"I don't want to be a doctor"

[GangaMaster]

How many times this year have you M1-3s told yourself this?

Twice so far.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[cbrons]

pretty natural during M3

 

[Psai]

Why wouldn't you want to be a doctor? Seems like everyone and their mother calls themselves doctor nowadays.

 

[Doctor Strange]

pretty natural during M3

I live a couple of third years, and this is a constant thing that's said in the house since rotations started. The burnout is strong.

 

[Kahreek]

0

 

[Arkangeloid]

During Microbiology I was actually seriously looking into how to get into programming, and talking to one of my good M1 friends who was a programmer before medical school.

But now, Psychiatry has reminded me of why I decided to go into medicine in the first place. I guess I just find the topic really interesting.

 

[cbrons]

During Microbiology I was actually seriously looking into how to get into programming, and talking to one of my good M1 friends who was a programmer before medical school.

But now, Psychiatry has reminded me of why I decided to go into medicine in the first place. I guess I just find the topic really interesting.

You a good man if you find psych interesting my friend. We definitely need a much higher caliber of psychiatrists than we have now.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile

 

[Arkangeloid]

You a good man if you find psych interesting my friend. We definitely need a much higher caliber of psychiatrists than we have now.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile

I don't understand, what's cooler than learning about the medicine of mental health? I thought everyone thought psych was cool, but people just didn't go into it because of stigma/low pay/poor patient outcomes/bad patient populations/etc.

 

[physicsnerd42]

I'm in the final year of my MD/PhD and I haven't really felt that way since M1. Honestly, I loved M3 (and fourth year is even better).

 

[evilbooyaa]

How many times this year have you M1-3s told yourself this?

Twice so far.

Guess you can't handle the awesome

 

[kreme]

During Microbiology I was actually seriously looking into how to get into programming, and talking to one of my good M1 friends who was a programmer before medical school.

But now, Psychiatry has reminded me of why I decided to go into medicine in the first place. I guess I just find the topic really interesting.

Doesn't mean you can't learn and eventually make this a hobby. Checkout codecademy.com to get some practice. Maybe one day you can learn to build an app that can help your practice run more smoothly.

 

[Kahreek]

You a good man if you find psych interesting my friend. We definitely need a much higher caliber of psychiatrists than we have now.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile

ohh c'mon don't be that guy, psychiatry as a group has a very competent and homogenous knowledge. Of course there some who might enter into mild quackery in their private offices.

 

[WaylonS]

Other than when I've had to pelvic exams on women with super infected lady parts, I've never had a day where I regretted going to med school

 

[Wordead]

I don't understand, what's cooler than learning about the medicine of mental health? I thought everyone thought psych was cool, but people just didn't go into it because of stigma/low pay/poor patient outcomes/bad patient populations/etc.

5 different psychiatrists can give you 5 different diagnoses, 75% of patients don't need real help aside from a place to sleep or a bullet in the head, largely unproven rationale for treatments, recurring patients who can't be helped. I can't think of any field I find less interesting. But more power to the people who want to deal with that.

 

[cbrons]

5 different psychiatrists can give you 5 different diagnoses, 75% of patients don't need real help aside from a place to sleep or a bullet in the head, largely unproven rationale for treatments, recurring patients who can't be helped. I can't think of any field I find less interesting. But more power to the people who want to deal with that.

I don't understand, what's cooler than learning about the medicine of mental health? I thought everyone thought psych was cool, but people just didn't go into it because of stigma/low pay/poor patient outcomes/bad patient populations/etc.

I do find psychiatry interesting, but I find the actual practice of psychiatry to be unappealing. There is a huge need, though, for good psychiatrists who practice evidence-based medicine. Sadly I don't think there many treatment modalities that substantially improve the quality of life for most psychiatric patients, and too many that seem to do little but make things a lot worse. And a good deal of stuff that seems like little more than glorified placebo.

On another but related note --- why in the world are there still MD pre-clinical professors preaching the gospel of Freudian psychoanalysis? I remember in M1 behavioral science had a guest lecturer for development (a child psychiatrist) talk about oedipal complexes, psychosexual stages of development, etc. I mean, aren't these guys embarrassed to be teaching this rubbish as legitimate in an allopathic medical school in the 21st century?

 

[dyspareunia]

0

 

[Arkangeloid]

5 different psychiatrists can give you 5 different diagnoses, 75% of patients don't need real help aside from a place to sleep or a bullet in the head, largely unproven rationale for treatments, recurring patients who can't be helped. I can't think of any field I find less interesting. But more power to the people who want to deal with that.

It's better than trying to manage (not treat, but manage from what I've learned) a bunch of old fat people who couldn't give two craps about their diabetes and hypertension.

And as for surgery, I wouldn't do any surgical specialty if I was paid $800K/year to do it and every third patient was a kitten who just wanted to cuddle with me. For one, the lifestyle sucks, and lifestyle is very important to me. For another, I hate the idea of doing anything procedural. Hell, we had a suturing workshop where we had to practice on a banana, and I didn't like it so I got angry and ate the banana and left.

Psych just seems like the least of all evils. I mean, I'd like to do it, though I'm not sure if my parents (who are footing the bill for med school) will let me.

I do find psychiatry interesting, but I find the actual practice of psychiatry to be unappealing. There is a huge need, though, for good psychiatrists who practice evidence-based medicine. Sadly I don't think there many treatment modalities that substantially improve the quality of life for most psychiatric patients, and too many that seem to do little but make things a lot worse. And a good deal of stuff that seems like little more than glorified placebo.

On another but related note --- why in the world are there still MD pre-clinical professors preaching the gospel of Freudian psychoanalysis? I remember in M1 behavioral science had a guest lecturer for development (a child psychiatrist) talk about oedipal complexes, psychosexual stages of development, etc. I mean, aren't these guys embarrassed to be teaching this rubbish as legitimate in an allopathic medical school in the 21st century?

I have no idea why they even talk about Freud and Oedipal Complexes and crap like that lol. I thought it was just a joke. But they weren't kidding...

 

[evilbooyaa]

It's better than trying to manage (not treat, but manage from what I've learned) a bunch of old fat people who couldn't give two craps about their diabetes and hypertension.

To some extent, you're right. However, IM/FM isn't ALL about diabetes and HTN (just like 60%). You see a number of treatable conditions (PNA) or managing relatively healthy patients (physicals)

And as for surgery, I wouldn't do any surgical specialty if I was paid $800K/year to do it and every third patient was a kitten who just wanted to cuddle with me. For one, the lifestyle sucks, and lifestyle is very important to me. For another, I hate the idea of doing anything procedural. Hell, we had a suturing workshop where we had to practice on a banana, and I didn't like it so I got angry and ate the banana and left.

Literally LOL'd at my desk. Getting weird looks now. Well played.

Psych just seems like the least of all evils. I mean, I'd like to do it, though I'm not sure if my parents (who are footing the bill for med school) will let me.

Wow. I was never pressured to go into a specific specialty (although radiology was talked up an awful lot during pre-clinical years). My parents understand that I'm going to be a doctor of some kind and while they talk crap on certain fields, would be proud regardless of what field I wanted to do. I think you may just be being your standard pessimistic self to have thoughts like that. If it hasn't been blatantly said to you, "You vill not be dirty psychiatrist!", then don't assume it.

 

[Arkangeloid]

Wow. I was never pressured to go into a specific specialty (although radiology was talked up an awful lot during pre-clinical years). My parents understand that I'm going to be a doctor of some kind and while they talk crap on certain fields, would be proud regardless of what field I wanted to do. I think you may just be being your standard pessimistic self to have thoughts like that. If it hasn't been blatantly said to you, "You vill not be dirty psychiatrist!", then don't assume it.

Actually, before medical school my father told me that he would love to see me in a prestigious surgical subspecialty (like Surg Onc or Vascular or something I guess). I ignored him. After my failure in Anatomy and subsequent mediocre performances, I think he's accepted that just getting through medical school with a match will be enough of an achievement for someone like me. He probably hopes that my more intelligent and industrious little brother, who is in a BS/MD program now, will turn out better.

He doesn't seem to like Psychiatry though. He told me that no American will want to see an Indian psychiatrist when they can see a white one, and no Indian will ever want to see me because in our culture, mental health professionals are hated. For that reason, he also said it may make it more difficult to find a wife for me if I went into such a specialty.

He also doesn't like Peds and OB/GYN because he says they are majority female professions. Doesn't matter to me though because I hate children.

Regardless, I think I can convince him otherwise if I tell him that Psych is the only thing I find interesting.

 

[evilbooyaa]

He doesn't seem to like Psychiatry though. He told me that no American will want to see an Indian psychiatrist when they can see a white one,

False. One of the most popular and well-liked psychiatrists (both by patients and staff) I worked with was a young Indian male who went to medical school in the US (I believe, either way he didn't have a strong accent). It's only an issue if you act like the previous generation of Indians. If you act like your patients have an actual problem and aren't just making up their mental illnesses (which is a belief widely held by previous generation, including partially by my own parents), patients will appreciate you the same as a white man.

and no Indian will ever want to see me because in our culture, mental health professionals are hated.

This bit is probably true. Indians are notoriously bad about going to mental health professionals, because it shows 'weakness of the mind'. But these Indians he is referencing aren't going to discriminate. They won't see ANY psychiatrist.

For that reason, he also said it may make it more difficult to find a wife for me if I went into such a specialty.

Not sure why this has any relevance. As long as you're not psychoanalyzing/diagnosing your wife, it shouldn't be an issue. You'll still be a doctor, which means you WILL be married at some point (which might be it's own issue) if you want to be.

Regardless, I think I can convince him otherwise if I tell him that Psych is the only thing I find interesting.

You absolutely should. Is your father in the medical profession? Sounds like an Indian doc who trained abroad and came here with his family and thus maintains the thought processes that were relevant one generation and one country ago.

 

[Arkangeloid]

Not sure why this has any relevance. As long as you're not psychoanalyzing/diagnosing your wife, it shouldn't be an issue. You'll still be a doctor, which means you WILL be married at some point (which might be it's own issue) if you want to be.

I think he meant that when he arranges my marriage (which at the rate I'm going will probably will be the only way I can ever get a woman interested in me), it may be more difficult to find an Indian woman who wants to marry a psychiatrist as opposed to a surgeon or something.

You absolutely should. Is your father in the medical profession? Sounds like an Indian doc who trained abroad and came here with his family and thus maintains the thought processes that were relevant one generation and one country ago.

No he's an engineer. He sees me as some sort of piece on a chessboard that he moves around in an attempt to win prestige and honor for his family. He denies it, and says he loves me unconditionally, but he's lying through his teeth.



In any case, I look at it realistically. I'd rather be happy and interested in a specialty than unhappy in another one just to make other people happy.

 

[evilbooyaa]

I think he meant that when he arranges my marriage (which at the rate I'm going will probably will be the only way I can ever get a woman interested in me), it may be more difficult to find an Indian woman who wants to marry a psychiatrist as opposed to a surgeon or something.

If he's smart (and you go into Psych) he should mention that you will actually be around to spend time with the wife/kids/etc. as opposed to the surgeon.

No he's an engineer. He sees me as some sort of piece on a chessboard that he moves around in an attempt to win prestige and honor for his family. He denies it, and says he loves me unconditionally, but I've learned in medical school that everybody lies, you just have to see through the facades.

Seems like an inferiority complex (likely to the surrounding Indian community) he has. I would highly recommend against letting him run your life at this point in your life, even if he is footing the bill

 

[Arkangeloid]

If he's smart (and you go into Psych) he should mention that you will actually be around to spend time with the wife/kids/etc. as opposed to the surgeon.


Seems like an inferiority complex (likely to the surrounding Indian community) he has. I would highly recommend against letting him run your life at this point in your life, even if he is footing the bill

.

(Never mind. Regardless, I don't plan to let him control anything else about me, especially given that he knows literally NOTHING about medicine.)

 

[syncrhodes]

How many times this year have you M1-3s told yourself this?

Twice so far.

Don't forget to think about what else you might do. Being a doctor may not be THE BEST job out there...but I have to imagine it's pretty far up. As far as socioeconomic class placement, being a doctor is probably the likeliest way to be in the top 1%...not that that's the goal, but to the extent SES matters. Other than that, it's trying to become a financial bank head or CEO...which is far more dependent on luck and other things that don't come out of just hitting the grindstone like medicine. We have the surest way to high SES...which is truly a privilege.

 

[Arkangeloid]

Literally LOL'd at my desk. Getting weird looks now. Well played.

Well, I might be wrong, but I always thought learning stuff like suturing was beneath me. I came to medical school because I wanted to learn how to diagnose and treat illness, not because I wanted to tie little knots. I mean, aren't there nurses and technicians to do that stuff for us so we can do more important things?

 

[DokterMom]

Hell, we had a suturing workshop where we had to practice on a banana, and I didn't like it so I got angry and ate the banana and left...

Sometimes a banana is just a banana

Psych just seems like the least of all evils. I mean, I'd like to do it, though I'm not sure if my parents (who are footing the bill for med school) will let me.

I have no idea why they even talk about Freud and Oedipal Complexes and crap like that lol. I thought it was just a joke. But they weren't kidding...

Spoken like someone with Daddy issues...
I'm serious, actually. Why be only interested in the one field of medicine your father would find most objectionable? One idea to consider is that it's one of the few socially acceptable (if passively aggressive) ways to say "Up yours, Daddy!" I bet if your Dad had a change of heart and decided psych was a great opportunity because of how very few Indian psychs there were, you'd find something not to like about it... See if you can forget what he doesn't want long enough to figure out what you do want.

 

[Arkangeloid]

Sometimes a banana is just a banana



Spoken like someone with Daddy issues...
I'm serious, actually. Why be only interested in the one field of medicine your father would find most objectionable? One idea to consider is that it's one of the few socially acceptable (if passively aggressive) ways to say "Up yours, Daddy!" I bet if your Dad had a change of heart and decided psych was a great opportunity because of how very few Indian psychs there were, you'd find something not to like about it... See if you can forget what he doesn't want long enough to figure out what you do want.

I'm interested in Psych because I'm more interested in the diagnostic and cerebral parts of medicine, I hate anything procedural, I want a degree of work-life balance, and I'm fascinated by how mental health works.

I was also interested in IM, and still am, but I've seen a lot of thoroughly miserable IM physicians, so I'm scared.

 

[notbobtrustme]

yo, are you going to medical school or is your dad?

time to man up and tell him how it is.

 

[Wordead]

I'm interested in Psych because I'm more interested in the diagnostic and cerebral parts of medicine, I hate anything procedural, I want a degree of work-life balance, and I'm fascinated by how mental health works.

I was also interested in IM, and still am, but I've seen a lot of thoroughly miserable IM physicians, so I'm scared.

I'd wait until your rotations. It's amusing to see Psych, diagnosis, and cerebral in the same sentence.

But yeah, you need to get out from under your parents man. And find some self confidence. Easier said than done, but still.

 

[Kaputt]

Because radiology exists, I don't regret going to med school.

Ark, follow your heart. Psych is a legit specialty. If I had any skills listening to people I might have considered it.

 

[DermViser]

Actually, before medical school my father told me that he would love to see me in a prestigious surgical subspecialty (like Surg Onc or Vascular or something I guess). I ignored him. After my failure in Anatomy and subsequent mediocre performances, I think he's accepted that just getting through medical school with a match will be enough of an achievement for someone like me. He probably hopes that my more intelligent and industrious little brother, who is in a BS/MD program now, will turn out better.

He doesn't seem to like Psychiatry though. He told me that no American will want to see an Indian psychiatrist when they can see a white one, and no Indian will ever want to see me because in our culture, mental health professionals are hated. For that reason, he also said it may make it more difficult to find a wife for me if I went into such a specialty.

He also doesn't like Peds and OB/GYN because he says they are majority female professions. Doesn't matter to me though because I hate children.

Regardless, I think I can convince him otherwise if I tell him that Psych is the only thing I find interesting.

Something tells me your father knows nothing about medicine in general, the ins/outs of specialties, etc. Your objective in choosing a specialty is more than just bringing in a paycheck and attracting a wife (by the way, most wives, even Asian ones, don't give a **** about you being a big surgeon). If you follow your Dad's advice, you won't have any work-life balance, and will be even more unhappy.

 

[DermViser]

Sometimes a banana is just a banana

Spoken like someone with Daddy issues...
I'm serious, actually. Why be only interested in the one field of medicine your father would find most objectionable? One idea to consider is that it's one of the few socially acceptable (if passively aggressive) ways to say "Up yours, Daddy!" I bet if your Dad had a change of heart and decided psych was a great opportunity because of how very few Indian psychs there were, you'd find something not to like about it... See if you can forget what he doesn't want long enough to figure out what you do want.

Something tells me if the reimbursement scheme were to change all of sudden and Psychiatrists were rolling bank like Surgeons, that Daddy would have a sudden change in heart about Psychiatry. Pretty fickle if you ask me.

 

[evilbooyaa]

I'm interested in Psych because I'm more interested in the diagnostic and cerebral parts of medicine, I hate anything procedural, I want a degree of work-life balance, and I'm fascinated by how mental health works.

I was also interested in IM, and still am, but I've seen a lot of thoroughly miserable IM physicians, so I'm scared.

You're still a MS1. If you're deciding between Psych and IM, you'll experience both in MS3 and can make a decision of one of those (or neither) fields.

 

[Microglia]

I'm in the final year of my MD/PhD and I haven't really felt that way since M1. Honestly, I loved M3 (and fourth year is even better).

I'm only in my first year of the program, but I'm guessing this is because we're all delusional by the end of 6 years of school and lab work hahaha. Can't wait!

Jk of course haha

 

[Helper3]

Hell, we had a suturing workshop where we had to practice on a banana, and I didn't like it so I got angry and ate the banana and left.

I totally burst out laughing when I read this

 

[circulus vitios]

5 different psychiatrists can give you 5 different diagnoses, 75% of patients don't need real help aside from a place to sleep or a bullet in the head, largely unproven rationale for treatments, recurring patients who can't be helped. I can't think of any field I find less interesting. But more power to the people who want to deal with that.

Playing adult babysitter, 9-5 for $200k/year doesn't sound too bad.

 

[Wordead]

Playing adult babysitter, 9-5 for $200k/year doesn't sound too bad.

To each their own. If that's what you aspire to, go for it.

 

[Arkangeloid]

To each their own. If that's what you aspire to, go for it.

And I'd rather babysit craycray peeps than fat old peeps if it came down to that.

 

[dbeast]

How many times this year have you M1-3s told yourself this?

Twice so far.

I still want to be a doctor. I don't want to be a medical student. Or a resident.

 

[Wordead]

And I'd rather babysit craycray peeps than fat old peeps if it came down to that.

Is that all you want out of life? To be a glorified babysitter?

 

[Arkangeloid]

Is that all you want out of life? To be a glorified babysitter?

Well what other options are there in medicine (that are accessible to a below average student like me).

 

[KnuxNole]

If he's smart (and you go into Psych) he should mention that you will actually be around to spend time with the wife/kids/etc. as opposed to the surgeon.


Seems like an inferiority complex (likely to the surrounding Indian community) he has. I would highly recommend against letting him run your life at this point in your life, even if he is footing the bill

This. I would hate to have a person like that in my life...

 

[Wordead]

Well what other options are there in medicine (that are accessible to a below average student like me).

There are a ton more specialties besides internal med and psych.....go read the choosing a specialty book.

And you're a M1. There is nothing off the table yet for you; stop being overdramatic.

 

[Evil_Abed]

.

 

[Kaputt]

Well what other options are there in medicine (that are accessible to a below average student like me).

jesus dude get off sdn and study

sure you have to remediate anatomy but it's not a death-mark where you can only do family med in nowheresville, usa

 

[punkedoutriffs]

Well what other options are there in medicine (that are accessible to a below average student like me).

Part of me feels like you have inherited your father's inferiority complex and are in danger of carrying it around for the indefinite future. You might even pass it onto your own children and subsequently force them to go into certain "prestigious" fields as a way to make up for what you "couldn't do" yourself. Do yourself and your future children a favor. Make the buck stop with you.

 

[MerickManual]

Actually, before medical school my father told me that he would love to see me in a prestigious surgical subspecialty (like Surg Onc or Vascular or something I guess). I ignored him. After my failure in Anatomy and subsequent mediocre performances, I think he's accepted that just getting through medical school with a match will be enough of an achievement for someone like me. He probably hopes that my more intelligent and industrious little brother, who is in a BS/MD program now, will turn out better.

He doesn't seem to like Psychiatry though. He told me that no American will want to see an Indian psychiatrist when they can see a white one, and no Indian will ever want to see me because in our culture, mental health professionals are hated. For that reason, he also said it may make it more difficult to find a wife for me if I went into such a specialty.

He also doesn't like Peds and OB/GYN because he says they are majority female professions. Doesn't matter to me though because I hate children.

Regardless, I think I can convince him otherwise if I tell him that Psych is the only thing I find interesting.

Got to do what you love. My mother was devastated when I chose FM at first.

Besides, my attending for psych was an Indian man, he seemed to be banking and had a wife, family, etc.

 

[Brain Bucket]

Actually, before medical school my father told me that he would love to see me in a prestigious surgical subspecialty (like Surg Onc or Vascular or something I guess). I ignored him. After my failure in Anatomy and subsequent mediocre performances, I think he's accepted that just getting through medical school with a match will be enough of an achievement for someone like me. He probably hopes that my more intelligent and industrious little brother, who is in a BS/MD program now, will turn out better.

He doesn't seem to like Psychiatry though. He told me that no American will want to see an Indian psychiatrist when they can see a white one, and no Indian will ever want to see me because in our culture, mental health professionals are hated. For that reason, he also said it may make it more difficult to find a wife for me if I went into such a specialty.

He also doesn't like Peds and OB/GYN because he says they are majority female professions. Doesn't matter to me though because I hate children.

Regardless, I think I can convince him otherwise if I tell him that Psych is the only thing I find interesting.

Do both, your father and yourself, a huge favor by starting to live for yourself. You will never satisfy him, no matter how hard you work, but if you find a specialty that makes you happy and one you excel at, in time your Father will learn to respect and admire you.

As for a woman, happiness and confidence are very attractive traits, and neither can be gained by living your life to satisfy someone else's idea of who you should be.

My advice for right now: surround yourself with people who're happy and doing well. Work your ass off to get those As or Bs for yourself.

+1 to punkedoutriffs' 2c.

 

[PrideNeverDie]

go into IM ark

you aren't gonna get a hot arranged wife as a psych attending

 

[Arkangeloid]

go into IM ark

you aren't gonna get a hot arranged wife as a psych attending

I just feel horrible that my decision between specialties possibly might come down to this.