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I feel so bad for each and every one of you.

Discussion in 'Pre-Pharmacy' started by axelz165, Dec 5, 2017.

  1. axelz165

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    For the student who couldnt hack med school applications so they chose pharmacy.

    For the child who's parent's pressured them into having a "higly paid" "prestigious" profession.

    For the follower who is just "going along" with what all their friends are doing.

    For the greedy that are in it for the money.

    For that starry-eyed poor soul who just wants to "help people".

    For to that one in a million person who actually loves pharmacy.

    This is NOT the profession you think it is. Please choose another profession; ANYTHING. Shadow a retail pharmacist, follow them around and ASK them how they feel about their job and whether they'd go go into pharmacy had they known what they know now. Better yet get a job in a retail pharmacy.

    Do not go into this based on the lies schools tell you. They only want you money and absolutely nothing else. They dont care about your dreams or your aspirations or the profession at all.. If they did they'd all willingly close their doors.
     
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  3. chemistpharmd

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    Actually I applied to pharmacy school after talking with Pharmacists and pharmacy students, and they all love what they are doing.
     
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  4. steveysmith54

    steveysmith54 Member

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    You must have talked to them 10 yrs ago, at least
     
  5. stoichiometrist

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    This thread needs to be stickied. Pre-pharms are getting played when they're proud of their "privilege" to sign away $200k+ in loans to go to pharmacy school.
     
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  6. SpartanDOnoharm

    Pharmacist Gold Donor Classifieds Approved

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    Don't forget that there are more areas of pharmacy besides retail. It's not all doom and gloom everywhere.
     
  7. jhawkins16

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    What's up with all the hate against Pharmacy students? Some of us actually think it's interesting and feel that it is a way we can work in the background so to speak in the healthcare arena.
     
  8. UGAZ

    UGAZ SDN Gold Donor
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    Unfortunately, that's where most jobs are.
     
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  9. PharmDgirl7

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    My point exactly! People know finding a job in pharmacy will be tough but if it’s their passion then let them be. I get trying to warn people but gosh at the end of the day everyone is going to do what they want to do. It’s their life, their money :)
     
  10. BigBoss

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    Well, it’s not their money, it’s the government’s money.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  11. GypsyHummus

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    I mean, what else are you sopposed to do with a worthless biology undergraduate degree with a GPA around the 2.8-3.2 mark?

    4 years of schooling for a 110k job seems like a pretty good gig. I know people say that it’s hard to find full time employment and whatnot, but if you are willing to relocated to rural areas I would think there is a demand.
     
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  12. Igra

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    I love your post, mostly because of what I found when I looked at your post history.

    Making fun of people because they couldn't hack med school applications so they chose pharmacy? Your post history seems to suggest that you had to choose pharmacy because of your low GPA, you even made a post in the past thinking about switching to dental and asked what people thought about your GPA, you even knew that pharmacy was becoming saturated and still pushed forward with it?

    your post to scare people off is just full of hypocrisy and is really just sickening. This is NOT the profession we think it is? enlighten us oh wise one? I've worked in pharmacy for years now and I'm well aware of what pharmacy is about. Are you trying to scare people off of pharmacy because you want better job prospects? or whats the deal here? I think pharmacy is not the profession YOU thought it was when you got in it and probably regret doing so. But then again, what do I know? I'm just a starry eyed poor soul that wants to help people and I love pharmacy, but couldn't get into med school.
     
  13. BigBoss

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    If you know what the job market's like then why would you apply? Look at other health professions that aren't saturated.
     
  14. stoichiometrist

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    I have to show you a dose of reality here...

    [​IMG]
     
  15. Igra

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    You're about just as bad as OP stoichiometrist, another pharmacy kiddo who knew the field was saturated but still went in to the field anyways, did you even know anything about pharmacy beforehand? I saw a previous post saying you shadowed a pharmacist, but did you work as a tech or anything? I would wager you're one of the people who googled "high paying jobs" and closed your eyes and pointed to one randomly and it happened to be pharmacy. Why did you choose pharmacy knowing it was saturated? I'm curious what area of pharmacy are you working in right now? You try so hard to convince people not to get in to pharmacy, which isn't necessarily wrong, but that manner that you go about doing it is just deplorable, wrong, and effortless.

    I like your little pie chart though, it's pretty cute. I thought about loading up microsoft paint and making a chart of my own with whatever stats I wanted, but realized the effort was far more than I cared to put in. Clearly you did put in some effort when you made it up though so kudos to that, thing about facts is you should try and back them up. A quick google search only yields your post of this same chart on reddit in another attempt to frighten people with your made up facts, a couple of people even asked for the source of this chart, you failed to produce it for them though (not surprising). I joined this forum as a means to connect and read about peoples experiences in many aspects of pharmacy, but really there just seems to be too many trolls like you that contribute very little to these forums and really hurt them more than help. You're a graduate student, a doctor, act like one.
     
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  17. Igra

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    Honestly dude, if I didn't have the experience and connections that I currently have from my like 6 years of working experience as a technician, I would totally get my BSN and CRNA. The thing is that I have a great history with all my previous/current pharmacy colleagues, and I would be able to get a job with ease upon graduation. If this weren't the case then I totally would look elsewhere. I work at a teaching hospital as a technician currently and my director, my manager, and the resident coordinator all love me, and they know I'm a great worker. The other part of the puzzle bro, I just enjoy the work. I probably have more of an idea of what pharmacy is about than 98% of pharmacy applicants/students, and in my experience, the best pharmacists are the ones who were previously technicians.

    I'd really like to see the ones that are posting with intent to drive students away from pharmacy answer this question, because it appears they also fell in to the same category of knowing pharmacy was becoming saturated, but they proceeded with pharmacy school anyways, and now they post trying to scare away people?
     
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  18. UGAZ

    UGAZ SDN Gold Donor
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    There is no point/intention to drive students away from the profession. Be very clear about this. I think stoichiometrist wants to show incoming/pre-pharm students the reality about market saturation. However, if the students already make up their own minds, nothing you can do about it. For exam, if my parents have an established pharmacy, and after graduation I just take over the store...it's a very clear situation. Or say, your brother is the CEO of a hospital and of course he can offer you a job after graduation. However, the majority isn't so. A lot of students don't know what they get themselves into...then regret during pharmacy schools...wasting seats, wasting time, money. Also, a lot of new pharmacists who didn't like the profession and just want to enter for quick money...ending up disappointment...or even if having jobs, ending up killing or harming patients. These people are NO NO for the profession...I type too quickly, please excuse typo, grammar.
     
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  19. Igra

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    UGAZ, I completely understand what you're saying, and my argument towards OP and stoichiometrist isn't what they're doing, it's how they're doing it. I do believe perspective students should at least know and understand that the market isn't ideal right now. I've talked to people that said they chose pharmacy because of googling "top paying jobs" and that drives me up the wall.

    There is a right and a wrong way to do things I think you would agree? There are plenty of well thought out, respectful, and factual posts on these forums about the saturation of pharmacy. I think anyone browsing these forums would be blind to miss these posts. In this thread OP is just belittling people, while having contradicting posts in other threads that make his whole post riddled with hypocrisy. As far as stoichiometrist behavior goes it's not much better either. If you look at his last 20 posts, how many of them mention 200k debt? the majority right? Now he is not technically wrong by saying you can go 200k into debt with pharmacy school, but hes not necessarily right either. There are schools that are 12k a year and some that are 40k a year, the people who pick the 12k schools I bet aren't going to be 200k in debt right? His pie chart that he just posted too? I honestly wouldn't be surprised if he made that himself. A reverse image search only shows that image on one other site, reddit, and it's posted by him. People even asked for the source of the data, but it wasn't provided.

    You want to educate and inform perspective pharmacy students about the poor job market situation at hand go ahead, but when a member of the community posts asking for advice/tips and stoichiometrist responds to the post with
    Is that okay to you? seems pretty trollish to me.

    I think people like stoichiometrist and axelz165 are making childish posts and should be held to a higher standard by this community and themselves.
     
  20. Opticalfuture

    Opticalfuture Opticqueen

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    What about optometry? Because i really want to do that
     
  21. Modest_anteater

    Modest_anteater Certified Brainlet.

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    This is actually a very beautifully written post. Thank you for your contributions and please students thinking about joining the pharmacy occupation read this.
     
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  22. I’m attending a pharmacy school which has 140 students in the class. I’ve asked many of my classmates why they’re going for pharmacy and their answer is that they don’t know what to do or what else to study, especially after graduating with a bachelor’s degree in biochem.
    Pharmacy school is easy for them to get in.
     
  23. GypsyHummus

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    What else are you going to do with a worthless biology degree?

     
  24. Yes.
    And also to some of them, between paying 100k or 200k for pharmacy school, there’s no difference because a total student loan (undergrad and grad) of 200k vs 300k plus accumulated interest will end up the same: they will pay back 10% of their adjusted gross income for 20 years...
     
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  25. GypsyHummus

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    I mean, if the average pharmacist makes 75-80K take home, thats like what, 6.5K/month? Live off of 2K/month and throw the rest at debt, around 54K/year in debt repayment. Lets say I have 200K in debt after pharmacy school, plus intrest every year so around 250K-270K. Im debt free in 5 years.

    Alas, most people wont take the 2K/month challenge. Before I entered school, I was living off of about 1.6k/month. I didnt have money to travel or do fun stuff, but I was able to eat and pay bills. Rented movies from the library a lot, lots of free activities like walking or hiking.



     
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  26. jhawkins16

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    Has it really gotten that bad?
     
  27. PangoPillPusher

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    Yes. Yes it has.

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
     
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  28. cpht2089

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    ^^^ one in a million person who loves pharmacy.

    ^^^ has worked in retail pharmacy for nearly 4 years.
     
  29. cpht2089

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    I bought a small home a few years ago with a payment of $650/month. I make $21/hr as a pharmacy tech, and will work through school, so my house will be nearly paid off by the time I graduate. I grew up poor and I know how to live on next to nothing. So the student loans don't intimidate me. I already plan to live on the bare minimum after graduation, and to throw all of my money at my loans until they are paid off. I have a lot of connections in pharmacy across the state I live in so I'm not worried about being unemployed.

    I love my job, but being a technician just isn't enough for me. Having grown up in poverty, I obviously want to make more money. But I do have a true passion for the field.
     
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  30. GypsyHummus

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    If you don’t get doc-itis and start buying new BMWs and a fancy new house and develops expensive tastes after pharamacy school and are committed to paying off debt, I say go for it.

    Get into the cheapest pharmacy school you can. If you got a state school go there. Or a 3 year program.

     
  31. CetiAlphaFive

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    Axel just got dunked on super hard.
     
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  32. Gombrich12

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    They aren't taking into account the 4 years of their life they have to spend in a pharmacy school to maybe get a job with poor working conditions. Even if I was offered a full ride to a pharmacy school I would turn it down at this point.
     
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  33. GypsyHummus

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    Eh, I wouldn’t go so far as to say pharmacists have poor working conditions. Yes, it’s a lot of standing, but we have AC, heating, and 20% of stuff at CVS sometimes.

    Beats working in Alaska at sub zero temps on an oil rig.

     
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  34. Gombrich12

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    I like the standing part of the job, that's never bothered me. What I don't like about the job most of all is that reimbursement has fallen so much for prescriptions that we get barely any help. You're running around all day at 95% effort with no lunch and not a minute to think. Also working nights, weekends, holidays gets old after a few years. I also hate the metrics we are pushed to meet and the telemarketing calls we have to make. Retail used to be ok about 10 years ago, its changed so much that I can't see why anyone would willingly go into it.
     
  35. GypsyHummus

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    Do you get time and a half for holidays?

     
  36. Gombrich12

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    Nope, but I don't want to work holidays period.
     
  37. FinallyOnTrack

    FinallyOnTrack Pharm.D Candidate

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    So I have worked in the pharmacy for 10 years now - I absolutely love the field and what all it entails. This is exactly why I decided on going to pharmacy school - and have been accepted into South College in Knoxville, TN. I debated DO school before applying to Pharmacy school and decided pharmacy is what I truly enjoy - I don’t care about making the tons of money (which is slowly going away) - I just want to be able to keep doing what I enjoy.
     
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  38. Wasting several years of schooling happens to anyone who wants to switch major or career, like from biochem to pharmacy. So they don't mind spending 3 more years.
    I'm in 3-year program. Getting in very easy compared to 5-10 years ago. And guess what? Tests are super easy compared to old tests they had 5-10 years ago. School doesn't want anyone to fail. I see there are many low quality students in my class.
    I don't know much about poor working condition. We do internship one day every 2 weeks at a retail pharmacy on our first year.
    I don't know between a retail pharmacy job and a biochem job, which one is better overall.


     
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  39. GypsyHummus

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    Of course schools dont want to fail out students. Thats only 50K compared to 200K! (or in the case of 3 years, 150K)

     
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  40. stoichiometrist

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    Every other pre-pharm thinks the same way. "I have x experience, y talent, and z connections. I'm better than everyone else so saturation won't affect me."

    It's sayings like these why it's hard to take pre-pharms seriously when you think you know more than others, especially practicing pharmacists, about pharmacy and even *gasp* how to act like a graduate student, a doctor!
     
  41. CetiAlphaFive

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    I don't mean this as an insult, but, in my personal experience at my school, only the weakest "pre-everything" students ended up in optometry after being rejected by literally everything else
     
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  42. Igra

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    I appreciate the response post like 3 weeks later? Every single post you've made here makes it hard to take you seriously and makes you look totally ignorant. I'm sorry you don't like pharmacy as much as you thought. Your posts are just asinine though and have no factual basis behind anything you claim, and in this case? Yes, I do know more than you, I've been working in pharmacy for longer than you and in more varied settings, and you're just a terrible troll, but hey, at least I know to hit you with a hot block because you haven't contributed anything to anything here so I appreciate that insight.
     
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  43. GypsyHummus

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    This.

    Although, I was a pretty weak student, I would never go anywhere near OD at this point do to the saturation levels. Id go Podiatry before OD or PharmD.

     
  44. BidingMyTime

    BidingMyTime Lost Shaker Of Salt

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    His chart was spot on. The vast majority of pharmacists work in retail, then a significant minority work as hospital staff. Very, very few pharmacists work in of the esoteric "other areas" of pharmacy. People who aren't willing to work retail, should not go into pharmacy, because changes are that is where their job opportunities will be.

    Definitely don't go into pharmacy. The vast majority of pharmacists in any area are working holidays. Lots and lots of holidays.

    You say this like it's a good thing. Getting passed through pharmacy school is no guarentee that you ever be a pharmacist. Look at all the "Failed NAPLEX" threads, many of them from people who have multiply failed NAPLEX. You should want a tough school that will teach you everything you need to pass NAPLEX.
     
  45. Hello2000

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    It's people like Ingra that are bad for pharmacy. The blinkered vision of how wonderful it is does nobody any favours. The brown nose and knee pad brigade have no place in pharmacy. I've been a pharmacist for over 25years and stoichiometry is right. "I have x experience, y talent, and z connections. I'm better than everyone else so saturation won't affect me." This is totally correct. I did well out of pharmacy and I get kids asking me to mentor them and ask advice on entering pharmacy school. I always turn them down as I don't want to encourage them. 20 years ago I would always invite them in to have a look around.

    My advice, become an airline pilot. 1 year of training, $75k, in a job after a year, air travel is expanding, pilot shortage, golden hello, $80k a year, no phonecalls on flight deck, and great view from the office window.
     
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  46. Melazine

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    I wish people would not make fun of this post. This is a serious issue for some of us. I graduated in 2016, I had a few offers, but none at the city I want to be in. I was sooo lucky to have found an inpatient job because of someone my parents know. My pay is way below average, I make less than $90,000 a year (including tax). It's in a rural area with 20,000 people. My study buddies all went into retail, and we all had to relocate. One of them is still looking for jobs ever since graduation. She has this mentality that she will eventually find a job in the big city she comes from, but it will only get harder and harder for her. Another friend just became a house wife instead.

    I really hope the job market gets better, because we are having a lot more graduates every year. The job demand and supply is severaly unbalanced. It may be easy for those who are smart, outgoing to find jobs in a matter of days, but it will take a lot longer for others. I have been trying find a new place to work since last year, and I have applied hundreds of places, and I have not heard anything back. I feel that I'm smarter than others, more hard working than others, but as you can see, it really doesn't matter.
     
  47. Dalteparin

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    LOL at that. If you want to work banker's hours, go be a banker. If you want to be a pharmacist, plan on working everything except banker's hours.
     
  48. lhs9696

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    Honestly, you can have your opinion but I dont believe that pharmacy is the worst field to go into.
    Yes, it is a very saturated field but part of it is to blame those random schools who keep on making easy to get into pharmacy schools and admitting students who shouldn't even be a pharmacist.
    I believe that the only reason you should go into pharmacy is if you have a true passion for it and that you will succeed. I have a **** ton of friends who graduated last spring from the best pharmacy schools and ALL got good paying jobs or residencies. So if you want to go into pharmacy, aim for a better school as well. Someone like me though of going MD/DO but I don't like a lot of aspects about that field. I have friends who have gotten into many different types of pharmacy jobs, so I think you should not try to scare people off. I shadowed many clinical pharmacists and I think that is a great job!
     
  49. Of course clinical pharmacist is a great job. Finding that job at where you live is a nightmare especially when you have 200k debt @ interest rate of 7%.
    What's the chance that you, future graduates, can get a job you want? This is why it's a very bad field when you can study others.
     
    #47 EastBay80, Jan 6, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 6, 2018
  50. lhs9696

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    I mean i know this sounds cocky, but for me it might be different. I am not paying for my graduate school education and I also live somewhere with a constant need for clinical pharmacists. I personally do not like other fields. I never wanted to be a PA, MD, eye doctor, etc. I like this field and I dont care what others say
     
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  51. I don't talk about the 1%. I'm talking about the general. (I, too, go into this field because I'm different from most people. My parents pay for my tuition and I don't have to work if I don't want to.) But most of my classmates are not the same as I. As long as they're ok to work at retails and to relocate, I think, new grads are ok for now.
     
    #49 EastBay80, Jan 7, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 7, 2018
  52. chemistpharmd

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    I can't believe you guys!!! Other people in the other majors who study way more than you (PhD student) have to relocate from one state to another state to get a job for 60k. Then you are unsatisfied with Pharmacy because you have to go one hour away from your city? unbelievable! It is still easier to a get a job with pharmacy more than most other majors. If you don't like your jobs, quit! It is not late.
     
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