Is joining the army, navy, or airforce going to pay off debt faster?

[IcySpice06]

My only holdback is my serious g/f who has some concerns w/ the military in general. A long winded response, but wanted to share my thoughts on this

Tell her that women in the Air Force (or wives/girlfriends of military men) have really strong networks. I am so impressed with the way the military promotes family values and community on base by sponcoring activities. One recent event employed a giant bouncing castle for the kids and an American Gladiator-style joust. Living on base is really safe, and military benefits off-base are numerous. You don't have to agree with the war on terror to find the good in securing and protecting our nation. I'm a liberal who thinks that serving in the military is a very rewarding opportunity. And I'm not the only one.

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[shamrock2006]

all those going out for either the army/navy/air force HPSP? have you already applied for it or is it still in the works?

 

[IcySpice06]

all those going out for either the army/navy/air force HPSP? have you already applied for it or is it still in the works?

My application is all complete except for a letter of acceptance ... when I get that (fingers-crossed), I can mail that puppy off!

 

[shamrock2006]

what branch are you going out for?

 

[IcySpice06]

what branch are you going out for?

Air Force. Are you applying for HPSP?

 

[shamrock2006]

I am...apparently I have to go in next week to interview w/ some major...are they making you do this? Of course, this is all a waste of time if I dont get accepted to dental school ha ha..trying to stay positive though

 

[IcySpice06]

I am...apparently I have to go in next week to interview w/ some major...are they making you do this? Of course, this is all a waste of time if I dont get accepted to dental school ha ha..trying to stay positive though

I talked to a Lieutenant Colonel. She was okay. But, be sure you know why you're applying for the scholarship because, she was being really suspicious of me for whatever reason. I was like, Look Lady I went to MEPS at 5 in the morning and had my modesty completely destroyed ... what else do you want from me to prove it?! (didn't really say that... but was thinking it for sure )

 

[shamrock2006]

yea i went through all that garbage too...MEPS was a pain, the probe and poke you like your a terrorist. not to mention I spent about 2 hours in my underwear on a cold a$$ room with 20 other guys...let me tell you how fun THAT was

 

[IcySpice06]

Oh no, tell me about it! The "visual" gender exam sure was an experience... straight for the pit of hell!

 

[IcySpice06]

Are you going Air Force too? If so, when are you planning to leave for COT?

 

[shamrock2006]

and the doctors administering the physicals had very cold, unfriendly hands...although I will say that I was treated better than the enlisted folk..when they all saw i was going for commission the attitude definitely stoppped

 

[shamrock2006]

I plan on leaving for COT as soon as I know i have the scholarship haha...of course like i said I dont even know if i'll get into school this cycle or not...but I'd like to go ASAP...my recruiter hasn't really told me about the dates of it or anything...but i'll ask him when i see him tuesday

 

[shamrock2006]

and yes, i'm going for the Air Force...my uncle is a surgeon in the USAf..a colonel now i believe, and my dad is in the reserves..so its something i know quite a bit about

 

[IcySpice06]

I plan on leaving for COT as soon as I know i have the scholarship haha...of course like i said I dont even know if i'll get into school this cycle or not...but I'd like to go ASAP...my recruiter hasn't really told me about the dates of it or anything...but i'll ask him when i see him tuesday

Well, if you go first of June I'll see you there! And if not, smart move getting it done early! Alabama is the only location for it right? Did you get that DVD? Hahaha... Keep me posted on the status of your app via PM. I'm interested to know how it goes for you!

 

[armorshell]

I was thinking about talking to an Air Force recruiter...less so I can get all my loans paid off, more so that if theres a manned mars mission anytime soon, I can be the crew dentist

 

[IcySpice06]

I was thinking about talking to an Air Force recruiter...less so I can get all my loans paid off, more so that if theres a manned mars mission anytime soon, I can be the crew dentist

Great Idea! I heard the Martians are struggling from a huge shortage of quality dental care... Did you hear they methanate their water??

 

[shamrock2006]

Well, if you go first of June I'll see you there! And if not, smart move getting it done early! Alabama is the only location for it right? Did you get that DVD? Hahaha... Keep me posted on the status of your app via PM. I'm interested to know how it goes for you!

Yeah i believe Alabama is where COT is held for the medical/law personell...everyone else who has a college degree but not going for any professional training goes to Texas i think for OTS...but who knows...yea i'll def. keep you updated. Good luck!!

 

[drem2006]

As a recent dental school graduate with friends working as military dentists, I'd like to put in my two cents.
Yes, all of what I have seen posted is true and great about practicing in the military.
However, also take into consideration what kind of dentistry you want to be practicing, if you are not going to specialize, which really you won't know until your third year of dental school.
In the military, you do not do the same type of restorative work as you would in private or group practice. My friends say they do a lot of "amalgam crowns", basically teeth that need crowns, but the govt won't pay for indirect restorations most of the time. I don't think they use composite, and I don't think they do much with porcelain, either. Both are more expensive. I'm not suggesting that the work they do is below the standard of care, but it is not work my patients would want in their mouths.
I work for a very large national group practice that is privately owned. I have no overhead to worry about. We use composite only, no amalgam. I restore implants and do pretty much only porcelain crowns. They pay all of my health insurance, malpractice insurance, I have 401k options, etc. And, I earn about 125k.
I don't think the military is a bad way to go at all. Having no debt right now would be awesome, but I would not trade it for being able to do the kind of work that I want to do.

 

[jmick101]

As a recent dental school graduate with friends working as military dentists, I'd like to put in my two cents.
Yes, all of what I have seen posted is true and great about practicing in the military.
However, also take into consideration what kind of dentistry you want to be practicing, if you are not going to specialize, which really you won't know until your third year of dental school.
In the military, you do not do the same type of restorative work as you would in private or group practice. My friends say they do a lot of "amalgam crowns", basically teeth that need crowns, but the govt won't pay for indirect restorations most of the time. I don't think they use composite, and I don't think they do much with porcelain, either. Both are more expensive. I'm not suggesting that the work they do is below the standard of care, but it is not work my patients would want in their mouths.
I work for a very large national group practice that is privately owned. I have no overhead to worry about. We use composite only, no amalgam. I restore implants and do pretty much only porcelain crowns. They pay all of my health insurance, malpractice insurance, I have 401k options, etc. And, I earn about 125k.
I don't think the military is a bad way to go at all. Having no debt right now would be awesome, but I would not trade it for being able to do the kind of work that I want to do.

Great points! Thanks for the information. I wish the army would switch over to composite like the everyone else. Same goes for porcelain. I would add the things that you have said to the "cons" category of military dentistry, but it still isnt compelling enough to say "no" to the "pros."

 

[DMD2005]

I've already graduated from dental school and I considered this route as well.

Consider this: you are going to owe them year for year for the years they paid for dental school. So that's FOUR years of active duty. READ THE FINE PRINT which recruiters ALWAYS gloss over - after those FOUR years, you will also owe them SEVEN, yes SEVEN, years of RESERVE duty. In times of war, YOU WILL BE called up as a RESERVIST. Additionally, if our foreign conflicts continue past this, the military CAN HOLD YOU IN until the conflicts are over. Therefore, they can PREVENT you from going on with your life...e.g. starting a practice. My brother was scheduled to retire and they DID NOT let him out on time.

It is a very noble act to serve our military...but go into this kind of situation knowing the truth. Chances are, your recruiter gets bonuses based on YOU signing up.

In the end, I decided I'd rather owe someone MONEY than my TIME.

 

[KOM]

i remember reading a report about this last year and they pay b/w $40,000 and 50,000 a year. they pay the specialists 10,000$ more per year.

Dentists become captains in the Air Force. I was told by my recruiterthat they make a starting salary of $~75,000. Then I read somewhere that they make ~$45,000. I have a big problem with trusting anything these guys tell me.

I was also told that you have 4 years of active duty and 4 years of reserve or inactive duty to complete. The 4 years of active comes after school and the 4 years that you're in school counts for the 4 years of inactive duty. Does that sound right?

 

[reapply2007]

While in school you are 0-1 for two years then 0-2 for two years. You receive pay at these pay grades while in school. At four years in service you become 0-3 (Army/Air Force Captain or Navy Lieutenant). You can access a military pay table with a google search. The columns are for years of total military service, the rows for your rank. You start denal school typically with 0 years service. When you make 0-2 you have two years, 0-3 you have four years service. On top of pay you will recieve a housing allowance which is tax free, if you do not live on station. This allowance is based on your zip code. You can also find current housing allowance rates with a google search, enter a zip code and your rank and the amount will come up.

Individual ready reserve commitment is either 7 or 8 years from your first day in service. If you get out before this time is up the military can recall you to duty if you are needed, before this time expires. This is what has been called the back door draft. If you aren't called up then you are a civilian during this time period. You could go into actual reserves or guard and do the "weekend" warrior lifestyle. The guard and reserve are and have been very heavily deployed in the last few years. If you retire you are subject to being recalled to service, if you are needed, for the rest of your life.

 

[jmick101]

I've already graduated from dental school and I considered this route as well.

Consider this: you are going to owe them year for year for the years they paid for dental school. So that's FOUR years of active duty. READ THE FINE PRINT which recruiters ALWAYS gloss over - after those FOUR years, you will also owe them SEVEN, yes SEVEN, years of RESERVE duty. In times of war, YOU WILL BE called up as a RESERVIST. Additionally, if our foreign conflicts continue past this, the military CAN HOLD YOU IN until the conflicts are over. Therefore, they can PREVENT you from going on with your life...e.g. starting a practice. My brother was scheduled to retire and they DID NOT let him out on time.

It is a very noble act to serve our military...but go into this kind of situation knowing the truth. Chances are, your recruiter gets bonuses based on YOU signing up.

In the end, I decided I'd rather owe someone MONEY than my TIME.

Everyone makes recruiters out to be these conniving types that just gloss over or lie about everything unpleasant about military life. That has not been my experience at all with either the guy who signed me up after high school, or the one who is working with me now. He came over and answered all of my questions and all of my wifes questions. He told my wife about how often I could get deployed, for how long, and the casualty rates for medical personel. Nothing sugarcoated, nothing "glossed over." He also explained the commitment you agree to is an active duty/ready reserve commitment that always totals 8 years, which I had already known. I am not really sure where you get 7 years of IRR time from, I have never heard that before.

 

[reapply2007]

Someone also mentioned not getting out of the military even though your contract is up. This called "stop loss" - basically the president can decide that the nation needs to keep military members in the military regardless of contract status, in order to support and defend the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic. Stop loss has been used in the most recent five years and will doubtlessly be used again in the future. Yes, it sucks to be stop lossed. Many people have lived through it and survived the consequences it had on their lives.

As a suggestion, I would say if a strongly top-down control structure is disturbing to you that you might not be well suited for the military.

 

[KOM]

Everyone makes recruiters out to be these conniving types that just gloss over or lie about everything unpleasant about military life. That has not been my experience at all with either the guy who signed me up after high school, or the one who is working with me now. He came over and answered all of my questions and all of my wifes questions. He told my wife about how often I could get deployed, for how long, and the casualty rates for medical personel. Nothing sugarcoated, nothing "glossed over." He also explained the commitment you agree to is an active duty/ready reserve commitment that always totals 8 years, which I had already known. I am not really sure where you get 7 years of IRR time from, I have never heard that before.

So what are the casualty rates?

 

[jmick101]

"No dentist has been killed in the line of duty. A couple of doctors but no dentists." That's what the recruiter said.

 

[johntara04]

Let me address this one more time. You were probably a kick-a$$ dental student with great grades, abilities and board scores.

I currently work as an assistant for a doctor that graduated last year (2005) with a 2.3 gpa and low board scores. Out of school he recieved 3 offers to associate, but decided to start his own practice from scratch. 17 months later he is taking home over $13,000 a month. It does not matter what your grades are, how good your techinque is, or what your board scores are. Patients will come to you if they like you, and if they don't like you, they won't come.

Before I moved to school, I worked for another doctor that had just recently bought a practice from another dentist. The previous dentist had done the crappiest work I have ever seen. It was ugly, technically incorrect and every other patient was getting something redone that the previous doctor had put in. Basically you could say that this dentist sucked. BUT, her patients loved her and would always go on and on about how great of a doctor she was, and how they had never had such a wonderful dentist and why wasn't she still around. In dental practice, grades, boards, and ability will almost always take a back seat to likeablility.

 

[Cablindian]

I have considered applying for the Army and Navy scholarships, but then I had to think about more than the money. What if I get shipped off to Iraq, a place where the US has no business being in the first place, and wind up getting killed by some roadbomb or enemy fire? Will it really make a difference that the Army has paid my tuition if I'm dead???

 

[Al4short]

First, let me introduce myself...I am an Army Health Care Recruiter. I pride myself on my integrity and won't compromise it for anyone or anything. We don't get paid extra for each person we put in the Army. I make the same amount of money as a recruiter, as I did as a Nurse.

With the Scholarship, all tuition, books and fees are paid, (keep in mind with books, they cover the required materials of a traditional program). It doesn't matter if you go to an Ivy League school or one that's less expensive. They also pay a monthly stipend, (currently the amount is $1,319, taxable). The stipend goes up every July, and is usually increased at the same rate that congress increases the Active Duty pay.

You enter school at the rank of O-1, and are promoted to O-3 upon graduation.

Your years toward pay, start the day you are commissioned. So, if you get the scholarship, and are commissioned 2 weeks before school starts, that's when your time for pay starts.

During your 4th year of Dental school, you can apply for AGD-1.

The obligation is 1 for 1. For every year you receive the scholarship, you owe one on active duty. Everyone that joins the military has a service obligation of 8 years, it's a matter of how much time you have to do on active duty, the rest of it is spent in either, an active reserve status, or inactive reserve status.

 

[t man]

what happens to my undergraduate loans? are they repaid? ...because i have to admit, this option doesn't sound bad at all if i have absolutely no educational debt to worry about. also, are there any signing bonuses, etc., that are offered?

 

[pine88]

what happens to my undergraduate loans? are they repaid? ...because i have to admit, this option doesn't sound bad at all if i have absolutely no educational debt to worry about. also, are there any signing bonuses, etc., that are offered?

I was told you get a $30,000 signing bonus you receive at your first assignment (post dental school). I don't think they repay your undergrad loans tho.

 

[t man]

mannnnn... i'm greedy! that 30K signing bonus does sound nice however

 

[4thQtrDreams]

What is the Obligation for the University of the Pacific, which is a 3 year dental school? Is it still 1 for 1? what further commitment is there? 1 year of reserve as well for each year paid?

 

[reapply2007]

This thread reappears every month around the twentieth. I look forward to the December - Holiday revival. Either that, or reset your outlook calendar reminder to a different date. Tons of stuff on military medicine is discussed, rediscussed, and rediscussed again on the military medicine forum of SDN.

I've never heard of a 30K bonus for military dentistry. If you enlist for at least three years in the Army you can get up to 60K in student loans repaid by the Army. The 60K is taxable income in the year it is repaid (20K annually accross three years, you incurr an annual out-of-pocket tax liability of about 7K) This is only good in the Army. The only extra money I've heard of for dentists other than while you are is school is that for dentists there is dental incentive pay once you finish school and get to your duty station. Doctors and other health professionals also get similar incentive pay based on their specialty. This money is distributed on significant anniversary dates and when you extend your contract beyond the minimum amount of years.

 

[Nomar]

I've been corresponding with a Navy recruiter. He told me the starting salary would be $70,000/yr. You get 30 paid holidays a year, plus all federal holidays (10) I think. You work for them for 4 yrs on a 4 yr scholarship, and are on reserve for 3 following that. For Navy the guy said that you could basically go where you wanted. As for afganistan, he said most dentists that would go over there are looking to make a military career and it looks good on their records. I am contemplating it, although being a dual citizen I would have to give up my Canadian in order to qualify. It would take so long to pay off $300k debt (out of state obviously) especially with interest accruing from day 1. Fair amount to think about really.

 

[jmick101]

What is the Obligation for the University of the Pacific, which is a 3 year dental school? Is it still 1 for 1? what further commitment is there? 1 year of reserve as well for each year paid?

The active duty obligation is still four years because the Army pays four years worth of tuition. The inactive reserve obligation is another 4 years.

 

[jmick101]

Your years toward pay, start the day you are commissioned. So, if you get the scholarship, and are commissioned 2 weeks before school starts, that's when your time for pay starts.

Let me get this straight, my time in Dental School will count towards my years in service? I have already done 3 years enlisted, will this mean that I will be an 0-3 with 6 or 7 years in when I start getting paid? If that is right, that is good news.

 

[sejin8642]

I have seen a lot of military recruiter and things they said about paying for my education sound very attactive. But something keeps me from joining the military lol.

 

[4thQtrDreams]

The active duty obligation is still four years because the Army pays four years worth of tuition. The inactive reserve obligation is another 4 years.

That sucks...

 

[BomberDoc]

Don't believe the hype. Joining the military for money reasons is absolutely the wrong thing to do. In fact, I can't think of a single good reason to join the military. The entire spectrum of military healthcare is badly broken. If you choose to listen to a recruiter, also do yourself the favor of listening to someone who has been there and done that. I am a physician, but work with dentists who suffer similarly.

Here are a few things I wish someone had told me.

You will not have a choice of where you are based.
You will not get the training you want.
You will deploy more often and for longer than you were supposed to.
You will be forced to do idiotic mandatory training that has nothing to do with your job.
You will be hindered by inefficient staff, antique equipment, and weighty bureaucracy.
The bottom line and the almighty dollar are more important than you or your patients.

 

[shamrock2006]

i think what some people dont realize is....yes, there is a 4 yr inactive reserve requirement and 4 active...for a grand total of 8...but your 4 years of dental school ARE your 4 yrs of inactive reserve b/c ur still being commissioned as an 0-1...ur basically getting ur obligation completed by finished D-school...once ur out...active duty starts. I know i talked to someone who thought that they paid for 4 yrs, and you owed them 8 coming out of school...not so.

 

[Turnerjo13]

No one has mentioned the value that you receive from building a practice and starting relationships with your patients and building your reputation in the community that will last for your whole career. Can you even put a price tag on four years of practice growth. Those relationships will continue to be paying you dividends long after four years is up. If you go to the military you will be at least four years behind.

Also another reason to pay off your student loans slowly is that they will be the lowest interest loans you have behind your practice, truck and home.

good luck everyone!

 

[Al4short]

If your enlisted years were active duty, yes you would be an O-3 with however many years of enlisted service, plus the number of years you receive the Scholarship. That counts for pay only!!! The years in Dental School do not count towards retirement.

 

[Al4short]

The obligation for the Scholarship is 1 year of Active Duty for every year you receive the Scholarship. The Service obligation is different. Everyone signs an 8 year contract, Army, Navy, Air Force and Marines. That applies to Officers and Enlisted. The remaining years of service are either in a Reserve status or Inactive Ready Reserve status (IRR), it's your choice.
Your Active duty obligation period starts after you finish Dental School.

 

[Al4short]

There are currently no other monetary incentives, which means that if you take the scholarship, there isn't an additional bonus or loan repayment for your undergrad. Bonus' and loan repayment are for Dentists already out of school, since they missed out on the Scholarship.

 

[tooth decay]

Since the services pay for most of your schooling, will you pay off you schooling faster by doing the service for a total of 5 years or work else where? Which one will get the school paid off faster plus make more money? Or are their some other type of programs out their like working for the state? Let me know your opinions please.

As a former member of the Army Reserve, I want you think long and hard about joining a military branch to pay for your tuition. The monies that you save from the front end e.g. tuition, will certainly be more than lost when you are either called to active duty or obligated to do active duty. The two circumstances for joining the military would be: one, you are a very patriotic citizen and you serving your country outweighs any financial consideration; two, there is absolutely no way you could afford to go to school (e.g. denied loans, etc.). Speak to others who have had gone thru this experience before signing on the dotted line.

 

[exnavyflier]

Army and Navy Dentistry (which covers the Marines - "One shot, one kill. Born to die but never will. Hoorah!") will send you straight to the lines (Iraq, Afghanistan...etc.). Who do you think is fixing all of those shot-up jaws and teeth left on the streets? Air Force dentists will be fixing teeth for wanna-be soldiers in Minot North Dakota. But who needs the Air Force? I hear that during OTS the Officer trainees are served martinis with breakfast at the crack of noon. Dont waste your time if you do not want to be deployed. Hoorah to all my Navy and Marine Corps hoodlums.

 

[tamubeast]

Army and Navy Dentistry (which covers the Marines - "One shot, one kill. Born to die but never will. Hoorah!") will send you straight to the lines (Iraq, Afghanistan...etc.). Who do you think is fixing all of those shot-up jaws and teeth left on the streets? Air Force dentists will be fixing teeth for wanna-be soldiers in Minot North Dakota. But who needs the Air Force? I hear that during OTS the Officer trainees are served martinis with breakfast at the crack of noon. Dont waste your time if you do not want to be deployed. Hoorah to all my Navy and Marine Corps hoodlums.

Funniest **** I read all day, not being sarcastic at all. But keep this in mind, those dentists in Iraq, for the most part, have requested to be there. The reason I say this is because if you want to apply for residency in the Army/Navy you have to have one of the following: (1) Outstanding GPA and board passage rate OR (2) commitment to the military. And what better way to show your commitment then requesting to be overseas. Just my thought.

 

[jmick101]

If your enlisted years were active duty, yes you would be an O-3 with however many years of enlisted service, plus the number of years you receive the Scholarship. That counts for pay only!!! The years in Dental School do not count towards retirement.

So with three years active duty and three years of school (Pacific) then I would be getting paid as an O-3E with 6?

 

[tamubeast]

So with three years active duty and three years of school (Pacific) then I would be getting paid as an O-3E with 6?

No. The only program that allows for a dental student to accrue time of service while in school is the Navy Collegiate Program. For all HPSPs you will come out making O-3 pay with zero years, whereas under the Collegiate Program you come out making O-3 pay with >4 years experience. However, the Collegiate Program requries 5 years of active duty service, whereas the HPSP requires a minimum of 2. I am currently trying to decide between the Navy Collegiate Program and the Army HPSP. If you have any questions PM me and I can give you my cell, I have visited a base in San Antonio and asked dentists the pros and cons and the ins and outs of serving in the military.