Jun 13, 2012
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This isn't a situation I am going through at the moment, but let's say hypothetically the Army tried to kick me out as an officer (for an adult entertainment past), after the fact that I told them about it when I enter Uniform Service Medical School. So I was completely honest with them, and hypothetically already went through my 4 years of med school and residency.

Do you think they have the power to kick me out at that point? or demote me?

And would I still keep my degree, and have the right to practice in the civilian market?
 

dr zaius

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Greatest thread I have seen in the milmed subforum. Please, elaborate.
 

Kilgoretrout 65

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I won't be the one asking for a link…
I don't think past transgressions that you admitted, especially legal ones, will matter to the Army.
 

d2305

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They used to ask all kinds of questions on the pre commissioning packet. It doesn't matter much what you told anyone verbally. It's what's in the paperwork. As an officer, you don't have to worry about a demotion. There are instructions for dealing with fraudulent commissioning which the Army may or may not enforce.
 
OP
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I love this thread already...

What exactly about this "adult entertainment past" is a deal-breaker? You're going to have to be more specific. And no, I won't pretend that I don't want to know.
Working at a strip club for 4 years (stripping license too).

no porn.

That's about it.
-----
Not too concern about the acceptance to the University (I would have 8 yrs of service by that point, officer experience as a nurse, competitive grades/mcat). I am more concern when I am up for promotions and such, and the Army makes a big deal about it.
 

colbgw02

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I mean, it doesn't sound like you've done anything illegal. I doubt that you would ever get ODE approval to do it again, but that's beside the point. If it happens to come up in any official capacity, probably as part of your security clearance background check, then just be honest. Once you're commissioned, then it's unlikely it will ever become an issue.
 

bustbones26

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This isn't a situation I am going through at the moment, but let's say hypothetically the Army tried to kick me out as an officer (for an adult entertainment past), after the fact that I told them about it when I enter Uniform Service Medical School. So I was completely honest with them, and hypothetically already went through my 4 years of med school and residency.

Do you think they have the power to kick me out at that point? or demote me?

And would I still keep my degree, and have the right to practice in the civilian market?
Jollie Rain (look it up) was in my unit, everybody knew it, nobody cared. Get over it!
 
May 19, 2013
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If, hypothetically, this were happening, you should stop talking about it to anyone (including the internet) and find a lawyer.

Fraudulent enlistment is no joke. In addition to fraudulent enlistment, the government can investigate/charge you for fraud for any monetary benefits you received as a result of your fraudulent commission. There is precedent for this, I remember hearing about a case (I think in North Carolina) where a girl who claimed to be a nuclear engineer and gained a commission as a result of her fraudulent degree in nuclear engineering was tried and convicted for fraud as a result of the VA home loan she took out. Here is the article: http://www.justice.gov/usao/pam/news/2012/Smith_11_20_2012.htm

The ramifications I can foresee:

- If you are other than honorably discharged, you might forfeit all benefits, likely be required to pay back your education at a high interest rate, and have to report this to any state licensing board to whom you apply for a license. I think that's unlikely...
- If you lose hospital credentials, you would have to report that to any state licensing board to whom you apply for a license.
- If you did not report that as employment on your security clearance investigation paperwork, they could penalize you up to and including whatever the fine print says on the forms.

If you reported it to the state licensing boards, you'd probably have to appear before the board, but I've seen people get licenses for worse past issues (DUI, getting kicked out of residency starting a new one, drug violations, etc...). So, I would say your chances of practicing later are good.

Don't freak out, just talk to an attorney. For what its worth, I do know of people in milmed who didn't disclose medical stuff prior to commissioning and TRIED to get kicked out to get out of their service contract and the military said "no." Basically gave them a slap on the wrist (no documentation officially) and let them continue their obligation.

*This is not legal advice.
 

Qurmish

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Oh my god.

Thank you for your post, it sums it up pretty well. The HSCP is the best route for me.

I want to work during medical school because the job is one of my life passions, but that life passion can't be a career, since it's a younger person's field.

I am certain I want to stay for the 20 years, for the military retirement, and for personal beliefs. But I want to get out as soon as diminishing returns hit in.
 

Perrotfish

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Preface: I'm not a lawyer, this is not legal advice

So to make sure that I understand this:

1) You are a former AD corpsman/nurse, about to start USUHS

2) At some point in the past, you were a stripper for 4 years, you have never been convicted of any crime.

What were are talking about here conduct unbecoming. The key question is: did you do this on active duty, or did you do this as a civilian? Also if you were a stripper on active duty, did this issue come before your command in an official capacity (ie you went to mast) or did you just tell people about it?.
 

colbgw02

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Yeah, we still need more information. To reiterate, did you do this while in the military? Have you or are you planning on continuing it after commissioning?

If you did this as a civilian, never committed a crime, disclose it appropriately, and don't do it again, then I really don't see the need for an attorney here. We're not talking about you lying about your qualifications or hiding a medical condition.
 

Kingfisher

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Stripping background does not sound like much of an issue. It's not illegal to be a stripper. I don't remember getting asked if I had served any time with a pole when I signed up. If you want to maintain credibility with your fellow residents and staff, I would definitely keep your past to yourself in the residency interviews.

Although, I can invision a very inappropriate end-of-year intern skit that would be remembered for years.
 

DrMetal

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Working at a strip club for 4 years (stripping license too).
Assuming you're serious, I'd offer the following advice:

Regarding your medical school application: If they're still asking for an employment history going back that far, go ahead and put it down. If you can avoid giving details, or if you can phrase things in a more ambiguous (yet still accurate) way--for instance, calling your position as that of a "performer", "entertainer" . . . rather than a "stripper"--all the better. During your medical school interviews, don't bring it up, unless specifically asked about it. If asked, stand tall and proud, talk about it (again, avoid details), try to put some kind of funny/positive spin to it. Don't worry about it, this isn't something that's going to keep you out of medical school. And that the fact that you have it down on your written applications means that nobody can ever give you sht for inadequate disclosure. You put it down, not your problem if people can't read.

Regarding your security clearance in the military: put it down for sure, here I would give a little more detail when asked about it. Reasoning is this: The security clearance application is a test of your honesty. You're not going to be denied a clearance because you used to strip . . . .you will be denied one if you lie about it. Putting it down and providing a little more detail is a good show of faith.

Regarding your future life as a medical student, military officer, doctor etc etc: I would try to keep this on the down-low. In fact, I wouldn't tell a single soul. I don't mean to suggest you should be embarrassed about it . . . it's just that people in medicine and the military talk a lot of ****. Hell I get crap for being a Laker's fan. If even one of your classmates finds out, your entire class will find out, then your patients might find out when you start your clinical education, then your preceptors etc etc etc. People can be incredibly judgmental (and wrongfully so) and form weird impressions of you . . . .that's just the way it is.
 
OP
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Jun 13, 2012
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Yeah, we still need more information. To reiterate, did you do this while in the military? Have you or are you planning on continuing it after commissioning?

If you did this as a civilian, never committed a crime, disclose it appropriately, and don't do it again, then I really don't see the need for an attorney here. We're not talking about you lying about your qualifications or hiding a medical condition.
I never done this. I am not an officer either.

I ask because it's something I plan to do (as a civilian).
 

backrow

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In case the OP doesn't come back to comment take a look at their post history. They are a ways away from even applying to medical school, possibly even thinking of enlisting.
 

absolutdokta

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Regarding your medical school application: If they're still asking for an employment history going back that far, go ahead and put it down. If you can avoid giving details, or if you can phrase things in a more ambiguous (yet still accurate) way--for instance, calling your position as that of a "performer", "entertainer" . . . rather than a "stripper"--all the better. During your medical school interviews, don't bring it up, unless specifically asked about it. If asked, stand tall and proud, talk about it (again, avoid details), try to put some kind of funny/positive spin to it. Don't worry about it, this isn't something that's going to keep you out of medical school. And that the fact that you have it down on your written applications means that nobody can ever give you sht for inadequate disclosure. You put it down, not your problem if people can't read.
"I am NOT a stripper


.....I am a DANCER!!"

isn't that what they all say anyway? :laugh:
 

Gastrapathy

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Doesn't the combo of the op's username and professed line of work = 100% troll. If not, this thread is worthless without pics and I'd love to help you get some clinical experience ( unless you are a dude, in which case I can only say welcome to the new military). Seriously, OP: if you want to be in medicine, don't do this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
May 19, 2013
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I never done this. I am not an officer either.

I ask because it's something I plan to do (as a civilian).
I know entertaining can be lucrative but there are other options. If you are desperate financially I am sure you can find assistance at your college student assistance center. If it is that you want to be famous, I think tryouts for American idol are coming up. If its daddy issues (like Chris rock says a dad's only job is to keep his daughter off the pole), then I think most colleges have free counseling available too.

Look at your problem many ways, often there's more than one option.
 

pgg

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This isn't a situation I am going through at the moment, but let's say hypothetically the Army tried to kick me out as an officer (for an adult entertainment past), after the fact that I told them about it when I enter Uniform Service Medical School. So I was completely honest with them, and hypothetically already went through my 4 years of med school and residency.

Do you think they have the power to kick me out at that point? or demote me?

And would I still keep my degree, and have the right to practice in the civilian market?
If you disclosed your employment history at the time of entry into the armed forces, and never did anything illegal (ie, just "stripping" and not "escorting" wink wink), then you'd have nothing to worry about. Hell, people disclose prior activity that's actually illegal (recreational drug use) and so long as they fly straight from then on, no worries.

Once on active duty that line of work is going to be off limits, primarily because all off-duty employment has to be specifically and individually approved by your command, and there isn't a CO anywhere who'll OK that. If at this point, you do that kind of work on your time off, you'll run afoul of the UCMJ in a couple ways - failure to obey an order (to get command approval prior to engaging in off-duty employment), and then there's that huge deliberately gray area of "conduct unbecoming" that could be tacked on.


I don't have the slightest moral problem with anything any consenting adults do together or in the general vicinity of each other, legal or not, but that kind of work is very likely going to generate some baggage you may not want to deal with later.
 

bryce

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As a CO (who encountered this amongst female Soldiers while I was still enlisted), it is an issue if done while simultaneously still in uniformed service. That said, I've (sadly) ran across more than a few peers that stripped in college for "beer money". Namely ROTC females, whom had too much time on their hands outside of their 'Organizational Leadership' major. It always comes out, eventually, but if you've truly committed yourself to bettering yourself as a person & leader, it will be overlooked. Competence is key. And besides, a Soldier isn't a Soldier if they haven't screwed up a few times.
 
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