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Kicked out of the military... How bad will it look?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical Allopathic [ MD ]' started by randomquestions, 05.12.14.

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  1. randomquestions

    randomquestions

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    Long story short, I was kicked out of basic training when they found out I was gay. This was shortly before they repealed "Don't ask, don't tell". I'm curious to know how adcoms will view this? Also, will they have access to why I was kicked out or will I have to explain it at every interview?

    Thanks for your help.
     
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  3. DokterMom

    DokterMom 2+ Year Member

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    I would think you'd want to explain. Getting kicked out of the military doesn't look good in general (implies you did something wrong), but the reason you were kicked out exonerates you from any wrong-doing. Any way to have your discharge reversed?
     
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  4. Do Something

    Do Something 2+ Year Member

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    I was kicked out of basic training for medical reasons. I put this on my AMCAS and included my explanation. I did so because I knew my entire military record would come out regardless in the background check if I got in anywhere, and I didn't want there to be any discrepancies between what I said on my AMCAS and what came up in the background check.

    Only one interviewer even asked me about it, and I felt his tone was more curious than judgmental. I don't think it affected my application in any way.

    But I would be proactive and put in on your AMCAS just to be safe.
     
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  5. Catalystik

    Catalystik Providing herd protection SDN Advisor 10+ Year Member

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    What category of discharge was it?
     
  6. xffan624

    xffan624 2+ Year Member

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    No ADCOM will hold it against it you (if they do, you don't want to attend that school anyway). I believe with the current environment and rules change you could reenter the military if you wished to. As a former military member, I am sorry you were kicked out for that reason and thanks for your willingness to serve.
     
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  7. randomquestions

    randomquestions

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    I'd definitely want to explain what happened if it was brought up, but I'd rather not have to relive that moment at every interview, if you understand where I'm coming from. I guess I just wanted to know whether this would be a big deal or not, so that I have time to mentally prepare for the questions.

    And I'm not sure if I can have it reversed. I should probably look into that. Thanks

    I received an Entry Level Separation being that I was not enlisted for more than 180 days.

    The bolded are definitely words to live by. Thanks
     
  8. Catalystik

    Catalystik Providing herd protection SDN Advisor 10+ Year Member

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    The AMCAS application will ask, "Did you receive an honorable discharge or a discharge under honorable circumstances?" If you say "NO" the application will give you an essay space to discuss the situation in writing, saving you from repeated interview explanations. If you say "YES" you don't get a chance to explain.

    Arguably, an ESL sounds like it should be in the latter category, but the military puts an ESL in its own category, ie not Honorable, and not General (Under Honorable Conditions). Perhaps you could interpret the words to suit your preference on how you'd like to provide an explanation. Maybe some ex-military folks could give their thoughts on these options.
     
  9. LizzyM

    LizzyM the evil queen of numbers SDN Advisor 10+ Year Member

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    If you have the opportunity to explain on the application, it is not likely that you'll be asked in the interview. I highly doubt that the situation would be held against you and most adcoms want to ask about what is not in the application rather than ask you to reiterate what is in black & white. (It is not a memory test of your knowledge of your application.)
     
  10. touchpause13

    touchpause13 nolite te bastardes carborundorum 2+ Year Member

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    I think you will be fine. Explain what happened on AMCAS and I doubt you will encounter resistance from Adcoms. If you do, well I doubt you would want to be in an LGBT unfriendly environment again.

    What happened to you was no fault of your own, so it's best just to be upfront about it.
     
  11. NontradCA

    NontradCA American Hero 2+ Year Member

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    Just to clarify, the only thing that comes up in a background check regarding your military service is the type of discharge.
     
  12. NontradCA

    NontradCA American Hero 2+ Year Member

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    If he received an entry level separation, it just means that his character could not be assessed by military service. It's not Honorable, General or UOTH etc. I don't see this as a big deal for anyone. Just reply no and provide a simple explanation. I could see someone asking in a non negative light about this because of the policy change and out of genuine curiosity. It won't hurt at all in my opinion, unless the person is against LGBQT.
     
  13. medic86

    medic86 5+ Year Member

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    This!

    Entry level separations aren't the ones that look bad... unless you actually did something bad to get one. Which OP didn't.
     
  14. NontradCA

    NontradCA American Hero 2+ Year Member

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    ELS has no character assessment to it. In my opinion, if you get this, there's nothing you did that was so wrong that should be hidden. Even if it is negative, there's no need to divulge anymore if you do not choose to do so OP. The destination is there for a reason- it has no character assessment to it, and it's for people who for whatever reason couldn't stick in the military. What I'm saying is that receiving an ELS in and of itself implies there is no wrong doing. If you did something really bad, higher ups would hammer you and the discharge would be something different.
     
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  15. Goro

    Goro 5+ Year Member

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    Won't be a factor at all, and you'll get lots of sympathy, actually (except maybe at Loma Linda or LUCOM). We never never see reasons for discharge...I've never interviewed someone who was discharged, but like an IA, I believe that there's a box you check and room for an explanation on the app.

     
  16. medic86

    medic86 5+ Year Member

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    I know. I just mean that there are a broad range of reasons for getting an ELS: from being homosexual in the old military, to attempting to kill yourself.

    But yeah. No character assessment, and no need to divulge any of that information.
     
  17. DokterMom

    DokterMom 2+ Year Member

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    I'm concerned that someone who didn't know what an ELS discharge was (like me) might reasonably assume there was something negative about it. Like:

    "it's for people who for whatever reason couldn't stick in the military." or

    "there are a broad range of reasons for getting an ELS: from being homosexual in the old military, to attempting to kill yourself."


    -- which could lead someone to assume that maybe that person 'couldn't stick' in medical school or has some other psychological condition that would be a legitimate cause for concern. Guess what I'm suggesting is that you take pro-active action to eliminate potential concerns or questions that might tip you toward the 'not interview' pile. I'm with @Goro that the treatment you received was unfair and unkind, and that you'd be more likely to receive the 'help an underdog' reaction than a discriminatory one. But of course, if you'd rather keep your orientation private, that's certainly your prerogative.
     
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  18. Do Something

    Do Something 2+ Year Member

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    The one interviewer I spoke about it with specifically asked because he had never heard of an ELS discharge before and wanted me to explain what that was. None of my other interviewers noticed or cared. I think it's in how you write your explanation.
     
  19. randomquestions

    randomquestions

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    Thanks for all your help, you guys. I've decided to check "No" and explain it. :)
     
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  20. Gastrapathy

    Gastrapathy no longer apathetic Lifetime Donor 7+ Year Member

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    ELS isn't technically a discharge at all. Think of it as an annulment. Its uncharacterized service rather than honorable or OTH service. I think you could write that you were determined to be ineligible to serve after arriving at boot camp if you want to keep it vague. I also think that ADCOMs are likely to view separation for homosexuality more positively than the other reasons they might speculate.
     
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  21. hubriz

    hubriz

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    Never mind - looks like you have good advice and will be fine. Good luck.
     
    Last edited: 05.13.14

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