LOR from a Forensic Science Detective

[premed12324]

One of my professors is part-time in law enforcement as a detective. He is also a PhD, who does a lot of forensic science-related research such as physical methods, blood stain analysis, etc.

Would a LOR from my professor cause any bias to admissions due to the anti-police sentiment in the country right now?

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[premed12324]

@gonnif @LizzyM @Goro @Moko @Catalystik

 

[Goro]

One of my professors is part-time in law enforcement as a detective. He is also a PhD, who does a lot of forensic science-related research such as physical methods, blood stain analysis, etc.

Would a LOR from my professor cause any bias to admissions due to the anti-police sentiment in the country right now?

Chill.

We Adcoms aren't stupid. We also LIKE first responders.

 

[Blueprint Med School]

One of my professors is part-time in law enforcement as a detective. He is also a PhD, who does a lot of forensic science-related research such as physical methods, blood stain analysis, etc.

Would a LOR from my professor cause any bias to admissions due to the anti-police sentiment in the country right now?

I think it could be one of the more 'cool' and unique letters. Is it just a class LOR or did you have extensive work/research with them?

David D, MD - USMLE and MCAT Tutor
Med School Tutors

 

[premed12324]

I think it could be one of the more 'cool' and unique letters. Is it just a class LOR or did you have extensive work/research with them?

David D, MD - USMLE and MCAT Tutor
Med School Tutors

I had two of my forensic science classes with this professor. Yeah, he was super interesting esp gaining his perspective on the recent cases rooted in forensic science/evidence as opposed to media.

 

[LizzyM]

I see no issues with such a letter. Be sure it is about YOU and not THEM. It should be about your performance, your demeanor, and your attitudes, not his.

 

[Blueprint Med School]

I had two of my forensic science classes with this professor. Yeah, he was super interesting esp gaining his perspective on the recent cases rooted in forensic science/evidence as opposed to media.

Neat! It sounds like a great experience. I echo what LizzyM says, to make sure the letter is principally about you, but if you have interesting stories (that mention no names are politically neutral) they could make great trail conversations about how you developed your mindset as a critical thinker. Good luck!

David D, MD - USMLE and MCAT Tutor
Med School Tutors

 

[Catalystik]

One of my professors is part-time in law enforcement as a detective. He is also a PhD, who does a lot of forensic science-related research such as physical methods, blood stain analysis, etc.

Would a LOR from my professor cause any bias to admissions due to the anti-police sentiment in the country right now?

No.

 

[LizzyM]

Completely trivial and solely for comic value, I could see a letter written in the style of Joe Friday from Dragnet.

Letters from military commanders come close. The paragraphs are typically numbered which I always find a bit odd but I understand that's their culture's format for letters.

 

[DNAJB6]

One of my professors is part-time in law enforcement as a detective. He is also a PhD, who does a lot of forensic science-related research such as physical methods, blood stain analysis, etc.

Would a LOR from my professor cause any bias to admissions due to the anti-police sentiment in the country right now?

It shouldn't be a problem. If there was a school that was that petty, would you honestly want to attend it anyway?

 

[Radishguy]

Sorry if it is bad form hijacking a thread, but this is older so I hope it isn’t an issue? Anyways, I have a related question that I was hoping someone could help with. I was a cop for ten years before going back to school, I was also an attorney and held a bunch of other positions, but the cop experience was actually a lot more patient interactions than someone might expect. Every shift I was providing some sort of medical care to someone, from basic first aid to CPR and a lot in between. Just from all the narcan I administered, I could probably claim a number of contact hours beyond the average applicant. However, given the way things are, I’m extremely hesitant to include these experiences. To be clear, I personally have no bad acts to account for. I worked in one of the country’s most dangerous cities, but still never used any sort of a weapon on anyone. I only had one internal affairs complaint in that decade, and it was for dropping the f-bomb while trying to pull myself out of a car that was just totaled in a chase. I left the department on good terms and for non-political reasons (I fractured my skull in a bunch of spots, fractured a vertebra, and compressed or herniated 6 discs, unrelated to the car accident where I swore). But I understand that people don’t like cops, and a lot of people have good reason for that. So I don’t know if I should just leave that all out. It kills me to leave it out because it is a lot of experience, but I don’t want to include it if it is just going to damn my application.

 

[DNAJB6]

Sorry if it is bad form hijacking a thread, but this is older so I hope it isn’t an issue? Anyways, I have a related question that I was hoping someone could help with. I was a cop for ten years before going back to school, I was also an attorney and held a bunch of other positions, but the cop experience was actually a lot more patient interactions than someone might expect. Every shift I was providing some sort of medical care to someone, from basic first aid to CPR and a lot in between. Just from all the narcan I administered, I could probably claim a number of contact hours beyond the average applicant. However, given the way things are, I’m extremely hesitant to include these experiences. To be clear, I personally have no bad acts to account for. I worked in one of the country’s most dangerous cities, but still never used any sort of a weapon on anyone. I only had one internal affairs complaint in that decade, and it was for dropping the f-bomb while trying to pull myself out of a car that was just totaled in a chase. I left the department on good terms and for non-political reasons (I fractured my skull in a bunch of spots, fractured a vertebra, and compressed or herniated 6 discs, unrelated to the car accident where I swore). But I understand that people don’t like cops, and a lot of people have good reason for that. So I don’t know if I should just leave that all out. It kills me to leave it out because it is a lot of experience, but I don’t want to include it if it is just going to damn my application.

I see nothing wrong with it. If a school is that hostile where it would penalize you for being a police officer, would you really want to live in that toxic of an environment for 4 years?

 

[Radishguy]

I mean, that’s kind of the world right now. I have people in my neighborhood who are hostile because they know I used to be a cop, so you can’t really escape it. It is what it is. I’m more trying to see if there is a way to say I had that experience without saying I was a cop. Or if there are enough adcoms who don’t hate cops to overrule the ones who do.

 

[LizzyM]

If you worked as a cop for 10 years, it is rather hard to leave that off of the work/activities section of the application without leaving a gapping hole that would be far more damaging. You will also need to include your law school transcript. The bigger issue I see is the question that will be raised by the career changing and how you have tested your interest and why this is finally the right spot for you and not just another stop on the path before you decide to change careers again.

 

[Radishguy]

If you worked as a cop for 10 years, it is rather hard to leave that off of the work/activities section of the application without leaving a gapping hole that would be far more damaging. You will also need to include your law school transcript. The bigger issue I see is the question that will be raised by the career changing and how you have tested your interest and why this is finally the right spot for you and not just another stop on the path before you decide to change careers again.

So the skull fracture and the back injuries were from two different unfortunate foot chases separated by about seven years. The skull fracture led to a brief induced coma and a really long rehab over a year for walking/talking etc. That year of being in and out of hospitals and doctors’ offices and rehab facilities is where I gained an appreciation for and interest in the medical field. Then the back injuries forced my retirement and gave me the opportunity to actually pursue it. I’m shadowing now and doing some volunteer work while I take the prereqs to make sure this is what I want to do for the rest of my life. I made the wrong choice when I chose law school over literally anything else. So, I am putting in a lot of due diligence this time around to make sure I don’t make the same mistake twice.

As for explaining the gap, I was an attorney or in law school for the entire time I was a cop, so I could theoretically leave it out without a gap to explain. The issue would be explaining why I was in critical condition at two points in my life, which I guess could just be summed up to bad luck.

 

[LizzyM]

So the skull fracture and the back injuries were from two different unfortunate foot chases separated by about seven years. The skull fracture led to a brief induced coma and a really long rehab over a year for walking/talking etc. That year of being in and out of hospitals and doctors’ offices and rehab facilities is where I gained an appreciation for and interest in the medical field. Then the back injuries forced my retirement and gave me the opportunity to actually pursue it. I’m shadowing now and doing some volunteer work while I take the prereqs to make sure this is what I want to do for the rest of my life. I made the wrong choice when I chose law school over literally anything else. So, I am putting in a lot of due diligence this time around to make sure I don’t make the same mistake twice.

As for explaining the gap, I was an attorney or in law school for the entire time I was a cop, so I could theoretically leave it out without a gap to explain. The issue would be explaining why I was in critical condition at two points in my life, which I guess could just be summed up to bad luck.

It is not worth trying to hide that you were employed as a cop by listing that you were in law school and working as an attorney from 20xx to 20xx but landed in the hospital and eventually started the academic preparation for medical school. The story makes more sense by stating that you were a cop. Frankly, I've not heard/seen any anti-police rhetoric here at the medical school in a city in a blue state. Anti-police brutality, anti-murder by cop, yes, but not animosity toward the profession in general.

 

[KnightDoc]

So the skull fracture and the back injuries were from two different unfortunate foot chases separated by about seven years. The skull fracture led to a brief induced coma and a really long rehab over a year for walking/talking etc. That year of being in and out of hospitals and doctors’ offices and rehab facilities is where I gained an appreciation for and interest in the medical field. Then the back injuries forced my retirement and gave me the opportunity to actually pursue it. I’m shadowing now and doing some volunteer work while I take the prereqs to make sure this is what I want to do for the rest of my life. I made the wrong choice when I chose law school over literally anything else. So, I am putting in a lot of due diligence this time around to make sure I don’t make the same mistake twice.

As for explaining the gap, I was an attorney or in law school for the entire time I was a cop, so I could theoretically leave it out without a gap to explain. The issue would be explaining why I was in critical condition at two points in my life, which I guess could just be summed up to bad luck.

There is no hiding it. They'll do a background check. They'll see it. It's not an extracurricular activity or a summer job - it's 10 years of your life. They'll rescind any acceptance you might have for lying by omission.

Again, back to @LizzyM's point, your bigger hurdle is going to be convincing them that medicine is your true calling after a lifetime first in law enforcement, and then in law. You have a very interesting story, but this is way more competitive than anything you've done before. The good news is you have disability to live on, so you won't have to incur tons of debt while exploring the possibility. Good luck!!

 

[Radishguy]

There is no hiding it. They'll do a background check. They'll see it. It's not an extracurricular activity or a summer job - it's 10 years of your life. They'll rescind any acceptance you might have for lying by omission.

Again, back to @LizzyM's point, your bigger hurdle is going to be convincing them that medicine is your true calling after a lifetime first in law enforcement, and then in law. You have a very interesting story, but this is way more competitive than anything you've done before. The good news is you have disability to live on, so you won't have to incur tons of debt while exploring the possibility. Good luck!!

The disability is the only reason I’m able to do this right now, otherwise taking this much time off of work just couldn’t work considering I have three kids, mortgages, car payments, etc. etc. However, I refuse to be on disability for more time than necessary so, I don’t want to waste too much time trying to figure all of this out.

About your comments on explaining why this isn’t just another whim I’m exploring, I didn’t think of that until it was brought up be you and LizzyM, any advice on how to handle that, when to handle that? I never intended to be a cop or a lawyer. I was signed up with the Marines when I was in law school. I was born on a Marine base and always planned on a career there. The plan was to finish law school, do The Basic School in the summers, then accept the commission at the higher rank and go the route of platoon leader instead of JAG, then just use the law degree as a resume point when going through the ranks. When my recruiter and I came up with this plan, I was a bartender, and thought being a cop would be another better resume point than bartender. So, I took the tests, got accepted and got placed on a special gun unit that was way more high speed than I probably should’ve been in while going to law school. Ended up riding the hood of a burglary suspect’s car straight into a telephone pole. Along with the skull fractures, I had three separate areas of subarachnoid bleeding, and apparently TBIs are a hard disqualifier for the Marines. Quickly found out the same is true for all the other branches of military. So I tried to make the best of the situation by sticking with the police department. Then I fell from really high during another chase, and that was it for the police gig. Honestly, I kind of disliked the profession of attorney before I went to the law school. It was just a means to an end, so after passing bars, I only did house closings and even that I did sort of begrudgingly.

That is a lot to explain and doing so would take up some valuable real estate on an application, so do you think it is something I should focus on in an application or wait until an interview if I get one? Thanks I’m advance for any advice.

 

[LizzyM]

You need to write "why medicine" but given your age and education, the backstory is going to be your hook and a necessity. You might start out by saying "I'm not unique in coming to an interest in medicine after being a patient but most pre-meds don't wind up in the hospital after riding the hood of a burglary suspect's car into a telephone pole and most pre-meds don't have a resume that includes bartender, police officer and lawyer but that's my story. My original plan, as the offspring (or say son or daughter -- fewer characters) of a Marine, was to follow those footsteps as an officer after completing law school. I took a job as a cop thinking that it would be better for my resume than bartending. The injuries I suffered as a police officer precluded enlistment in the armed services after law school but sparked an interest in medicine that had previously been unexplored....." Then go into how you tested your interest through shadowing, volunteering, employment, etc. Someone can tell you how many characters you get for the AMCAS application but what I've put here as a hook and an introduction is less than 20% of the total allowed so you should be fine. Good luck!

 

[Radishguy]

You need to write "why medicine" but given your age and education, the backstory is going to be your hook and a necessity. You might start out by saying "I'm not unique in coming to an interest in medicine after being a patient but most pre-meds don't wind up in the hospital after riding the hood of a burglary suspect's car into a telephone pole and most pre-meds don't have a resume that includes bartender, police officer and lawyer but that's my story. My original plan, as the offspring (or say son or daughter -- fewer characters) of a Marine, was to follow those footsteps as an officer after completing law school. I took a job as a cop thinking that it would be better for my resume than bartending. The injuries I suffered as a police officer precluded enlistment in the armed services after law school but sparked an interest in medicine that had previously been unexplored....." Then go into how you tested your interest through shadowing, volunteering, employment, etc. Someone can tell you how many characters you get for the AMCAS application but what I've put here as a hook and an introduction is less than 20% of the total allowed so you should be fine. Good luck!

That is a really good hook. Thank you so much for taking the time to write that out!

 

[LizzyM]

I think that you could also make "service" a running theme through your essay and that the marriage of service and science that is medicine appeals to you given that your career as a police officer was in service to people often experiencing the worst day of their life and in many cases requiring the first aid you were trained as an officer to provide including Narcan, CPR and so forth. I can see service aspects of bartending and real estate lawyer, too, so you can make that a theme if you wish.