Is medical school worth it?

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Peterock said:
Some part of me finds the OP being very realistic. I wish you that recognized that in his post (even if it is admittedly negative) and in your own application situation. I know more about Wake Forest's admissions process than you since I have multiple friends who have attended the school and spent last year talking to Ms/Dr. Tise. I actually asked her if I post bacc'ed at a school around the quality of Eckerd how well I would be expected to do and she said a "4.0 for that caliber of school". So... I hate to break it to you, but without a 30.. if not a little higher, you're nothing to Wake.

You cannot refute ANY of my previous arguments
1) you're not from NC and have at best a shallow knowledge of the school (if you've spent lots of time in NC and wake, lemme know)
2) your ugrad is not competitive for a medical school that openly discriminates against ugrads when selecting students ... + your ave. ugrad gpa for the school only further hurts you

The positive is that you've shown a lot of interest... but... reason #1 makes it shallow and unimportant.

OK, let's try this one more time.
1) It doesn't matter. Wake takes 65% of its class from out of state, if not a little more. Look at who was accepted, and where they came from.
Accepted
268
North Carolina
82
Out-of-State
186
http://www1.wfubmc.edu/MDProgram/Admissions/Class+Profile.htm
2) My GPA is solid, my undergrad is good (Eckerd sent someone to Duke), and MEDIAN MCAT means just that. There are +/- standard deviations. Check the definition of median, will you please.
Finally, I don't have to defend myself to you, or anyone, for that matter. I just hope degrading people makes you feel better. I definitely wouldn't want my physician to be the kind of person that enjoys putting others down. Oh, and what arguments would I be refuting? All I heard was negative, meaningless garbage.

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JDAD said:
Man, the people in this thread are drinking a lot of haterade.

It's now fortified with spite!
 
JDAD said:
Man, the people in this thread are drinking a lot of haterade.

Man, nothin' like a sip of Haterade to keep things rollin'.

No hate here for anyone but the OP.
 
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Yale's got a good attitude. It seems like they are past the whole insecurity thing. The UC schools I have looked at seem to have an inferiority complex, and they take it out on the students. Might not be the case, but that's my impression.
 
MCAT is easy said:
Yale's got a good attitude. It seems like they are past the whole insecurity thing. The UC schools I have looked at seem to have an inferiority complex, and they take it out on the students. Might not be the case, but that's my impression.

I think YOU have an inferiority complex, asshat.
 
Wow, I really didn't see that one coming. Seriously. Like, not even in a million years. That was sooooooo out of the blue.
 
MCAT is easy said:
Wow, I really didn't see that one coming. Seriously. Like, not even in a million years. That was sooooooo out of the blue.

Shut your ass.
 
morganlefay said:
OK, let's try this one more time.
1) It doesn't matter. Wake takes 65% of its class from out of state, if not a little more. Look at who was accepted, and where they came from.
Accepted
268
North Carolina
82
Out-of-State
186
http://www1.wfubmc.edu/MDProgram/Admissions/Class+Profile.htm
2) My GPA is solid, my undergrad is good (Eckerd sent someone to Duke), and MEDIAN MCAT means just that. There are +/- standard deviations. Check the definition of median, will you please.
Finally, I don't have to defend myself to you, or anyone, for that matter. I just hope degrading people makes you feel better. I definitely wouldn't want my physician to be the kind of person that enjoys putting others down. Oh, and what arguments would I be refuting? All I heard was negative, meaningless garbage.

I am sure that Wake Forest is legally required to have a certain percentage of it's undergraduate class be from NC (since they receive millions of dollars from the State of North Carolina). The actual number of NC students who matriculate is ~40 every year. This is not conincidence.

Your undergraduate is below average for a student who goes to Wake Med. I was told that they do not take people for interviews generally from a school like Harvard if the student's gpa is <3.35. I asked them about a school with a very similary SAT to your school (slightly lower, just slightly), and they said they'd expect a 3.9+ over four years).

Unfortunately you did not refute my first statement. You know nothing about Wake Forest so your claims of it being your "top choice" are worthless.

Also, my guess is that the average accepted NC applicant has a lower MCAT then the out of state MCATers. This means that your MCAT really needs to be more like a 31.
Wake Forest 15
UNC-CH 12
Duke 9
NC State 3
Davidson 2
http://www1.wfubmc.edu/MDProgram/Admissions/Class+Profile.htm
Hmm.... so where are all the other crappy NC schools that would be the equivalent of Eckerd?



I have yet to degrade you, I have only said realistic information that you're too stubborn to admit might be true. I'm done here... but I've wanted to say this to you for quite some time that you need to think of yourself as a longshot with that MCAT/ugrad at a school like Wake, which does not pay much respect to intangibles etc.

Anyway, good luck w/ the process.
 
I think I like the OP.

There's nothing wrong with having a low threshold for BS, as long as you realize that BS is an essential part of the human condition. Physicians hassle with Mickey Mouse paperwork and insurance restrictions, lawyers spend their days pouring out legalese, politicians kiss babies and caucus incessantly. You can't get away from it.

From what he writes, it sounds like he wants a career that will exercise his problem solving skills and not bore him to death with the same problem over and over. That's available in medicine...maybe as one of those academic surgeons who gets all the zebras no one else will touch. It's available elsewhere too. Just depends on what kinds of problems he likes...myself, I'm the same way, and I'm going for hardcore BME research.

And for the OP: go find people who are smarter than you are. Right now. If possible, start an intellectual argument and watch yourself lose. It's an individual thing, but I think you'd like it. And it'll do you some good after Davis. :smuggrin:
 
MCAT is easy said:
Yale's got a good attitude. It seems like they are past the whole insecurity thing. The UC schools I have looked at seem to have an inferiority complex, and they take it out on the students. Might not be the case, but that's my impression.

oh yeah, i totally agree there... all that the uc medical schools (especially ucsf and ucla) can do is to be ashamed of their mediocrity and develop a severe inferiority complex when extraordinarily talented individuals such as yourself are getting recruited by other schools. there is definitely no one at the uc medical schools as well-qualified as you are for sure, so i can see your point.
 
Hey Sunflower, are you hot? :)
 
Peterock said:
I am sure that Wake Forest is legally required to have a certain percentage of it's undergraduate class be from NC (since they receive millions of dollars from the State of North Carolina). The actual number of NC students who matriculate is ~40 every year. This is not conincidence.

um, ok. This really doesn't apply to anything I said. If anything, it just proves my point that there are more out-of-staters than in-staters attending.

Your undergraduate is below average for a student who goes to Wake Med. I was told that they do not take people for interviews generally from a school like Harvard if the student's gpa is <3.35. I asked them about a school with a very similary SAT to your school (slightly lower, just slightly), and they said they'd expect a 3.9+ over four years).

And the dean told me my application was competitive. So I take it he's trying to make me feel better? Or lying, or both? Umm, ok. Not buyin this one.

Unfortunately you did not refute my first statement. You know nothing about Wake Forest so your claims of it being your "top choice" are worthless.

I could say the University of World-Class Anal Retentive Freaks was my top choice and wouldn't have to explain why to you. In fact, in that case, you might actually take up for me, like you did for the OP.

Also, my guess is that the average accepted NC applicant has a lower MCAT then the out of state MCATers. This means that your MCAT really needs to be more like a 31.

Again, logic fails. If this were the case, there would be more in-state people than out-of-state, as with state schools. Wake Forest is a private school. Case in point, USF COM. State school, lower score requirements for instaters, higher requirements for out of staters, and VERY few out of staters accepted/matriculated.

I have yet to degrade you, I have only said realistic information that you're too stubborn to admit might be true. I'm done here... but I've wanted to say this to you for quite some time that you need to think of yourself as a longshot with that MCAT/ugrad at a school like Wake, which does not pay much respect to intangibles etc.

Anyway, good luck w/ the process.

Again, I don't see how this whole stupid discussion relates in any way to why I posted on this thread, or what I said to the OP. You're just looking for someone to antagonize, and I do not believe for a minute that you give any care to my "realizations" or insight into the application process. Peace, out.
 
Certainly. I also killed your MCAT score.

Would you like to help me breed a race of super-gunners in between our 130-hour workweeks? :D
 
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MCAT is easy said:
I am applying to medical schools with a good GPA and a 36 on the MCAT.

I always assumed that medical school was so difficult, because the payoff was so rewarding. I don't mean money, I just mean that you will grow and be challenged, and that kind of thing. I am beginning to wonder if any human institution can really do that for you.

I know I CAN do this, and always do better than my peers, and it's easy for me. I also wonder if the truly smart people are off doing something else, and I am getting stuck in a program with a bunch of try-hards who want to make their parents happy.

-I notice that all my peers who made it to this point have some pretty unique personality traits. They all seem to be very...meek and unopinionated. For all the touchy-feely bull**** they preach, many of them have values that are precisely opposite. The politically correct tone of medical schools bothers me, too. The University of Oregon has a page on their web site that says minority applicants are preferred. On the same page, it states that they do not make decisions based on race, religion, etc. My brain cannot deal with outright bull**** very well. I would rather do something useful about a problem than be filled with ineffectual liberal guilt. FYI, I am a member of the Green party, so don't think I am some right-wing nut ranting.

-I am convinced that the secondary applications exist only to deter people from applying. Those who can put up with the irrelevant bull**** that is the essays get to move on to the next phase. So is this a test of ability, intelligence, and real learning, or is the whole process a contest to see how much irrelevant bull**** you can put up with? Is this about learning to be a strong person or is it a contest to see who can go without sleep the longest? In other words, is the challenge something you learn and benefit from, ir is it just a test to see who is the most stubborn?

-This goes along with point number one. I get the distinct impression that the medical school process is designed to make you willing to accept ****ty conditions. The number one trait medical schools appear to look for, from what I see...is subserviance. Why should I work my ass off so that I can be told what to do by some administrator with a master's degree?

-Medical schools do not make their expectations at all clear. When asked what they look for, the usual answer you get is "Well, we don't really know, we just look at what we get, and want to build a class". Bull****. They know exactly what they want. It's not right for them to be playing those kinds of games when you are dancing around trying to please them, in the most competetive field there is. The MCAT was great, because unlike my undergraduate classes that were taught by incompetent professors, I knew exactly what was expected for the MCAT. At UC Davis, I felt like the challenge was not in learning the material, but rather in compensating for the inability of the instructor to communicate their expectations.


So there you have me. Frustrated, pissed off, because I have a lot of energy and ability that I want to put to good use, but feel like the system I am trying to please is only a hindrance. Medicine feels dehumanizing and emasculating. I am taking the LSAT in the Spring, because I am starting to feel like law is a better career that won't require me to cut my own balls off.

Do not feed the troll

troll.jpg
 
MCAT is easy said:
Hey Sunflower, are you hot? :)

Why do you keep posting, you asshat douche bag?
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
 
Come on out to California, and let's get it on, baby... :)

Ughh, I need to go to sleep.
 
MCAT is easy said:
Come on out to California, and let's get it on, baby... :)

Ughh, I need to go to sleep.

Ha ha!

Baby needs sleep... :sleep:

Asshat.
 
Having two accounts to argue with yourself is trolling. This is inappropriate at SDN.
 
...
 

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Anybody deranged enough to log in two separate accounts back and forth to argue with themselves on an internet message board has my respect. Big ups.
 
I believe he has many more than just those two.

It's pretty deranged. I kind of feel sorry for him. Trolling on any public board, by nature, reveals a certain amount of psychopathology.

It's especially disconcerning when the person is obviously educated.
 
educated? do we have to go over this again?? sigh... :rolleyes:
 
Pete may lack tact but there is a lot of truth in what he says.

With your stats, Miss LeFay, you don't really stand a good chance at WF.

However, if you wanna apply, then it's your money.
 
MCAT is easy said:
I am applying to medical schools with a good GPA and a 36 on the MCAT.

I always assumed that medical school was so difficult, because the payoff was so rewarding. I don't mean money, I just mean that you will grow and be challenged, and that kind of thing. I am beginning to wonder if any human institution can really do that for you.

I know I CAN do this, and always do better than my peers, and it's easy for me. I also wonder if the truly smart people are off doing something else, and I am getting stuck in a program with a bunch of try-hards who want to make their parents happy.

-I notice that all my peers who made it to this point have some pretty unique personality traits. They all seem to be very...meek and unopinionated. For all the touchy-feely bull**** they preach, many of them have values that are precisely opposite. The politically correct tone of medical schools bothers me, too. The University of Oregon has a page on their web site that says minority applicants are preferred. On the same page, it states that they do not make decisions based on race, religion, etc. My brain cannot deal with outright bull**** very well. I would rather do something useful about a problem than be filled with ineffectual liberal guilt. FYI, I am a member of the Green party, so don't think I am some right-wing nut ranting.

-I am convinced that the secondary applications exist only to deter people from applying. Those who can put up with the irrelevant bull**** that is the essays get to move on to the next phase. So is this a test of ability, intelligence, and real learning, or is the whole process a contest to see how much irrelevant bull**** you can put up with? Is this about learning to be a strong person or is it a contest to see who can go without sleep the longest? In other words, is the challenge something you learn and benefit from, ir is it just a test to see who is the most stubborn?

-This goes along with point number one. I get the distinct impression that the medical school process is designed to make you willing to accept ****ty conditions. The number one trait medical schools appear to look for, from what I see...is subserviance. Why should I work my ass off so that I can be told what to do by some administrator with a master's degree?

-Medical schools do not make their expectations at all clear. When asked what they look for, the usual answer you get is "Well, we don't really know, we just look at what we get, and want to build a class". Bull****. They know exactly what they want. It's not right for them to be playing those kinds of games when you are dancing around trying to please them, in the most competetive field there is. The MCAT was great, because unlike my undergraduate classes that were taught by incompetent professors, I knew exactly what was expected for the MCAT. At UC Davis, I felt like the challenge was not in learning the material, but rather in compensating for the inability of the instructor to communicate their expectations.


So there you have me. Frustrated, pissed off, because I have a lot of energy and ability that I want to put to good use, but feel like the system I am trying to please is only a hindrance. Medicine feels dehumanizing and emasculating. I am taking the LSAT in the Spring, because I am starting to feel like law is a better career that won't require me to cut my own balls off.

Sometimes I feel the same way. I hope this guy wasnt banned for this particular post.
 
dmoney41 said:
Anybody deranged enough to log in two separate accounts back and forth to argue with themselves on an internet message board has my respect. Big ups.


Same here, but only if they are unbiased towards both aliases.
 
Rule #1. If you have to ask, it's not worth it for you.

This applies to the OP and to every DO vs MD, PA vs MD, DDS vs MD, law vs MD, etc. post.
 
hot_lunch_69 said:
Jeez, this thread bugs big time.

I don't give a crap about the OP's problems. Snore. :sleep:


I'm with you.

The entire point of this "namby-pamby," "feminized," "nicey-nicey" process is to weed out people like the OP, who believes that compassion & goodwill must be "insincere," whose sole desire to go to med school, as far as I can tell, is based on some need to beat people at a game.
 
Peterock said:
I am sure that Wake Forest is legally required to have a certain percentage of it's undergraduate class be from NC (since they receive millions of dollars from the State of North Carolina). The actual number of NC students who matriculate is ~40 every year. This is not conincidence.

Your undergraduate is below average for a student who goes to Wake Med. I was told that they do not take people for interviews generally from a school like Harvard if the student's gpa is <3.35. I asked them about a school with a very similary SAT to your school (slightly lower, just slightly), and they said they'd expect a 3.9+ over four years).

Unfortunately you did not refute my first statement. You know nothing about Wake Forest so your claims of it being your "top choice" are worthless.

Also, my guess is that the average accepted NC applicant has a lower MCAT then the out of state MCATers. This means that your MCAT really needs to be more like a 31.
Wake Forest 15
UNC-CH 12
Duke 9
NC State 3
Davidson 2
http://www1.wfubmc.edu/MDProgram/Admissions/Class+Profile.htm
Hmm.... so where are all the other crappy NC schools that would be the equivalent of Eckerd?



I have yet to degrade you, I have only said realistic information that you're too stubborn to admit might be true. I'm done here... but I've wanted to say this to you for quite some time that you need to think of yourself as a longshot with that MCAT/ugrad at a school like Wake, which does not pay much respect to intangibles etc.

Anyway, good luck w/ the process.


This whole process is not as numbers-driven as you think. We've all heard stories of applicants w/ 3.8 GPAs, 35+ MCATs, who were rejected everywhere.

Check out this profile of a guy who got into Harvard w/ a 23 MCAT and a 3.3 GPA from the Univ of Central FL:

http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=957
 
Notice the above applicants race, in addition to the fact that this is one person of 44,000, thus not statistically representative.
 
dmoney41 said:
Anybody deranged enough to log in two separate accounts back and forth to argue with themselves on an internet message board has my respect. Big ups.


Mine too, actually. You sure had me going.
 
Alexander Pink said:
Notice the above applicants race, in addition to the fact that this is one person of 44,000, thus not statistically representative.


That's just my point: statistics doesn't provide the whole picture in this process. And even as someone w/ a 3.98 GPA & 37-40 on practice MCATs, I believe that this is a good thing.


Schools are sincere, I think, when they say they want a class from different backgrounds, interests, & talents. Being Ugandan & having a real passion for medicine (as I assume this guy must in order to get acceptances with those numbers) can outweigh weaknesses in other areas.

Here is a white male who got into Harvard w/ a 25 on the MCAT:

http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=438
 
MCAT is easy said:
So there you have me. Frustrated, pissed off, because I have a lot of energy and ability that I want to put to good use, but feel like the system I am trying to please is only a hindrance. Medicine feels dehumanizing and emasculating. I am taking the LSAT in the Spring, because I am starting to feel like law is a better career that won't require me to cut my own balls off.

If you are feeling this way now about medicine, you will be even more disillusioned and miserable once you are in med school . The key to surviving the medical world is being a perpetual optimist and closet masochist. You know that it will all be better, but yet love the pain.

I have seen exceptional students become disillusioned and it is so truly sad.

Spend more time shadowing a resident and an attending (in any field); you will get a better feel for what medicine is about.

Good luck in your career choice.
 
I can't beklieve how beligerent this thread got...well i guess it started off on the wrong track.

BTW, what do trolls like to eat?
 
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