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Hey, everyone! I am an incoming senior in college, and I am currently researching different Psyd programs to apply to this fall. I am very interested in The Wright Institute psyd, and would love to talk to someone with more information about the program. Is there anyone on this forum who currently attends/ recently graduated The Wright Institute that I could talk to? I would love to private message you and get more of a sense of the program :)

Note: I am set on applying to psyd programs, I am not interested in PhD students explaining why I should apply to funded programs instead.

I am also planning on applying to Pacific University Psyd in Oregon, Palo Alto, and Ferkauf (Yeshiva), and would love to talk to students at those programs as well :)
 
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FreudianSlippers

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Note: I am set on applying to psyd programs, I am not interested in PhD students explaining why I should apply to funded programs instead.

Don't worry, i'm sure there will be plenty of PsyD students who can explain to you why it's a bad idea.
 
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I have had several colleagues over the years who went there. They are all majorly stressed due to financial situation post-graduation. Their clinical work and understanding of science was below average to average. I wrote about this in another thread and the pseudoscience stuff that they were doing. You can search for it. Just wanted to chime in with direct knowledge since I am not sure how many of them are on SDN. Good luck.
 
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Feb 9, 2020
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For a group of people interested in being mental health practitioners, y'all can be really rude. Complete lack of understanding of other people's circumstances. I have done my research, and am not interested in opinions as to what type of school I should attend.
 
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WisNeuro

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For a group of people interested in being mental health practitioners, y'all can be really rude. Complete lack of understanding of other people's circumstances. I have done my research, and am not interested in opinions as to what type of school I should attend.

Just how the board operates. Information and advice is provided to the board, not Just the OP. We like people to see all of the info in case they find the thread in a future search. I wouldn't expect people here not to chime in when people ask about bad programs. Furthermore, the way to really get people to get snarky, is to preemptively tell them not to respond.
 
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Sanman

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For a group of people interested in being mental health practitioners, y'all can be really rude. Complete lack of understanding of other people's circumstances. I have done my research, and am not interested in opinions as to what type of school I should attend.

What does being a mental health practitioner and being rude have to do with each other? I reserve the right to be both.
 
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AcronymAllergy

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I know other posters have asked about Ferkaulf/Yeshiva, Palo Alot, and Write Institute in the past, so I would imagine you may at least get a few PMs, if not some open replies in the thread.

All that being said, I always recommend applying as broadly as possible (and applicable). And, of course, reviewing outcome data on all potential programs.
 
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Justanothergrad

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For a group of people interested in being mental health practitioners, y'all can be really rude. Complete lack of understanding of other people's circumstances. I have done my research, and am not interested in opinions as to what type of school I should attend.
You are free to make bad choices. That's your personal choice. Bad training programs are a bad choice, for you and your clients. Expecting professionals to not have opinions about professionally relevant issues in a discussion forum dedicated to that profession is a bit shortsighted. As said above, our responses to this thread are not always to you. If you don't want opinions, feel free to ignore them.

Massive debt + bad outcomes + poor training = bad choice. It's your choice to make, so best of luck.
 
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psych.meout

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For a group of people interested in being mental health practitioners, y'all can be really rude. Complete lack of understanding of other people's circumstances. I have done my research, and am not interested in opinions as to what type of school I should attend.
Huh, it's almost like people behave differently based on context and setting, so that psychologists might interact differently with their patients than they would other people outside of a therapeutic setting.

Just how the board operates. Information and advice is provided to the board, not Just the OP. We like people to see all of the info in case they find the thread in a future search. I wouldn't expect people here not to chime in when people ask about bad programs. Furthermore, the way to really get people to get snarky, is to preemptively tell them not to respond.
Exactly. Just because someone starts the thread does not mean that they get to set the bounds of what can be discussed or who can participate. Moreover, it's important to make information fully available to everyone, such that future readers get the unvarnished truth instead of a limited perspective because an OP doesn't want to hear inconvenient truths.

And it's not even like people are derailing the thread. The lack of funding is generally connected to other important programmatic and outcome issues. E.g., lacking funding means that the program isn't really invested in their students. They are disposable and easily replaceable, which is why attrition rates are often so high, cohorts are so large, individual mentoring is lacking, etc.
 
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For a group of people interested in being mental health practitioners, y'all can be really rude. Complete lack of understanding of other people's circumstances. I have done my research, and am not interested in opinions as to what type of school I should attend.

1. This is a professional forum on the interwebs, not a therapy room. Sac up.

2. Your "research" on this topic has lead you to one of the worst programs in the country (by most all objective metrics) and some of the most expensive. Obviously, those who are more trained and experienced than you in this field are going to question this "research."

3. To essentially say: Dont question me my decisions and only tell me about one aspect of a multifacted issue is a terrible way to ask for advice and get feedback that makes for a well-informed decision. It is also unscientific.
 
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PsyDuck90

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Putting the debt aside for a second (which is very important to consider as others have said above and in previous threads), think of it this way. Programs that take less students and provide funding for them are making an investment in those students. The department and university as a whole, along with the faculty, are invested in the success of these students. Furthermore, when you only have <10 students per cohort, then the time faculty have for mentorship goes up. There's a limit to how much time a faculty member can spend emailing/meeting with students, and the less students, the more individual time. This time is valuable as they are there to help mold you into a clinician and set you up for success, guiding you to tailored externship/internship sites and so on. Graduate education is so much more than what happens in the classroom. On the flip side, programs that charge an exuberant amount of money in tuition tend to also have significantly larger cohort sizes. Thus, the individual attention significantly decreases. The metrics don't lie. Programs with smaller cohorts have much better APA-accredited match rates and EPPP pass rates than the pay-to-play programs. Even if you are dead set on a PsyD instead of a PhD (even though any PsyD worth its salt will have about the same amount of research expectations as a balanced PhD program), there are a (very) small handful of programs that take smaller cohorts and provide funding.
 
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beginner2011

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Hey, everyone! I am an incoming senior in college, and I am currently researching different Psyd programs to apply to this fall. I am very interested in The Wright Institute psyd, and would love to talk to someone with more information about the program. Is there anyone on this forum who currently attends/ recently graduated The Wright Institute that I could talk to? I would love to private message you and get more of a sense of the program :)

Note: I am set on applying to psyd programs, I am not interested in PhD students explaining why I should apply to funded programs instead.

I am also planning on applying to Pacific University Psyd in Oregon, Palo Alto, and Ferkauf (Yeshiva), and would love to talk to students at those programs as well :)


Hello! How do you plan to discriminate between these programs?

What sort of information would make you say, for example, that Pacific University is superior to Palo Alto, or vice versa?
 
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Feb 9, 2020
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Hello! How do you plan to discriminate between these programs?

What sort of information would make you say, for example, that Pacific University is superior to Palo Alto, or vice versa?

Totally fair question! APA match rate information and attrition rates are obviously important factors, but all of that information is available online. I also value the research interests of the faculty of each school, and that information is also available online. Right now I am looking for more information about the experience of learning in these programs. I would like to hear about how happy people generally are with each program, how the community is among students, how supported students feel by faculty and peers, and how prepared they feel by the course work. I feel that actually speaking to individuals enrolled in these schools will be very valuable for me.

My list of places I am looking is relativley narrow, because I am only looking to apply to places where my fiance and myself can see ourselves living. This means somewhere that is close to one of our families, somewhere where he could pursue a career in his field, and somewhere with a strong Jewish community.
 
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@HelenOra FWIW I know a few private practice psychologists that went to the Wright Institute and have heard good things about their training experiences from them. They seem like skilled clinicians and have active if not full practices. My sense is that if you can stomach the price tag, interested in the theoretical orientations that their faculty are stronger in (you can probably get more info by digging through bios/CVs etc), and are aiming for a private practice type of setup down the road, then it's not a bad choice. All this with the caveat that I'm a beginner myself and applying to PhDs this year as well. From all that I've gathered from friends (who attended) and other sources regarding the Wright Institute (and some other PsyD programs) and based on my interests/goals, I am only applying to funded PhD programs. But my interests, goals and priorities may be quite different than yours.

Oh, and a final note to answer your original query: I would bet that if you email the Wright, Yeshiva or any of those programs you're interested in, the admissions coordinators would be happy to put you in touch with current students. Admissions at PsyD programs tend to work differently than PhDs; you are paying them rather than the other way around - meaning that there is an element of the program trying to recruit the applicants/having more time available to talk to applicants. No judgements about the model as it really depends on what you're into and who you are, just stating what may represent a difference that you may want to take advantage of in order to better assess the possibilities.
 
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My list of places I am looking is relativley narrow, because I am only looking to apply to places where my fiance and myself can see ourselves living. This means somewhere that is close to one of our families, somewhere where he could pursue a career in his field, and somewhere with a strong Jewish community.

This honestly reads like: "I don't want to slum it in a second rate city for six years." Substandard Psy.D. programs profiteer greatly off of this kind of thinking hence why we see so many in CA, Chicago, and NY. But I'm not just a critic: I subscribed to these beliefs a number of years ago when I went for my first round of applications to mostly Psy.D. program and I even interviewed at one of programs the OP listed. The interview day was less about assessing our qualifications and more about selling the program to us. I remember one of the faculty literally saying they admit so many students to fund their program. Thankfully, I found SDN, got beat up a little, swallowed my pride, and reapplied for a funded spot the following year in very livable area. It was a downgrade in someways (I got a lot of 'why'd you leave?' from people who didn't understand my circumstances), but I definitely don't regret it. I'd make the same decision again and again.

Another quick thought: OP, even if you have the money, there's also the issue of quality as @Justanothergrad mentioned. These programs don't train people to think scientifically, which is a very important part of being a psychologist.
 
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Indiana_Jane

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This honestly reads like: "I don't want to slum it in a second rate city for six years." Substandard Psy.D. programs profiteer greatly off of this kind of thinking hence why we see so many in CA, Chicago, and NY. But I'm not just a critic: I subscribed to these beliefs a number of years ago when I went for my first round of applications to mostly Psy.D. program and I even interviewed at one of programs the OP listed. The interview day was less about assessing our qualifications and more about selling the program to us. I remember one of the faculty literally saying they admit so many students to fund their program. Thankfully, I found SDN, got beat up a little, swallowed my pride, and reapplied for a funded spot the following year in very livable area. It was a downgrade in someways (I got a lot of 'why'd you leave?' from people who didn't understand my circumstances), but I definitely don't regret it. I'd make the same decision again and again.

Another quick thought: OP, even if you have the money, there's also the issue of quality as @Justanothergrad mentioned. These programs don't train people to think scientifically, which is a very important part of being a psychologist.

Same here. I applied to a now non-existent PsyD program because I didn’t think I was competitive enough for PhD. Thankfully, they took my application money and made sure to call me the day AFTER the program deadline to tell me they were shutting down.

I say *thankfully* because I am now in a fully-funded PhD program and applying to internship. The lack of debt, funding, amazing clinical experiences, mentorship and solid research training = worth it.
 
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beginner2011

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Totally fair question! APA match rate information and attrition rates are obviously important factors, but all of that information is available online. I also value the research interests of the faculty of each school, and that information is also available online. Right now I am looking for more information about the experience of learning in these programs. I would like to hear about how happy people generally are with each program, how the community is among students, how supported students feel by faculty and peers, and how prepared they feel by the course work. I feel that actually speaking to individuals enrolled in these schools will be very valuable for me.

My list of places I am looking is relativley narrow, because I am only looking to apply to places where my fiance and myself can see ourselves living. This means somewhere that is close to one of our families, somewhere where he could pursue a career in his field, and somewhere with a strong Jewish community.

I think it's very wise of you to gather information about student satisfaction. Happiness, community, support and preparation are all certainly crucial elements of what make a strong graduate program in clinical psychology. It's also important to consider whether or not students are actually prepared, not just whether they feel prepared. That's an empirical question that can be addressed by looking at outcome data.

I would encourage you to try to get in touch with people who have sufficient experience in the field and do not have any incentive to mislead you before you make a decision. In other words, not the admissions folks at any of these institutions. They will want to get you in the door to sign on the dotted line. The people on this forum certainly fall within the category of being experienced in the field and not having any incentive to mislead you, and it's a bit odd to me that you're disregarding the advice they're offering.

I will say that as a post-bacc I was mentored by someone who took a faculty position at one of the institutions you're considering (in my opinion it's the best of the four you mentioned) and this mentor strongly discouraged me from considering applying to the institution because of the quality of training, the limited professional opportunities, and the poor reputation of the program in the field.
 
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Okay, do you have some suggestions for psychology doctorate programs that are very clinically focused? I really would love to practice as a clinical psychologist, and would like to attend a program that emphasises clinical work over research. If there are PhD programs like that, I would maybe look into applying. What are some balanced programs you would recommend?
 

beginner2011

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Okay, do you have some suggestions for psychology doctorate programs that are very clinically focused? I really would love to practice as a clinical psychologist, and would like to attend a program that emphasises clinical work over research. If there are PhD programs like that, I would maybe look into applying. What are some balanced programs you would recommend?

The Insider's Guide that @representwitpixels mentioned is an excellent resource. I used it when I was applying to programs. In my experience it's the exception rather than the rule that a PhD program does not provide adequate clinical training for students. It sounds like you're pretty geographically restricted, so it might make sense to start by looking closely at the programs that meet your geographic requirements to see if they'll meet your other training needs.

One thing to also consider is whether or not you really want to be a psychologist. If your primary goal is to provide psychotherapy there are many other ways to get adequate training to do that well other than to become a psychologist. You should definitely take some time to read through this really excellent guide written by a member of APA leadership regarding graduate school options: http://mitch.web.unc.edu/files/2017/02/MitchGradSchoolAdvice.pdf
 
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Okay, do you have some suggestions for psychology doctorate programs that are very clinically focused? I really would love to practice as a clinical psychologist, and would like to attend a program that emphasises clinical work over research. If there are PhD programs like that, I would maybe look into applying. What are some balanced programs you would recommend?
Most programs result in graduates doing clinical work. Depending on your area of interest you want to specialize in, that may be a better guide. Note, this doesn't mean you wont be doing research in a PhD, its the nature of the training (getting a scientist-practitioner psychologist training means getting science training and universities want research from faculty to fund students [over-simplification, but still], thus also the ordeal). Since you are geographically limited, I agree with Beginner, examine programs in your region as it complies with your partners work.

Also, as noted, if you just plan to do do therapy, you may want to consider other routes as well that increase options.
 
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Sanman

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So , here is a question for the OP:

What will you do when it comes time to move for internship and post-doc?

If the answer is the same for all of the steps in the education cycle (prioritize location over quality of education) why not get a masters and practice? A lot less headache in the long run.
 
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chicandtoughness

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Just going to re-drop this thread, which should be required reading and stickied =P

As for the questions at hand:

I interviewed at Wright and Yeshiva, and one of my masters degree classmates attends Palo Alto's PhD program (which runs similarly to their PsyD). I'm happy to put you in contact with her.

I'm curious why you've picked out those programs to apply to, besides the geographic location. They are ridiculously expensive even by PsyD standards. PGSP-Stanford (Palo Alto's program) is FIFTY THOUSAND a year in tuition alone (!!!) PsyD programs are at least 5 years. You're going to be $250k+ in the hole when you get out. I'm not trying to be judgemental, but do you understand our concern when you say you want to take on $300k of debt (and half of that will be private loans that will balloon faster than you can snap a finger) to do a job that earns $70k starting?!

My list of places I am looking is relativley narrow, because I am only looking to apply to places where my fiance and myself can see ourselves living. This means somewhere that is close to one of our families, somewhere where he could pursue a career in his field, and somewhere with a strong Jewish community.

I recognize people have their own needs and reasonings for choosing programs, but one thing I want to caution you on is this: if you attend a substandard PsyD program, you will have a harder time with internship (and/or postdoc) search. Even if you can attend your PsyD in a city of your choosing, there is absolutely no guarantee that you can remain in that city for internship/postdoc. Are you guys okay with being apart for 1-2 years so that you can do training somewhere else?

But I'm not just a critic: I subscribed to these beliefs a number of years ago when I went for my first round of applications to mostly Psy.D. program and I even interviewed at one of programs the OP listed. The interview day was less about assessing our qualifications and more about selling the program to us. I remember one of the faculty literally saying they admit so many students to fund their program.

I went through the exact same thing. 2 years ago I applied mainly to PsyD programs (and a few PhD programs with POIs I really liked) because, like OP, I was geographically limited and thought that I wanted to go hard on the clinical work. It's not worth it. The sad thing is that I did get accepted to some decent PsyD programs (that were mildly selective) that I would have gladly attended if they didn't cost $40k+ tuition per year. As much as we like to say we don't get into this field for the money, it is a very real thing and will cause you all sorts of burnout and living stress in the future. Why would you willingly subject yourself to this, OP?

Okay, do you have some suggestions for psychology doctorate programs that are very clinically focused? I really would love to practice as a clinical psychologist, and would like to attend a program that emphasises clinical work over research. If there are PhD programs like that, I would maybe look into applying. What are some balanced programs you would recommend?
Most programs nowadays are fairly balanced. I second the Insider's Guide. Also, just browse the program websites - research focused programs are usually very clear about their stance and you can strike them from your list easily.

I'm a masters level clinician who decided against going the doctorate route (even after getting into some programs) because like you, I just wanted to do clinical work and provide psychotherapy. To be honest, it was much more worth it to just get a masters in 2 years and then be out practicing, rather than spending 5 years doing research that I wasn't interested in, just to graduate with a degree that makes me only slightly more than a masters. If you're interested in that path please don't hesitate to reach out.
 
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Thank you for your thoughts and input. A lot of the comments were right on the nose: I am way more interested in providing psychotherapy than I am in conducting research. As such, I am now looking at Masters programs. My main interest is domestic violence, and the ways in which our relationships shape our mental health, so I am specifically looking into MFT programs. I think that the allure of being a doctor was somewhat blinding when looking at options. Thank you to those who responded with kindess and understanding, posting actual information instead of pointing and laughing. Those in this thread that responded with snark and dismissiveness were no help at all. Please be mindful of the ways in which you give advice, no matter how right you believe yourself to be.
 
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foreverbull

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Wow, well this thread took an interesting turn. I am a latecomer to this thread but I know someone who graduated from The Wright Institute a handful of years back and would probably be able to connect you with an alum willing to answer some of your questions more objectively than folks handpicked by admissions. Feel free to PM me if you are still curious, but of course considering all of the caveats discussed above by other folks.
 
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MamaPhD

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I think that the allure of being a doctor was somewhat blinding when looking at options. Thank you to those who responded with kindess and understanding, posting actual information instead of pointing and laughing.

It's conscientious of you to consider your blind spots and be willing to rethink your options in light of your training and career goals, especially after receiving some hard to hear feedback. I will say that being a doctor quickly loses its shine when you realize the number of people who casually call you by your first name and speak of you as a "therapist."

MFT programs might be a great match, but don't rule out clinical social work programs either. Some of the most gifted therapists I've worked with were trained as social workers. Good luck with your decision making!
 
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MFT programs might be a great match, but don't rule out clinical social work programs either. Some of the most gifted therapists I've worked with were trained as social workers. Good luck with your decision making!

I'd second social work as something to consider. The theoretical base for MFT is not that difficult to understand and could be easily covered in a structured supervision experience, IMO. And many social workers work directly with couples and families. In addition to better career opportunities and more money within social work than either MFT or counseling, you also have the benefit of gaining experiences with DV as a social worker, which might help you see the problem from vantage points other than just providing psychotherapy. The other thing to consider is that pre-licensure, post-graduation, there's a good chance you'll be doing the job of a social worker anyways.
 
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Sanman

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It's conscientious of you to consider your blind spots and be willing to rethink your options in light of your training and career goals, especially after receiving some hard to hear feedback. I will say that being a doctor quickly loses its shine when you realize the number of people who casually call you by your first name and speak of you as a "therapist."

MFT programs might be a great match, but don't rule out clinical social work programs either. Some of the most gifted therapists I've worked with were trained as social workers. Good luck with your decision making!

Ahh, good old ingrained gender bias. As a man, I get mistaken for the psychiatrist all the time.
 
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I wouldn't necessarily entirely write off doctoral study, but it does sound like some more introspection into what you really want to do day-in, day-out could be helpful. My own opinion is that psychologists still make some of the best therapists given the depth of knowledge and training, and our understanding of research plays into that; in my mind, you can't divorce the two. You might also be surprised by how much you actually enjoy conducting, or at least critically consuming, research once it relates to things you like reading about.
 
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...and the ways in which our relationships shape our mental health...
This actually sounds more like a research focused interest (rather than applied), and an interesting and important one. From your original post, sounds like you have another year of undergrad. I'd encourage you to spend some time over the next year reading some research literature on the topic. You might (and probably will!) find it interesting, and maybe it will get you more interested in phd type training. A clinical masters (I'd look more at clinical social work than MFT) is certainly a good option. However, you really are early in this process- certainly too early to write off anything. You might discover over the next year that you have more interest in research than you thought. You're at an exciting time, and this could be the year to really figure out what is next and make an informed decision. Remember- most of phd graduates don't do research (and haven't since grad school) and work primarily in applied clinical settings. Also- on though whole we got more clinical training and experience during grad school than our psyd counterparts. It's great to just want to do therapy. It's even greater to aim for the best, most comprehensive training you can get to be able to do so. If it leads to more job flexibility, higher pay, and increased job satisfaction, all the better!

I sincerely wish you good luck. It's an exciting time for you, with so many possibilities. Keep an open mind and use the time you have to explore and prepare for ALL your options.
 
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summerbabe

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Keep up the introspection. My ideas for what I wanted/could see myself doing for a career going into my senior year of undergrad and what I do now are pretty different (hint: the words psychology and therapy were not part of those initial considerations) but nevertheless, similar in foundational themes.

I spent 5 years between undergrad and grad school and that was invaluable time for me to get more work and life experiences and continue to figure out what contributes more/less to my overall happiness. If you're still finding yourself uncertain as you go through your senior year, it might not be the worst idea to settle somewhere that works for you and your fiance and wait before committing to graduate study. Funded PhD programs will still likely incur some debt, as will any Master's degrees. And if you're a traditional-aged college student, you've got plenty of decades of possible work ahead of you.
 
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I'm not sure if this suggestion has already been made- but there's also the option of working for a few years before going down the grad school route. You don't necessarily have to begin a graduate program right away, especially if you're still reflecting on your interests/ options.

I was sort of in this same spot at the end of undergrad, so I decided to work for some time before beginning my MA & PhD. Not only did it provide substantial financial freedom, but it didn't negatively impact any of my applications. I actually think it might have helped them quite a bit.

Just a thought :)
 
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Just going to re-drop this thread, which should be required reading and stickied =P

As for the questions at hand:

I interviewed at Wright and Yeshiva, and one of my masters degree classmates attends Palo Alto's PhD program (which runs similarly to their PsyD). I'm happy to put you in contact with her.

I'm curious why you've picked out those programs to apply to, besides the geographic location. They are ridiculously expensive even by PsyD standards. PGSP-Stanford (Palo Alto's program) is FIFTY THOUSAND a year in tuition alone (!!!) PsyD programs are at least 5 years. You're going to be $250k+ in the hole when you get out. I'm not trying to be judgemental, but do you understand our concern when you say you want to take on $300k of debt (and half of that will be private loans that will balloon faster than you can snap a finger) to do a job that earns $70k starting?!



I recognize people have their own needs and reasonings for choosing programs, but one thing I want to caution you on is this: if you attend a substandard PsyD program, you will have a harder time with internship (and/or postdoc) search. Even if you can attend your PsyD in a city of your choosing, there is absolutely no guarantee that you can remain in that city for internship/postdoc. Are you guys okay with being apart for 1-2 years so that you can do training somewhere else?



I went through the exact same thing. 2 years ago I applied mainly to PsyD programs (and a few PhD programs with POIs I really liked) because, like OP, I was geographically limited and thought that I wanted to go hard on the clinical work. It's not worth it. The sad thing is that I did get accepted to some decent PsyD programs (that were mildly selective) that I would have gladly attended if they didn't cost $40k+ tuition per year. As much as we like to say we don't get into this field for the money, it is a very real thing and will cause you all sorts of burnout and living stress in the future. Why would you willingly subject yourself to this, OP?


Most programs nowadays are fairly balanced. I second the Insider's Guide. Also, just browse the program websites - research focused programs are usually very clear about their stance and you can strike them from your list easily.

I'm a masters level clinician who decided against going the doctorate route (even after getting into some programs) because like you, I just wanted to do clinical work and provide psychotherapy. To be honest, it was much more worth it to just get a masters in 2 years and then be out practicing, rather than spending 5 years doing research that I wasn't interested in, just to graduate with a degree that makes me only slightly more than a masters. If you're interested in that path please don't hesitate to reach out.
Hi there! I am in this same struggle now as I am looking to PsyD vs MSW programs if I dont get into any funded PHD programs. I am not that attached the research aspect of the field, so its hard for me to justify taking more time off to do research if I don't get into PHD since my primary goal is pursuing the clinical aspect. I have looked at PsyD programs in NY and CA such as pace, palo alto pgsp, yeshiva, and wright, but somehow I keep feeling torn with whether or not it would be worth it to tag on this cost and additional years of school. I have recently begun looking at NYUs msw program as it seems to have a more clinical focus, as well as USC, and some UC schools. If you have any insight on what it is like being an LCSW I would love to find out more about it. People have just always tried to steer me away from the career due to burnout
 

R. Matey

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I am not that attached the research aspect of the field, so its hard for me to justify taking more time off to do research if I don't get into PHD since my primary goal is pursuing the clinical aspect.

You need other reasons aside from the hundreds of thousands dollars in debt and more limited career opportunities?
 
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calimich

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I agree with others who have suggested the LCSW path. I advise my own students who are considering licensure at the MA level to strongly consider the MSW degree. I think it's the most versatile and nationally known MA license and the "strongest" imo. I also think it still holds somewhat of a stigma though or is stereotyped more than an MFT or LPC.

Regarding Wright and PGSP, I also generally agree with others. Those programs are extremely expensive, exist in saturated markets, and have large cohorts. They are also generally well respected in the area and much better than other local professional schools and online options. Their match rates have improved, but still lag behind average I believe, as do their EPPP and licensure rates. I don't encourage my own students to apply there, however I'll almost always support their decision if they do apply after knowing all the details. The couple of students who are actually attending are generally enjoying their experience and nearly all have some money available to pay tuition, limiting, in some cases eliminating, loans.

If a student is serious about pursuing a career as a psychologist I strongly encourage them to apply nationwide to funded programs, whether Phd/PsyD, clinical/counseling. If they cannot do that, depending on the reason, I encourage a MA licensure program or an MA/postbac program and then reapplying.
 
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summerbabe

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People have just always tried to steer me away from the career due to burnout
There's gonna be high burnout potential for every mental health job, whether you have a doctorate or not. A key is figuring out what you're best suited for. For example, some people will never be wired to do face to face therapy for 25 hours a week long-term.

If you end up pursuing a MSW, don't get suckered in by an expensive brand name. I have no idea where the SWers I currently work with went to school and don't particularly care. And if you have an idea of where you want to settle, look for something with a good reputation locally and can help with networking, which will often be a state school. It might feel good to have an NYU degree hanging in your office but it will likely matter less than you think, especially if you don't end up working in Manhattan.
 
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chicandtoughness

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Hi there! I am in this same struggle now as I am looking to PsyD vs MSW programs if I dont get into any funded PHD programs. I am not that attached the research aspect of the field, so its hard for me to justify taking more time off to do research if I don't get into PHD since my primary goal is pursuing the clinical aspect. I have looked at PsyD programs in NY and CA such as pace, palo alto pgsp, yeshiva, and wright, but somehow I keep feeling torn with whether or not it would be worth it to tag on this cost and additional years of school. I have recently begun looking at NYUs msw program as it seems to have a more clinical focus, as well as USC, and some UC schools. If you have any insight on what it is like being an LCSW I would love to find out more about it. People have just always tried to steer me away from the career due to burnout
Are you from CA or NY? Just curious why you’re looking at programs in those geographies specifically.

If you want to go the masters route, get the MSW. I regret it every day that I didn’t do social work. Especially if you plan on practicing in NY state. LICSW has so much more respect than LMHC there :(

Do not go to USC, it is ridiculously expensive and the only benefit is the “brand”, which as someone pointed out earlier, is a moot point for your patients.
 
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Are you from CA or NY? Just curious why you’re looking at programs in those geographies specifically.

If you want to go the masters route, get the MSW. I regret it every day that I didn’t do social work. Especially if you plan on practicing in NY state. LICSW has so much more respect than LMHC there :(

Do not go to USC, it is ridiculously expensive and the only benefit is the “brand”, which as someone pointed out earlier, is a moot point for your patients.
I am from CA but am looking to make a change as I've lived here my whole life and did Berkeley for undergrad. I don't care so much about the school's title, I just was attracted to NYU based on its clinical focus. Thank you for confirming my initial thoughts on USC, definitely would do public schools if I stay in CA. I had originally been thinking MFT but am much more leaning towards MSW now :)
 
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mdwpsyd

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I am very sad that I googled this to learn what it meant. :hungover:
IMHO, "sac up" is simply a contemporary take on an ancient phrase, "gird one's loins", which appears in several Biblical passages, along with "gird up".

According to the Oxford English Dictionary (OED), "gird one's loins" has meant—in a figurative sense—"to invest or endue with attributes, esp. (after biblical phrase) with strength, power, etc." since about 1000, and "to prepare (oneself) for action; to brace up (oneself) for, to, or to do something, often with up" since about 1450.

gird, v.1 : Oxford English Dictionary (subscription required)
 
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