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I got a 7, 13, 12, and need advice. Do I need to retake?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by Premed2003, Jun 7, 2002.

  1. Premed2003

    Premed2003 Senior Member
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    I am so disappointed with this terrible 7. My overall is 32, which would be great if only it were balanced. Or, does it not matter if it's balanced? What are top med schools going to think? Are they going to think I don't know English? I'm a native English speaker...I don't understand what I did wrong.

    I have a 3.8 from princeton. I have great clinical experience, leadership etc. I want to get into a top school because I've worked so hard...if I just go to my state school, then all of my work was for nothing...I could have had fun in college instead of studying so much. My goal has been to go to a top 10(ish) school and I was on my way until I saw that 7. I didn't think I would get into every top school, but at least 1 I figured...Do you think this 7 is going to be a huge red flag? Or will some admissions committees think that this 85 minute period doesn't show what i can do? I don't think this 7 represents me since I got 11s on practice tests!!! But I don't want to destroy my summer by studying every day again. I'm so burnt out from April.

    but if I don't take it again, I'm always going to second guess...maybe I'll still have a chance at top 10ish schools, but then again maybe I'll get rejected and end up at my state school (which is really a bad state school). My whole life I'll wonder...what if?

    but then I remember how torturous the MCAT is.

    Please help. Does anyone know of people who have gotten a 7 on verbal and gotten into harvard or hopkins or stanford or the like? Please help
     
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  3. sunflower79

    sunflower79 Plays well with knives
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    What is the problem with you people. Things happen and of course you know English. I hate repeating myself, so read the "advice urgently needed" thread. Sheesh.

    Besides, I hate this snooty attitude about a non-top 10 school not being good enough for people. Medical school is medical school and even people who go to the middle-tier schools end up in academia at UCSF. So get a life, people, and stop fussing.
     
  4. scootad.

    scootad. Senior Member
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    I agree, do you wanna be a doctor or do you wanna be able to impress people by saying "I went to Hopkins"? Its an accomplishment to get into any U.S. medical school and it all leads to the same degree. Most people dont give a sh!t where you went to medical school and certainly your patients wont.

    I would not retake the MCAT if I were in your shoes. You have stellar stats besides that 7.
    Good luck in getting into a medical school.
     
  5. superdood68

    superdood68 Senior Member
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    i think you #s are pretty good because your ECs are good. by all means, apply!!
     
  6. Kazzar

    Kazzar Psychiatrist
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    Yeah I agree with Sunflower. All I hear is "Waa waaa waaaaaaaaa." You'll be a doctor. So you aren't going to Stanford or Yale, big whoop! The only reason you would want to go there is for the prestigue. There are plenty of non-top-10 schools with lots of resources to make you a great doctor.

    And you're from Princeton (and you let this fact be known, like it makes you better somehow)? It figures. I am sure you didn't go there to have a well-rounded education and to mature and become a wise person.

    You'll be a doctor. It might be harder to get that dermatology or neurosurgery residency, but people rarely go into those fields unless they want to be the best or they want the money. (Although, to prevent flames, I am sure there are plenty of altruistic dermatologists and neurosurgeons, don't get me wrong).
     
  7. paean

    paean Senior Member
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    What did you get on the writing section? I know that it has the reputation of not mattering, but a low verbal score can be partially offset (in the minds of some admissions committees) by a decent writing score.

    You probably won't get into a "top ten" school with a 7. But if you think that you can still get into your state school, you're in excellent shape. I know many state schools where the average MCAT is above a 32, and where a 7 would make it difficult to be accepted. What many applicants don't realize is that the schools that look at the overall picture of an applicant, and are willing to accept someone with a blemish of some sort (which is most applicants, you are not alone) are often private, and many are considered top tier. State schools are frequently no less picky, and my experience is that many are more rigid about applicants being above some mythical cut-off.
     
  8. scootad.

    scootad. Senior Member
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    And I'm not so sure how much harder it would be to get that derm or neurosurgery residency. Assuming you rock your boards and classes you can get any residency you want I would think coming from a U.S. medical school.
     
  9. DOtobe

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    I agree with scootad. The most important people in a doctor's life (besides their own family) are their patients, and patients could care less where you went to school. I have no idea where my doctor went to school, and frankly I don't care. It's nice to want to get into a great school, but you will be a doctor whether you go to Hopkins or the smallest medical school in the world. I can understand wanting to get into a "good" school with all the hard work you've done, but applying in itself is hard. Some people luck out in the process, and some only get accepted to one school, and a lot don't get accepted at all. My doctor's son had an awesome GPA and MCAT scores from an ivy league school (Dartmouth, to be exact), and guess where he got in? NOWHERE. I guess he is now reapplying.

    I guess what I'm saying is that the whole application process is one big crapshoot, and even the people with the 4.0 GPAs and the 45 on the MCAT don't get in sometimes. Don't retake the MCAT. You've proven you can do well in the classroom. And plus, do you really want to go through all that stress again? I retook it because I had to, and I can tell you first hand that studying in the summer SUCKS!

    Good luck to you. :D
     
  10. paean

    paean Senior Member
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    The truth is if you didn't "work so hard" you probably wouldn't get in anywhere, even with a better verbal score. If you think that you somehow deserve to get one of the ~1200 spots at the "top ten" schools because you worked hard, you are sorely mistaken. Who gets one of those spots is somewhat of a crapshoot, with luck and having something stand out in your profile as valuable as hard work. To assume that you are in the 97th percentile of applicants (assuming 40K apply) is pretty arrogant. I doubt that you worked harder that that many people. As hard, sure, I don't know you, and you certainly could have, but harder?

    In answer to your question, talk to your premed advisor about what you want and where she thinks you have a reasonable chance of getting in. Unless you are set on going to Harvard and the like, I wouldn't bother retaking the MCAT unless you have to re-apply.
     
  11. MRF1366

    MRF1366 Been Here Long Time
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    You know, it's posts like this one that make me SO damn glad that I partied my ass off, studied abroad, and basically had the time of my life in college. Sure, I got a 3.4, and was stoked at my 30 MCAT. But you know what? I'm a third year med student at a top 50 (no not top ten) school. And you know what that means? That means that me and my pathetic 3.4, earned while having the time of my life, will be an MD in less than 2 years.

    So you can take your sob story about not getting into a top ten, and realize that it is actually a sob story about how you should have had more fun during those 4 years of college, instead of gunning for some goal that makes no real difference.

    Those of you still in college, learn from this.
     
  12. The Fly

    The Fly Senior Member
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    </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by MRF1366:
    <strong>You know, it's posts like this one that make me SO damn glad that I partied my ass off, studied abroad, and basically had the time of my life in college. Sure, I got a 3.4, and was stoked at my 30 MCAT. But you know what? I'm a third year med student at a top 50 (no not top ten) school. And you know what that means? That means that me and my pathetic 3.4, earned while having the time of my life, will be an MD in less than 2 years. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I find it remarkable that you seem to think that studying hard and partying hard are mutually exclusive -- they most certainly are not.

    It's posts like this that really piss me off, when someone like yourself is interested in rationalizing why they're not in a school that they wish they were -- indeed, if you were truly so happy with your decision to party at the expense of doing well in school (and on the mcat), then I seriously doubt you would have presented your case in the manner in which you did (that is, oozing insecurity).

    I know a GREAT MANY people that had wonderful times in college and did not let that come at the expense of their work -- indeed, while you will certainly be a doc in two years, if you rationalize your 'decision' every chance you get, you're just going to be tipping off everyone to the reality that you truly have doubts about your undergrad years.

    Putting down others for working hard to get into their dream schools is the saddest condemnation I can conceive and nobody should learn from you. Your assertions are completely absurd and needlessly inflammatory to those, like myself, who were able to strike a wonderful balance.
     
  13. diego

    diego Junior Member
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    Premed2003,

    I'm not sure why everyone is coming down on you so harshly for your high asppirations. Yes it may get old for those who have been answering these types of questions for awhile, but many of us here have been in a similar situation with similar (and valid) concerns. I totally can sympathize with your position as I am also from princeton, and I also did worse than I ever expected on the verbal section. All I can say is that you definitely have a good shot at top schools, depending on your ECs and application. Definitely talk to Dr. Notterman about your concerns, but just to give you an idea, I got into 3 Top tens with a 8V,12B,13P and 3.7 so don't worry too much about it. There are also certain top tens that seem to love our school, so maybe you want to take that into consideration as well. I agree with everyone else here who are saying that getting into a top ten isn't everything, but that is no reason to give up on them if that is your aspiration. Good luck and feel free to PM me if you have anymore questions.
     
  14. BlueJayBill

    BlueJayBill Member
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    if going to a top 10 is what motivates you, so be it.

    Frankly, yes a 7 will be a red flag. Anything really below a 9 is almost a far gone conclusion for these schools (maybe except for Hopkins since they really dont put that much emphasis on the MCAT or if you come from a disadvantaged background-- your modesty tells otherwise).

    If your sole goal was to go for a top 10, then retake, and try to get 10 and above on verbal.

    You can still go to medical school, which is an accomplishment in of itself.

    Ok I can't hold it in much longer..
    I tried to be nice, I really did

    going to pricenton in of itself entitles you to ****. most people work what they get for. On top of that ur attitude is disgusting.. let me try putting you down, which you have done to others...

    1. 3.8 from princeton is pretty unspectualr other than its a 3.8, not because its P-ton -- why? - rampant grade inflation -- the fact that your classes are generally coasts. I could gone to a less pompous school and my grades would have actually meant something more.

    2. you have eating clubs, and i'm guessing you belong to one. That in of itself isnt a bad thing, it's that your a pompous stereotypical epitome of an eating club member.

    Oh guys I wish I could have gone to princeton, where i could do no work and have lots of fun. Also, I prolly wouldn't have had to waste all tha time studying for the SATs!

    (Please note the intended sarcasm)

    This princeton guy sucks.
     
  15. DesiDentist

    DesiDentist G. S. Khurana, DMD, MBA
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    I wouldn't want you being my doctor. Lots of people would give anything to go to their state school...with that kind of attitude I bet you'll get rejected.

    Stop whining and try again if you want it so much.

    DesiDentist
     
  16. diego

    diego Junior Member
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    I'm sorry dude, but I couldn't help but respond. It's really sad to hear people like you somehow try to make going to a school like princeton sound like a bad thing. i don't know if you did want to get into princeton and couldn't, or just wrote of princeton from the beginning because of your ill-conceived notions about the school, but let me help you out-you're just plain wrong. All I tried to do is give a little encouragement to someone who was getting battered for a concern that many premeds have. No one said going to princeton means that you deserve anything. But being a princeton grad I know for a fact that it does open up a lot of doors. So why don't you just chill out, enjoy the fact that you got into school, and wish this pre med good luck like i did. and don't talk about a school that you have no clue about and start making wild assumptions about people based on that. it's really petty
     
  17. HanSolo

    HanSolo Member
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    Easy people :) The man/lady(?) is feeling pretty down already...There's nothing wrong with people gunning for Harvard Med or Hopkins and feeling dejected if somehow their chances greatly diminishe <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> One is certainly entitled to dream "big."
    Premed03, you just might as well give it a shot. Who knows?? With scores like yours it is do-able to get in Top 10 schools (have heard of people getting in with score like yours provided they had other stellar credentials), however it's certainly an exception not the general rule.
     
  18. Mr. H

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    I agree this princeton guy needs to calm down, but I think most everyone who has responded have been bashing him, and that's just as worse. People, its plain rude to say "I hope he never is my doctor", this guy may have this idealized version of what he wants, but that's just it, its HIS. So everyone just calm down, and give CONSTRUCTIVE criticism.
     
  19. MRF1366

    MRF1366 Been Here Long Time
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    </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by The Fly:
    <strong> It's posts like this that really piss me off, when someone like yourself is interested in rationalizing why they're not in a school that they wish they were.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Actually, I was accepted to, and am attending my top choice school.

    It may surprise some of you that not everybody's top choices coincide with what US News Magazine considers to be the best schools in the country.

    As for balancing school and social life, I think examples like mine prove that it can be done.
     
  20. brickmanli

    brickmanli Senior Member
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    If you think you can do better on the verbal (or you did much better on the diagnostics), then by all means take the test again. It looks like that you have the capability, and maybe you panicked on the verbal section or something.

    I made a wise decision in taking the MCAT again last August despite advice to the contrary by my friends and professors. It was an increase of only 2 points, but that made a huge difference, which is usually the case when you're gunning for those highly competitive schools.

    One summer of studying again for the MCAT is worth it considering how pissed off you'd be if you don't get into your dream school. To a lesser ambitious person I would tell him/her the opposite.
     
  21. C3PO

    C3PO Junior Member

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    Premed2003,

    I have wanted to be a doctor my whole life and would have been willing to go to Mexico to get my degree (if I could have talked my wife into it). However, I also wanted to attend the best medical school possible, I think that is only normal. Anyway, here are my scores: Biol 10, Phys 8, VR 13-15 (I don't even remember what I got on the writing sample, but it was somewhere in the middle). I have a 3.8 gpa from a state school in Utah. I have a lot of extra-curricular activies and leadership and some pretty good research and shadowing experience.

    I tried to get advice from my counselor on where to apply and she was zero help. So I applied to a whole range. I was offered interviews at Harvard, Johns Hopkins, Dartmouth, Penn State, Utah, Medical College of Wisconsin, OHSU, MCV, Creighton, St. Louis, and NYMC. I only went to some of them and was offered a spot at Dartmouth, St. Louis, and Utah; in addition to waitlist positions at Johns Hopkins and NYMC. I was not even offered a secondary from Stanford, and all that the Mayo accepted in addition to the AMCAS was more money.

    So, the point was not to share my whole life history or to brag, but to prove a point. I think that every school is different and they all focus on different aspects of your application. I think that Mayo and Stanford may have automatically ruled me out on the low MCAT score. So do some research and apply to the schools that you like, I think that your scores are more than adequate. Good luck.
     
  22. paean

    paean Senior Member
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    Gower on medical gold said that verbal scores were abnormally low across the board this year. Lots of 6's and 7's. So maybe your situation isn't as bad as it seems.
     
  23. paean

    paean Senior Member
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    Gower on medical gold said that verbal scores were abnormally low across the board this year. Lots of 6's and 7's. So maybe your situation isn't as bad as it seems.
     
  24. jot

    jot

    isn't it statistically determined? wouldn't that mean there are probably the same proportional #. i dunno, not relevent though.
    -jot
     
  25. Premed2003

    Premed2003 Senior Member
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    You know...why are you being so mean?

    First of all, how could you know anything about Princeton unless you've gone there? There is no grade inflation...this is only in humanities courses at HARVARD...not Princeton. When you have the brightest students in the world at a school, you're competing against each other. It's extraodinarily hard to get As here because everyone works hard and is capable of getting As. People do not party all day long and skip classes...everyone is very conscientious. So please don't make wild assumptions about a school because you might have been rejected there for college, or whatever your reason is. It's sad what is happening in this thread. Before tonight, I thought this board had wonderful, kind people. Now, I think this board is overflowing with terrible, cruel people.

    Thank you Diego for your kind post. And it's very interesting what you say about Medical Gold's Gower saying that the verbal scores are low this year. Does anyone know why? So would a 7 this year be equal to like a 9 in normal years? And would med schools know this?

    I have q on writing...does this make a difference? At what point in the writing scale does the writing make up for the rest?

    Thanks to those kind people on this board...and please don't respond if you're cruel.
     
  26. Zulq

    Zulq Senior Member
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    Hi Premed, :)

    I would suggest that you retake... I know, MCAT is such a pain, but it'll be a smaller task focussing hard mostly on the verbal next time (what happened on the real test: did you not complete all the questions, or did you just get too many wrong? maybe practice speed reading and passage analysis, and do more simulated verbal sections over the summer).

    To make it easier, don't drag your preparation out over the entire summer, maybe start intense prep just a month before, and save yourself some work by making sure you retain the basic science over the summer by periodic review (your science scores are already amazing! :D I wouldn't fret over trying to match those, prepare yourself mentally to be satisfied with breaking 11 or 12 on those sections on the retake, b/c adcoms should take account of your highest score in the section. Your focus is on verbal, verbal, verbal now. But I'm sure that by maintaining your current knowledge base somewhat over the summer, you will repeat those science scores without much difficulty :) )

    Another reason you should retake is b/c I don't think a stellar writing score will compensate for the verbal comprehension part of the test to any adcom.

    P.S. I think all the negative reactions above were unreasonable, however keep in mind that people on the board don't know you in real life. Your concerns are very valid, IMO perhaps you should have just stated the situation without adding certain keywords to describe your feelings of distress that could have been perceived as undue whining. Keep your head and hopes up and I wish you the best! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
     
  27. Blazed

    Blazed Senior Member
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    This top ten school **** irritates me. Man be happy to get into a med school. You are not going to be a doctor to impress people, you should be doing it to have the privledge of practicing medicine and making a difference in peoples lives. If you get into any school in the US feel blessed and be happy.
     
  28. Human_Genome

    Human_Genome Member
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    here is my 2 cents,

    retake it only, and i mean ONLY if you are confident and sure that you can improve your verbal score. (to at least a 9) i know numerous examples when ppl decide to retake it and end up with the same score again. if you have tried your best (which i assumed you did because you said you were burned out), i say go ahead and apply
     
  29. MRF1366

    MRF1366 Been Here Long Time
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    I appologize for being mean. Studying for boards has me a bit grumpy.

    In all honesty, if you feel you can do better, take the MCAT again. But I think enjoying the summer sounds like a better plan.

    Oh, and do yourself a favor and go to the school that you feel most comfortable at - NOT the school who's name looks best on your diploma.

    J-
     
  30. Premed2003

    Premed2003 Senior Member
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    Thanks guys for your nice posts <img border="0" alt="[Clappy]" title="" src="graemlins/clappy.gif" />

    If I were to *yikes* retake it, could I hold my score during the August administration and only release it if I do better?
     
  31. Premed2003

    Premed2003 Senior Member
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    Oh shoot. No wonder people are being so mean to me. I just reread my post and see that yesterday the way I wrote it is not the way I intended it to sound.

    I said I'm an Ivy Leaguer with a 3.8 to say that I have a 3.8 from an Ivy League school, which is given more weight than a 3.8 from Podunk State. I wanted to say my GPA, great extracurriculars, etc. to ask if this 7 is going to ruin me. Or would the admissions people see this 7 as something that doesn't accurately represent me and just look at everything else without giving much consideration to the 7? That's the only reason that I included that my school is an Ivy League school...just to go along with my GPA! Next time I should reread my posts <img border="0" alt="[Pity]" title="" src="graemlins/pity.gif" />
     
  32. Laura JC

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    Many of us realize that attending a top ten medical school does not make you a better doctor. However, if you go to a top ten school, you probably don't have to get the best scores in your class to qualify for a great residency. Perhaps you think that you NEED to get into a top ten school, since you can't COUNT on doing very well on your scores, now that you see yourself in comparison with non-Ivy League (translate: regular) people on the MCAT? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
    To be fair though, I see that you are trying to correct that impression (your reference to 'Podunk State' aside). Good luck with the shocks yet to come as you apply, regardless of whether or not you sit again for the MCAT. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
     
  33. Premed2003

    Premed2003 Senior Member
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    Laura..please, you don't know me so why are you trying to put words into my mouth?

    I see you enjoy telling everyone that you got a 13-15 on your verbal, so I'd say you're bragging. I'm not bragging by saying what school I went to.
     
  34. Laura JC

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    If you think I mentioned my verbal score (on another thread where it was relevant to the discussion) in order to brag, then I can see why you got a 7 on the verbal. Your reading comprehension needs a little work.
     
  35. Laura JC

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    :::sigh:::You know, I should NOT have written that just now. I apologize.
    I finally have figured out what irritated me about the original post. It's not the 'Ivy League' thing, it's not the 'top ten school' thing. It was the reference that you made about how if you had known what was in store, you would not have worked so hard to do so well in school. Maybe it's because I'm an old person, but I find that kind of remark sad and immature. I believe that there is nothing more rewarding than doing your work with everything you've got. You know what? You have a good MCAT score, you have good grades, you seem like an intelligent person. You are unhappy with your scores, but you will most likely get into medical school and become a good doctor, which is the point, right?
     
  36. Premed2003

    Premed2003 Senior Member
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    Laura, thanks for retracting your original cruel message.

    It's difficult to know people on this message board from a few paragraphs.

    In no way did I imply that I would not have worked so hard. I am saying that I worked incredibly hard (sacrificing my happiness this year due to MCAT preparation on top of course work--I had no time for happiness), and it was for nothing because this 7 is destroying my entire score.

    From the beginning of my college years, I have worked my hardest b/c I love learning. I work too hard though and don't have time for enough just plain fun. I could have settled with a 3.5 gpa or lower and gotten into my state school. My state school is one of the lowest schools in the country, so it would not be in my best interest to go there. I just don't want to end up at my state school after working so incredibly hard...just because of this terrible 7!

    Let's pretend I got a 9 on the verbal and with everything else, I would be in at top 10 School X. But the score is 7 instead of 9. Do you think they would just throw my app out because it's a 7? Do you think they will only look at this one number, or the entire package? Does anyone have experience with such a disappointing # and still get into a top school?

    Thanks.
     
  37. DrBlueDevil

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    </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Premed2003:
    <strong>Do you think they will only look at this one number, or the entire package? Does anyone have experience with such a disappointing # and still get into a top school?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Like others have suggested, you should talk to your premed advisor. Only he/she will have the experience of seeing how thousands of premeds FROM PRINCETON with all sorts of scores have faired. Obviously your 7 blows, but the rest of your app is ridiculously good. Apply to top 10 schools...you never know. I saw plenty of people with stats like yours get in to top 10 schools from Duke. And who determines top 10 for you anyway? usnews? How important to you is it that a school beats another one out because it gets, say, a hundred million dollars more one year in NIH money? Will that help you learn how to practice medicine better? If it's top 10 or bust for you, are you sure you want to deal with 100-hour work weeks treating people? You make it seem like it'd be a disaster to you if you "only" got in to a school ranked 11-20 by usnews. This kind of attitude will show through in the interviews, and it would kill your chances. Are you sure you want to be a doctor?
     
  38. saiyaman

    saiyaman Member
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    hmmm, first of all, i think part of the general reaction to your original post stems from the fact that you made it out as if you intrinsically deserved to go to a top 10 school simply because you worked hard and deserve something for it. in all fairness, it was also a very elitist post. honestly, most people i've read so far on this board seem to be hard workers, as are in general most of the people applying to med school. while i think you should be proud of what you've already done (although as to the GPA, aren't ivy league schools notorious for grade inflation?...j/k), this process is random, and that there are gonna be others who have done plenty more and plenty less than you. ultimately, the only person who has to be comfortable w/your verbal score is you, not the admissions people. if you're as strong otherwise as you imply, that 7 won't make or break you, unless it affects your own confidence enough to do so. so take it again if YOU need to.

    peace
     
  39. diego

    diego Junior Member
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    I can't believe that I come to the computer today to see that this thread is still going. PreMed2003, I defended you before when I felt that people were coming down on you unfairly, but I really think you should realize by now that the answers that you are looking for will never be satisfied by anyone on this board. No one here will be able to tell you what schools will throw away your application after seeing your 7, and which one's will give you a fair look. The truth is, with out obsessing over MCAT preparation for the entire summer, you will be hard pressed to duplicate your efforts on the science sections. Think about that before you throw away a summer that could be spent further boosting your EC's. As everyone here has said, you can get into a school with your scores, and as many (incuding myself) can attest to, you can get into a top school as well. I know you have had the best intentions in describing yourself, but I am still troubled by the way in which you have used the princeton name to justify your frustrations over seemingly blowing your chances at the top schools. in that sense, a lot of people who have responded are right. i'm as proud as you are to be a tiger, but you have to realize that it is very easy to come off as pompous when you continuously wear the name like a badge of honor that separates the haves from the have nots. At this point, it really is not as important as you might want to believe. all of these people have worked very hard, some more than you. take comfort that you had an opportunity to attend a wonderful undergraduate institution, and move on. And do not confuse my post with those who have been berating you. I'm just trying to give you some real advice.
     
  40. scootad.

    scootad. Senior Member
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    I also don't like the elitist attitude. REALITY CHECK...the top 10 schools are hardly the be all and end all. Let me tell you, you go to ANY United States medical school and you will find people with as high of a GPA as high of an MCAT score and yes even many people from PRINCETON UNIVERSITY and the other IVY LEAGUE SCHOOLS. And yes, those people worked just as hard as you did and have volunteered in Africa and were there on their dying mothers' death bed and were orphans.

    A doctor is a doctor is a doctor...
     
  41. ellerose

    ellerose Member
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    I had a friend who had a similar problem to yours a year or two ago, except I think she got a 6 on verbal. The premed advisor at our school suggested to take it again, and she focused on verbal (it wasn't her strong point to begin with) the whole summer, really changing the way she practiced for that section. It was a tough summer for her, but she pulled her verbal up to a 10. Her science scores were not hurt by this either. I have a few friends right now studying for the August MCAT, and I know it blows, but it's really up to you and what you think will make you happy in the end. To get some real advice, call up some of your top schools and point blank ask them what they think of your scores. I had another friend two years ago who totally bombed his MCAT (the August one, no less)and simply called every single school he had applied to, and they were honest with him and told him to withdraw his app, retake the test, and reapply next year (he eventually got in to an MD/PhD program starting this year). I think you should just apply right now with the scores you have. I had an overall lower score than you (28), but it was balanced, and got into most of the "top" schools I applied to. I really think they look at the overall package. If you do take it over again, just release the scores when you take the test. If some schools are actually going to wait for the scores, it could hold your app back if you wait to see them before you release them. Listen, if medicine is your absolute passion, whether it is the compassion you have for patients or the miracle of medical science, that will show through in your application and your interview. You will get in and you will be a doctor. If you are absolutely sure you want to do academia or get into a kick-ass residency or become a dean or something, then yeah, shoot for the "top 10" according to whoever. But many practicing docs will simply tell you, it doesn't really matter where you go. I know a VERY successful plastic surgeon who started out at a Carribbean school, of all places. Luckily he was able to transfer to an American school to finish his MD, but none of his patients know or care that he started his medical education at a "foreign" school. Okay, enough. Good luck whatever you decide to do.
     
  42. Michelys

    Michelys Senior Member
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    Hey Premed2003,

    Bummer--sorry about your situation. An acquaintance of mine last year was in the same situation--very bad Verbal score and great Bio and Phys scores. I, personally, would take the MCAT over again. Everyone here knows good and well how much weight adcomms place on Verbal Reasoning on the MCAT. You don't want to think later down the line in December how you didn't get an interview at that one school you worked for so badly because of a crummy 7 and your decision not to retake the MCAT. Honestly, just go attack some Princeton Review VR books and practice those non-stop everyday till August. Or why not take the Verbal Accelerator class they offer. Your GPA and stats are great--don't let the 7 be the one thing that throws you off concerning admissions! I sure wouldn't! Just keep your head up and good luck in August!

    <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> Michelys
     
  43. gbv

    gbv Member
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    premed, the first thing you may want to do is have a talk with your premed advisor, noone on this board really is qualified to give you a solid opinion on what you should do--only personal anecdotes. you may also want to take some time away from the board for a bit and think about what you truly want to do, regardless of motive, rather than allowing some negativity from some people to unnecessarily bog you down. in any case, best of luck.
     
  44. paean

    paean Senior Member
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    </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Premed2003:
    <strong>
    Let's pretend I got a 9 on the verbal and with everything else, I would be in at top 10 School X.
    </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Premed 2003, the reason you got flamed is because you say stuff like the above and that Princeton has the brightest students in the world, and that Princeton has no grade inflation.

    The first statement is not true, getting a perfect score is no guarantee of getting in ANYWHERE, and a 9 certainly isn't one either.

    That Princeton has the brightest students is the single most arrogant thing I have ever seem someone post on SDN. I know that you are probably feeling defensive (I would be in your position) and may have written that without thinking about it, but the flaming in a reaction that you at least partially brought on yourself.
     
  45. paean

    paean Senior Member
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    That there is no grade inflation at Princeton (granted there is at many schools, specifically the top private ones) is hard to accept when last year princeton's chancellor (dean? I'm sorry, I don't remember exactly who) held a press conference exclusively to talk about how serious a problem grade inflation is at Princeton. Grade inflation doesn't mean that you don't all work hard for your good grades. It just means that there are disproportionately more As and Bs than a standard bell curve would give, with a C (or even C+) as the mean.

    I understand not wanting to go to a medical school that you feel isn't what you are looking for, like your state school. We all want to go to the best school for us. There are 125 MD schools in the country. Removing the top 25 for being too score focused, 30 for not considering out of state applicants, and another 20 for being schools like your state school (bad fits for you), there are 50 schools in the country that you could reasonably expect to be considered at, and want to attend. So if you don't retake the MCAT, consider those. But if your heart is set on a top ten, definately retake the test.
     
  46. Zack90

    Zack90 Senior Member
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    Relax... from an applicant this year with a 7V, 12PS, 12BS, I had several interviews (even a few I declined), and several acceptances to chose from in the end... Only YOU can decide what's best for you. But, if I were in your shoes - talk with your premed advisor - get some facts - make a decision - then hang on to your shorts for a long bumpy ride this year. And finally, as an older soon-to-be med student, stop and enjoy life once in awhile, it's quite fun!!
     
  47. wgu

    wgu Senior Member
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    Hi all,
    I just read this thread and found it immensely interesting how much opinions can differ and the type of conflict that's here. It makes me want to inquire about how Premed was brought up and what his parents were like... no just kidding :D

    Seriously though... Premed, like I said in your MCAT section thread you should be a littttle more objective in your advice-seeking. Also try to calm down and think straight. You can reach career goals without panicing. I don't mean to be cruel but you must take other people's views into consideration when speaking in public. Also I will PM you w/ some more thoughts.
    That being said, I also don't think people should post their anger on this thread especially since he seeked advice. I mean what does that accomplish besides revealing that you react w/ emotion?
     
  48. Zeffer

    Zeffer "My dog ate em. I swear thats the truth!"
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    Premed2003,

    You are in a catch 22 situation. Your overall score is good, but obviously not what you wanted. Even if you retake the MCAT the Adcoms will see the scores from both tests. If you are absolutely certain you can rock the test next round and significantly increase your VR score to ~10 or 11 then do it.

    I would also consider applying this year to see if you find that you like a school more than your current top choices. Each school has a different personality and you might find that you would fit in/enjoy another school more (happened to me). If by chance you don't find yourself in this situation by next Dec/Jan then prep for the April MCAT.

    Of course another option is to apply anyway and retake the test in Aug. But I have no idea if that would help you or not.
     
  49. T-bruin

    T-bruin Member
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    </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Michelys:
    <strong>Hey Premed2003,

    Bummer--sorry about your situation. An acquaintance of mine last year was in the same situation--very bad Verbal score and great Bio and Phys scores. I, personally, would take the MCAT over again. Everyone here knows good and well how much weight adcomms place on Verbal Reasoning on the MCAT. You don't want to think later down the line in December how you didn't get an interview at that one school you worked for so badly because of a crummy 7 and your decision not to retake the MCAT. Honestly, just go attack some Princeton Review VR books and practice those non-stop everyday till August. Or why not take the Verbal Accelerator class they offer. Your GPA and stats are great--don't let the 7 be the one thing that throws you off concerning admissions! I sure wouldn't! Just keep your head up and good luck in August!

    <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> Michelys</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hi Michelys,

    Is a 7 really that terrible? I got a 7V,14P,11B and I was overjoyed. I got a 6V,10P,10B last April, so even though I still got a low verbal score, I was jumping for joy. I just want to get into a medical school. Is the 7 going to really keep me from that? The more I read on this forum, the more insecure I feel about my 32. Please advise. Thanks.

    P.S. Thanks for the extra feedback on my PS. You're the best!
     
  50. medname

    medname Member
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    Hey-

    You should have a booklet that you got when you applied to take the MCAT. Pay close attention to the amount of people that actually improved their scores. Sure you could bring up the 7. But what happens if you drop on the 12 and 13?? I think that it would be easier to bring up the 7 than to hold the other high two. A 12 and a 13 is pretty dang good. If you retake the MCAT, remember to study for the other two sections as well.

    Bottom line- do what you want to do.
     
  51. RT

    RT Rt
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    Dear all,

    It would be good if we all could sympathize to others' goals and aspirations even when they appear offensive. It's difficult to be in the same wavelength while having different standards, but it's certainly something we could try.

    Premed,

    Your 7 will certainly harm you, but we have no way of knowing how much since schools vary in their interpretation of your qualifications. If you're lucky, you might be able to get into top schools like Diego. However, your overall value would definitely be less attractive than if you were to have a 9+ in Verbal.

    You have several options:

    1. You could apply this year knowing that you won't have a good chance being admitted to top schools.
    2. You could apply next year knowing that you might get a better score and thus better chance of going to one of your top choices. The risk for this option is delaying a year, which is quite agonizing. You also don't know how much you could improve. However, you have another 10 months to prepare yourself.
    3. You could also apply to only schools you would be happy in attending now. Talk to your advisor to see how much would it hurt for a reapplicant applying again.

    Since you're a native and had scored 10's on your practice exams, I certainly think you could improve your Verbal. Work on your test taking skills, i.e. be calm no matter what, because if you're panic for a passage or two, that's about a point or two lower than your potential.

    And actually I admire the fact that you have worked hard for your goals and are determined to go to top institutions. Most applicants would be thrilled just to attend med schools and that's probably the reason why they're offended by your ambition. Again, people have different standards. They find it difficult to accept overachievers trying to be at the end of the food chain. What's needed is understanding and sympathy for the unfortunate in their field of thoughts. Keep your ambition and don't lower your standard at any cost. There's nothing wrong with living up to your dreams and there's certainly nothing wrong with reaching your goals through a flat straightaway rather than an uphill dirt course.

    Ultimately however becoming successful is determined by you. One can be successful by attending a decent med school, but attending a great institution would make that job much easier.

    RT

    Success comes from the cross-path of dedication and opportunity. A part of success, however, is knowing how the world works.
     

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