Idea??

[50960]

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In an attempt to foster interesting discussion and shared interests I am considering adding a sticky that would be for psychologist/students to discuss shared topics with psychiatrists/students. We share many common issues in regards to Dx, Tx, ethics, insurance issues etc.. Any feedback would help???

PS. we would not discuss RxP here.

 

[Psyclops]

I'd like it, that is if everyone could play nice.

 

[PublicHealth]

No RxP! 😱

 

[PsychEval]

In an attempt to foster interesting discussion and shared interests I am considering adding a sticky that would be for psychologist/students to discuss shared topics with psychiatrists/students. We share many common issues in regards to Dx, Tx, ethics, insurance issues etc.. Any feedback would help???

PS. we would not discuss RxP here.

I don’t think its possible. Scope of practice, diagnosis, insurance, etc. It would all come back to RxP or Med Psych. The discussion would be entertaining and probably argumentative, but not productive. Most independent practice psychologists increasingly have little to do with psychiatrists, and are working more and more with primary care. Consequently, I would recommend fostering this type of discussion with peds or family practice. They don’t seem too threatened by us. Furthermore, the discussion would likely be helpful to both groups. What do you think?

 

[Psyclops]

I think psycheval has some good points, also why not invite Neuro, they certainly might have some interesting things to say about differential diagnoses. But psychiatry should be part of the discussion too.

 

[PsychEval]

I think psycheval has some good points, also why not invite Neuro, they certainly might have some interesting things to say about differential diagnoses. But psychiatry should be part of the discussion too.[/QUOTE]

Why?

 

[Psyclops]

I think that they, like it or not, are a big part of the mental health system as it stands now, and will be for the forseeable future. Therefore we should incorporate them into our "Treatment Team". We don't always have to defer to them as they seem to want us to, nor do we have do develop psychiatry envy like our moderator has, but I think they will have some intresting things to say. I think we can discus things without talking politics, don't you?

BTW, I'm certain this will turn into a fight.

 

[PsychEval]

I think that they, like it or not, are a big part of the mental health system as it stands now, and will be for the forseeable future. Therefore we should incorporate them into our "Treatment Team". We don't always have to defer to them as they seem to want us to, nor do we have do develop psychiatry envy like our moderator has, but I think they will have some intresting things to say. I think we can discus things without talking politics, don't you?

BTW, I'm certain this will turn into a fight.

The mod does not have psychiatry envy. Everyone interested in med psych gets accused of this.

 

[50960]

Thanks psycheval, and you are right. What I don't envy is mental health providers who have no medical training to the detriment of their patients. I do however respect psychiatrists, and do not (usually) let the psychology partyline turn me into a psychiatrist basher.

 

[Psyclops]

Alright, my bad, I guess I'm not god at diagnosing people. Either way I'm in...

 

[50960]

I hope not, all I am to you is a pitcher of beer with an attitude. (see my avatar). I had a nice give and take recently with 2 folks on the psychiatry forum (the mod, and a new grad (MD)) about neurophys/neurochemistry in PTSD. I just don't see why we can't do that more often. In the real world I work very well with psychiatrists, and other MDs. I think inviting neurologist students is a good idea as well, but agree we are most likely to be hijacked from a psychiatry newbie etc.. Anasazi (MOD psychiatry) is adamantly against RxP etc, but we have a Hx, and I think he would even be up for it. Most of the good threads in this vein have been hijacked by a newbie on either side, and that is why I jumped on you and your comments when you first joined..I did apologize though 😉

 

[Psyclops]

I know, I tried to join that talk, I didn't get much of a reply though, I think they still resent my post in reply to Solideliquid quoting me. Maybe I'm just being Narcisisstic, they probably don't care. I tend to be opposed to Rxp as well, but for different reasons. I tend to have a knee jerk reaction to psychiatrists, I haven't been that impressed with them in practice as far as I have seen, and the bio level is not always the most useful level to appraoch a problem, but it seems to be the only one they know or are willing to spend time on. But' Like I said, I'm in, but i don't deal well with condecsenidng (I can't spell) tones.

 

[lazure]

I really like the idea of talking with family practice and pediatrics people - we send so many reports to them and I would love to hear their perspectives.

 

[PsychEval]

Thanks psycheval, and you are right. What I don't envy is mental health providers who have no medical training to the detriment of their patients. I do however respect psychiatrists, and do not (usually) let the psychology partyline turn me into a psychiatrist basher.

There are worse bashers than me. Take a look at what someone said to ProZack in the optometry forum:

You're very cocky for a psychiatrist. You have a superiority complex that is not warrented. You're a psychiatrist, you are not in any position to have a superiority complex. A f*cking psychiatrist.

gerido.

P.S. did I mentioned that you're just a psychiatrist?


Zack seems pretty pro psychology, luckily I'm not an optometrist.

 

[PsychEval]

You did recently have a positive interaction on the psychiatry forum. Although, I suspect if the dialogue continued it would likely end poorly, because what your asking and what your learning is perceived as taking away from their livelihood (which is ridiculous). Consequently, because of this resentment so many of them have toward us, I am more interested in obtaining my tennis lessons from a ski instructor or whatever Anasazzi wrote some time ago. Psisci, if you have gone through the training you are aware there are a few prescribing psychologists that know more about medicine than some psychiatrists. These numbers will only grow. Anasazzi obviously knows his stuff, better than most I would say, but unfortunately I see too much tension for continued productive interactions.

 

[PsychEval]

I think psycheval has some good points, also why not invite Neuro, they certainly might have some interesting things to say about differential diagnoses. But psychiatry should be part of the discussion too.

Neuro is very interesting, but I still think primary care is the way to go. Specifically, peds and family medicine. I doubt OB/GYN or IM would engage. Maybe?

 

[Psyclops]

I meant to say I'm not good at diagnosing people above, obviously I'm not god. I think the nature of the forum will be dicated by who participates. There are always going to be detractors, and this meduim offers the opportunity for some of us (myself included sometimes) to say things we otherwise wouldn't. But I think it offers us the opportunity for us to share with others who are similarly minded and interested in furthering their understanding. So what are we going to do, have assigned readings?

 

[soaringheights]

Neuro joining in would be good.
Psychiatry...i don't know how open they'll be to join and whether the discussions will ultimately boil down to psychiatry vs psychology

 

[Psyclops]

Even if the forum boiled down to Psychology vs. Psychiatry, that would work for me, It may still lead to beneficial and educational discussions. You don't learn by arguing with people you agree with! Let's let the fight happen if that is what happens. Especially on the heals of this massive JAMA research study on depression and phamachological treatments. It would be more interesting now than ever.

I can't promise I wouldn't enter this discussion with a bit of a chip on my shoulder, But I also think this is important for us to have these discussions. especially for those who are interested in this board for more than just the grad school application forum stuff. Get this going Psisci!

 

[psych2b]

peds or family practice. They don’t seem too threatened by us.

I can't speak for all psychiatrists, but my group greatly appreciates our encounters with psychologists, and we 😍 do not feel "too threatened" by our bretheren caregivers. *warm fuzzies to all*

 

[psych2b]

In an attempt to foster interesting discussion and shared interests I am considering adding a sticky that would be for psychologist/students to discuss shared topics with psychiatrists/students. We share many common issues in regards to Dx, Tx, ethics, insurance issues etc.. Any feedback would help???

PS. we would not discuss RxP here.

I like your idea, psisci - and being from the psychiatry forums, I'd love to have a thread where we all lay down whatever swords or shields we may have, and come together to discuss similar issues. I believe that we share many common issues, regarding dealing with difficult patients/families/insurance, etc - like, when is it better to use CBT vs. supportive therapy, or how does one set up boundaries, or even a practice? what computer programs are we using to code/bill/keep-records? do you take notes during the interview? how do you end a session? set limits? do you guys worry about malpractice insurance? do you make patients sign a contract before starting therapy, agreeing to acceptable behavior or waiving legal something-or-other? (fyi, i don't know of any psyhiatrists who do this either, i'm just curious). how do you handle parents who want you to "fix" their child, when the family itself has many issues that are part of the problem? how does one approach the parent without alienating them? or any family member? how does one help patients who either don't want help or don't believe they need it? is it an ethical obligation to help them? at what point does pt autonomy trump our beneficience?

[um, maybe you guys all know the answers to those things - and if so, I'd love to hear your approach to any/all of the above. I really think that I, at least, can learn a lot from anyone in the mental health field, be they psychologists, social workers, clergy, counselors, and any others I've left out].

Hoping for a warm happy exchange of ideas (may be one-sided, as you may not need/want any ideas from our end, which is fine - but would make this thread a bit "selfish" for me/other-psychiatrists - but if y'all are willing to give ideas, I would love to hear them.).

 

[soaringheights]

Check out the psychiatry thread by Poety...it has snowballed into a fight before the original thread proposed by psici has even started....
Come to think about it, I'v not come across this nasty attitude from psyciiatrists towards psychologists wherever I have worked.

 

[50960]

Nor have I. Poety has just finished med school, and is in no position to speak for psychiatry. I have decided not to pursue my idea on this board, ...I am just too busy to try to make this work. 🙁

 

[Poety]

But psici! I was a nurse for 8 years, working on psych units, scrub, step down, blah blah - doesn't that count for MORE than new med grad? COME ON! 😉

 

[Poety]

Check out the psychiatry thread by Poety...it has snowballed into a fight before the original thread proposed by psici has even started....
Come to think about it, I'v not come across this nasty attitude from psyciiatrists towards psychologists wherever I have worked.

Why don't you look at what YouR brethren wrote about psych in this thread, AND THEN came over to our thread and decided to bash about psych before saying such things - that psyclops (ie John White or whatever that nick was) loves to attack us pffffffftttt

Psici, I still say you should come on over to the "other" side 😛

 

[Psyclops]

Poety, grow up.

You won't hear any more spirited comments from me, I'm bowing out of this.

Peace.

 

[Solideliquid]

P, grow up.

You won't hear any more spirited comments from me, I'm bowing out of this.

Peace.

Poety, or did you mean yourself?

 

[soaringheights]

Why don't you look at what YouR brethren wrote about psych in this thread, AND THEN came over to our thread and decided to bash about psych before saying such things - that psyclops (ie John White or whatever that nick was) loves to attack us pffffffftttt

Psici, I still say you should come on over to the "other" side 😛

Poety
Wasn't that thread started by u? Psyclops was giving u his reaction. I'm not saying that he dint bash psychiatry, but only that it was U who started the bashing first. I don't think u have any right to jump on people's throats if u continue your dogmatic views about psychiatry, and if u continue to view psychology through a narrow perspective. Recognize where the power of meds end. 🙄
As I recall, the only useful post of yours I'v seen recently has been ur reply to Psici about PTSD. 👍 So u know, contrary to what u project, u are not COMPLETELY incapable of writing sense.
I'l not be wasting anymore of my time replying to anyone who has posted in in similar vein as your post was. Grow up.

 

[Poety]

Poety
Wasn't that thread started by u? Psyclops was giving u his reaction. I'm not saying that he dint bash psychiatry, but only that it was U who started the bashing first. I don't think u have any right to jump on people's throats if u continue your dogmatic views about psychiatry, and if u continue to view psychology through a narrow perspective. Recognize where the power of meds end. 🙄
As I recall, the only useful post of yours I'v seen recently has been ur reply to Psici about PTSD. 👍 So u know, contrary to what u project, u are not COMPLETELY incapable of writing sense.
I'l not be wasting anymore of my time replying to anyone who has posted in in similar vein as your post was. Grow up.

Yeah, that thread was started by me, in response to what YOU guys were talking about over here pffffffttt

I can talk as much sense as I want - or I can just banter like anyone else. In these forums am I supposed to spew my education all over the place and be some touchy feely wack job? I don't think so - search my old threads, you'll see WHY I have my feelings about psychologists (not ALL by ANY stretch - just mostly the ones here and ones I've WORKED WITH that in actuality throw out THEIR dogmatic principles denying the biological base to mental illness!) which runs along the same theme Psyclops has 🙄

And btw, I have no intention of growing up any time soon 😛