Hello All,
This is a very specific question. I have already gone through all of the threads pertaining to this topic, read the NYSED rules about moonlighting, contacted them AND gotten a response, so please refrain from posting what most of us already know. This is a copy of a conversation that I had with the NYSED:
My 1st Mail:
To whom it may concern:
I have been going through the NY law regarding the ability of non-LCME graduates to receive licenses in NY while current residents in ACGME-accredited programs, primarily for the purposes of moonlighting.
Currently, in order to receive an unrestricted license in NYS, an IMG is required to be done with 3 years of post-graduate training (internal medicine residency length). Therefore, in order to moonlight externally, and to receive external malpractice, the IMG must be done with his/her residency. This is in accordance with the License Requirements on NYSED's page.
However, under section § 6525 covering exempt persons, it clearly states:
Thus, the reason for this email, to clarify the current state of internal moonlighting among international medical graduates. I am aware that J1-visa holders are not allowed to work externally.
Their 1st response:
Hello,
I’m sorry but I’m a bit confused. Are you asking if you can do overtime? As you mentioned, you would be limited to the hospital where you are already doing the residency and restricted to no more than 80 hours in a work week. Would be getting paid by a separate entity? Would you be working in a different specialty? What would be different about the moonlighting work that you think it might not be allowed?
My 2nd mail:
Yes; the question is whether we can work overtime, as long as it is within the 80 hour cap. The residency is in internal medicine, and if one is to work outside mandatory rotation hours, the residency program would through its financial department pay for it.
The plan would be to work within the same specialty but also if could extend to the hospital’s ED or other entities owned by the health system for instance nursing homes.
The moonlighting legality to work confusions stems from NYSED saying indirectly on one an independent license is required to moonlight but not differentiating between internal and external moonlighting ( why would one need an independent license to work overtime in the same facility?). Technically , IMGs can only get independent licenses after completing residency so the general understanding is they cannot moonlight in NY, but this doesn’t address internal overtime.
Please feel free to contact me if anything is unclear
Their final response:
Hello,
It is up to the facility to determine. If your employing hospital deems this “moonlighting” to be outside of your residency and treated differently administratively on their end, then you are not covered under the residency exemption and would need a license. If they consider it the same as your residency work but just extra hours, then the residency exemption applies.
Kind Regards,
Back to the question: Does anyone know of any program in NYS that allows internal moonlighting without the need of a license? The only policy I found online was from 2015, Suny Downstate medical center makes mention of internal moonlighters not needing a license (I will link the policy below and upload), but perhaps because it's ranking time, I had not gotten a response when i e-mailed them.
Of note, I'm already doing residency in Western NY, and when I broached the topic, my PD wanted to see if any other program in NYS was doing it. I know it is a lengthy question, but any real input would be highly appreciated.
This is a very specific question. I have already gone through all of the threads pertaining to this topic, read the NYSED rules about moonlighting, contacted them AND gotten a response, so please refrain from posting what most of us already know. This is a copy of a conversation that I had with the NYSED:
My 1st Mail:
To whom it may concern:
I have been going through the NY law regarding the ability of non-LCME graduates to receive licenses in NY while current residents in ACGME-accredited programs, primarily for the purposes of moonlighting.
Currently, in order to receive an unrestricted license in NYS, an IMG is required to be done with 3 years of post-graduate training (internal medicine residency length). Therefore, in order to moonlight externally, and to receive external malpractice, the IMG must be done with his/her residency. This is in accordance with the License Requirements on NYSED's page.
However, under section § 6525 covering exempt persons, it clearly states:
- Any physician who is employed as a resident in a public hospital, provided such practice is limited to such hospital and is under the supervision of a licensed physician;
Thus, the reason for this email, to clarify the current state of internal moonlighting among international medical graduates. I am aware that J1-visa holders are not allowed to work externally.
Their 1st response:
Hello,
I’m sorry but I’m a bit confused. Are you asking if you can do overtime? As you mentioned, you would be limited to the hospital where you are already doing the residency and restricted to no more than 80 hours in a work week. Would be getting paid by a separate entity? Would you be working in a different specialty? What would be different about the moonlighting work that you think it might not be allowed?
My 2nd mail:
Yes; the question is whether we can work overtime, as long as it is within the 80 hour cap. The residency is in internal medicine, and if one is to work outside mandatory rotation hours, the residency program would through its financial department pay for it.
The plan would be to work within the same specialty but also if could extend to the hospital’s ED or other entities owned by the health system for instance nursing homes.
The moonlighting legality to work confusions stems from NYSED saying indirectly on one an independent license is required to moonlight but not differentiating between internal and external moonlighting ( why would one need an independent license to work overtime in the same facility?). Technically , IMGs can only get independent licenses after completing residency so the general understanding is they cannot moonlight in NY, but this doesn’t address internal overtime.
Please feel free to contact me if anything is unclear
Their final response:
Hello,
It is up to the facility to determine. If your employing hospital deems this “moonlighting” to be outside of your residency and treated differently administratively on their end, then you are not covered under the residency exemption and would need a license. If they consider it the same as your residency work but just extra hours, then the residency exemption applies.
Kind Regards,
Back to the question: Does anyone know of any program in NYS that allows internal moonlighting without the need of a license? The only policy I found online was from 2015, Suny Downstate medical center makes mention of internal moonlighters not needing a license (I will link the policy below and upload), but perhaps because it's ranking time, I had not gotten a response when i e-mailed them.
Of note, I'm already doing residency in Western NY, and when I broached the topic, my PD wanted to see if any other program in NYS was doing it. I know it is a lengthy question, but any real input would be highly appreciated.
