PhD/PsyD Humanistic/Transpersonal/Holistic approaches to Clinical Psychology?!

[ri0t123]

Hello guys,

I am currently studying in Vienna but looking forward to move to America 2015 in order to start my PhD/PsyD. Not its quite difficult to gather all the information I need through the interweb. Well, I know the direction I want to move toward. It's just not easy to find out about all the universities, there accreditation, reputation etc. I really hope you guys can help me with that. Now.. here is what I imagining myself doing.

-Either doing research or work as a "clinical" psychologist (I am not sure of that one yet, I guess APA accreditation would be important here?!)
-Humanistic/holistic/health/transpersonal psychology
-Spirituality
-Help human beings to their full potential, not just concentrate on pathologies
-Psychedelics and there healing/transforming potentials
-Approaches from different cultures (like meditation, shamanic rituals)

Now I found some Universities like the Sofia University and the Californian Institute for Integral studies and their curriculum seemed very appealing to me. On the other hand its quite "heavy" that they aren't APA accreditet, right? There's no possibility to get APA accreditation through another way?

What do you guys think would be my best choice? Maybe just start a PsyD/PhD at a "normal" university with a kind of open minded reputation and holistical approach and see that I move toward transpersonal psychology etc. in another way?

Well, that's it for now. Thanks for your help and have a nice weekend!

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[erg923]

How viable do you think practicing soley from that framework is within the American healthcare/mental health care system?

 

[WisNeuro]

I'm with erg, you're going to have a hard time getting any money from insurance carriers. So, unless you can find a healthy, rich, community that wants those services, you may be living under the poverty line and struggling to find work.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

How viable do you think practicing soley from that framework is within the American healthcare/mental health care system?

This. For solely addressing things like spirituality and "helping human beings to their full potential," you're likely going to be unable to bill insurance, which is going to limit your job opportunities (with private practice being your main "bastion"). Same goes for psychedelics, if you can even find someone willing to let you research them. As for the humanistic approach, portions of that (along with health and the "holistic" approach in terms of addressing biological, psychological, and social contributing factors) are largely incorporated in many existing treatment paradigms and theoretical orientations.

As for APA accreditation, yeah, not having it at the grad school level is going to be a HUGE issue, and one you won't somehow be able to make up later. It's honestly a fairly low bar in terms of the criteria, so if a program isn't able to meet that standard (and isn't brand new and in the process of obtaining it), then that'd be a huge red flag for me. I want to say that the California Institute for Integral Studies in particular seems to have a fairly horrid reputation with respect to providing any semblance of a foundation in science.

 

[erg923]

-Psychedelics and there healing/transforming potentials

Uh, yea. Seemed to work well for Syd Barrett.

 

[CKAW]

Glad you posted this as I've been wondering about similar things. My interests are a little less new age-y and I've been looking into how these ideas translate into existing research. I've been reading about mindfulness based stress reduction, positive psychology, and some stuff about "flourishing." What does everyone on the board think about the potential for applying these things in practice beyond simply applying to study them in grad school?

 

[erg923]

They already are incorporated into many existing therapies.

 

[CKAW]

Thanks! Erg, I'm trying to get into grad school and I've taken to looking through journal articles and faculty pages on websites to find people with similar research interests. Could you name a couple of these related therapies or theories to search for?

 

[empathiosis]

One thing you may want to do is get yourself a copy of Graduate Study in Psychology, it's a guide to graduate programs published by the APA: http://www.apa.org/pubs/books/4270097.aspx

Not sure if they will ship to Europe, but it is worth a try. If not, you can go to your university library and see if they will get it for you through Interlibrary Loan.

Another good place to get information is the APA web site, they actually have a list of all the accredited programs: http://www.apa.org/ed/accreditation/programs/

You can then Google the programs to find out more information about them. There are doctoral programs in clinical and counseling psychology. The counseling psychology programs tend to be more holistic ... but one particularly good clinical program known for a humanistic phenomenological focus is Duquesne University. This is their web site:
http://www.duq.edu/academics/schools/liberal-arts/graduate-school/programs/clinical-psychology

Another way to do this is to search APA PsycNet for topics of interest to you. That way you will get a sense of who is doing research that interests you and where they are. Here's that:
http://psycnet.apa.org/index.cfm?fa=search.advancedSearchForm

Finally, APA accreditation is indeed important if you plan to live and practice in the US. If you are planning to return to Europe, that may be less important. If you want to consider programs in Europe, Trinity College in Dublin has an excellent doctoral program in counseling psychology that you might like: http://psychology.tcd.ie/postgraduate/d-couns/

Feel free to PM me if you need any more help getting this stuff.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Thanks! Erg, I'm trying to get into grad school and I've taken to looking through journal articles and faculty pages on websites to find people with similar research interests. Could you name a couple of these related therapies or theories to search for?

DBT makes some pretty hefty use of mindfulness, and I believe components of it may be directly/indirectly incorporated in ACT as well.

 

[psychologue]

Lisa Miller of Teacher's College at Columbia, Director of the Spirituality and Mind Body Institute: http://www.tc.columbia.edu/academics/?facid=lfm14

 

[beastmaster5000]

I'd recommend checking out MAPS and researching some of their past presenters, some of whom have been able to explore these practices within the medical model / evidence-based state of the field:

http://www.maps.org/conference/

If you find folks doing work that inspires you I would contact them and ask how they got to where they are.

 

[ri0t123]

First of all thank you for all the information.
I am not planing to work soley from this framework so please don't let this thread become a discussion about principles. Also I did not know that Syd Barrett took psychedelic-assisted psychotherapy, that's very interesting. I know my passion and the direction I want to move towards to and right I am not thinking about how to capitalize that. You might be right that it will be more difficult to find work etc. but I will risk that and deal with those issues when they arise. I see the "usual" clinical approach as my "solid scientific foundation" and of course I want to integrate this in my work as well. My initial post might have sounded a little extrem but still still - long term this will be my focus/specialization.

I guess my next step will be to check some papers/studies and see which universities and researchers are focusing on my subject. I already looked up the MAPS homepage, which is very interesting.. but still there's a lot more to explore. I guess I need to get in contact with some researchers directly...
If you have some suggestions, inspiration, experiences, ideas, critique or maybe know some universities which you think fit into my field of interests, I would be glad if you let me know.

That's it for now. Thank you very much

 

[erg923]

It was a joke, dude

 

[PsyDr]

Probably the best choice would be to apply to Harvard, tell them that you want to reproduce Henry Murray's experiments, including validation of the TAT, psychological profiling, the use of psychedelics in mind control, and the potential to recreate the Unabomber.

 

[WisNeuro]

Kids these days, no appreciation for the classics. Or senses of humor it seems.

 

[WisNeuro]

I think people were giving honest feedback about the viability of that career path. It is what it is. And Google is fairly ubiquitous these days I hear.

 

[WisNeuro]

The Google comment was for looking up Syd Barrett. And it wasn't really opinion, the viability of that career choice is extremely limited, especially considering those schools are not accredited. Just a fact, pursue those options and you will will most likely have a hard time finding a full-time job according to the statistics and trends.

 

[erg923]

Yes, cultural insensitivity. Someone wants to practice here in US and we provide advice about how things work here. Poster makes joke about musicician whose mental health was certainly NOT helped by acid. Another provides insight into all the help Tim Leary did for for advancement of that subfield. Yes, we are racist, obvioulsy.

 

[ri0t123]

No I knew it was a "joke" but since this is quite a sensitive topic I really couldn't laugh about it. I just dont like it when you drag this topic to the polemic level. We don't need to discuss how Syd Barrett's (as far as google told me) consume of psychedelic substances might differ from a therapeutic setting, come on.. There is also a big gap between cultural insensitivity and racism..
But I don't want this to become an emotionally heated up discussion so PLEASE let's get back to topic now

 

[WisNeuro]

Man, if you can't laugh about it, grad school is gonna be extra tough for you. It's healthier to have a somewhat cynical sense of humor. anyway, Sofia/Institute of Transpersonal Psych is kind of a garbage program. Their match statistics and such are worse than the worst of the Psy.D's. I think Columbia is getting bigger into the psychology spirituality thing, but in that case you better beef up your resume, I think it's a tough program to get into. As far as career aspirations, honestly, not a big market for it, and insurance won't cover it. Maybe you could swing it as a researcher, but that field will be extremely narrow for that topic as well. If it's your dream, go ahead and shoot for it, just be prepared for a Sisyphean journey.

 

[erg923]

No I knew it was a "joke" but since this is quite a sensitive topic

Exactly. Thus I would recommend you invest your efforts in using he science of psychology to help others, since you want to be psychologist, rather than trying to rehash the supercalifragilisticexpialidocious acid tests. It has a poor track record and is not a very viable option in the US at this time.

 

[SpiritMachine]

I have similar interests. Secular spiritualism, Buddhist psychology, mindfulness, positive psychology, but I am not into psychedelic therapy personally. There are a few APA accredited Psy.D./Ph.D. programs with a sort of humanistic and (or) transpersonal slant, but they are still very scarce. Positive psychology is somewhat of a new field, and I don't know of any programs that specialize in it at the moment. I believe you can get a certification from the VIA institute, but I know there are a few humanistic programs in California, and one really good one in the Northeast (that has been posted here before :/).

APA accreditation should definitely be seen as a minimum unless you are going for a research-only doctorate. If you do decide to go the research route, you can clinically respecialize later on. But I am unsure how this affects potential employment. It would give you the necessary clinical training if you choose a non clinical/counseling area of psychology though. I would recommend going to Sofia first if that's your interest, but it's very expensive to attend like most universities in California.

https://www.apa.org/ed/graduate/respecialization.aspx

http://www.psydp.org/

I guess certifications for positive psych are springing up, but I don't think they mean much yet.

Good luck.

 

[empathiosis]

Penn has Seligman's Positive Psych Center and they have an MA in positive psych http://www.sas.upenn.edu/lps/graduate/mapp/

And a list of faculty interested in positive psych around the world (but positive psych defined very broadly)
http://www.ppc.sas.upenn.edu/ppfaculty.htm

 

[InNae]

Penn has Seligman's Positive Psych Center and they have an MA in positive psych http://www.sas.upenn.edu/lps/graduate/mapp/

Wow - $54K for mostly online content and a "degree" that doesn't exist anywhere else? The certificate is a "Master of Applied Positive Psychology", which is NOT a traditional MA (Master of Arts). If the content is mostly online anyway, seems a person could read and learn the stuff on their own for free. The FAQs are kind of shocking - no scholarship opportunities, "degree" doesn't prepare people for much of anything, need to make your own lodging arrangements for those couple of days on campus...

 

[bcliff]

.

 

[WisNeuro]

Wow - $54K for mostly online content and a "degree" that doesn't exist anywhere else? The certificate is a "Master of Applied Positive Psychology", which is NOT a traditional MA (Master of Arts). If the content is mostly online anyway, seems a person could read and learn the stuff on their own for free. The FAQs are kind of shocking - no scholarship opportunities, "degree" doesn't prepare people for much of anything, need to make your own lodging arrangements for those couple of days on campus...

You forgot about the requirement that you also have to send in three boxtops from Captain Crunch cereal.

 

[InNae]

You forgot about the requirement that you also have to send in three boxtops from Captain Crunch cereal.

Right?

It's so frustrating. Rackets like these are sadly successful because enough people apparently have extra disposable income, and because those people want to be able to say they studied under Seligman (which they won't, because he probably just delivers the occasional lecture) and that they now have a "masters from UPenn", (which they don't). I will say that if anyone ever applies to our doctoral program after having gotten (paid for?) a "MAPP", I will not only instantly realize that they don't have adequate preparation for doctoral study, but I also will seriously question their judgment.