How would you reform medical school?

[deleted862527]

If you had to reform the medical school educational curriculum, what alterations would you make and why? Personally, as cheesy as this sounds (I'll probably get a firestorm for saying, but get the popcorn ready), I sort of wish getting an M.D. was its own undergraduate major like Nursing, etc. because I wish I could start on this journey ASAP instead of waiting until after College (hey, we'd all graduate and begin our careers four years earlier if this happened), but I completely understand the reasons why this is (because they want mature students, as well as students who 100% know this is what they want to do).

So, what changes would you make? Would you make any at all? This thread is meant for this type of discussion.

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[sliceofbread136]

I agree, requiring a bachelors prior to an MD is a waste of time. Should be a 6 year program that would have some screening out of students who can't handle the academic rigors prior to clinical training (i.e. Can't pass step 1)

 

[deleted862527]

I agree, requiring a bachelors prior to an MD is a waste of time. Should be a 6 year program that would have some screening out of students who can't handle the academic rigors prior to clinical training (i.e. Can't pass step 1)

Additionally, if they made it a six year program as you claim, it will cost students less debt because of no inclusion of a previously earned undergraduate major. Medical School can also be taught at a much slower pace if it's spanned over 6 years as compared to 4.

I like it.

 

[doctorleospaceman]

Look at the current competitiveness of medical school and now imagine adding in the countless premeds from your prereq bio and chem 101 courses who left the premed path within a semester to the mix.

Undergrad before medical school is a way to start weeding out some unqualified or undetermined candidates before they put on significant debt while still allowing them to end up with a valuable bachelors degree in any field they choose as a backup.

Also you can't ignore all the personal growth that happens during 4 years of college (and gap years). Not only do you learn a lot from your classes, but hopefully you also learn a lot from the interactions you have with others. It's important and healthy to meet people your age who have contrasting opinions to yours so that hopefully you start being more open minded which is a very valuable characteristic both in medicine and life in general.

 

[md-2020]

I respectfully suggest that keeping M.D. as a graduate degree is completely necessary in the current U.S. healthcare landscape. Being a doctor requires much more maturity and personal growth than just memorizing the relevant anatomical structures, that highschoolers entering into a MBBS-esque track don't have. Burnout is already quite high in the profession--inadequately preparing basically underage kids (16-18) for an objectively challenging career is a recipe for greater workforce issues. More life experiences = more resiliency & context for the demands encountered throughout healthcare. Statistically, the MCAT & high school grades are also far better indicators of future board scores/success in practice than high school grades & SAT; many excellent high school students do not in fact have the intellectual capabilities to succeed in medical school, whereas some less noticeable students earlier in life may actually be tremendous future practitioners. Furthermore, modern medicine is increasingly about research; it requires physicians to have a significant scientific knowledge background that simply cannot be taught in an undergraduate program's time/student maturity/resource constraints.

Additionally, worldwide we are increasingly seeing a switch towards longer education tracks within traditionally MBBS/undergrad medical education countries. For example, many of the top medical schools in say, China, are now offering 8-year graduate pathways for their best students (basically modeled on the U.S. system w/ non-medical courses in the first few years) that award a Ph.D. in medicine. The UK is likewise gradually introducing medical training reform that is making the 4-year straight through plan less prevalent (though at the moment still common). The thinking is that more worldy knowledgeable & well-rounded people will make better doctors in society because, well, clinical work is as much about human dynamics as it is about the correct usage of drugs/procedures.

Finally, from a more meta perspective that I generally didn't put a lot of stock into prior to college myself, undergraduate studies are such a formative experience in one's professional life. It's genuinely irresponsible to say "well, I could have done without college" (unless you basically partied four years away) because it's during this time that individuals first begin to explore and contemplate the wide range of jobs & opportunities available to them. Not all pre-meds switch because their grades aren't up to par; not all med students entered college as pre-meds. Undergrad might not be the best four years of your life (I was happy enough to graduate in three), but they're exceedingly important towards laying the groundwork of whatever future profession you might enter into. It's also rewarding to be learned about things other than medicine: after all, hospitals play a generally minor role in most people's daily lives, and ideally we would want to minimize it even further! A full life exists outside of your job (whatever that may be), and college starts cultivating a side of your personality that can help to embrace these perspectives.

TLDR: a bored medical student doing summer research is waxing poetic on SDN

 

[fldoctorgirl]

To build on this, I used to also wish that we could go straight to medical school after high school, or just complete an AA degree to get all the pre-reqs done before matriculating. However, I don't agree with this anymore. I think I would have been completely overwhelmed going straight to medical school after high school, or even after earning an AA degree. I am glad that I was "forced" to get a well-rounded education by getting a bachelors-- even more so that it was from a liberal arts school. It's important to remember that your entire world shouldn't be about medicine. It's important to be well-rounded.

I know it seems like a long road when you begin, but it goes by really fast. Enjoy the four years of undergrad.

If I could actually change anything, I would get rid of schools with poor clinical sites (both DO and MD, although arguably more prevalent at DO schools) or force them to improve their rotations. I think this is a big problem with medical schools currently, and is only further damaging the stigma against DOs since it is more common in their schools.

 

[NotASerialKiller]

I'd get rid of all "reflection" assignments and group discussions that as far as I can tell only serve to fill med students with blinding rage, unless of course they're the insufferable kind of people who want to spew BS about how much they blossomed as human beings in the previous semester.

"Dear my medical school, I learned so much last week when I got near a patient but wasn't allowed to interact with them yet, it really made me reconsider how I view the relationship between patients and physicians, am I at the minimum word count yet? No? Okay, it was windy yet sunny day the first time I saw a patient, I believe I was wearing a blue shirt...."

 

[jcorpsmanMD]

I whole-heartedly agree with @md-2020 , I couldn't have said it better myself, seriously lol. On that note, no chance in hell I would have been accepted to a 4 year MD program after high school. My experiences after high school / during college provided me with discipline needed to be an exceptional student in college, capable of gaining acceptance to an MD program. I never was considered intelligent by my peers or even my teachers in high school, but, for me, discipline = being a WAY better student overall. I think there'd be a lot of fellow incoming / current medical students that wouldn't be in medical school right now if what you proposed was to happen someday. I like the system the way it is, for now.

 

[fldoctorgirl]

If anyone is interested, FAU this year started the first program of its kind in the US (or at least, that's what they say) accepting students straight out of their high school program to their medical school. They also gave them a full-ride for all 4 years of medical school.

To give some background, FAU's high school program allows students to basically be full-time college students during high school (for free). Most of these students have graduated with their bachelors before their high school diploma. The only requirements for them to matriculate into medical school are to do some research (which most of them have already done) and meet a minimum MCAT score. I know these students are incredibly bright, but I just don't agree with this program. FAU is already giving away so many spots to their med school to students in their various 7-year programs. My friend is starting medical school at FAU this year after being in this program...he did the bare minimum in undergrad, took the MCAT 3 times just to meet the bare minimum (which was a 507, I believe they raised it now), didn't do any type of extracurriculars because he knew he had guaranteed acceptance, etc. I am happy for my friend, but I think these kinds of programs are a disadvantage to the medical profession.

 

[PreMedMissteps]

I agree, requiring a bachelors prior to an MD is a waste of time. Should be a 6 year program that would have some screening out of students who can't handle the academic rigors prior to clinical training (i.e. Can't pass step 1)

It might be hard to complete all the prereqs in 2 years , now that more have been added/recommended. Three years would seem to be the minimum...or 2.5 years.

That said, I'm not sure that having more 20 year olds in med school is a great idea. There's a lot to be said, maturity-wise, for older applicants.

The completion of a bachelors isn't a total waste of time. If planned carefully, the 4th year can be lighter and maybe include some classes, just for interest.

The goal is to have more well-rounded med students/doctors, not just a bunch of brainiacs who can whiz thru prereqs, and little else, in 2-3 years.

 

[mistafab]

The only reforms I care about is lowering tuition or improving resident pay. Med school (at least mine) is pretty dope. It is gratifying to have worked so hard to get here, saying "one day I will learn only things I care about in school," and then get to actually learn what you care about in school. Being a graduate program, most of my peers are pretty mature. Gotta say it is just peachy in medical school. You work hard, yes, however it is completely different than anything else.

Edit: out of a handful of Ba/MDs that got into our program, one of them had a maturity thing for the first 6 months. Gotta say that younger people in med school is probably not a good idea. It was definitely a struggle for her both emotionally and mentally to adjust.

 

[sliceofbread136]

It might be hard to complete all the prereqs in 2 years , now that more have been added/recommended. Three years would seem to be the minimum...or 2.5 years.

That said, I'm not sure that having more 20 year olds in med school is a great idea. There's a lot to be said, maturity-wise, for older applicants.

The completion of a bachelors isn't a total waste of time. If planned carefully, the 4th year can be lighter and maybe include some classes, just for interest.

The goal is to have more well-rounded med students/doctors, not just a bunch of brainiacs who can whiz thru prereqs, and little else, in 2-3 years.

Do you have any support for saying that one would be more ready to start clinics if we require two more years of undergrad? Is a 24 year old that much better than a 22 year old?

Is really that much more gained as far as "well roundedness" in two years of college? I've never used what I learned then, and I personally know of very few who have. Other than that one does not have to get a bachelors to be "well rounded"

 

[libertyyne]

1.5 preclinical 1.5 clinical. Residency training capped at 5 years for surgical specialties. Direct integrated residency pathways for intervential / sub specialty programs.

And programs to complete BS degrees in 2.5 vs traditional 4.

 

[PreMedMissteps]

The only reforms I care about is lowering tuition or improving resident pay.

True.

A friend has just moved to Boston for her residency and the rents there for TINY apts/studios are crazy expensive. Instead of being able to rent something close to BWH, she had to find something a distance away, but the rent is still over 2400 a month! And that's just rent...there's also water, electric, wifi, food, and so on.

Residencies in high rent areas should either have to provide subsidized housing/apts, or provide a $12k/yr stipend.

 

[libertyyne]

True.

A friend has just moved to Boston for her residency and the rents there for TINY apts/studios are crazy expensive. Instead of being able to rent something close to BWH, she had to find something a distance away, but the rent is still over 2400 a month! And that's just rent...there's also water, electric, wifi, food, and so on.

Residencies in high rent areas should either have to provide subsidized housing/apts, or provide a $12k/yr stipend.

Some programs in high COA provide subsidized housing . UCLA does so.

 

[jqueb29]

Lol I could not more extremely disagree with making M.D. an undergrad degree. If I was learning medical school material right out of high school, I would have flunked out by the end of 1st semester. As it is currently, I'm one of the best performers in my med school class. Children aren't equipped to handle medical school. Requiring a bachelor's degree weeds out those who will never be capable, while also allowing time for the capable but young to mature.

 

[PreMedMissteps]

Some programs in high COA provide subsidized housing . UCLA does so.

Yes, I'm aware that some do. Don't know why all of the ones in very high rent areas don't.

 

[ChymeofPassion]

Yes, I'm aware that some do. Don't know why all of the ones in very high rent areas don't.

Three words: Roxbury, Link Pass

 

[AttemptingScholar]

There are countries where students enter medical school right after high school. I think the USA MD/DO programs are generally considered better. I imagine there is a relation.

 

[P0ke]

To build on this, I used to also wish that we could go straight to medical school after high school, or just complete an AA degree to get all the pre-reqs done before matriculating. However, I don't agree with this anymore. I think I would have been completely overwhelmed going straight to medical school after high school, or even after earning an AA degree. I am glad that I was "forced" to get a well-rounded education by getting a bachelors-- even more so that it was from a liberal arts school. It's important to remember that your entire world shouldn't be about medicine. It's important to be well-rounded.

I know it seems like a long road when you begin, but it goes by really fast. Enjoy the four years of undergrad.

If I could actually change anything, I would get rid of schools with poor clinical sites (both DO and MD, although arguably more prevalent at DO schools) or force them to improve their rotations. I think this is a big problem with medical schools currently, and is only further damaging the stigma against DOs since it is more common in their schools.

My eight years of undergrad didn't go by very fast

 

[Med student 18]

So the reason you mentioned + financial situation I moved to south america to go to med school. it's straight from high school to med. The length of it is 7 years since you do what one would study in undergraduate + med school. So that's that.

As for the reform the biggest thing is a concept change; just because a professor is a superspecialist in something doesn't mean that they can teach. As for other things, more emphasis on how to communicate with patients, maybe even some communication courses. Another thing is to have more emphasis on interlinking subjects for better memory retention.

 

[Dox4lyfe]

I'm actually really curious now: Does anyone have info on the acceptance rates, success and pass rates of med students in countries such as France where they go straight from high school to med school.

All this maturity and well-roundedness talk makes sense, but is there any data or statistical/factual info on this?

 

[deleted862527]

I'm actually really curious now: Does anyone have info on the acceptance rates, success and pass rates of med students in countries such as France where they go straight from high school to med school.

All this maturity and well-roundedness talk makes sense, but is there any data or statistical/factual info on this?

I second this. It will be highly interesting to see the results of this. In England, students do not go to College to go to Medical School---they are admitted straight out of High School, and I am sure their Physicians are competent.

 

[DocWinter]

Financial aid reform. No interest until 6 months after graduation, interest rate of 3-4% max. No more of this inane 7% interest accruing thousands even before you set foot in a hospital

 

[deleted862527]

One other aspect of our educational curriculum that should be reformed are the general education requirements at state Universities. Learning about Romeo and Juliet in your English class is not going to prepare you for medicine.

However, this isn't to say that if such an event were to transpire in the future where general education requirements were revoked, medical school applicants may be viewed more favorably if they possess more than one degree.

 

[Med Ed]

Premed: "Medical training should start straight out of middle school and be completed in 9 months. Slash the bachelor's requirement, remove all non-essential courses, compress the pre-clinical to 3 months, and make M3/M4 one clerkship. I want my six figure salary and I want it yesterday."

Fellow: "Dear God, if you are listening, I wish I could have at least twelve more months of supervised practice before I have to go out and face this on my own..."

 

[allantois]

1/4 of physicians in the US are foreign-educated (read went to medical school straight from high school). It worked out for them just fine.

Even a lot of older physicians in the US didn't have to complete their undergraduate degrees

 

[PreMedMissteps]

Financial aid reform. No interest until 6 months after graduation, interest rate of 3-4% max. No more of this inane 7% interest accruing thousands even before you set foot in a hospital

Very true. The interest needs to be subsidized while in med school and the rate needs to be much lower.

 

[sliceofbread136]

Lol I could not more extremely disagree with making M.D. an undergrad degree. If I was learning medical school material right out of high school, I would have flunked out by the end of 1st semester. As it is currently, I'm one of the best performers in my med school class. Children aren't equipped to handle medical school. Requiring a bachelor's degree weeds out those who will never be capable, while also allowing time for the capable but young to mature.

You can weed out at step 1, preclinical don't cost that much. Clinical time is what is expensive.

I do however have a hard time believing that an extra 2 years of undergraduate material somehow make one so much more prepared to start learning ms1 material. It's really not that much more rigorous

 

[sliceofbread136]

Premed: "Medical training should start straight out of middle school and be completed in 9 months. Slash the bachelor's requirement, remove all non-essential courses, compress the pre-clinical to 3 months, and make M3/M4 one clerkship. I want my six figure salary and I want it yesterday."

Fellow: "Dear God, if you are listening, I wish I could have at least twelve more months of supervised practice before I have to go out and face this on my own..."

You can't compare additional clinical training and additional undergraduate years.... comepletely apples and oranges.

 

[sliceofbread136]

1.5 preclinical 1.5 clinical. Residency training capped at 5 years for surgical specialties. Direct integrated residency pathways for intervential / sub specialty programs.

And programs to complete BS degrees in 2.5 vs traditional 4.

I agree with bs and preclinical years here. I don't think we should limit clinical years of medical personally (I learned a lot during ms4 actually).

 

[jqueb29]

You can weed out at step 1, preclinical don't cost that much. Clinical time is what is expensive.

I do however have a hard time believing that an extra 2 years of undergraduate material somehow make one so much more prepared to start learning ms1 material. It's really not that much more rigorous

It may not necessarily be the extra 2 years of material (I think some of the material certainly helps, but some is also definitely worthless garbage), but rather, like I said, the 2 extra years of maturity. Med school requires an extremely well-developed pre-frontal cortex, and that bad boy is still developing well into age 23-24+.

Also, pre-clinical is at least $44,000 (and can easily hit $75k+), in addition to the opportunity cost of losing out on 2 years' salary doing something else and future investment of that salary

 

[Lucca]

Idk if theres anything wrong with med school per se, I'm not at that stage yet. More broadly speaking, I think the US healthcare system overall needs to be radically changed and at that time it will be necessary to change medical education and training to rationally align with a new healthcare structure.

I'm not holding my breath but the 40 hour work week, the minimum wage, end of child labor etc. were pretty radical (and sudden, historically speaking) changes brought about in moments of political upheaval so I'm fully prepared to be surprised.

 

[Gilakend]

In the US public K-12 school system I don't think there is anyway to determine if someone can be a successful physician. I think undergrad is necessary. People in the top 10 of my class who did AP and dual enrolled and all that jazz are currently failing out of undergrad. Also, think about all the other things that you get in undergrad that aren't possible for most HS students such as research. Also, if you went straight from HS to med school, when would you go to college parties? The most important prerequisite.

 

[sliceofbread136]

It may not necessarily be the extra 2 years of material (I think some of the material certainly helps, but some is also definitely worthless garbage), but rather, like I said, the 2 extra years of maturity. Med school requires an extremely well-developed pre-frontal cortex, and that bad boy is still developing well into age 23-24+.

Also, pre-clinical is at least $44,000 (and can easily hit $75k+), in addition to the opportunity cost of losing out on 2 years' salary doing something else and future investment of that salary

I have an extremely hard time believing that a 22 year old cannot handle the material a 24 year old can. The notion seems entirely ridiculous to me. Do you have anything to support that claim?

And I am referring to the actual cost to the school, not tuition paid by student. Preclinical is mostly classroom based and won't cost much more than undergrad did (maybe slightly more for cadavers etc etc). Clinicals cost schools significantly more and the school typically covers that increased cost (the yearly tuition increase isn't making up the difference). If a bunch of people dropped out after the clinical years they would be losing that money. The screening process just needs to be in place before this point (which is how Europe does it)

 

[deleted862527]

Well first off, as jqueb said - it's not the material, it's the maturity. I think you may have misread that. I am currently 24 and not the same person I was as a 22 year old, and I'm sure I'll be even more different when I finish med school in 2 years. Some of that is a result of two years of dealing with med school stuff specifically, some of that is just two years of dealing with plain ol' life experience. It should tell you something that the majority of people responding who have been through at least part of med school aren't fans of a shortened path to an MD.

And regarding the material itself, just for fun...the material itself is not that hard, it's having the work ethic and mental stamina to learn it all in what feels like an incredibly short amount of time, which partially comes with age. Obviously there are more factors than just age at play, but there is a school I interviewed at when I was applying and the majority of their students come from their 6-year BS/MD program. They told us that their Step 1 pass rate recently increased by 20% to a little over 80%. Most schools are over 90%. I would encourage you to look into the dropout rates and scores/match lists for US schools with most students coming from shortened BS/MD programs.

Hey I have a question. This is probably pretty stupid question, but it should be because I'm a pre-med and not a medical student.

Anyway, do most medical students do well on Step 1? Do most medical students get matched into a residency?

Thanks.

 

[PreMedMissteps]

In the US public K-12 school system I don't think there is anyway to determine if someone can be a successful physician. I e.

This is very true. I can't imagine that US public K-12 faculty would have what it takes to make such determinations and recommendations.

We also don't track students like they do in other countries.

 

[bananafish94]

I'll play.

-First of all, I'm opposed to making it an undergraduate-type route. There's a 0% chance I would've been mature enough for medical school at 18...I'm arguably not even mature enough now.

-Preclinical courses should be taught by people with formal training in education, not Ph.Ds or M.D.s with an organ system track that includes anatomy (I've heard that some schools have anatomy as its own course...that seems insane to me). No rank Pass/Fail.

-A lot of clinical exposure prior to M3 year.

-Generally a lot more efficiency with everything.

 

[bananafish94]

Oh, and just as a critique of the "system" in general, stop making everything so obscenely expensive. Secondary application do not need to be $100, Harvard. Your endowment is larger than the GDP of some nations.

 

[gyngyn]

Oh, and just as a critique of the "system" in general, stop making everything so obscenely expensive. Secondary application do not need to be $100, Harvard. Your endowment is larger than the GDP of some nations.

The fee is the only disincentive to everyone applying everywhere.
There is already so much inefficiency as it is!

I would gladly send secondaries for free if there were a limit on the number of applications.

 

[bananafish94]

Curious why you feel this way. My school has anatomy and other basic/foundational classes first semester, then organ blocks after, and I didn't think it was too bad.

I feel like the education would suffer. At my school we went into a great amount of detail for each organ system, and the anatomy from each block was reinforced in every subsequent block because so much of it builds on itself. I feel like that cannot be achieved in one unit of anatomy. Of course, I suppose that the argument could be made that you don't need to know that much in the first place. But I still feel that an organ-system approach is more logical and yields a more thorough understanding.

 

[bananafish94]

The fee is the only disincentive to everyone applying everywhere.
There is already so much inefficiency as it is!

I would gladly send secondaries for free if there were a limit on the number applications.

I respectfully disagree. A better disincentive, in my opinion, would be to make secondary applications more challenging. Include more essays, or make them more thought-provoking. Make them put in a significant amount of work if they want to apply! I think you would be surprised by the number of people who just have their parents write them a carte blanche for as many applications as they want, at profound disadvantage to people who don't have a wealth of resources at their disposal.

I also think that if there were a limit on applications, it would favor students from "lucky" states with lots of regional schools (i.e. Michigan), at the disadvantage of people from states with very few schools (or none at all) or people from regions with only extremely prestigious schools, forcing them to apply elsewhere and compete with people with innate advantages of being from those areas.

 

[bananafish94]

Ah, I see. That's fair. I will say at my school we did review the anatomy in organ blocks as well, particularly where it was relevant to some sort of pathology, albeit in less detail than we covered it in our anatomy course.

Interesting. Also, every time you post it makes me happy because I'm reminded that there are other young West Wing fans out there.

 

[gyngyn]

I respectfully disagree. A better disincentive, in my opinion, would be to make secondary applications more challenging. Include more essays, or make them more thought-provoking. Make them put in a significant amount of work if they want to apply! I think you would be surprised by the number of people who just have their parents write them a carte blanche for as many applications as they want, at profound disadvantage to people who don't have a wealth of resources at their disposal.

I also think that if there were a limit on applications, it would favor students from "lucky" states with lots of regional schools (i.e. Michigan), at the disadvantage of people from states with very few schools (or none at all) or people from regions with only extremely prestigious schools, forcing them to apply elsewhere and compete with people with innate advantages of being from those areas.

Somebody still has to read them (for free) and the well-off applicants still pay folks to write them!
You are making my point. It would go a long way to leveling the playing field between rich and poor applicants to limit the number of aps.

 

[Goro]

Oh, and just as a critique of the "system" in general, stop making everything so obscenely expensive. Secondary application do not need to be $100, Harvard. Your endowment is larger than the GDP of some nations.

Secondaries are often a tax on the hopelessly optimistic, if not pathologically naive.

Is this thread really about reforming medical education? Or about the med school app process??????

 

[gyngyn]

Secondaries are often a tax on the hopelessly optimistic, if not pathologically naive.

Is this thread really about reforming medical education? Or about the med school app process??????

And those with more money than sense.

 

[deleted862527]

Secondaries are often a tax on the hopelessly optimistic, if not pathologically naive.

Is this thread really about reforming medical education? Or about the med school app process??????

It can honestly go both ways, coming from the OP.

 

[bananafish94]

Secondaries are often a tax on the hopelessly optimistic, if not pathologically naive.

Is this thread really about reforming medical education? Or about the med school app process??????

In my personal opinion, I have a problem with receiving a primary application from somebody who has absolutely no chance of getting in (be that for GPA, MCAT, personal history, etc.) and then charging them an exorbitant fee just to be rejected. Are they making a bad decision by applying? Yes. Should they have done proper research before pursuing a path that was certain to fail? Yes. But selling false hope for $100 just doesn't sit right with me. It actually sounds like a microcosm for everything that the Caribbean schools do. Again, just my opinion.

I made a comment about changes I personally would like to see in medical school, so this particular issue doesn't need to be discussed further if you'd rather not. Although I do think there is a discussion to be had about the amount of money medical students are supposed to pay for things like standardized tests, residency applications, etc.

 

[vellez]

I think medicine should be more competency based as opposed to a blanket 4 years. And I don't think students should be...penalized...if they need an extra semester. Also, I think medical degrees should be 3 years post graduate. One year of condensed, intense didactics and two years of clinical rotations. You learn a lot more about forming differential diagnoses, and treatment during your clinical years. Or maybe instead of 2+2, do 1+2+1 research year. I think students should be given a chance to do meaningful research and that takes time.

 

[deleted862527]

I made a comment about changes I personally would like to see in medical school, so this particular issue doesn't need to be discussed further if you'd rather not. Although I do think there is a discussion to be had about the amount of money medical students are supposed to pay for things like standardized tests, residency applications, etc.

Don't feel ashamed. Some people are too sensitive on SDN. I liked the other issues regarding the cost of medical school applications you brought up.