In which specialties is it most acceptable to work part-time (as a male)?

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FunnyDocMan1234

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I want to live my life with 3-4 day weekends even if it means making 80k/year so money isn't an issue. I just don't want people to guilt-trip me about not working full time or have animosity in the hospital due to this. So what specialties are the best/worst for this (and you won't feel like patients are dying/can't get treatment because of your choice)?
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It's very possible to work part time in EM but you likely won't have Thur-Sun off every week.
 
Theoretically you could do any outpatient field 3-4 days a week, but that might not be enough to keep the lights on/pay employees/satisfy a group practice.
 
Just through my research of the fields, I would like to Add psych to the pile. Derm, Rads, and PM&R are nice options just competitive minus PM and R, and Optho would be something to look into also.

So some specialties that will potentially offer you the lifestyle your looking for.

Rads, Optho, Derm, Radiation Oncology, PM&R and Psych (So many diff practice settings and over half of all psychiatrist already work part time)

Thats a quick list for you too look into
 
or IM hospitalists, 7 day on 7 day off, 180-200k :naughty:, technically not part-time but 1 week vacation every other week is hard to beat.

EM: you might not get to pick which days of the week you want to work or day vs. night shift, holidays etc.
 
I just don't get why people go into medicine if they want that life
 
JP2740 said:
I just don't get why people go into medicine if they want that life
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I can understand not wanting to work 60-70hr/week when you have a family and intrests outside of medicine, but part-time is a little light.
 
FM or IM. Join an outpatient group that does no IP. M-Th 8-5. Friday is half day for "administrative duties". 40 hour work week worth $150K not including any bonuses. With production (ie. seeing more patients beyond a pre-determined threshold) I know for a fact it can be at or close to $200K.

You may have to do some phone call if that is part of your group.
 
Plenty of EM doctors in their 50s and above work only a handful of shifts a month. The short residency, no call, and shift work might be attractive too.
 
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JP2740 said:
I just don't get why people go into medicine if they want that life
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After so many long hours/years invested, coupled with sacrificing time with friends & family, I can see why people choose a lighter career track or even part-time. I'd consider it myself someday as well. I guess you could say there is such a thing as 'too much medicine'.
 
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JP2740 said:
I just don't get why people go into medicine if they want that life
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There are many reasons to go into medicine. Each person gets to chose their own path.
 
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A lot of hospitalist positions are 7 on and 7 off right? If you worked part time that would be 1 week of work followed by 3 weeks off? 200k avg / 2 = 100k working 1 week a month?!!!!??!

edit: I read somewhere that sometimes 2 people who want to work part time split a full time hospitalist position
 
CDI said:
After so many long hours/years invested, coupled with sacrificing time with friends & family, I can see why people choose a lighter career track or even part-time. I'd consider it myself someday as well. I guess you could say there is such a thing as 'too much medicine'.
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3 days a week? Yea, that's called lazy.
 
JP2740 said:
3 days a week? Yea, that's called lazy.
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Many doctors who work 3 days a week work around 40 hrs a week. I would estimate most Americans work around 40 hrs a week. I met a cardiothoracic surgeon, with a little girl he never sees, that mentioned in retrospect he'd likely do something else. So I guess it depends on your values and goals.

I can understand those who decide to dedicate their life to patients, and also those who would rather work 40 hrs and spend more time with family. You only live once.

Good luck. I hope you accomplish your goals.
 
Peds! there are a couple at my school who only work mornings.

Oh and outpatient gyn. Although this is a little harder to do right out of residency.
 
Derm, EM, urgent care.

These things are out there, but you shouldn't go into medicine thinking you are going to do a part time job.
 
100% disagree. Some people don't want the same lifestyle as you. If you are content with making less money (studies have shown that at a certain salary level, well below what even a FM doctor makes, your level of happiness doesn't rise with an increase in salary.... anybody who has been apart of some worldly and meaningful experiences can testify to this). So, if you can live contently from the salary you would make working 3-4 days a week, why would you not spend that other time enjoying your life and being around friends and family. Not laziness, intelligence and a craving for LIFE!!
 
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JP2740 said:
3 days a week? Yea, that's called lazy.
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Did you consider that a person might do more than sit on their ass the other half of their time? Possibly do something that genuinely interests them other than medicine?

I know of several practicing physicians who happen to be into business. Real estate, banks, consulting, etc. Many of these choices don't take up ALL your time because you don't have to physically be there. I was actually interviewed by a physician who practices, and is also an associate for a management consulting firm.

And yet others may choose to do 3 days...and go fishing for 4 days. Don't see anything wrong in that either.
 
FSU2013 said:
Derm, EM, urgent care.

These things are out there, but you shouldn't go into medicine thinking you are going to do a part time job.
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Says who? Why not just do what makes you happy, while being comfortable? You'll probably do a better job when you are on your shift then the guy next to you who is miserable and hates having to work so much.

I'd rather go to the doctor who wants to be there.
 
FunnyDocMan1234 said:
I want to live my life with 3-4 day weekends even if it means making 80k/year so money isn't an issue. I just don't want people to guilt-trip me about not working full time or have animosity in the hospital due to this. So what specialties are the best/worst for this (and you won't feel like patients are dying/can't get treatment because of your choice)?
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Dentistry.
 
At a minimum, doctors should work 40 hours, IMO. Medical school is a zero-sum game and each spot is extremely valuable. We aren't hedge fund managers or MBAs or any other type of job out there that can be trained on demand. The way the US system of physician training is setup, each student holds a coveted spot that will take nearly a decade to realize their training.

I can understand not wanting to work 80, 100 hours a week, but at the same time, each student should feel a sense of duty to provide given the incredible investment made with each student.
 
notbobtrustme said:
At a minimum, doctors should work 40 hours, IMO. Medical school is a zero-sum game and each spot is extremely valuable. We aren't hedge fund managers or MBAs or any other type of job out there that can be trained on demand. The way the US system of physician training is setup, each student holds a coveted spot that will take nearly a decade to realize their training.

I can understand not wanting to work 80, 100 hours a week, but at the same time, each student should feel a sense of duty to provide given the incredible investment made with each student.
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Give me that decade of time back I lost with my family and friends and I'll put in the extra hours.
 
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notbobtrustme said:
At a minimum, doctors should work 40 hours, IMO. Medical school is a zero-sum game and each spot is extremely valuable. We aren't hedge fund managers or MBAs or any other type of job out there that can be trained on demand. The way the US system of physician training is setup, each student holds a coveted spot that will take nearly a decade to realize their training.

I can understand not wanting to work 80, 100 hours a week, but at the same time, each student should feel a sense of duty to provide given the incredible investment made with each student.
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Hahaha. Thank God I'm free to do whatever I want, and not what others think I have to do for society... comrade.

Anesthesia is a field which has some 7-4, no call no weekend positions, though most jobs are not like that. We call it the mommy track.

Good luck.
 
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CDI said:
Says who? Why not just do what makes you happy, while being comfortable? You'll probably do a better job when you are on your shift then the guy next to you who is miserable and hates having to work so much.

I'd rather go to the doctor who wants to be there.
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1. Medicine is exceedingly demanding. It takes dedication. To put yourself through med school and residency for a "part time job" borders on insanity. If your goal is lifestyle, I don't think you could make yourself put up with the stuff you have to for near a decade to get to the "lifestyle" point.

2. There is a shortage of physicians is nearly every specialty. If you want a part time job, do something else and let the guy behind you in line for acceptance to a med school get the nod.

3. You'll almost definitely make more per hour practicing medicine than anything else you would do. Could you practice real estate? Sure, but you'd be losing money. Academics (usually) make less per hour doing non-clinical work.

4. Medicine inherently isn't a part time job. It's very dynamic and will take a certain amount of time just to stay up to date. I've talked to one of my mentors about this. He spends about half the time in clinic now that he's in academics and says he has trouble remembering all of the medication dosage.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating for physicians to do 80 hour work weeks and not have a work/life balance. There are lifestyle specialties, and I'm even going into one that's a little more family friendly. I'm just saying that if lifestyle is your goal, going to med school doesn't seem practical.
 
CDI said:
Give me that decade of time back I lost with my family and friends and I'll put in the extra hours.
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It's not like you were kidnapped and forced to become a doctor. You went into the field, presumably, with the knowledge of what medical training is required.
 
FSU2013 said:
1. Medicine is exceedingly demanding. It takes dedication. To put yourself through med school and residency for a "part time job" borders on insanity. If your goal is lifestyle, I don't think you could make yourself put up with the stuff you have to for near a decade to get to the "lifestyle" point.

2. There is a shortage of physicians is nearly every specialty. If you want a part time job, do something else and let the guy behind you in line for acceptance to a med school get the nod.

3. You'll almost definitely make more per hour practicing medicine than anything else you would do. Could you practice real estate? Sure, but you'd be losing money. Academics (usually) make less per hour doing non-clinical work.

4. Medicine inherently isn't a part time job. It's very dynamic and will take a certain amount of time just to stay up to date. I've talked to one of my mentors about this. He spends about half the time in clinic now that he's in academics and says he has trouble remembering all of the medication dosage.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating for physicians to do 80 hour work weeks and not have a work/life balance. There are lifestyle specialties, and I'm even going into one that's a little more family friendly. I'm just saying that if lifestyle is your goal, going to med school doesn't seem practical.
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Chances are people in this thread are already in or at the tail-end of med school, or beyond. It's not as easy to back-track and pick up skills to go another track. (And those with heavy loans may be in even more of a crunch.)

2. The "shortage of physicians" claim never made much sense to me. We've heard it over and over but the number of residency spots doesn't increase. If there was a shortage you'd think there would be some more attention given to this issue. Instead we keep hearing about increased physician burn-out. I know of a surgical resident who dropped out in 5th yr. The system just killed his motivation to practice further. He was instantly hired as a healthcare consultant w/ a comfortable 6 fig salary because he has a medical degree and they needed his input. He's still making a difference in the field, just in a non-traditional way. Did his surgical spot/skills go to waste...possibly.

3. I disagree. There are ways to make more money per hour compared to practicing medicine. By the time that consultant reaches partner he'll be making more playing golf than he would hunched over an operating table.

4. Staying up to date isn't really all that. How much really changes any given year? Getting your renewal/CMEs seems like a joke. I know someone who's at a medical conference right now, laying on the beach, getting their CME credits...
 
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notbobtrustme said:
It's not like you were kidnapped and forced to become a doctor. You went into the field, presumably, with the knowledge of what medical training is required.
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Sure, I knew what medical training required. However, good thing there's no "practice" requirement after that. Cruise control sounds nice.
 
With regard to 7 on/7 off hospitalist positions... are those usually 12 hour shifts? If so, working 84 hours a week e/o week sounds pretty miserable, even with the entire week off in between.
 
CityLights said:
With regard to 7 on/7 off hospitalist positions... are those usually 12 hour shifts? If so, working 84 hours a week e/o week sounds pretty miserable, even with the entire week off in between.
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Hospitalist is a miserable job. All these green-horns thinking they only work half the year have no clue what they're talking about. That week "on" is living and breathing the job. No time for anything else. That week "off"? Well, the first couple days are pure recovery. Mainly sleep. The next days are running all the errands you were unable to attend to during the previous week. One day of being able to get hammered, or whatever else it is you do. Then those last 2-3 days are spent in utter dread of the 7 day blast of work to come.

And don't even get me started on what the job itself entails. I would rather rape my eye socket with a stick of rhubarb than do inpatient hospitalist medicine.
 
As IlDestriero said above, thank Jesus your opinions on how much I should work aren't worth a bucket of spit.
 
JP2740 said:
3 days a week? Yea, that's called lazy.
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you cant call anyone who is board certified lazy.. maybe its beyond your comprehension, but just because someone wants to be a dr. doesnt mean they want to work 80/hr a week, get 3 divorces, and die on the way to work at 51 from a heart attack.
 
CDI said:
3. I disagree. There are ways to make more money per hour compared to practicing medicine. By the time that consultant reaches partner he'll be making more playing golf than he would hunched over an operating table.
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Yeah, there are many ways to make money. Profits are better than wages. If you have an idea or create a business that can make money, it has potential to earn much more than you could working for wages - even as a doc.

Ask Dr. Sattar who created Pathoma, if there are other ways to earn money than clocking hours as a pathologist. His business likely earns more than he did as a pathologist and it's basically on autopilot right now. Also the guys running Doctors in Training.
 
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JP2740 said:
3 days a week? Yea, that's called lazy.
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You must not be familiar with EM...The doc I shadowed all through college usually worked three 12-hour shifts a week. He had a young son he wanted to spend time with, but he was/is anything but lazy. Get a clue, not everyone has to devote their lives to their careers.
 
someguy321 said:
you cant call anyone who is board certified lazy.. maybe its beyond your comprehension, but just because someone wants to be a dr. doesnt mean they want to work 80/hr a week, get 3 divorces, and die on the way to work at 51 from a heart attack.
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Yea that was exactly what I suggested. I think everyone should work 80 hours, get 3 divorces, and die from heart attacks. :rolleyes:

And yea I can call board certified people lazy. There are plenty of people in my class who don't put in a lot of work and will eventually graduate. You guys are acting like I said everyone should work 100 hours a work and take vows of no marriage. Personally, I think working 3 days a week is ridiculous.
 
CDI said:
2. The "shortage of physicians" claim never made much sense to me. We've heard it over and over but the number of residency spots doesn't increase. If there was a shortage you'd think there would be some more attention given to this issue. Instead we keep hearing about increased physician burn-out. I know of a surgical resident who dropped out in 5th yr. The system just killed his motivation to practice further. He was instantly hired as a healthcare consultant w/ a comfortable 6 fig salary because he has a medical degree and they needed his input. He's still making a difference in the field, just in a non-traditional way. Did his surgical spot/skills go to waste...possibly.

3. I disagree. There are ways to make more money per hour compared to practicing medicine. By the time that consultant reaches partner he'll be making more playing golf than he would hunched over an operating table.

4. Staying up to date isn't really all that. How much really changes any given year? Getting your renewal/CMEs seems like a joke. I know someone who's at a medical conference right now, laying on the beach, getting their CME credits...
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The number of physician residency spots is a function of government funding. Do you really trust that I'd there was a problem, the government would address it? I don't.

Are there ways to make more money per hour than clinical work? Yes. Is it common? No. Most physicians I know that have other endeavors are complaining about how to get out of it. Physicians are bad investors of epic proportions. Sure, some guys will make boatloads of money outside of medicine. Most will just get a headache.

I didnt really mean "staying up to date" with respect to CME. CME and staying up to date on medicine are two different things. Beyond that, I don't even necessarily mean learning new medicine or acquiring new skills. If you don't do something often enough, you will lose your skills.
 
FSU2013 said:
I didnt really mean "staying up to date" with respect to CME. CME and staying up to date on medicine are two different things. Beyond that, I don't even necessarily mean learning new medicine or acquiring new skills. If you don't do something often enough, you will lose your skills.
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This one comes up regularly on SDN. Federally funded academic physicians are generally limited (NIH training grant holders and others) to about 20% clinical time. Even if not by rule, this is a common amount (10-25% clinical time). Although not always strictly followed, it generally is. This includes both junior and senior faculty. I do two months a year of full-time clinical service as well as some weekends and nights. I have followed this pattern for my entire career of more than two decades as an attending.

I must be incompetent at patient care for only working clinically about 20% total time. I even have to look up medication doses sometimes, that my full-time clinical colleagues probably don't.
 
kindasorta said:
Hospitalist is a miserable job. All these green-horns thinking they only work half the year have no clue what they're talking about. That week "on" is living and breathing the job. No time for anything else. That week "off"? Well, the first couple days are pure recovery. Mainly sleep. The next days are running all the errands you were unable to attend to during the previous week. One day of being able to get hammered, or whatever else it is you do. Then those last 2-3 days are spent in utter dread of the 7 day blast of work to come.

And don't even get me started on what the job itself entails. I would rather rape my eye socket with a stick of rhubarb than do inpatient hospitalist medicine.
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While IM is not for me, this is a major exaggeration. Sure working 7 12h days in a row is tough, but its hardly the brutal experience you're describing. Many of our rotations have 12h days or longer for 6 days in a row with only 1 day off. Adding 1 more work day for 6 days off sounds fantastic. You hardly need 2-3 days of sleep to recover for a week where you can still sleep 8 hours a night (12 hours on means 12 hours off).

Hospitalist burn out is common, but its less about the schedule and more about the general issues with inpatient medicine: Lots of administrative overhead, babysitting for other services, all the consults/care coordination, and high patient census.
 
As for the OPs question, I'm sure its possible to find part-time gigs in most fields. Surgical fields would be tougher, but is certainly possible for shift work type scenarios (e.g. trauma or acute care surgery). Fields that already work in shifts like hospitalists, ER docs, intensivists, etc. probably lend themselves to part-time work more easily.

Ignore all the judgement about how you want to work. If you find a setup that makes you and your family happy, then that's all that matters.
 
oldbearprofessor said:
This one comes up regularly on SDN. Federally funded academic physicians are generally limited (NIH training grant holders and others) to about 20% clinical time. Even if not by rule, this is a common amount (10-25% clinical time). Although not always strictly followed, it generally is. This includes both junior and senior faculty. I do two months a year of full-time clinical service as well as some weekends and nights. I have followed this pattern for my entire career of more than two decades as an attending.

I must be incompetent at patient care for only working clinically about 20% total time. I even have to look up medication doses sometimes, that my full-time clinical colleagues probably don't.
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Obviously, (or maybe not obviously) that was not my intention. I was not calling anyone a bad doctor and I was not bashing academicians. I just meant to say that there is certainly a minimum amount of time required to remain competent - and even that can be subjective as there are certainly different levels of competency. The time required to remain competent is going to dependent on the specialty and the individual. If you're a surgeon who only operates 1/2 day a week, it seems reasonable to assume you will be somewhat rusty when compared to the full time clinician who spends 3 days a week in the OR.

Jerry Rice ran the best routes in football. In his prime, he was practically unstoppable. That being said, I'd take Crabtree over Rice today. Rice was better, but Crabtree is doing it now and has practiced more lately.

I'm not saying you have to spend 80 hours a week to stay good at something, I'm not saying you have to spend 40 hours a week to stay good at something. I'm just saying that it takes some finite amount of time to stay good at something. Medicine is something that takes practice, we can argue about the amount of practice, but it takes practice. If your goal is to put in the minimum, I don't think you'll be as good as someone else who wants to be great. I just don't believe it's in the patient's best interest to have a part time doctor (and I'm not saying academicians are part-time doctors) or at least someone who has a stated goal of being part time. Feel free to disagree with me, that's fine. I may be wrong, I just think we owe it to our patients to be great at what we do.
 
Seriously people do what makes you happy

YOLO
 
IlDestriero said:
So it's A-OK for an academic physician to practice clinical medicine one week a month (or less), on probably sicker patients, but it's not OK for Joe Punter to want to work 3 days a week?
Makes sense.
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You seem to be attempting to let logic enter into this discussion. This is the internet. You should know better.
 
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