is the most humanitarian to me. Frankly, the reason I've always been interested in medicine ever since I stumbled upon my father's library when I was a kid was because of academics. I love medical knowledge and I want to contribute to the field. While I understand professionalism and patient care, I still feel like medicine is about academics...Is my thinking wrong? Am I in the wrogn place?? I really don't know.
Yes, your thinking is wrong. There is much more to being a physician than being smart and doing research. You don't even have to do research to become a doctor. You clearly need more significant clinical exposure because you don't grasp what the medical field truly entails. I agree with @xffan624, there are many things you won't be able to learn from a textbook that are necessary to becoming a good physician.
 
Apr 8, 2011
285
55
Bay Area
Status
Medical Student (Accepted)
If you're thinking about studying for the MCAT on top of that busy academic and research schedule, I would ask you to reconsider. If you spread your schedule over an extra year or take a few months to focus on just the MCAT, do you think you would get a higher score? If I were in your position, I would ask myself that question. You have good things going for you so far, but I would hate for you to get a low MCAT or low grades because you decided to get everything done quick. That being said, I don't know what you're capable of so you need to be honest with yourself.
 

IL Pre Med

5+ Year Member
Oct 11, 2012
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I don't know why but I've never envisioned medicine as a humanitarian profession. Its just another job that plays into the whole which is society. A doctor, in my eyes, is just as important as a farmer who grows the food we eat but I dunno it doesn't seem like a farmer is the most humanitarian to me. Frankly, the reason I've always been interested in medicine ever since I stumbled upon my father's library when I was a kid was because of academics. I love medical knowledge and I want to contribute to the field. While I understand professionalism and patient care, I still feel like medicine is about academics...Is my thinking wrong? Am I in the wrogn place?? I really don't know.
This makes you sound like you have no friends.