just HOW important is your undergrad school?

[Peachy720]

Hey everyone!

I swear, ONE more over-paranoid question from me, and then I'll be able to be peaceful (until it comes time for MCATs )

Just HOW important is the undergrad school you attend? I attend University of Louisiana-Lafayette (they thought changing the name from University of Southwestern Louisiana would automatically make it more prestigious ). Now, Louisiana is known as having the second-lowest education value in the States. Also, from mdapplicants and other sites like that, I have seen NOBODY from my university listed as accepted. I know one person who was accepted into LSU-NO, and she was the SGA President!!

Should I transfer somewhere while there's still hope (I had attended Millsaps College my first semester, but had personal problems and had to come home)? Will I ever get out of here? Heeeeelp!

I'm not crazy...really.

---

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[Samus Aran]

Peachy, transfer to my school!!!!

 

[Peachy720]

Misty!! Good to see you, girlie! Where do you go?

(any news on the furkid?)

 

[jlee9531]

well you just need to support your high grades at LA with a good solid mcat score to show that you know your stuff. if you can do that, no point in thinking about transferring.

 

[Peachy720]

thanks jlee--you've been so helpful in both threads!!

just worried because in some of the books I've been reading, it says they give more weight to schools with harder curriculums. Considering UL-L isn't even on the map...

 

[Samus Aran]

Peachy, I sent you a pm to answer your school question

No news on any puppies though

 

[terpgirl]

Wow... I almost accepted an offer to go there. They offered me in-state, and when I came down to meet with their admissions they'd give me a full ride. I was desperate--I didn't want to go to UMCP (and yet that's where I ended up, and am very unhappy!)

I never knew it didnt have a great academic reputation...

-Liz

 

[Peachy720]

terpgirl-Congrats on the offer! I'm really sorry at how unhappy you are where you're at. How far from graduating are you? In all fairness, ULL seems to be trying to make themselves appear better: they've rennovated their library, and are doing 3 or 4 other construction projects that have been going on for years. They've raised tuition from under $900 a semester to around $1300 a semester. However, they are VERY bad at student relations. A lot of them are rude and literally send you to 8 or 9 places only to have you wind up at the original office. I wish you all the luck in the world!

Misty--on my way to the PM box--the furkid will come when the time is right!

 

[Downhill Racer]

You definitely have the best school moniker, RAJUN CAJUNS... can't beat that!

As said before continue to perform well with your GPA, MCAT and outside activities, demonstrate your commitment to medicine, communicate that effectively on paper (essays, apps) and in person (interviews) and I'm sure you'll have your selection of schools. Its always best to see where students from your school get accepted and include those schools among your application.

G'Luck!

 

[W222]

Well, I went to a school with less than 2000 undergrads. They have not sent anyone directly to an allopath school in almost ten years, although they have sent several to DO schools, vet schools, great PA schools, and dental schools. The school has a fairly decent USNews ranking, I think 88, but it gets **** on because its very small and it is in Mass, surrounded by a ton of great undergrad schools. So, I did have it a little tougher than most getting into med school, I had to bust my ass in research and make up for it with good ECs and MCATs. BUT, I think my school was just as good as anywhere else and I am not looking back. I got a good number of interviews and now I am heading to a good allopath med school, I dont think you should worry to much, work hard and get good grades-the rest will all fall into place.

 

[lane]

didn't you know that adcoms just put on a blindfold and throw random applications into the interview pile?

i would say that you'd have an advantage if you're planning on applying to LA state schools (if it's anything like the texas schools - check out their class lists). regardless of that, though, just make sure to maintain a decent GPA, study hard for that MCAT, and get plenty of clinical/research experience.

 

[jlee9531]

thanks jlee--you've been so helpful in both threads!!

just worried because in some of the books I've been reading, it says they give more weight to schools with harder curriculums. Considering UL-L isn't even on the map...

this is somewhat true. if you go to a place with a hard curriculum...your gpa will obviously be lower than someone that goes to a place with an easier one.
this is where the mcat comes in to level the field....to see if that low gpa is because of the coursework or just your lack of knowledge.......
if you have a high gpa at an easier place but a low mcat....then it tends to show that your coursework may not be as challenging.

so just do well on the mcat to ensure you wont have to deal with this question.

 

[kiki the alto]

Thanks for posting a thread on this...I was concerned about my school for the same reason. I go to Northern Arizona University which sounds about as unknown as ULL. I was really worried that the school I'm going to would affect the decision, but it sounds like it won't be as big an issue as I thought.

 

[PreMedPoohBear]

Hi Peachy, I kind of understand your situation. I started at a community college, and I thought I had to transfer to a very good university; however, financial reasons kept me from going to some of the schools I was looking into, my top choice was Millsaps. I decided to go to another school in Mississippi that offered me a full scholarship. I haven't started yet, but I think I made a good choice. I've heard good things about the school, and it isn't too big, and I'll be able to save money for med school applications and things of that nature. I think it really doesn't matter what school you go to as long as you make the most of it. Do well in your class, study for the MCAT, get involved on and off campus and you should do well in your road to med school.

 

[jlee9531]

Thanks for posting a thread on this...I was concerned about my school for the same reason. I go to Northern Arizona University which sounds about as unknown as ULL. I was really worried that the school I'm going to would affect the decision, but it sounds like it won't be as big an issue as I thought.

actually hardcore sports fans of college sports will know your school. ive watched a couple of their basketball games.

just as long as you do well on the mcat. it will be ok.

 

[terpgirl]

Peachy--

Apparently they are just like UMCP. One of the regents wants to raise tuition to $16K a semester from $3k. Why? Because his logic is that the better the school, the more they should charge to go there. The more it costs, the better it is. Keep in mind, it's currently $3k a semester IN STATE. Lord, my tax dollars support the school, and I shouldn't be paying that kind of money instate! Plus, the school will be only populated with people willing to pay that kind of money. UMCP always says their "peers" are the UCs, Michigan, UNC Chapel Hill. RIIIIIIIIGHT. They're a lot better than UMCP, so stop bringing them down to your level.

Yeah, UM will send you in a rat race as well. Because of a situation that happened and them running me in circles after the fact, I've hired a lawyer.

Okay, maybe our football and basketball teams are good. But as of now, that's about it. Maybe the new facilities they've built aren't so bad either.

-Liz

 

[BigBopper]

Well, I went to a school with less than 2000 undergrads. They have not sent anyone directly to an allopath school in almost ten years, although they have sent several to DO schools, vet schools, great PA schools, and dental schools. The school has a fairly decent USNews ranking, I think 88, but it gets **** on because its very small and it is in Mass, surrounded by a ton of great undergrad schools. So, I did have it a little tougher than most getting into med school, I had to bust my ass in research and make up for it with good ECs and MCATs. BUT, I think my school was just as good as anywhere else and I am not looking back. I got a good number of interviews and now I am heading to a good allopath med school, I dont think you should worry to much, work hard and get good grades-the rest will all fall into place.

heh sounds like a school one of my friends went to. They had 20 premeds and he was the only one accepted at a MD school. 15 didn't get in and 4 got into DO schools only.

 

[BerkeleyPremed]

If you need to stay ins-state...transfer to Tulane. I heard great things about that school and its faculty. Tulane is ranked in the top 50 colleges&universities in the nation and it attracts talent from all over the country. Tulane also has a decent name and I'm sure their med school acceptance rate is also pretty good. Just a thought.

 

[Newquagmire]

i agree with jlee. although i have no evidence to back me up, i can't imagine that a 46Z on the MCAT will get tossed aside because "Antartica State Community Farm" is a school of no repute.

 

[bewitched1081]

much of the admissions process is political in nature. dont expect most adcoms to try to see who you are as a person in regards to good character and such. in my opinion, most adcoms view good character as coming secondary to such things as school, prestigious awards, connections, the nature of your research projects/publications, and giving them what they want to hear (rather than just being yourself). as my mentor says, hard work/ good grades only gives you the opportunity to compete. and i might add, sometimes you dont even get to compete.

 

[LTbulldogs]

Go to Louisiana College. They have a 92 percent admissions rate to medical school over the past ten years(The best in Louisiana). 100% of their applicants were admitted last year. Second is the historically black, Xavier University of Louisiana. (85%)

 

[freaker]

You're using the same books and taking the same classes as everyone else. Maybe you have less competition and maybe your tests are a little easier. So what? Just get the grades, do the ECs, and bust the MCAT. You do well on the MCAT, and doors will open. I'd guess that attending a top school might be worth an extra .1 or .2 on your gpa. That's about it.

As for the guy from Northern Arizona, I personally know they have an excellent Native American studies program there and that Flagstaff is a really cool town. Some really cool outdoor things nearby, too. Gotta love those exits off the interstate leading down dirt roads.

By the way, this is coming from an English and art history major from Tennessee. If I know about your school, I'm sure an adcom knows about your school.

 

[BaseballFan]

food for thought on this topic:

http://www.architrave.net/college/gradeadj.htm

 

[Mr. Obsessive]

I had a similar question in regards to GPA. Say you went to a really good school but your gpa sucked a$$. I'm worried about my cousin. She goes to Tufts but bombed chemistry. I know she would have done considerably better in a state school. I saw a reply that added only .1 to .2 to your gpa. Can that be right?

 

[BerkeleyPremed]

I had a similar question in regards to GPA. Say you went to a really good school but your gpa sucked a$$. I'm worried about my cousin. She goes to Tufts but bombed chemistry. I know she would have done considerably better in a state school. I saw a reply that added only .1 to .2 to your gpa. Can that be right?

If your cousin was at Berkeley (a public school)...she would've probably bombed chemistry even harder than she did at Tufts. Please take care to specify which state schools you're talking about..2nd, 3rd, and 4th tier state schools. The top public schools (University of Virginia, University of Michigan-Ann Arbor, Berkeley, etc) all have excellent and rigorous programs in the sciences.

 

[Mr. Obsessive]

If your cousin was at Berkeley (a public school)...she would've probably bombed chemistry even harder than she did at Tufts. Please take care to specify which state schools you're talking about..2nd, 3rd, and 4th tier state schools. The top public schools (University of Virginia, University of Michigan-Ann Arbor, Berkeley, etc) all have excellent and rigorous programs in the sciences.

Come on. You know I was referring to the other 99% state schools that are not top tier. That wasn't the point of my post. I was wondering if "top tier" schools like Berkely held a considerably higher wieght in regards to their GPAs than lower tiered schools. I wasn't trying to bash state schools. I went to one and loved it.

 

[Peterock]

I had a similar question in regards to GPA. Say you went to a really good school but your gpa sucked a$$. I'm worried about my cousin. She goes to Tufts but bombed chemistry. I know she would have done considerably better in a state school. I saw a reply that added only .1 to .2 to your gpa. Can that be right?

Tufts isn't a really good school. She's in trouble, seriously. Only people from like MIT and Cornell are going to get weighed gpa's, otherwise it's just gpa/mcat. Some med schools definitely weed out people from non-prestigious schools, but most do not...

 

[Mr. Obsessive]

Thanks for the reply. That was what I was worried about.

 

[Peterock]

Yup, no problem.

The chem part won't save her either.

Sorry.

 

[BerkeleyPremed]

Come on. You know I was referring to the other 99% state schools that are not top tier. That wasn't the point of my post. I was wondering if "top tier" schools like Berkely held a considerably higher wieght in regards to their GPAs than lower tiered schools. I wasn't trying to bash state schools. I went to one and loved it.

Ahh...my mistake. I just hate it when my school is lumped in the same category as North Carolina State, Florida State (I heard this one is basically a 4 year vacation), Michigan State (people tell me that most high school classes are harder than MSU classes), etc. I'm pretty sure that adcoms are more accepting of lower GPAs from top schools than they are of higher GPAs from no-name state schools...I can't provide a link to support his except the Boalt Hall grade inflation survey...which pertains to law school admission (not med school admssion). But something tells me the folks on the adcom are smart enough to realize that it is harder to earn a 3.5 at Cornell than it is to earn a 4.0 at California State University-Dominguez Hills.

 

[coffeeluver]

Tufts isn't a really good school. She's in trouble, seriously. Only people from like MIT and Cornell are going to get weighed gpa's, otherwise it's just gpa/mcat. Some med schools definitely weed out people from non-prestigious schools, but most do not...

I know Cornell is ivy-league, but is it known for its hard curriculum? Do Cornell students get weighted gpa's?

 

[terpgirl]

I wouldn't think that Cornell would get weighted... I wouldn't say it's curriculm is "hard" in comparison to many others.

I have a good friend who graduated from there in 2003, sat on his behind and did NOTHING in a great major (not a sit on your butt kind of thing, but not the highest) and had a GPA of 3.3. No effort.

I wouldn't say that it matters to that point. I go to UMCP, a great school that's known for it's basketball team... and somehow is moving up in rankings for it's academics. Not UNC or Ann Arbor, but up there none the less. We've got anal retentive professors just like any other school.

Wasn't there a recent thread on Harvard, and how so many graduated with honors, and that way too many A's were being given out? Search for that. Pretty good thread and article.

By the way, I didn't go to an ivy for one reason--MONEY. That alone makes me smart and I'd hope adcoms would show me a little bit of love for that There are lots of smart people at state schools.

-Liz

 

[bearpaw]

I know Cornell is ivy-league, but is it known for its hard curriculum? Do Cornell students get weighted gpa's?

of course they do. check out the premed stuff on the website, they give a lot of good advice. there are also accepted/rejected charts that show you what you need to have to get love. i think a 3.4 is like 90% acceptance, regardless of mcat. This is for non-urm which is pretty sweet.

 

[LaurieB]

I have a bit of a different opinion on this subject. It is my impression that adcoms are looking to see if you can handle a difficult curriculum and succeed. For example, even though I had a low GPA from a moderately challenging state school, I had a difficult major (ChemE) and I went to a challenging school for my postbac (UofChicago). None of my interviewers brought up grades and one even noted that I had done a good job of proving my academic ability.

I also have friends who went to a tiny unknown liberal arts college in Central Illinois and ended up at Pritzker, Hopkins, and SIU. There had been few medical acceptances from their school in previous years, but they rallied together to pursue interesting and relevant activiites that would also help them stand out against other applicants.

My point is that you can make the most of your situation if you are happy where you are and do not want to transfer.

Good luck!

 

[SaltySqueegee]

I would have to say JLee hit the nail on the head.

For example:

My school (SJSU) has historically not been a feeder school for any MD programs. Not including the Post-Baccs, it is sometimes years apart where an undergrad from SJSU has gotten into an MD program.

Yet, just this past application cycle, all of my undergrad 'pre-med' friends except one placed into an MD program; some mind you at very prestigious institutions (UCSF, UCLA, Stanford, etc.). The only difference between this year and previous ones, would have to be the mindset of the application pool. i.e. they all seem to have their heads screwed on right, and aren't f#cking around like previous applicants. So with that, the school you attend matters about 5% IMHO, the rest is up to you. If you think you can cut it still by staying were you are at, by all means save the money and the hassle of transferring to a more reputable university.

Remember this process is made successful by you and not necessarily the undergrad institution you attend.

 

[viking]

some schools weight your GPA based on where you went to undergrad; like they multiply it by a number and you have a high multiplier if you go to Harvard

 

[Harps]

Your undergrad. rep. doesn't matter. Period. GPA and MCAT matter.

Have fun!

-Harps

 

[Premedtomed]

I attend Northern Kentucky University - financial and family reasons (I am an immigrant) Someone from my school got accepted to Johns Hopkins three years back. It doesn't matter what school you go to. Sometimes it helps if you go to school in a state like Kentucky.
My high GPA and MCAT scores will prove that I am smart enough but have attended a vacation like school due to other reasons.

Good GPA and MCAT scores are all that's needed. Also a stunning personal statement.

Sky is the limit

 

[principessa]

Your undergrad. rep. doesn't matter. Period. GPA and MCAT matter.

Have fun!

-Harps

I disagree. People from lower-ranked schools have a higher bar to meet before being considered at elite med schools. Someone from a top tier undergrad can get into an elite med school if they have the average GPA and MCAT for that school. Not so for someone from a lower tier undergrad. They have to score well above average or be an URM (or both).

After you've been granted an interview, it doesn't matter so much anymore, but a few interviewers are prejudiced against people from lower tier schools, and they will patronize you or act as if you have no chance at their school. Plus you don't have any kind of alumni advantage. Some schools try to match people up with interviewers who went to the same undergrad. That's next to impossible if you went to a lower tier school.

I'm not saying it's impossible for someone from a lower tier school to get into an elite med school, because it happens all the time. It's just more difficult.

 

[PhysicsDoc]

food for thought on this topic:

http://www.architrave.net/college/gradeadj.htm

I'm surprised noone has even questioned the validity of this site yet (I've seen it at least ten times in the past). The 'grade adjustment' table is from a *law school*, which is going to be evaluating applicants who have taken primarily english/poli sci/history/etc. (humanities) classes, whose difficulty can vary *greatly* depending upon where you go to school. Converseley, science classes all teach the same thing, and (in my opinion) the difficulty does not vary greatly depending upon where you are, save maybe MIT and Caltech.

 

[SunnyS81]

I'm pretty sure I'm the first person from my undergrad, which is one of the nation's top 5 engineering schools, to be in Michigan's Medical school. I know Yale dissed one of my friends (40+/4.0) because they assumed non-engineering majors are slack at my school (which is true compared to the engineering majors). However, any doubts in your credentials are more likely to filter you before an interview. If you look at a place like Stanford, you'll be hard pressed to find non-elite schools. They pull from every top liberal arts school, university, and other places. I'm not how the ivy's work.

I will disagree that it is all numbers. Harps went to a solid undergrad that no one will diss on, but at pretty much every med school I've interviewed at, have friends at, or am at, the school seems to like to have ivy pedigree in its ranks. More over, just what type of numbers do you need to stand out as many people claim. I know a lot of people with 36+'s....standing out may be harder than you make it sound. I hear certain schools are more into pulling from name undergrads while other are less so (Penn I hear is good about not being name obsessed).

Just my $.02.

 

[Harps]

I'm pretty sure I'm the first person from my undergrad, which is one of the nation's top 5 engineering schools, to be in Michigan's Medical school. I know Yale dissed one of my friends (40+/4.0) because they assumed non-engineering majors are slack at my school (which is true compared to the engineering majors). However, any doubts in your credentials are more likely to filter you before an interview. If you look at a place like Stanford, you'll be hard pressed to find non-elite schools. They pull from every top liberal arts school, university, and other places. I'm not how the ivy's work.

I will disagree that it is all numbers. Harps went to a solid undergrad that no one will diss on, but at pretty much every med school I've interviewed at, have friends at, or am at, the school seems to like to have ivy pedigree in its ranks. More over, just what type of numbers do you need to stand out as many people claim. I know a lot of people with 36+'s....standing out may be harder than you make it sound. I hear certain schools are more into pulling from name undergrads while other are less so (Penn I hear is good about not being name obsessed).

Just my $.02.

You're right. Stanford, Harvard, Yale, and U of M have students primarily from other 'elite schools'. Principessa is also right. One's GPA and MCAT are MORE critical for those who attend 'average' schools. STILL I would argue that with a solid GPA and MCAT, in addition to genuine/unique EC's, one can gain admission to medical schools!! BUT admission to a 'top' school may be a LOT easier if one attended an 'elite' undergrad.--as you mentioned, the alumni connection and perception of admissions officers about the school's quality of education have a definite effect. I will refrain from mentioning schools that are especially 'name obsessed'

-Harps

 

[Gleevec]

I think the answer to your question depends on what kind of med school you are looking at.

If youre looking at a top 20 private medical school, for the most part they are probably accepting students from top 20 undergraduate schools or major regional powerhouses.

This doesnt mean that it would be impossible to go to an unknown school and get in (I think for sure you would need an excellent MCAT, good LORs, good GPA, etc) but I imagine the bar is higher. You get the feeling that undergrad schools tend to "send people" (ie lots of students from an undergrad go to a particular set of med schools) to certain schools, and that the quality of those med schools people are "sent" to is dependent upon your undergrad.

So by no means does this mean you will have problems if you are an exemplary candidate at your lesser-known school, but it is likely the bar will be higher. Id imagine adcoms like going with students from institutions they "know" because they know what theyre getting. This is just speculation though.

 

[Neuronix]

If youre looking at a top 20 private medical school, for the most part they are probably accepting students from top 20 undergraduate schools or major regional powerhouses.

I Gleevec, and I'm not picking on him. In fact, this what he says is true.

That being said, see my sig. I went to the University of Delaware undergrad, hardly prestigious, and I am now at the University of Pennsylvania. Hell, most of the people at UDel told me it was impossible. Screw em.

The truth is undergrad rep matters. But, it doesn't matter a whole lot. If you get involved, do cool stuff, get a good GPA, and rock the MCATs, you're every bit as competitive as your peers at the Ivies.

I'm candidly drunk, but good luck anyways!

 

[Medikit]

I wouldn't make a big deal out of your undergrad unless you're just starting out. I think all of us are in the application process right now, so there isn't much we can do about it. Good luck all.

 

[principessa]

I Gleevec, and I'm not picking on him. In fact, this what he says is true.

That being said, see my sig. I went to the University of Delaware undergrad, hardly prestigious, and I am now at the University of Pennsylvania. Hell, most of the people at UDel told me it was impossible. Screw em.

The truth is undergrad rep matters. But, it doesn't matter a whole lot. If you get involved, do cool stuff, get a good GPA, and rock the MCATs, you're every bit as competitive as your peers at the Ivies.

I'm candidly drunk, but good luck anyways!

I graduated from the University of Kentucky. As far as I know, at least one person from UK has been accepted to a top 10 med school every year. A few people get into top 25 schools every year. That's not bad, but nothing like the Ivies. However, if you add up numbers like this for all the other lesser known state schools, it's pretty significant. So every top tier med school has a few people from lesser known schools, but still not many.

Also, although I mentioned the lack of alumni advantage for interviews, coming from a lesser known school can work in your favor in the diversity/interest area. Schools like to have people from different backgrounds and geographical areas.

 

[Gleevec]

I Gleevec, and I'm not picking on him. In fact, this what he says is true.

That being said, see my sig. I went to the University of Delaware undergrad, hardly prestigious, and I am now at the University of Pennsylvania. Hell, most of the people at UDel told me it was impossible. Screw em.

The truth is undergrad rep matters. But, it doesn't matter a whole lot. If you get involved, do cool stuff, get a good GPA, and rock the MCATs, you're every bit as competitive as your peers at the Ivies.

I'm candidly drunk, but good luck anyways!

Yeah but you're a ridiculously smart mofo (not that the rest of yall arent as well, Ive just met Neuronix ).

I also hope my post didnt make it sound like you CANT get into a top school if you dont. Im just saying there is a tendency for top med schools to pick from top undergrads.

Its the difference between riding the slow wave (generated by your school) to shore or swimming back by yourself. But I definitely do NOT mean to imply that it is an unsurmountable hurdle. The way I see it, its more of a 0 vs slight + thing, as opposed to a - vs + thing.

Also, it really is about the MCAT (assuming you have a good GPA, good letters, good EC, good PC, etc)

 

[seev99]

the name probably pulls in greater weight if you can do equally well at the more prestigious school than at your regular school; if you do worse, it may actually hurt you...also, at the more prestigious schools, you'll have about half of your class applying to the same top medical schools as you, so they will probably pick the one's from your class who have the best numbers....so you should probably choose a school where you can do well at...you can't go wrong with that, b/c even if you don't get into a top medical school...at least you will be paying in state tuition for undergrad and med school, which will save you a lot of money! anyways, you should probably go to the school with the best football team and get laid a lot...holla!

 

[MichaelBarker]

I have been accepted to Our Lady of the Lake College in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. However, I am going to apply to Louisiana College in Alexandria, Louisiana. Louisiana College's pre-med program is suppose to be great. Over the past 5 years, their medical school acceptance rate is at 85%.

 

[Darko]

MichaelBarker = necromancer, bringing back posts from the dead