How Rude!

[usa_tigress]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

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[fpr85]

Is that what he stated, or is that just what you're assuming because he didn't ask you anything?

 

[usa_tigress]

Is that what he stated, or is that just what you're assuming because he didn't ask you anything?

That's what he stated! and then i corrected him...he was baffled by the idea!

But in general, it has happened before and won't be the last.

 

[UCLAstudent]

This thread reminds me of Stephanie Tanner.

 

[legobikes]

uh. you said yourself he was OLD.




and seriously, you couldn't find a better role model than TOMB RAIDER?

 

[obake_at_night]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

I don't want to make you feel worse. But, I do sympathize with what happened to you. I can understand how you would feel insulted as I am very much a feminist. I would just chock it up to, "He may just not be up with the times. It is that old school thinking: females are nurses and males are docs." I have had similar comments thrown at me too. When friends have suggested I become a nurse, I just explained why I wanted to become a doctor. I must admit to getting angry with some of them. I understand that you were in a worse predicament because it was a patient of a surgeon that you were shadowing. Thus, you couldn't pursue the matter further with the elderly man. This happens a great deal, unfortunately. Frustrating and very tough situation.

 

[TCIrish03]

He's old, I doubt he's ever going to watch Tomb Raider.

It's like our grandparents who still call black people "colored". They might not be racist at all, but it's just how they grew up. It's bad enough breaking habits of our own in our 20's....do you really expect people to change in their 70's and 80's?

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

 

[fleetgoddess]

i had this happen so many times in the er. get used to it i'd say.

I want to go into ortho and i'm a girl. i've had doctors laugh at me and i've had young ortho docs say we need more girls.

i know if i continue in ortho i'm just going to have to ignore it.

 

[usa_tigress]

It hasn't just been the old man. I've gotten comments in the past from people much younger. But in the end I think it's all up to me.

 

[str8flexed]

I don't see why it's rude at all. There's nothing wrong at all with being a nurse. My g/f is training to be one, and if that's what she wants, that's cool... We need them, and they need us...

 

[xSTALLiONx]

I don't want to make you feel worse. But, I do sympathize with what happened to you. I can understand how you would feel insulted as I am very much a feminist. I would just chock it up to, "He may just not be up with the times. It is that old school thinking: females are nurses and males are docs." I have had similar comments thrown at me too. When friends have suggested I become a nurse, I just explained why I wanted to become a doctor. I must admit to getting angry with some of them. I understand that you were in a worse predicament because it was a patient of a surgeon that you were shadowing. Thus, you couldn't pursue the matter further with the elderly man. This happens a great deal, unfortunately. Frustrating and very tough situation.

Feminists.. like there aren't better things to do with the short time you have on earth...

God I hate hippies.. -Cartman

 

[topogigio]

When I was volunteer at a hospital, a lot of old men would say to me "you know, my daughter wants to be a nurse like you", or "my daughter just graduated from nursing school also and would like to get a job like yours" etc. They would just assume I was a nurse and that nursing was what I wanted to do.

I would just listen and nodd and say "uh-huh" or "oh, really?"
There's really no point in me giving a speech about how I'm actually a pre-medical student that wants to go to med school, and how I already have more education than nursing requires (I have a Biochem degree, and I'm working on a masters), bla bla bla.
Yeah, sometimes it would bother me that they confused me with a nurse given that all I've thought about for the last 5 years is MED SCHOOL, but it's really no big deal. Someday I'll have an MD next to my name and it all be okay. Maybe I'll even get to treat those same old guys.

PS. I have nothing against nurses. Nurses are great. I just don't want to be one, ok?

 

[Zoom-Zoom]

I don't see why it's rude at all. There's nothing wrong at all with being a nurse. My g/f is training to be one, and if that's what she wants, that's cool... We need them, and they need us...

Touche, well played

 

[eddie13231]

I'd hate see you if someone really actually insulted you instead of a non-malicious comment from some geezer. Grow up, you're no doctor yet and not even a nurse. Patients always say random crazy ****, especially old men. When I worked in the hospital, they would try to grab the girls asses or make sexual comments all the time. Being called a nurse should be the least of your worries when it comes to old men.

 

[riceman04]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

gender roles and professional identity....interesting topic

 

[MahSpoon]

While volunteering at the hospital, I've had female nurses assume that I wanted to become a nurse (I'm a guy) but wasn't offended or anything. ?_?

 

[DropkickMurphy]

It hasn't just been the old man. I've gotten comments in the past from people much younger. But in the end I think it's all up to me.

Develop thicker skin or find a different profession. Better choice: Develop thicker skin or find a cave to hide in. Those are your only options. End of story.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

We need them, and they need us...

Don't tell that to some nurses. I mean some of them have even earned the title "Doctor So and So"

 

[DrHusky]

While volunteering at the hospital, I've had female nurses assume that I wanted to become a nurse (I'm a guy) but wasn't offended or anything. ?_?

On a similar note (well not really), this awesome AMCAS beard I am growing (not shaving for good luck) combined with my aviators and hooded sweatshirt got me several nasty looks at the bank today. The security guard actually came up and waited in line next to me and then followed me out when I was done.

I would much rather people assume I was a nurse and not a criminal...wait a minute, what the hell is wrong with being a nurse anyways. This reminds me of this amazon neurosurgeon I met that snaps when people call her a neurologist like it is some kind of sexist BS or something. Pick your battles!!

 

[braluk]

you should also grow out an armpit afro as well. A little chia pet at your disposal at all times

 

[Haemulon]

When I was volunteer at a hospital, a lot of old men would say to me "you know, my daughter wants to be a nurse like you", or "my daughter just graduated from nursing school also and would like to get a job like yours" etc. They would just assume I was a nurse and that nursing was what I wanted to do.

I would just listen and nodd and say "uh-huh" or "oh, really?"
There's really no point in me giving a speech about how I'm actually a pre-medical student that wants to go to med school, and how I already have more education than nursing requires (I have a Biochem degree, and I'm working on a masters), bla bla bla.
Yeah, sometimes it would bother me that they confused me with a nurse given that all I've thought about for the last 5 years is MED SCHOOL, but it's really no big deal. Someday I'll have an MD next to my name and it all be okay. Maybe I'll even get to treat those same old guys.

PS. I have nothing against nurses. Nurses are great. I just don't want to be one, ok?

Great post. I agree, medical professionals of all types are there to treat the patient's illness/injury, not to give lessons about social stereotyping and political correctness. Time and a place for everything. I think its great advice to not let it bother you. There is no malice intended by comments like that, why make the patient feel bad or ignorant? I'm sure most patients are already intimidated by the hospital environment and their health condition. I say, cut them some slack.

 

[newbie1kenobi]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

The comment did not seem to be rude, rather it is a misconception and ignorance on his part.

I'm a clinical instructor, and when seeing patients with students, they assume that I am the student. Maybe I look young for my age , which makes it a compliment

 

[MissCutie]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

I am with you on this issue. It's very frustrating, and I'm glad you made this post. Im actually a bit surprised about how some people have chosen to respond. You dont need to "suck it up" or anything along those lines. You didn't go screaming at the patient, and that's what most important. You do have the right to vent about it later, and just because others might not choose to doesn't mean you shouldn't. Venting isn't a sign of weakness. You're just getting it out of your system. And I know what you mean about people other than the patient being like that, including people within the profession who could affect your career. Having a voice is smart, not an indication that you need "thicker skin."

Anyway, I cant say I'm impressed with a lot of people who have responded, particularly those without much sympathy. I'm not gunna bother checking this post out anymore because I dont really want to waste my time reading some of these responses, but if you want to vent to someone, just PM me. And if you're over it, that's cool too! Take care.

 

[Severus]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

1. He's old. It's just how he is.
2. You should have responded back with something like "Hell no... I'm trying to become a trophy wife."

 

[Haemulon]

I am with you on this issue. It's very frustrating, and I'm glad you made this post. Im actually a bit surprised about how some people have chosen to respond. You dont need to "suck it up" or anything along those lines. You didn't go screaming at the patient, and that's what most important. You do have the right to vent about it later, and just because others might not choose to doesn't mean you shouldn't. Venting isn't a sign of weakness. You're just getting it out of your system. And I know what you mean about people other than the patient being like that, including people within the profession who could affect your career. Having a voice is smart, not an indication that you need "thicker skin."

Anyway, I cant say I'm impressed with a lot of people who have responded, particularly those without much sympathy. I'm not gunna bother checking this post out anymore because I dont really want to waste my time reading some of these responses, but if you want to vent to someone, just PM me. And if you're over it, that's cool too! Take care.

But ... your handle is "MissCutie"

 

[astrife]

Get off your high horse. He's an old guy who isn't up with the times. I hate knee-jerk feminists ten times more than I hate ignorant old men.

 

[docjolly]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

i'm not surprised by any of this.. many people hold this type of attitude, it's just that some are more vocal than others...

before i entered medical school, several of my family members and ex-coworkers asked, when, upon finding out that I had been accepted to medical school, "Why don't you want to be a nurse instead?"

Amazing...

There's no need to take offense to any of it..Just brush it off and move on..

 

[Rafa]

This is one of the more dissapointing threads I've read on SDN.

That said, to the OP, just keep your head up. As MC noted, it *is* frustrating, and it isn't right. But you maintained your professionalism. And if you keep pushing, you'll soon be in med school, and one step closer to the goal. Ignore the ignorance (on this thread and in real life), and do your best to not let such negativity get you down.

 

[braluk]

It happens, but you handled it well. One pointer I'd like to make is to be wary to not fall into the trap of doctor and premed ego of superiority over another. Granted, there will probably be a bunch of patients who will incorrectly label you, or naive coworkers, all of which aren't in any insulting intention. When I worked at the Mayo Clinic, I learned the hard way, that it is not appropriate to e-mail a heart surgeon signing off with the signature "Thanks!" Apparently, the "!" probably trounced on his ego as being superior, because "!" denotes some sort of comraderie, which was not my intention. Needless to say, I hope that one day, I can be as relaxed at work with everyone as I would be with my own kids.

 

[ADeadLois]

Get off your high horse. He's an old guy who isn't up with the times. I hate knee-jerk feminists ten times more than I hate ignorant old men.

How was it knee-jerk feminism? The elderly man made an incorrect assumption about the OP based on gender stereotypes. It's not a huge deal, but I would understand why the OP would want to vent.

 

[ChuckNorrisFTW]

^

The OP is most likely a knee-jerk feminist, who fails to realize that there are alot of people (including young people) who think men should be docs and women nurses. Just because people don't agree with her doesn't give her the right to criticize them.

 

[newbie1kenobi]

Another thing to consider is when somebody thinks that a male nurse is a doc, and says "oh, you're a nurse...", like their disappointed. Misconceptions can hurt both ways.

 

[durfen]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

You sure you don't want to be a nurse? (I keed I keed)

 

[newbie1kenobi]

i had this happen so many times in the er. get used to it i'd say.

I want to go into ortho and i'm a girl. i've had doctors laugh at me and i've had young ortho docs say we need more girls.

i know if i continue in ortho i'm just going to have to ignore it.

Ignore those ignorant fools. We have a female orthopod fellowship-trained in hands. She's as competent and well-respected and recognized as the other docs.

 

[ExKitty Doctor]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

usa tigress - I can totally relate. I've been working at a clinic in LA for over a year and half and its happened countless times. Thanks for posting that because I think its important for us women doctors to have open communication abouts sexism because its very real.

And all of you giving her a hard time about how people are old and don't change... that is so not the point.

 

[sentrosi]

I'm sure there are non-fictional strong women that would make better role models for you.

Maybe that's why he doesn't take you seriously.

 

[nekrogg]

^

The OP is most likely a knee-jerk feminist, who fails to realize that there are alot of people (including young people) who think men should be docs and women nurses. Just because people don't agree with her doesn't give her the right to criticize them.

i can totally undertand the offense. its like if i was chinese, they would ask me why do i want to become a physician, if i can just open up a dry cleaner for a living. but you cant really do anything about it but move on. hes old and stuck in his ways. and no she doesnt have to be a knee-jerk feminist, she can also be a woman. most of the people criticizing her on this thread are probably dudes who cant comprehend her situation or realize the fact that they dont know what it feels like to be a female in a male dominated profession. so give her a break, shes venting her frustration.
(and i am a dude and i am chinese).

 

[njbmd]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

Hi there,
I am the chief resident on my current surgical rotation. The other day when I was rounding with the team, we stopped in to see one of our patients who was an elderly female. The rest of the team is male and the medical student and junior resident presented their morning findings to me. I spoke to the patient about the plans for the day and as were were leaving the room, the patient said to me, "Honey, can you put me on the bedpan before you leave?" I happily obliged and placed her on the bedpan, after which, I alerted the nurse and kept on with my rounds. It took all of 45 seconds and gave the intern time to write the orders that I had given.

Many patients see female and think nurse or see male and automatically think doctor. It happens and is going to happen as most nurses are female and most physicians are male. I just don't have the energy to "get my knickers in a knot" about this stuff.

Would my elderly lady patient have asked any member of a team of male physicians to help her with the bedpan? Probably not, but then she needed to use the bedpan and I was happy to assist her; actually, I am glad that I could assist her because she is my patient after all.

Bottom line: Get over it because it's going to happen again and again if you are female physician. You just get used to going with the flow and saving your anger for something that counts.

njbmd

 

[nekrogg]

Hi there,
I am the chief resident on my current surgical rotation. The other day when I was rounding with the team, we stopped in to see one of our patients who was an elderly female. The rest of the team is male and the medical student and junior resident presented their morning findings to me. I spoke to the patient about the plans for the day and as were were leaving the room, the patient said to me, "Honey, can you put me on the bedpan before you leave?" I happily obliged and placed her on the bedpan, after which, I alerted the nurse and kept on with my rounds. It took all of 45 seconds and gave the intern time to write the orders that I had given.

Many patients see female and think nurse or see male and automatically think doctor. It happens and is going to happen as most nurses are female and most physicians are male. I just don't have the energy to "get my knickers in a knot" about this stuff.

Would my elderly lady patient have asked any member of a team of male physicians to help her with the bedpan? Probably not, but then she needed to use the bedpan and I was happy to assist her; actually, I am glad that I could assist her because she is my patient after all.

Bottom line: Get over it because it's going to happen again and again if you are female physician. You just get used to going with the flow and saving your anger for something that counts.

njbmd

 

[braluk]

Experience wins

 

[DrHuang]

This thread reminds me of Stephanie Tanner.

haha me too

 

[chaldobruin]

Hey there, I can understand your frustration, but unfortunately people use the "representativeness heuristic" as a common problem solving strategy all the time. E.g. you try to answer a question based on how many examples you can think of your head. If you've met 10 doctors that are all male, and 10 nurses who are all female, you are going to assume that most doctors are male. Another example, if I ask you what is the most common household pet, and you know 15 people who have dogs, and 10 people who have cats, you will most likely reply dogs even though in reality you have no idea.

Don't worry, back in this guy's early days most of doctors were male but that as changed, med schools are graduating 50% females so in about 20-30 years the practicing docs will have a 50/50 ratio. Right now it is still skewed in favor of males.

Also keep in mind it could be worse. Think about what kind of hardships you'd go through if you are African American, or Hispanic, especially in the U.S.

 

[topogigio]

Don't worry, back in this guy's early days most of doctors were male but that as changed, med schools are graduating 50% females so in about 20-30 years the practicing docs will have a 50/50 ratio. Right now it is still skewed in favor of males.
Also keep in mind it could be worse. Think about what kind of hardships you'd go through if you are African American, or Hispanic, especially in the U.S.

I was told by one of my professors (a practicing physician) that a lot of the women who graduate from medical school eventually leave the practice in order to care for a family/children. He gave us some statistics which I cannot remember exactly, but it was very disturbing, because the majority (not some) of women will eventually leave the practice, while men are more likely (very likely indeed) to never interrupt/leave the profession.

Unfortunately, as women, sometimes we have to choose between caring for our children ourselves or working, or between working and letting our children be cared for by a nanny/someone else, or maybe not having children at all.
It is sad but it is true.

 

[jackieMD2007]

Hi there,
I am the chief resident on my current surgical rotation. The other day when I was rounding with the team, we stopped in to see one of our patients who was an elderly female. The rest of the team is male and the medical student and junior resident presented their morning findings to me. I spoke to the patient about the plans for the day and as were were leaving the room, the patient said to me, "Honey, can you put me on the bedpan before you leave?" I happily obliged and placed her on the bedpan, after which, I alerted the nurse and kept on with my rounds. It took all of 45 seconds and gave the intern time to write the orders that I had given.

Many patients see female and think nurse or see male and automatically think doctor. It happens and is going to happen as most nurses are female and most physicians are male. I just don't have the energy to "get my knickers in a knot" about this stuff.

Would my elderly lady patient have asked any member of a team of male physicians to help her with the bedpan? Probably not, but then she needed to use the bedpan and I was happy to assist her; actually, I am glad that I could assist her because she is my patient after all.

Bottom line: Get over it because it's going to happen again and again if you are female physician. You just get used to going with the flow and saving your anger for something that counts.

njbmd

Point well taken, but is it possible that she did understand that you were a doctor, but simply wanted someone of the same gender to help her with her bedpan? I mean, my grandmother would rather wet the sheets than have a male help her with anything like that. Just a thought.

 

[aung]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

You should not get riled up so much from a comment like that. Just ignore him. After all, he is only a patient and his opinions matter little on what you are able to accomplish. If you were already a doctor and he was your patient and he assumed you were a nurse, would you let it get to you? Would you treat him any differently than you would any other patients? If you truly do want to become a good doctor, I suggest you get used to ignoring comments like this no matter how insulting they may be to you. Just be professional and do your job.

 

[OSUdoc08]

I was shadowing a surgeon with this other guy a few weeks ago and one of the patients (old man) asked the guy if he wanted to be a surgeon but then assumed i wanted to be a nurse without asking!

Some men need to stop it and watch Tomb Raider once in awhile. Just venting.

Do you look like a surgeon or nurse?

I'm betting that you don't look like Lara Croft. If you do, please post a pic.

THanks.

 

[riceman04]

While volunteering at the hospital, I've had female nurses assume that I wanted to become a nurse (I'm a guy) but wasn't offended or anything. ?_?

Do you mind me asking why they assumed that?...I think I know why but I dont want to say it.

 

[NiteOwl]

I have been asked if I am going to become a nurse when I say that I am going to go to medical school. It happens sometimes when I am shadowing. If it is the patients that ask it and they are older, it doesn't bother me that much. But when it is a non-patient that asks what I am studying or something and I say I am in college right now and I plan to go to medical school in a few years and they say "Oh, are you going to be a nurse?". Thats when it starts to bother me. Especially if it is a younger person and they see that women become doctors. One time I even had a drug rep ask if I was going to become a mid-wife (she was young too)! If they ask if I am going to be a nurse I just politly say "No, a doctor." As for the the mid-wife thing, but I stuck with a similar answer "No, I just want to be a doctor, probably family practice. No delivering babies, not really interested in that."

 

[obake_at_night]

I have been asked if I am going to become a nurse when I say that I am going to go to medical school. It happens sometimes when I am shadowing. If it is the patients that ask it and they are older, it doesn't bother me that much. But when it is a non-patient that asks what I am studying or something and I say I am in college right now and I plan to go to medical school in a few years and they say "Oh, are you going to be a nurse?". Thats when it starts to bother me. Especially if it is a younger person and they see that women become doctors. One time I even had a drug rep ask if I was going to become a mid-wife (she was young too)! If they ask if I am going to be a nurse I just politly say "No, a doctor." As for the the mid-wife thing, but I stuck with a similar answer "No, I just want to be a doctor, probably family practice. No delivering babies, not really interested in that."

A great number of people actually think that people go to medical school to become nurses. At the same time, they know that there are many female doctors. This misunderstanding usually occurs because they are just not familiar with the application process. Maybe they don't know anyone applying to medicine. They are pursing other careers and don't need to know for themselves. It is just like pre-meds not knowing the application process to be in another field.

 

[debvz]

Like njbmd, I'm a female surgery resident. Even with the long coat with MD embroidered on it, the cellphone, sometimes multiple pagers, and that oh-so-nice post-call look, I'm still often addressed as "nurse".

Regardless of whether they think I'm their Dr or their nurse, I've made it a habit to introduce myself, "I'm Dr. Debvz, one of the surgery residents working with Dr. Attending".... I think it's just polite to make the introduction, and it puts your job in perspective pretty quickly.