If you are having second thoughts on optometry school, I'm here to tell you to RUN

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Hi everyone,

I wanted to write this post to share my experiences and opinions on being an optometrist. I graduated a few years back and have had the opportunity to work private and corporate and also own my own business.

I wanted this to serve as a warning to y'all... Optometry is not it. I repeat, optometry is NOT it.

I came into the profession very optimistic and excited since it's been a lifelong dream of mine to be an optometrist. The profession has changed drastically in the last few decades and I really believe the glory days of optometry are long gone. It's reminiscent of pharmacy and it is a very scary thought that you are going into school with these absurdly high tuition costs. The ROI of optometry school is no longer worth it. You are having to spend 200k for tuition to fight for a 100k salary. My friends in other professions are out-earning all of us. The joy of this profession is being slowly sucked out of us by corporate optometry, insurance companies, and google/yelp reviews.

Let me elaborate. on corporate optometry first. It is the plague of optometry and it will only continue to worsen. People with no degrees in optometry dictating our salaries, amount of patients we see, how we practice ( some don't like when you dilate), and now their new thing is forcing optometrists to perform telehealth visits when we are willing and capable to see our patients in person. They now want you to earn and train someone to play doctor in our place while we sit somewhere remote and put our license on the line (call visionworks, target optical, lenscrafters, for eyes, and myeyelab if you don't believe me). Corporate optometry also decreases our exam reimbursements, giving optometrists $40-45 for exams total. Essentially, the motto is to see more patients and pay doctors pennies on the dollar.

Private practice is a slightly better experience. However, the competition is crushing. Gone are the days where the optical and the contact lens sales are going to keep your practice afloat. How can you compete with 1800 contacts or Warby Parker/ online glasses and contact companies, especially in this economy? I've met so many young ODs who have started private practices and hate having their optical and dealing with the BS that comes with that. Patients have increasingly grown more demanding and entitled especially with their perceived power from Google/ Yelp reviews. We've also bent over backwards for way too long, giving up our evenings and weekends to accommodate for patients' schedules when most other professionals can strive for a work/life balance.

Overall, if I were to do it all again knowing what I know, I definitely would NOT choose optometry. I think the job it once was has completely changed for the worse and I know so many people trying to find any and every way out of clinical care ( some even going back to school to work in tech or other fields). Some of my peers working in California are earning 300-400/ day but people who are opticians can now earn 250/ day. For the amount of debt we take on and for the amount of money older PP doctors used to make, our starting salary being stagnant is absolutely insulting to this profession as a whole. I could go on and on about why optometry isn't it but if you are having second thoughts I would definitely recommend shadowing docs in various settings and really make sure that you can do this forever. Personally, the appeal has completely diminished and I know I'm not alone.

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Here we go again. Is this topic going to turn into a 300 response by many ODs and their opinion ?
I get you. Optometry is a wonderful profession. A great profession where you help people with their most precious sense, vision. You can practice it any way you choose to the highest standard of your state legislation permitted.
I've said this before and will say it again, until I turn blue and die, this isn't a profession where you will retire easily one day or retire early. It is NOT a profession that allows you to do this when compared to medical and or surgical sub specialties.
I've preached this to many but it falls on deaf ears. Anyone coming out of OD school now with 250-300K student debt, you're facing a mountain of hurdles to pay that back.
Impressions: Great field, job not worth the ROI.
Very few make the big bucks in Optometry. The majority pay their bills, go on vacations, fine dining, etc................................but that's where it ends.
This isn't a field that will take you to the next level $$$$.
But it's okay. I'm out there 3 decades and I can assure you all, the money days in Optometry are not what they use to be.
Don't believe me...............................................You'll all find out one day.
GLTA !
All of this is based in the US, right?
 
All of this is based in the US, right?
Yes. US. However, this is my opinion and only my opinion from what I have experienced almost three decades. It doesn't mean it's the gospel. Many others might feel and believe differently.
I would like to hear from many other ODs how they feel.
 
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Hi everyone,

I wanted to write this post to share my experiences and opinions on being an optometrist. I graduated a few years back and have had the opportunity to work private and corporate and also own my own business.

I wanted this to serve as a warning to y'all... Optometry is not it. I repeat, optometry is NOT it.

I came into the profession very optimistic and excited since it's been a lifelong dream of mine to be an optometrist. The profession has changed drastically in the last few decades and I really believe the glory days of optometry are long gone. It's reminiscent of pharmacy and it is a very scary thought that you are going into school with these absurdly high tuition costs. The ROI of optometry school is no longer worth it. You are having to spend 200k for tuition to fight for a 100k salary. My friends in other professions are out-earning all of us. The joy of this profession is being slowly sucked out of us by corporate optometry, insurance companies, and google/yelp reviews.

Let me elaborate. on corporate optometry first. It is the plague of optometry and it will only continue to worsen. People with no degrees in optometry dictating our salaries, amount of patients we see, how we practice ( some don't like when you dilate), and now their new thing is forcing optometrists to perform telehealth visits when we are willing and capable to see our patients in person. They now want you to earn and train someone to play doctor in our place while we sit somewhere remote and put our license on the line (call visionworks, target optical, lenscrafters, for eyes, and myeyelab if you don't believe me). Corporate optometry also decreases our exam reimbursements, giving optometrists $40-45 for exams total. Essentially, the motto is to see more patients and pay doctors pennies on the dollar.

Private practice is a slightly better experience. However, the competition is crushing. Gone are the days where the optical and the contact lens sales are going to keep your practice afloat. How can you compete with 1800 contacts or Warby Parker/ online glasses and contact companies, especially in this economy? I've met so many young ODs who have started private practices and hate having their optical and dealing with the BS that comes with that. Patients have increasingly grown more demanding and entitled especially with their perceived power from Google/ Yelp reviews. We've also bent over backwards for way too long, giving up our evenings and weekends to accommodate for patients' schedules when most other professionals can strive for a work/life balance.

Overall, if I were to do it all again knowing what I know, I definitely would NOT choose optometry. I think the job it once was has completely changed for the worse and I know so many people trying to find any and every way out of clinical care ( some even going back to school to work in tech or other fields). Some of my peers working in California are earning 300-400/ day but people who are opticians can now earn 250/ day. For the amount of debt we take on and for the amount of money older PP doctors used to make, our starting salary being stagnant is absolutely insulting to this profession as a whole. I could go on and on about why optometry isn't it but if you are having second thoughts I would definitely recommend shadowing docs in various settings and really make sure that you can do this forever. Personally, the appeal has completely diminished and I know I'm not alone.
Do you mind telling us what state/states you have worked in?
 
I'm sorry to hear that things haven't been going well for such long. Sorry if I can't bring in my own perspective since I am only starting OD school this fall in Canada. The numerous thread definitely on sdn definitely got me scared and hesitating about such commitment. However, after having talked to some practicing ODs and final year students, things seem more promising here. In my province (Quebec), total tuition is only about 40-50k$ for the whole doctorate and including all mandatory instruments. Starting salary as an associate is around 100-120$/h (reimbursement is about 55-70$ if patient is covered under provincial insurance, and 80-120 if patient pays out of pocket with 20-25% overhead, consultations last 30-40 mins). No saturation since one needs to pass a french proficiency exam to practice in my province and there is only one french school that accepts like 46 students per year. However, cons include higher income tax rates than the US, more and more corporate/commerical offices, more limited scope of practice, etc.
I'm glad it's better over there for y'all! I'm sure practicing in Canada also comes with nicer and less entitled patients as well. Tuition cost vs starting salary over there also seems way more worth it from what you've described too. Good luck in the fall I'm sure you'll be an amazing doctor!
 
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I'll take the other side of the story. Right now there are 2x as many job postings as there are applicants. There are tons of practices for sale and retiring Docs. Most of my friends and colleagues I know are making at least $150K and the friends that practice owners are making $250-$300K. If you live in desirable and saturated cities yes it will be a little more difficult. Right now it is easier than ever to find a job and most job postings are quite good. Sorry but just kind of sounds like sour grapes.
 
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I'm glad it's better over there for y'all! I'm sure practicing in Canada also comes with nicer and less entitled patients as well. Tuition cost vs starting salary over there also seems way more worth it from what you've described too. Good luck in the fall I'm sure you'll be an amazing doctor!
Thanks for the encouragement! We never know what will happen after 4-5 years here but with online sales and "corporatization" (here as well), it's may not be roses and rainbows here neither. @percyeye @therealityofbeinganOD , out of curiosity, can you comment on other aspects of the profession, such as (any of):

-Does the job become repetitive and/or stressful?
-does salary increase with experience? what's the highest salary you have ever seen as an associate or an owner?
-Is the demand really there in terms of patients? (like after having found a job or started your own practice, is it easy to have a fully booked schedule in your area or should you rather have to expect multiple blanks in your schedule?)
-Are you paid per patient or rather on an hourly basis? how much does each patient pay and how much is the overhead?
-Do you feel respected by ophthalmologists?
-Is you regret it, what other profession would you have pursued?
 
There is always so much doom and gloom… I have never worked a Saturday, first patient is at 830 and last at 410, I take a 2 hour lunch and I will make just under 200k this year. I’m 3 years out of school as an associate, most of my friends don’t work weekends unless they want to and I everyone makes over 150k. Do I wish I made surgeon money? Hell yeah but it’s an easy job, minimal stress and 200k ain’t bad
 
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There is always so much doom and gloom… I have never worked a Saturday, first patient is at 830 and last at 410, I take a 2 hour lunch and I will make just under 200k this year. I’m 3 years out of school as an associate, most of my friends don’t work weekends unless they want to and I everyone makes over 150k. Do I wish I made surgeon money? Hell yeah but it’s an easy job, minimal stress and 200k ain’t bad
May I ask: How many pts per hour?
Are you rural? Private? Corporate? What's base and production? Is it virtually all medically billed?
 
May I ask: How many pts per hour?
Are you rural? Private? Corporate? What's base and production? Is it virtually all medically billed?
I have about 20-25 scheduled per day, the county I live in is about 500k people and is 30mins from a medium sized city of just over 1 million. My pay was salary with an end of year bonus first year and now it’s just production at 17%. I have benefits of health insurance, simple IRA, dues and malpractice. The highest producer in our group did 1.6m last year so when I grow my patient base to that my salary would be in the high 200’s. It’s like 30-40% medical the rest routine vision. I have built a pretty decent specialty lens practice where I fit 2-4 sclerals per month that has helped boost my production.
 
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I have about 20-25 scheduled per day, the county I live in is about 500k people and is 30mins from a medium sized city of just over 1 million. My pay was salary with an end of year bonus first year and now it’s just production at 17%. I have benefits of health insurance, simple IRA, dues and malpractice. The highest producer in our group did 1.6m last year so when I grow my patient base to that my salary would be in the high 200’s. It’s like 30-40% medical the rest routine vision. I have built a pretty decent specialty lens practice where I fit 2-4 sclerals per month that has helped boost my production.
What an awesome setup. Thanks for the details.
 
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I worked as a technician for an optometrist that owned his practice in a growing suburb in Texas. I would consider it rural, but there are many new apartments and neighborhoods being built in the area. Fortunately, he was transparent about his finances with me. He was paying himself $300K and his associate $150K a year. He saw on average 12-14 patients a day and was selling frames like crazy. He hired someone to create a website for his practice where patients could choose their frames and pick them up later - very, very lucrative for his practice.

While this is not the case with many private practices, I truly believe that location matters. Right now, recent grads have a lot of opportunity based on job listings. Tuition is expensive, but that can be said for many professions. The reality is that many professionals have student loan debt for 5-10 years. I just don't know what incoming students and recent grads are expecting from the profession? It's hard to open any business in America today... I don't think anyone is going to optometry school expecting to make $200k right after graduating? Or am I crazy? Unless you open a practice… there’s always been a ceiling with corporations. My peers are satisfied making $90-$120K… that’s what is expected right now based on the market.
 
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I worked as a technician for an optometrist that owned his practice in a growing suburb in Texas. I would consider it rural, but there are many new apartments and neighborhoods being built in the area. Fortunately, he was transparent about his finances with me. He was paying himself $300K and his associate $150K a year. He saw on average 12-14 patients a day and was selling frames like crazy. He hired someone to create a website for his practice where patients could choose their frames and pick them up later - very, very lucrative for his practice.

While this is not the case with many private practices, I truly believe that location matters. Right now, recent grads have a lot of opportunity based on job listings. Tuition is expensive, but that can be said for many professions. The reality is that many professionals have student loan debt for 5-10 years. I just don't know what incoming students and recent grads are expecting from the profession? It's hard to open any business in America today... I don't think anyone is going to optometry school expecting to make $200k right after graduating? Or am I crazy? Unless you open a practice… there’s always been a ceiling with corporations. My peers are satisfied making $90-$120K… that’s what is expected right now based on the market.
So you can and it’s not uncommon to make 200k as an associate. You need to join a busy practice, probably in a more rural area, work hard and be paid on production. Production pay is 15-20% so you need to do 1M-1.3M in production. The busier the practice the shorter time that will take to build up. I really don’t know anyone making less than 150k a year unless they are part time after a couple of years. Your first year salary is totally irrelevant. You don’t know what you are doing and it will take 6 months to be credentialed. Look at the 3-5 year potential and there is no reason most docs shouldn’t be able to crack 200k
 
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So you can and it’s not uncommon to make 200k as an associate. You need to join a busy practice, probably in a more rural area, work hard and be paid on production. Production pay is 15-20% so you need to do 1M-1.3M in production. The busier the practice the shorter time that will take to build up. I really don’t know anyone making less than 150k a year unless they are part time after a couple of years. Your first year salary is totally irrelevant. You don’t know what you are doing and it will take 6 months to be credentialed. Look at the 3-5 year potential and there is no reason most docs shouldn’t be able to crack 200k
I think it depends on which state you're living in. These aren't realistic numbers for optometrists working for major corps in Texas.
 
I think it depends on which state you're living in. These aren't realistic numbers for optometrists working for major corps in Texas.
Yeah you will never make that working cooperate because they don’t pay on production. Usually a higher starting salary but no advancement. It’s ok to start there but OMD/private OD offices will offer the highest upside. There are more of your colleagues than you think making great money but it involves building for a patient base and doing more than just refraction and referring. If you sublease you will for sure break 200 in the corporate world but rarely as an employee
 
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I have about 20-25 scheduled per day, the county I live in is about 500k people and is 30mins from a medium sized city of just over 1 million. My pay was salary with an end of year bonus first year and now it’s just production at 17%. I have benefits of health insurance, simple IRA, dues and malpractice. The highest producer in our group did 1.6m last year so when I grow my patient base to that my salary would be in the high 200’s. It’s like 30-40% medical the rest routine vision. I have built a pretty decent specialty lens practice where I fit 2-4 sclerals per month that has helped boost my production.
My best year in corporate was $300k (at 3 locations 6-7 days/wk) but now I've settled in around the $150k net range (1 location). I'm content where I'm at since it's only 4-5 minutes from my home, and we love the area that we live. My wife would have a hard time leaving the area and church we're apart of. We are 100% debt free including student loans, cars, home etc. So now quality of life is everything for us.

Seeing 20-25 patients gets up to my top range if I work 8am-6pm. If you're taking a 2 hour lunch break that leaves roughly 6 hours for clinical care. At 20 patients (18 min/patient) or 25 patients (14.5 mins/pt) that's difficult. Some of my older patients getting them to be quiet so I can start the exam can be a challenge.
 
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My best year in corporate was $300k (at 3 locations 6-7 days/wk) but now I've settled in around the $150k net range (1 location). I'm content where I'm at since it's only 4-5 minutes from my home, and we love the area that we live. My wife would have a hard time leaving the area and church we're apart of. We are 100% debt free including student loans, cars, home etc. So now quality of life is everything for us.

Seeing 20-25 patients gets up to my top range if I work 8am-6pm. If you're taking a 2 hour lunch break that leaves roughly 6 hours for clinical care. At 20 patients (18 min/patient) or 25 patients (14.5 mins/pt) that's difficult. Some of my older patients getting them to be quiet so I can start the exam can be a challenge.
We have a lot of tech support, patients are dilated when I see them. My schedule holds 33, I am just not full most days
 
Is this typical? even in rural? Seems a bit low to me
That’s pretty typical, that includes all optical revenue and contacts as well. Total net is going to be in the 30% neighborhood so if total comp is 15-20% then we the owners are bringing in 10-15% of what you bring in as profit
 
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We have a lot of tech support, patients are dilated when I see them. My schedule holds 33, I am just not full most days
Are the techs doing the refractions? If so, then 20-30 becomes achievable without burning the OD out. This frees the OD up to do SLE, fundus exam with BIO or other trouble shooting problems.

Unfortunately in my state they require the OD to do the refraction. Although I suppose you could have a tech do it and then do a +-0.25 & +-0.50 over the tech's findings and call it a refraction.
 
Are the techs doing the refractions? If so, then 20-30 becomes achievable without burning the OD out. This frees the OD up to do SLE, fundus exam with BIO or other trouble shooting problems.

Unfortunately in my state they require the OD to do the refraction. Although I suppose you could have a tech do it and then do a +-0.25 & +-0.50 over the tech's findings and call it a refraction.
No I refract, there are days it’s crazy and days it’s not so bad. Everyone takes a lot of vacation so we work when we work and don’t when we don’t. I took about 20 days off last year
 
So you can and it’s not uncommon to make 200k as an associate. You need to join a busy practice, probably in a more rural area, work hard and be paid on production. Production pay is 15-20% so you need to do 1M-1.3M in production. The busier the practice the shorter time that will take to build up. I really don’t know anyone making less than 150k a year unless they are part time after a couple of years. Your first year salary is totally irrelevant. You don’t know what you are doing and it will take 6 months to be credentialed. Look at the 3-5 year potential and there is no reason most docs shouldn’t be able to crack 200k
I'm curious why practice owner compensation is only 250k-300k when you could produce 1M-1.3M. Is overhead that high? Full disclosure: ophtho here and its not hard to collect >1M just seeing patients and not operating (just straight medical billing, no optical). In fact, we collect more seeing patients than doing surgery unless it involves out of pocket cash pay type of procedures.
 
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I'm curious why practice owner compensation is only 250k-300k when you could produce 1M-1.3M. Is overhead that high? Full disclosure: ophtho here and its not hard to collect >1M just seeing patients and not operating (just straight medical billing, no optical). In fact, we collect more seeing patients than doing surgery unless it involves out of pocket cash pay type of procedures.
That’s not partner comp, partner comp would be in 30% neighborhood so 3-400k in 1-1.3M production example.
 
I’m 3 years out of training, my friends that are practice owners are as well. They are not established yet. The partners in my group all make over 300 and the higher producing partners are making north of 500k. I’m sure it’s the same for y’all, there are some OMDs that make 7 figures and there are some that make way less. It just depends how busy you are
 
I’m 3 years out of training, my friends that are practice owners are as well. They are not established yet. The partners in my group all make over 300 and the higher producing partners are making north of 500k. I’m sure it’s the same for y’all, there are some OMDs that make 7 figures and there are some that make way less. It just depends how busy you are
This is correct. If someone wants to mark good money in Optometry you must be an owner where you mindset changes and producing more and being more busy can net you some serious income $300K-$500K plus any real estate the practice might own. If not then you become the majority where you scrounge and fight for that $130 to maybe $180Kish a year and then go to sleep working as an employee the next 20-30 years.
 
This is correct. If someone wants to mark good money in Optometry you must be an owner where you mindset changes and producing more and being more busy can net you some serious income $300K-$500K plus any real estate the practice might own. If not then you become the majority where you scrounge and fight for that $130 to maybe $180Kish a year and then go to sleep working as an employee the next 20-30 years.
Totally true. I wanted to clarify as you characterized your practice owner friends as 250-300. The numbers did not quite make sense.
 
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