IMG Family Medicine Applicants- Match 2019

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Guyton&Hall

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Hi guys, I'm a Caribbean school graduate completely new to sdn. Couldn't find a place for IMG's applying to family medicine for this cycle. Hopefully we can get this one going and support each other during this time.

Step 1: 213
Step 2 CK: 226
Step 2 CS: Pass
Step 3: Not taken
YOG: 2018
Visa Status: U.S. Citizen

Programs Applied to: 174

Rejections: Montana
Acknowledgements: Minnesota
Interviews: None so far

I know things start of slow for us as the U.S. schools begin to hear back. Feel free to share and discuss!

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I would not expect more than max 2 regardless of the type of applicant until MSPEs go out. Also as AMGs begin cancelling :)
 
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IMG , Caribbean grad .. 2nd attempt

Step 1: 210
Step 2 CK: 236
Step 2 CS: Pass
Step 3: Not taken
YOG: 2017
ECFMG cert
Visa Status: Green Card , Permanent Resident


Programs Applied to: 200

Rejections: Kadlec
Acknowledgements: Univ Arkansas, Univ of Iowa .
Interviews: None

Red Flags: Took 2 years off after passing Step 1 and before starting my clinical due to financial reasons .
 
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IMG , Caribbean grad .. 2nd attempt

Step 1: 210
Step 2 CK: 236
Step 2 CS: Pass
Step 3: Not taken
YOG: 2017
ECFMG cert
Visa Status: Green Card , Permanent Resident


Programs Applied to: 200

Rejections: Kadlec
Acknowledgements: Univ Arkansas, Univ of Iowa .
Interviews: None

Red Flags: Took 2 years off after passing Step 1 and before starting my clinical due to financial reasons .

Thanks for sharing! Can I ask how many interviews you had last season? With the big jump in your ck score I figured chances would be very high.
 
Don't get too discouraged yet. It's early in the application cycle. Most of us don't bother seriously looking at applications until after October 1st when we start receiving Dean's letters.
 
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What are my chances...

Canadian IMG, require visa, YOG - 2017

Step 1: 197
CK : 214
CS: Pass . All exams in 1st attempt.


3 LORs - 2 IM & 1 FM.

Planning to apply around 115 programs..
 
Thanks for sharing! Can I ask how many interviews you had last season? With the big jump in your ck score I figured chances would be very high.

I applied late last year and to IM programs .. Got few, decided IM is too competitive and everyone i know involved in it is miserable.
 
All right, here we go:

US-IMG

Step 1: 199 :dead:
Step 2 CK: 219
Step 2 CS: Pass
Step 3: Not yet taken
YOG: 2018
 
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All right, here we go:

Non-California-accredited Caribbean school student

Step 1: 199 on second attempt :dead:
Step 2 CK: 219 on first attempt
Step 2 CS: Pass on first attempt
Step 3: Not yet taken
YOG: Nov 2018
Visa Status: U.S. citizen

Programs applied to: 280

Rejections:
Montana
University of Wisconsin Madison and Baraboo
University of Nebraska Rural Program

Acknowledgements:
New Hanover
Stamford
UAMS Little Rock
University of Iowa

Interviews: None so far

Covered all red flags in PS, LORs are 2 FM and one IM.

Hey, we have almost similar profile except that I need a visa. Haven't had any acknowledgements so far. Where do u think I stand?
 
All right, here we go:

Non-California-accredited Caribbean school student

Step 1: 199 on second attempt :dead:
Step 2 CK: 219 on first attempt
Step 2 CS: Pass on first attempt
Step 3: Not yet taken
YOG: Nov 2018
Visa Status: U.S. citizen

Programs applied to: 280

Rejections:
Montana
University of Wisconsin Madison and Baraboo
University of Nebraska Rural Program

Acknowledgements:
New Hanover
Stamford
UAMS Little Rock
University of Iowa

Interviews: None so far

Covered all red flags in PS, LORs are 2 FM and one IM.

How did you make your list? I'm curious because some of your acknowledgements have cut-offs like no repeats or scores over 210/220.

I'm planning on adding programs and was hoping for recommendations on what states I should be shooting for (least competitive/best yield for getting an interview).
 
step 1- 223
step 2 -215
CS-pass
YOG -2018
USCE 11months
Need Visa
Applied to 150 programs
Caribbean grad



What are my chances ??
 
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Applied to about 175 FM programs. Going to add another 50 or so programs. My application probably is going to be seen as a backup since everything is geared towards IM

Had a couple of acknowledgements and one rejection from deaconess because grad date will exceed 3 years by July 2019
 
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How did you make your list? I'm curious because some of your acknowledgements have cut-offs like no repeats or scores over 210/220.

I'm planning on adding programs and was hoping for recommendations on what states I should be shooting for (least competitive/best yield for getting an interview).


I researched all the FM programs in states my school is eligible in and used my best judgment based on a couple of factors to apply. Too much to go into here lol. I fully expect a whole lot of silence and rejections but we’ll see how this all plays out lol
 
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Hey, we have almost similar profile except that I need a visa. Haven't had any acknowledgements so far. Where do u think I stand?

Honestly I wish I could offer some insider knowledge or reassurance but I got nothin, I’m in the same boat as everyone else here. There are so many variables that go into this process. Someone posted something in the main FM 2019 thread that I liked which I will find and repost for us here.
 
Natividad Resident said:
In my experience people either want data-free reassurance or they want data-based perspective. Here's both, and a reality check.

Reassurance: As long as it's September, it's WAY too early to draw ANY conclusions whatsoever. Unfortunately you have to be patient. Programs that wait for MSPEs are waiting for MSPEs. Some programs choose to not wait for MSPEs in order to get in early with extremely compelling candidates; do not use their experiences as a ruler or a mirror. If you feel like you are a weak candidate, then review the last 10 years of posts here to get some ideas for what you can do over the next 4 months, such as contacting programs mid-season to take advantage of cancellations. Regardless, unless you are in massive pathological denial about your chances, you WILL have the delicious experience of your first invite. Consider planning for the experience, such as having a song ready to dance to etc. Call/email/text a significant mentor or parent or preceptor and say THANK YOU. Those of your med school classmates who are not being gracious, discreet, supportive and publicly calm after they start getting invites are a-holes and you are right to judge them harshly; OBVIOUSLY, be a good person after you start getting invites.

Data-based perspective: There were 557 FM residencies in NRMP last year. 20 programs are listed in this very very VERY low traffic SDN thread. 10% of FM residencies do not fill in the match. Medium-popularity residencies got at least 500 apps on Saturday. Most programs have a protocol for evaluating each app that can't be automated; the time required for human eyes to find relevant data (open website, click things, scroll, use tired middle-aged eyes to read data that is judged by tired middle-aged human brain, mark app as invite-now vs hold vs no) is a minutes-long task. Then it's another minutes-long task to issue the interview invite (staff member receives list of applicants to contact, processes that list with mail merge or individual email or individual phone call or other). If a program has 2 people with one hour per day (generous) for this task, that program is going through 50-100 apps per day. There is no data to predict whether your app that went out on Saturday is in the first 50-100 apps or the last 50-100 apps. FM is one of the specialties that gets flooded with poorly competitive apps, which slows everything down for everybody. Your pretty-good app is in line behind an FMG with several Step 1 attempts and some red flags who applied to 500 programs.

Reality check: FM residency program directors did not clear their calendars to get through all of the apps as fast as possible, because they have other priorities such as patient care, kids starting school, current residents in crisis, life. Your match experience is a once-in-a-lifetime massively-high-stakes SERIOUSLY BIG FAT DEAL but for people who work at residencies it's ho-hum interview season AGAIN. Similarly to med school apps, the cost to a residency of losing one good candidate is infinitesimally small because there are ridiculous boatloads of apps thus there is no high-stakes quality assurance pass to make sure a gem isn't lost. Infinite gems, lots of residencies, no individual consequences to a residency for improperly handling an app.

Please believe me that you WILL survive the waiting, that there's no career difference in getting your 100% perfect residency choice vs. your 90% perfect residency choice, and that forming resentments about the match process is an utter waste of time.

Good luck to all.
 
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As long as it's September, it's WAY too early to draw ANY conclusions whatsoever.

Very true, way too early.

Medium-popularity residencies got at least 500 apps on Saturday.

I think this number is a bit on the low side, more like 700-800.

the time required for human eyes to find relevant data (open website, click things, scroll, use tired middle-aged eyes to read data that is judged by tired middle-aged human brain, mark app as invite-now vs hold vs no) is a minutes-long task.

Also very true, my middle-aged eyes tire after the 10th application from someone who "took care of my grandma as she died of cancer, which solidified my desire to help people" essay crap. Or the 20th application from someone with volunteer experience at the homeless shelter. Or the 50th application from the past president of the Orthopedic Surgery club, and the secretary of the Dermatology club, who found family medicine was their true passion (after scoring poorly on boards, that is).

It's hard to figure out who really is worth considering for an interview.

FM is one of the specialties that gets flooded with poorly competitive apps, which slows everything down for everybody. Your pretty-good app is in line behind an FMG with several Step 1 attempts and some red flags who applied to 500 programs.

Not an issue, we have filters that filter all the crappy applications out, so we don't have to deal with them. Out of 800 applications, we end up with about 200 after filters are applied.

FM residency program directors did not clear their calendars to get through all of the apps as fast as possible, because they have other priorities such as patient care, kids starting school, current residents in crisis, life.

Yes, indeed, we're human and have other things to do. Be aware that the application season is extremely busy for all of us (staff, directors, etc.) so be polite and respect our time. If you have a less than stellar application, don't call us after we reject you. You're wasting staff's valuable time, and it makes all of us very cranky. Leave it alone, and move on. If I was more tech savvy I would insert here a mini movie of Rambo holding a knife to the sheriff's neck and saying "let it go...let it go..." (look it up on You Tube).

Your match experience is a once-in-a-lifetime massively-high-stakes SERIOUSLY BIG FAT DEAL but for people who work at residencies it's ho-hum interview season AGAIN.

We really, really try to remember this, but it's hard. It happens every year, and as soon as it's over it seems that it starts all over again right after it ended.

It's a busy time, and we need to fit all that extra work on top of all the other stuff we need to do (residency goes on for all residents, we can't just put everything on hold to deal with the application season).

The take home is this:

- If you're an IMG with a good application, relax, it's too early to worry.

- If you're an IMG with a poor application, wait and see what happens, don't call programs and bug them. Honestly, DON'T CALL PROGRAMS. You'll piss off the staff and decrease your chances even further.

If you could hang out at our admissions office during the application cycle you would totally understand. The phone rings NON-STOP and our overworked staff hates it. Sometimes they don't even pick up the phone and just go through the voice mail (delete...delete...delete). This is a huge time-waster.
 
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Very true, way too early.



I think this number is a bit on the low side, more like 700-800.



Also very true, my middle-aged eyes tire after the 10th application from someone who "took care of my grandma as she died of cancer, which solidified my desire to help people" essay crap. Or the 20th application from someone with volunteer experience at the homeless shelter. Or the 50th application from the past president of the Orthopedic Surgery club, and the secretary of the Dermatology club, who found family medicine was their true passion (after scoring poorly on boards, that is).

It's hard to figure out who really is worth considering for an interview.



Not an issue, we have filters that filter all the crappy applications out, so we don't have to deal with them. Out of 800 applications, we end up with about 200 after filters are applied.



Yes, indeed, we're human and have other things to do. Be aware that the application season is extremely busy for all of us (staff, directors, etc.) so be polite and respect our time. If you have a less than stellar application, don't call us after we reject you. You're wasting staff's valuable time, and it makes all of us very cranky. Leave it alone, and move on. If I was more tech savvy I would insert here a mini movie of Rambo holding a knife to the sheriff's neck and saying "let it go...let it go..." (look it up on You Tube).



We really, really try to remember this, but it's hard. It happens every year, and as soon as it's over it seems that it starts all over again right after it ended.

It's a busy time, and we need to fit all that extra work on top of all the other stuff we need to do (residency goes on for all residents, we can't just put everything on hold to deal with the application season).

The take home is this:

- If you're an IMG with a good application, relax, it's too early to worry.

- If you're an IMG with a poor application, wait and see what happens, don't call programs and bug them. Honestly, DON'T CALL PROGRAMS. You'll piss off the staff and decrease your chances even further.

If you could hang out at our admissions office during the application cycle you would totally understand. The phone rings NON-STOP and our overworked staff hates it. Sometimes they don't even pick up the phone and just go through the voice mail (delete...delete...delete). This is a huge time-waster.
You seem to be doing a job you dont enjoy. No one is forcing you to be part of a residency program. Move on if you cant handle it.
 
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You seem to be doing a job you dont enjoy. No one is forcing you to be part of a residency program. Move on if you cant handle it.

While I obviously can't speak to whether or not Shinken enjoys his/her job, I can tell you that everything they posted was 100% truth. You may read it as bitter, but that's certainly not how I read it, which is someone who is in the same position.
 
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Keep your head up! October is only a few days away and I expect a ton of interviews to come your way :) Mark my words
Thank you. I hope that is true for all of us!
I can barely sleep anymore, so worried about getting even one IV at this point.

Did you post your stats?
 
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Hi, Has any IMG applicant gotten any FM interview invites yet?
 
Honestly I wish I could offer some insider knowledge or reassurance but I got nothin, I’m in the same boat as everyone else here. There are so many variables that go into this process. Someone posted something in the main FM 2019 thread that I liked which I will find and repost for us here.

Thanks!
 
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What are my chances...

Canadian IMG, require visa, YOG - 2017

Step 1: 197
CK : 214
CS: Pass . All exams in 1st attempt.


3 LORs - 2 IM & 1 FM.

Planning to apply around 115 programs.
Hey Mann .....can you please tell me whether you got any interviews, you don't have to mention the name of the program. Thanks
 
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I applied there as well. Haven’t heard back from them. *sigh*


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Same here, she lives in cali and is a us citizen

passed all boards first time
203/212/pass/no step 3
no USCE done in last 2.5 years
No FM LoR or IM LoR
 
Hey Mann .....can you please tell me whether you got any interviews, you don't have to mention the name of the program. Thanks

None so far, hoping I get one at least tbh. What about u?
 
October is just a few days away when MSPEs will be released. Try to keep your sanity till then! My friends got 2-3 on the same day the day after MSPE
 
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Ya I do have PTAL. I am Canadian with ties to Cali due to family. U think it's hard for visa IMG's in Cali?
I do think its hard. I am surprised/shocked how many Family programs do NOT sponsor visas. Internal med seems a lot more friendly for visa applicants.
 
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Yeah I do, Im actually surprise

I do think its hard. I am surprised/shocked how many Family programs do NOT sponsor visas. Internal med seems a lot more friendlier for visa applicants.

I didn't notice a difference b/n IM & FM in Cali tbh. I was able to find approx 10 each in both IM & FM which are visa & IMG friendly. I applied to those only. There may be other programs which give visa but if there are no IMG's, didn't bother applying. Don't know if I made the right choice, please let me know if should apply to few more as well. Thanks.
 
I didn't notice a difference b/n IM & FM in Cali tbh. I was able to find approx 10 each in both IM & FM which are visa & IMG friendly. I applied to those only. There may be other programs which give visa but if there are no IMG's, didn't bother applying. Don't know if I made the right choice, please let me know if should apply to few more as well. Thanks.
Overall I saw a big difference.

I wouldnt apply if there are no IMGs. I cant give advice on visa since I dont need it. I would make sure you have applied everywhere you meet the requirements for that is IMG friendly. I would say this is the last week to be on time
 
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Don't get too discouraged yet. It's early in the application cycle. Most of us don't bother seriously looking at applications until after October 1st when we start receiving Dean's letters.
How do you actually evaluate the Dean's letter? Seems tedious.

Are transcript updates showing honors in electives worth it?

(I'm not an IMG, Im a US MG)

Thanks.
 
How do you actually evaluate the Dean's letter? Seems tedious.

Are transcript updates showing honors in electives worth it?

(I'm not an IMG, Im a US MG)

Thanks.
Deans letter shows them how you ranked relative to classmates, clinical comments, gaps in medical education and if you had to redo any coursework.
 
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How do you actually evaluate the Dean's letter? Seems tedious.

Are transcript updates showing honors in electives worth it?

(I'm not an IMG, Im a US MG)

Thanks.
Honestly, it seems like a dumb measure to use to me as well. Dunno how deeply it’s studied but all I know is IMGs are usually interviewed after that.
 
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Deans letter shows them how you ranked relative to classmates, clinical comments, gaps in medical education and if you had to redo any coursework.
Last 3 things I can see. Compared to others isn't very concrete though and often extremely off. Ex. being in one rotation site = only 1-2 honors vs another site = straight honors. Yet both are in the same class and hence ranked vs each other with no accounting for severe grade inflation/deflation.
 
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Last 3 things I can see. Compared to others isn't very concrete though and often extremely off. Ex. being in one rotation site = only 1-2 honors vs another site = straight honors. Yet both are in the same class and hence ranked vs each other with no accounting for severe grade inflation/deflation.
As long as your MSPE matches the
rest of your app and doesnt show anything crazy it wont matter.
 
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