LOW GPA but HIGH MCAT

[ifonlyifonly]

So I just got my MCAT scores back, and I got a 39 (14P/11V/14B) and I wanted some advice about what to do.

I have a low GPA..but a good upward trend. I'm currently a senior graduating in May with a Biology degree.
My cGPA and sGPA are around a 2.92/2.97 but I believe they'll both be bumped up to a 3.00 by the end of this semester, and 3.1 by graduation. I got lower grades in freshman year, but I've been making up for it. I've gotten a lot of good grades in higher level sciences.
LORs-I'll be able to get really good ones from three teachers.
EC's
radio show, cultural club (small just in it for the fun)
Leadership position-budget committee since Jr Year
Research-This summer, and continuing into the year. I don't have anything published, but I believe I should be able to get a good letter.
Volunteering-Clinical:I've logged around 100 hours in the hospital, and should have 200/250 by next June. I also have been volunteering in the children cancer ward, but haven't kept track of hours. We just comfort the kids and play with them. If I had to put a number I'd say like 40? 50? That will increase by next June.
Non-clinical-tutoring kids on saturdays in math. I've done this since sophomore year.
Jobs-I've had tutoring type jobs here and there. Possible TA position in Bio next semester.
Shadowing-2 doctors, about 40 hours (this is an estimate) over the course of summers and winter breaks.

I'd really like to apply next June, because I really don't want to waste anymore time and I don't want my MCAT score to expire. I was thinking that I would apply to SMPs after I get my fall semester grades in January, and apply to medical schools in June. I was thinking of Georgetown, Tufts, Cincinatti, Drexel, and NYMC.
Would this be a good plan? What SMPs are the best for getting in during your SMP year? Which ones are high linkage/interview? Should I apply to more?

Or should I do a fifth year and take upper level bio classes to raise my uGPA? I'd be able to realistically raise it to a 3.3/3.4, but I've already taken a lot of bio classes so I don't know if adcoms will just look at it as blatant GPA boosting, which it is. I'm just worried that uGPA is the most important thing, and that if I do an SMP it won't matter even if I do rock it.

Also I really am aiming for an MD, so I'd really like MD-specific advice. I will apply to DOs when I apply to medical school, because I'd rather be a doctor in the end but I'm aiming for MDs.

Thanks in Advance!

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[supermintyfresh]

So I just got my MCAT scores back, and I got a 39 (14P/11V/14B) and I wanted some advice about what to do.

I have a low GPA..but a good upward trend. I'm currently a senior graduating in May with a Biology degree.
My cGPA and sGPA are around a 2.92/2.97 but I believe they'll both be bumped up to a 3.00 by the end of this semester, and 3.1 by graduation. I got lower grades in freshman year, but I've been making up for it. I've gotten a lot of good grades in higher level sciences.
LORs-I'll be able to get really good ones from three teachers.
EC's
radio show, cultural club (small just in it for the fun)
Leadership position-budget committee since Jr Year
Research-This summer, and continuing into the year. I don't have anything published, but I believe I should be able to get a good letter.
Volunteering-Clinical:I've logged around 100 hours in the hospital, and should have 200/250 by next June. I also have been volunteering in the children cancer ward, but haven't kept track of hours. We just comfort the kids and play with them. If I had to put a number I'd say like 40? 50? That will increase by next June.
Non-clinical-tutoring kids on saturdays in math. I've done this since sophomore year.
Jobs-I've had tutoring type jobs here and there. Possible TA position in Bio next semester.
Shadowing-2 doctors, about 40 hours (this is an estimate) over the course of summers and winter breaks.

I'd really like to apply next June, because I really don't want to waste anymore time and I don't want my MCAT score to expire. I was thinking that I would apply to SMPs after I get my fall semester grades in January, and apply to medical schools in June. I was thinking of Georgetown, Tufts, Cincinatti, Drexel, and NYMC.
Would this be a good plan? What SMPs are the best for getting in during your SMP year? Which ones are high linkage/interview? Should I apply to more?

Or should I do a fifth year and take upper level bio classes to raise my uGPA? I'd be able to realistically raise it to a 3.3/3.4, but I've already taken a lot of bio classes so I don't know if adcoms will just look at it as blatant GPA boosting, which it is. I'm just worried that uGPA is the most important thing, and that if I do an SMP it won't matter even if I do rock it.

Also I really am aiming for an MD, so I'd really like MD-specific advice. I will apply to DOs when I apply to medical school, because I'd rather be a doctor in the end but I'm aiming for MDs.

Thanks in Advance!

Congrats on your MCAT score! It's amazing that you were able to score 99 percentile.

I'm afraid that your GPA being below a 3.0 is going to have some schools automatically not give you a chance, unless you do a post-bacc or SMP. I'm not certain about the policies of specific schools, so you would have to look on their websites.

Also take a look at this sticky to get a good idea of where you are; it says you have about a 55 pct chance of matriculating, and it would be even higher if you have above-average ECs and interview skills: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=12107997#post12107997

My honest suggestion would be try to get it above a 3.4 as you stated above for a decent shot! Best of luck!

 

[ifonlyifonly]

Congrats on your MCAT score! It's amazing that you were able to score 99 percentile.

I'm afraid that your GPA being below a 3.0 is going to have some schools automatically not give you a chance, unless you do a post-bacc or SMP. I'm not certain about the policies of specific schools, so you would have to look on their websites.

Also take a look at this sticky to get a good idea of where you are; it says you have about a 55 pct chance of matriculating, and it would be even higher if you have above-average ECs and interview skills: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=12107997#post12107997

My honest suggestion would be try to get it above a 3.4 as you stated above for a decent shot! Best of luck!

Thank you for your advice! My concern is that since I'm already a bio major I've already taken a lot of classes. I could take some upper level bio classes, enough for two full semesters, because there are still classes I haven't taken, but they're classes I'm not interested it. They're classes like zoology that I don't think Med schools see as super helpful anyways. I don't want to just take classes to boost my GPA if it really won't help. Plus I think I'd be miserable. Would a 3.3 really be better than a 3.1 under these circumstances?

 

[inycepoo]

Thank you for your advice! My concern is that since I'm already a bio major I've already taken a lot of classes. I could take some upper level bio classes, enough for two full semesters, because there are still classes I haven't taken, but they're classes I'm not interested it. They're classes like zoology that I don't think Med schools see as super helpful anyways. I don't want to just take classes to boost my GPA if it really won't help. Plus I think I'd be miserable. Would a 3.3 really be better than a 3.1 under these circumstances?

Any GPA boost at this point would help you not get screened out almost automatically at many MD schools with that GPA. No one knows whether they screen based on GPA, MCAT, or both, but I'm sure you will get auto rejects due to that 3.0 (God forbid it stays at 2.9). With mediocre ECs like that (just being honest bro), you're in real danger for MDs.However, taking classes you're not interested in is the perfect recipe for getting bad grades anyway.

SO APPLY EARLY.


As for SMPs, Bryn Mawr and BU are also well-regarded and apparently write excellent letters (I know 2 Bryn Mawrs who got into top 20s from my top 5 ugrad).

 

[kmp0410]

If you can get your GPA above a 3.0 I would apply ASAP. That 39 would get you in somewhere assuming you apply broadly.

 

[occams_razor]

With a 39 MCAT, if you can get your GPA above 3.0 you have a good shot. Most schools auto screen for a 3.0 GPA. if you could get it to a 3.3+ that would be good. Fwiw I know someone who had a 3.1 and 37 MCAT and he got into a few MD schools. Also know someone with a 3.3 cGPA and 35 MCAT who got into a really good school but he had crazy amazing ECs.

IMO SMPs are great for people with GPAs below 3.4-3.5 who have good MCAT scores.. But your MCAT is beyond good, it is amazing, so I think you may be able to save yourself a lot of money, avoid the SMP and just take some post-bacc classes to boost your GPA

 

[occams_razor]

I just noticed I missed the part where you mentioned making good grades in upper level science courses and that the low grades were from freshman year. You also said you could get the GPA to 3.0 by the end of the semester and 3.1 by graduation. In that case OP if I were you, I would apply June 2014 as soon as AMCAS opens. applying early and broadly with that MCAT and the upward trend (and a LizzyM score of 69-70), I have faith you will get in somewhere MD. Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

 

[supermintyfresh]

I just noticed I missed the part where you mentioned making good grades in upper level science courses and that the low grades were from freshman year. You also said you could get the GPA to 3.0 by the end of the semester and 3.1 by graduation. In that case OP if I were you, I would apply June 2014 as soon as AMCAS opens. applying early and broadly with that MCAT and the upward trend (and a LizzyM score of 69-70), I have faith you will get in somewhere MD. Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

I missed that part too. Yeah above a 3.0 should help with those auto-screens with secondaries/Interview Invites.

Also pre-write all of your secondaries (look at last year's thread), work on the AMCAS as soon as it opens, and submit on the first day possible. I'm applying this cycle, and I regret having put off some secondaries until later because of research.

Apply broadly and you have a decent shot

 

[ifonlyifonly]

Any GPA boost at this point would help you not get screened out almost automatically at many MD schools with that GPA. No one knows whether they screen based on GPA, MCAT, or both, but I'm sure you will get auto rejects due to that 3.0 (God forbid it stays at 2.9). With mediocre ECs like that (just being honest bro), you're in real danger for MDs.However, taking classes you're not interested in is the perfect recipe for getting bad grades anyway.

SO APPLY EARLY.


As for SMPs, Bryn Mawr and BU are also well-regarded and apparently write excellent letters (I know 2 Bryn Mawrs who got into top 20s from my top 5 ugrad).

Thanks for the information! So I checked MSAR for the schools I'm interested in, and my score will be good for the 2014 and 2015 cycle for all of them, and even 2016 cycle for a lot. Doing an SMP is considered a GPA boost even though it's not included in uGPA? I'm just concerned that I'll do an SMP and do well but still not get in because of uGPA, and at that point it will be too late to take undergrad classes.

EDIT:Also I think Bryn Mawr is for career changers

 

[ifonlyifonly]

If you can get your GPA above a 3.0 I would apply ASAP. That 39 would get you in somewhere assuming you apply broadly.

With a 39 MCAT, if you can get your GPA above 3.0 you have a good shot. Most schools auto screen for a 3.0 GPA. if you could get it to a 3.3+ that would be good. Fwiw I know someone who had a 3.1 and 37 MCAT and he got into a few MD schools. Also know someone with a 3.3 cGPA and 35 MCAT who got into a really good school but he had crazy amazing ECs.

IMO SMPs are great for people with GPAs below 3.4-3.5 who have good MCAT scores.. But your MCAT is beyond good, it is amazing, so I think you may be able to save yourself a lot of money, avoid the SMP and just take some post-bacc classes to boost your GPA

I just noticed I missed the part where you mentioned making good grades in upper level science courses and that the low grades were from freshman year. You also said you could get the GPA to 3.0 by the end of the semester and 3.1 by graduation. In that case OP if I were you, I would apply June 2014 as soon as AMCAS opens. applying early and broadly with that MCAT and the upward trend (and a LizzyM score of 69-70), I have faith you will get in somewhere MD. Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

I missed that part too. Yeah above a 3.0 should help with those auto-screens with secondaries/Interview Invites.

Also pre-write all of your secondaries (look at last year's thread), work on the AMCAS as soon as it opens, and submit on the first day possible. I'm applying this cycle, and I regret having put off some secondaries until later because of research.

Apply broadly and you have a decent shot

This is really encouraging thanks you guys it's really nice that I know I have hope now. Should I do an SMP during my gap year (2014-2015) even if I apply June 2014? I was thinking that if I do well that first semester it'll really help with getting interviews. Plus I kind of want to do it, as weird as that sounds. I'm really excited to learn medicine!
Also, I probably should mention I'm an asian/indian girl which doesn't help haha.

 

[occams_razor]

Thanks for the information! So I checked MSAR for the schools I'm interested in, and my score will be good for the 2014 and 2015 cycle for all of them, and even 2016 cycle for a lot. Doing an SMP is considered a GPA boost even though it's not included in uGPA? I'm just concerned that I'll do an SMP and do well but still not get in because of uGPA, and at that point it will be too late to take undergrad classes.

if you do well in an SMP, while it doesn't change your undergrad GPA, adcoms are likely to look past your undergrad GPA because by doing well in an SMP you have shown you can handle med school workload.

If you feel that you want to and would benefit from an SMP then by all means go for it. Your MCAT could get you into a top MD school but your GPA will hold you back at the top schools. If it's important to you to have a shot at higher ranked programs then doing well in an SMP will help. If you look up the blog stealing med school, the guy who ran that blog was in a similar situation to you where he had a low undergrad GPA (I believe it was a 3.0) but high MCAT, so he did a masters, got good grades and is now at a top school.

 

[DokterMom]

This is really encouraging thanks you guys it's really nice that I know I have hope now. Should I do an SMP during my gap year (2014-2015) even if I apply June 2014? I was thinking that if I do well that first semester it'll really help with getting interviews. Plus I kind of want to do it, as weird as that sounds. I'm really excited to learn medicine!
Also, I probably should mention I'm an asian/indian girl which doesn't help haha.

You know, that Asian/Indian angle actually might not be so bad...
You know the stereotype -- Tiger parents pushing super-studious Asian kids. Obedient, study-aholic Asian kids with no social life trying to meet tiger-parents' expectations. (Think 4.0 GPA and 28 MCAT.)

If your story is that you rebelled against parental pressure and parental goals and partied hard freshman year, then realized the person you were hurting most was yourself and YOUR OWN GOALS -- then buckled down and did well -- Well, that's an interesting story. One that works against 'type', and one that (assuming it's true) could be very relatable.

 

[RogueUnicorn]

With a 39 MCAT, if you can get your GPA above 3.0 you have a good shot. Most schools auto screen for a 3.0 GPA. if you could get it to a 3.3+ that would be good. Fwiw I know someone who had a 3.1 and 37 MCAT and he got into a few MD schools. Also know someone with a 3.3 cGPA and 35 MCAT who got into a really good school but he had crazy amazing ECs.

IMO SMPs are great for people with GPAs below 3.4-3.5 who have good MCAT scores.. But your MCAT is beyond good, it is amazing, so I think you may be able to save yourself a lot of money, avoid the SMP and just take some post-bacc classes to boost your GPA

completely false in every way

This is really encouraging thanks you guys it's really nice that I know I have hope now. Should I do an SMP during my gap year (2014-2015) even if I apply June 2014? I was thinking that if I do well that first semester it'll really help with getting interviews. Plus I kind of want to do it, as weird as that sounds. I'm really excited to learn medicine!
Also, I probably should mention I'm an asian/indian girl which doesn't help haha.

from what I can see you have two major deficiencies - ECs and GPA. as for GPA i'd recommend post-bac to chin up that GPA to over 3.0, do an SMP and murder it. then you might get a few interviews but even then you may only get into your home school if at all. applying and doing an SMP at the same time ensures you'll do neither particularly well.

as for your ECs, you really need to round that out. unless you've been doing your couple of activities for a long time it looks like you have no real interest and have been doing things piecemeal here and there. try to develop one into a real strength.

good luck

 

[occams_razor]

completely false in every way



from what I can see you have two major deficiencies - ECs and GPA. as for GPA i'd recommend post-bac to chin up that GPA to over 3.0, do an SMP and murder it. then you might get a few interviews but even then you may only get into your home school if at all. applying and doing an SMP at the same time ensures you'll do neither particularly well.

as for your ECs, you really need to round that out. unless you've been doing your couple of activities for a long time it looks like you have no real interest and have been doing things piecemeal here and there. try to develop one into a real strength.

good luck

what is false about what I said? assuming OP just wants to get into any MD school, with a 39 MCAT and 3.1 GPA (which is what she said she would have at graduation) and her upward trend, she may very well be able to avoid an SMP which would save her a lot of money. Most SMP students have 3.0-3.3 GPAs and 30-32 MCAT, so while her GPA warrants an SMP her MCAT is so high that she may be able to avoid it, if she wanted to

 

[Etyan]

what is false about what I said? assuming OP just wants to get into any MD school, with a 39 MCAT and 3.1 GPA (which is what she said she would have at graduation) and her upward trend, she may very well be able to avoid an SMP which would save her a lot of money. Most SMP students have 3.0-3.3 GPAs and 30-32 MCAT, so while her GPA warrants an SMP her MCAT is so high that she may be able to avoid it, if she wanted to

I would probably widen that SMP GPA range to 3.0-3.5, with a 30-37 MCAT. OP, the decision to do post-bacc or SMP also depends on what school(s) you want to go to. Different MD programs take different approaches in how they look at post-bacc/SMP work.

Take a look at the websites of schools you'd like to go to, e-mail admissions, etc. Good luck!

 

[occams_razor]

I would probably widen that SMP GPA range to 3.0-3.5, with a 30-37 MCAT. OP, the decision to do post-bacc or SMP also depends on what school(s) you want to go to. Different MD programs take different approaches in how they look at post-bacc/SMP work.

Take a look at the websites of schools you'd like to go to, e-mail admissions, etc. Good luck!

I guess I'm just of the opinion that if someone has a 3.5 GPA (cumulative and BCPM) and 30+ MCAT, it would be financially wiser to work on other aspects of the application, such as improving ECs, before doing an SMP (assuming the person doesn't have a family willing to help with SMP costs). I just know people who went into tons of debt from SMPs so personally I would want to avoid that. For example someone with a 3.5/31 with strong ECs and LORs that just wants to get into their state school (excluding Cali residents), I just don't see spending so much money on an SMP worth it for an applicant like that. I agree though that it definitely depends on the applicant and what his or her goals are.

 

[supahfresh]

First and foremost, please do not fret about not getting the deal done on the first try. Secondly, your time is NOT wasted. I agree with most of the stuff said on here so far but now you can take it from a guy who got bad grades and an ok MCAT (not great but better than average) score. YOU on the other hand are sitting pretty with a kickass MCAT score. Nice work!

I had to look up SMP because I had never heard of it in "my day"(old man voice). But if you plan to take 1 year maybe 2 to boost your credentials by getting a masters or post-bacc, then I recommend this option provided you carefully consider the actual program and their reputation for feeding you into the medical school and whether research is part of their curriculum. Take the post-bacc or master's at the school where you want to be. When asked about your backup plan, you say "enroll in courses at your university and cultivate my research aptitude."

I actually did this exact thing because my GPA was pretty bad and could not even score an interview the first two times around. Man, I wasted a lot of money on applications. But I would like to suggest to you that you are not "wasting" your time. Time in between college and medical school is very undervalued and its a great opportunity. Take advantage because those that go straight into medical school.....I'm sorry but those guys missed out. I was a ski bum in Colorado while doing grad school in biochemistry. It's very hard to take a break after medical school but you can take a break just before it. By the time I got into medical school, I was rejuvenated and ready to work hard and did not feel like i flushed my entire 20's down the toilet studying in a library every weekend. I only did that for half my 20's!

It is true that schools get flooded with apps and they need to weed people out and the easiest way to do so is by having GPA and MCAT cutoffs. therefore, people like us need to get to know the people at the school a little better to demonstrate that we are solid candidates. Big deal, I had some bad grades my first 2 years of college. It doesn't mean anything except that I didn't try that hard. But that bad gpa prevented me from getting my foot in the door......everywhere!

But fear not....
Try and think about it like this:
Don't keep asking yourself "can I get in with these exact scores and grades?" Don't live the type of life where you just "get by." A few courses here and there to boost your gpa is a very very weak attempt. The medical school wants to see that you are serious. Therefore, draw a line in the sand and decide for yourself that you are going to school no matter what whether it takes you 1 or 5 or 15 years. The problem with the wasted time philosophy is that you miss out on enjoying your life. Furthermore you might be inclined to "settle" meaning you might actually get into a school that you either don't like or don't like the location and you'll have to live with it. I suggest applying to a few schools where you have made contact with someone and might have a reasonable chance. Pick a few schools that you really care about, some place that offers you something very special (close to home, good reputation, etc). Any other applications is just a waste of money.

If you do not get accepted, I recommend working your way in from the inside (which I assume the SMP is supposed to help with so do some detective work and make sure they arent just taking your money). However, I would strongly encourage students to consider developing their research background. Research is what will really set you apart and if you can get research experience prior to medical school, it will help you for the rest of your career. As an example, research was so important to our medical students at Yale, that they took a 5th year of medical school to do exclusive research and thus compete at a higher level for better residencies. Better residencies in my humble opinion are more important than a better medical school.

 

[aesculapian]

Don't keep asking yourself "can I get in with these exact scores and grades?" Don't live the type of life where you just "get by." A few courses here and there to boost your gpa is a very very weak attempt. The medical school wants to see that you are serious. Therefore, draw a line in the sand and decide for yourself that you are going to school no matter what whether it takes you 1 or 5 or 15 years.

Out of curiosity, what would you say the GPA cutoff would be for a post-bac/SMP vs. taking a few extra courses? If someone had a cGPA of 3.4, does it suffice to take a few extra courses, or is doing a full SMP the better option? What if the cGPA was 3.3, or 3.5?

 

[supahfresh]

Good question. I believe below 3 is going to be very hard and require some major work even with the very high McAT. Somewhere between 3 and 3.5 is hard for me to say. You'll have to research the individual schools as they vary. Let me ask a follow up question: how long does the standard SMP usually last? Because if your gpa was 3.4, you probably don't need more than one extra year. Keep in mind however that after 4 years of college, 1-2 courses at the A+ grade level won't significantly increase your gpa.

So my suggestion would be this:
1. Apply early.
2. Talk with the school admission counselor early and ask THEM what they want you to do. They may have very specific advice.
3. Apply the following year while doing everything you were instructed to do.
4. Repeat steps 1-3 until admitted.

 

[SunDevil14]

That is an awesome score, congrats! I think you have a good shot with that many hours of volunteering. How long did you prepare for the MCAT btw, just curious?

 

[ifonlyifonly]

That is an awesome score, congrats! I think you have a good shot with that many hours of volunteering. How long did you prepare for the MCAT btw, just curious?

I'll PM you

Good question. I believe below 3 is going to be very hard and require some major work even with the very high McAT. Somewhere between 3 and 3.5 is hard for me to say. You'll have to research the individual schools as they vary. Let me ask a follow up question: how long does the standard SMP usually last? Because if your gpa was 3.4, you probably don't need more than one extra year. Keep in mind however that after 4 years of college, 1-2 courses at the A+ grade level won't significantly increase your gpa.

So my suggestion would be this:
1. Apply early.
2. Talk with the school admission counselor early and ask THEM what they want you to do. They may have very specific advice.
3. Apply the following year while doing everything you were instructed to do.
4. Repeat steps 1-3 until admitted.

The reason I'm concerned about time is that medicine is a long haul. 4 years of school,then 3-5 years of residency, then 3-5 more to specialize? 10 years? I don't want to spend all of my life in school. I want to start a life eventually, maybe have kids get married all that. But I would want to establish my career first you know?

completely false in every way


from what I can see you have two major deficiencies - ECs and GPA. as for GPA i'd recommend post-bac to chin up that GPA to over 3.0, do an SMP and murder it. then you might get a few interviews but even then you may only get into your home school if at all. applying and doing an SMP at the same time ensures you'll do neither particularly well.

as for your ECs, you really need to round that out. unless you've been doing your couple of activities for a long time it looks like you have no real interest and have been doing things piecemeal here and there. try to develop one into a real strength.

good luck

What are good EC's then? I don't think I can get a research publication I have been doing the volunteering for a long time, and I think I'm dedicated to them. What would you recommend for EC's?

You know, that Asian/Indian angle actually might not be so bad...
You know the stereotype -- Tiger parents pushing super-studious Asian kids. Obedient, study-aholic Asian kids with no social life trying to meet tiger-parents' expectations. (Think 4.0 GPA and 28 MCAT.)

If your story is that you rebelled against parental pressure and parental goals and partied hard freshman year, then realized the person you were hurting most was yourself and YOUR OWN GOALS -- then buckled down and did well -- Well, that's an interesting story. One that works against 'type', and one that (assuming it's true) could be very relatable.

haha this is actually what happened..

Thank you so much you guys I really really appreciate the help !

 

[inycepoo]

"What ECs are good" is the same question as "what am I interested in." Those with the "best" or "most amazing" ECs just did what they liked, and the rest spoke for itself. You don't truly enjoy something you don't actually like all that much. And to be good at something, I'd argue you need to like it quite a bit.

e.g., I'm a diehard cuber because I'm really into it for various reasons. I don't consider it unique at all because I've been doing it so long and am active in the community, but if I put it on an app, it always gets brought up at interviews (undergrad, BS/MD, Sunai HuMed, summer internship interviewers have all inquired about it). It will probably be brought up at my med school interviews as well because I'm marking it as "most significant." I now realize it's something that's much more "sellable" than I ever thought. But the point is that I got started because I truly love the intricacies and complexities of the activity, and the rest fell into place.

If you're looking for ECs, check out what's at your school first and be open-minded. If you find that nothing really interests you all that much, no need to force yourself to do things for a round table of people to judge you on. Take your "average" ECs, whatever that means, and run with it if you're happy.

 

[ifonlyifonly]

I'll keep the note about the ECs in mind but I think they aren't as piece meal as I made them out to seem. I'll be able to talk about them in an interview because I have done stuff that I really have enjoyed. Like volunteering in the children's cancer ward was really rewarding. I helped make art projects and crafts with these kids, play games, and really make them feel better. It really is a rewarding experience. Also I tutor kids in the inner city, and that has been one of the more powerful experiences of my life. Sometimes I come back home and cry at how sad it is, but I think that I've helped them. I explain concepts as clearly as I can, and don't give up until they've got it. It's really awesome when they get all excited because they finally were able to grasp a concept. So I think I really got a lot out of those two experiences. I have more but idk can't think of everything right now.

my main concern is the GPA and that my MCAT score might expire I wanted to wait until next year to take it but I knew I wouldn't have been able to study during the school year. If I have to retake it, I'll retake it but I'm really trying to avoid that.

For GPA, I guess I should contact the schools I'm interested in then for postbacc vs SMP? I'm just curious but if you apply during the SMP year is your application considered "late" even if you applied in June because they have to wait for your fall grades? How easy it to go to interviews while doing an SMP? is it better to go to a high linkage one (like drexel) or a better known program (gtown)?

 

[inycepoo]

my main concern is the GPA and that my MCAT score might expire I wanted to wait until next year to take it but I knew I wouldn't have been able to study during the school year. If I have to retake it, I'll retake it but I'm really trying to avoid that.

For GPA, I guess I should contact the schools I'm interested in then for postbacc vs SMP? I'm just curious but if you apply during the SMP year is your application considered "late" even if you applied in June because they have to wait for your fall grades? How easy it to go to interviews while doing an SMP? is it better to go to a high linkage one (like drexel) or a better known program (gtown)?

Your concern over your MCAT expiring is misinformed. It is 2013, and therefore you must enter medical school in the fall of 2016, and thus you must apply over the summer of 2015 for that score to stay valid at the majority of medical schools. I fail to see how this is a problem if you do an SMP or postbacc.

 

[Vidpur]

Your concern over your MCAT expiring is misinformed. It is 2013, and therefore you must enter medical school in the fall of 2016, and thus you must apply over the summer of 2015 for that score to stay valid at the majority of medical schools. I fail to see how this is a problem if you do an SMP or postbacc.

. Mcat is from April 2011

 

[DoktorO]

1. Apply Early
2. Apply to non traditional programs, such as Rural programs, or research or mdphd programs. These usually do NOT have MCAT or GPA cut offs, so they will guarantee that they will look at your app.
3. Apply broadly, do this no matter what scores you have, its stupid to apply narrowly unless you have a good safe state school which admits 80% of applicants. Myself as a CA resident I do not have this luxury and I thus applied to 30 schools.
4. Enroll in a post bac program, just in case you do not get into medical school this time around. Next time you will have a higher GPA, which will get your past screens.

 

[inycepoo]

. Mcat is from April 2011

OP got his scores back last week. What are you talking about?

 

[supahfresh]

I'll PM you


The reason I'm concerned about time is that medicine is a long haul. 4 years of school,then 3-5 years of residency, then 3-5 more to specialize? 10 years? I don't want to spend all of my life in school. I want to start a life eventually, maybe have kids get married all that. But I would want to establish my career first you know?


I hear ya. That extra year is a pain in the ass. I would also not want to be taking an EXTRA year of classes especially if it was not useful in some way towards my medical career. In this case, you have to find classes or a post-bacc that helps you either by allowing you to perform better in medical school or by providing you with some other assets that you might not get in medical school. My post-bacc was mostly medical school type classes and I studied hard, which made medical school that much easier and I did well on the boards and those are your top 2 goals for the first two years: excel on the USMLE/COMLEX boards and get good grades. Good scores means getting a good residency, good job, etc....basically setting up your career which is what you want mentioned so you can get on with your life. So put the post-bacc year to good use.

Yes medicine is a long haul. And I went through the post-bacc pain, then 4 years of medical school, then 4 years of residency, then 2 fellowships. that's 4+6=10 years of training not including college and the stupid post-bacc year. Its hard work and not for everybody. But you should understand that a career in medicine is lifelong learning. You only deal with being a student for a very short time compared to 35+ years of a very satisfying career with great job security and good earning potential.

Life does not start after training. Its a gross misconception for young premeds to think they have to rush in because life doesn't start until after training. Life already started. Medical school and residency were very hard but some of the best years of my life. Time flies by and its a lot of fun. Pretty much everybody gets married and has families throughout medical school, residency, and fellowship. I have seen many women have kids during surgical residency. That's just how it goes because otherwise life passes you by.

I think its important for you to know that there is no guarantee that your life will be easy once you finish training. Its nice to get paid once you are an intern so really you just have to get through 4 more years of taking out loans. And then the money gets better as an attending.

The work hours might not get better depending on what you choose to do. Although many jobs are easier after training, we have seen a change of the tide as of 2003 with such strict work hour restrictions. Residents are looked after and coddled whereas you fend for yourself (to some extent) as an attending. Overall, I would say that even during my hardest months as a surgery resident working 100+ hours a week (and I doubt you guys will be subjected to that) I still went out for a beer after work or went skiing postcall.

Honestly, I think you will be totally fine with that MCAT. The gpa may or may not set you back a short time but you gotta apply and find out.

Good Luck!

 

[Vidpur]

OP got his scores back last week. What are you talking about?

Oops! I am soooooo.. sorry, I had an almost identical post on a diff thread ... my mcat expires ... .. sorry , screwed up..

 

[ifonlyifonly]

I'll PM you


The reason I'm concerned about time is that medicine is a long haul. 4 years of school,then 3-5 years of residency, then 3-5 more to specialize? 10 years? I don't want to spend all of my life in school. I want to start a life eventually, maybe have kids get married all that. But I would want to establish my career first you know?


I hear ya. That extra year is a pain in the ass. I would also not want to be taking an EXTRA year of classes especially if it was not useful in some way towards my medical career. In this case, you have to find classes or a post-bacc that helps you either by allowing you to perform better in medical school or by providing you with some other assets that you might not get in medical school. My post-bacc was mostly medical school type classes and I studied hard, which made medical school that much easier and I did well on the boards and those are your top 2 goals for the first two years: excel on the USMLE/COMLEX boards and get good grades. Good scores means getting a good residency, good job, etc....basically setting up your career which is what you want mentioned so you can get on with your life. So put the post-bacc year to good use.

Yes medicine is a long haul. And I went through the post-bacc pain, then 4 years of medical school, then 4 years of residency, then 2 fellowships. that's 4+6=10 years of training not including college and the stupid post-bacc year. Its hard work and not for everybody. But you should understand that a career in medicine is lifelong learning. You only deal with being a student for a very short time compared to 35+ years of a very satisfying career with great job security and good earning potential.

Life does not start after training. Its a gross misconception for young premeds to think they have to rush in because life doesn't start until after training. Life already started. Medical school and residency were very hard but some of the best years of my life. Time flies by and its a lot of fun. Pretty much everybody gets married and has families throughout medical school, residency, and fellowship. I have seen many women have kids during surgical residency. That's just how it goes because otherwise life passes you by.

I think its important for you to know that there is no guarantee that your life will be easy once you finish training. Its nice to get paid once you are an intern so really you just have to get through 4 more years of taking out loans. And then the money gets better as an attending.

The work hours might not get better depending on what you choose to do. Although many jobs are easier after training, we have seen a change of the tide as of 2003 with such strict work hour restrictions. Residents are looked after and coddled whereas you fend for yourself (to some extent) as an attending. Overall, I would say that even during my hardest months as a surgery resident working 100+ hours a week (and I doubt you guys will be subjected to that) I still went out for a beer after work or went skiing postcall.

Honestly, I think you will be totally fine with that MCAT. The gpa may or may not set you back a short time but you gotta apply and find out.

Good Luck!

Thank you so much for your advice. It really is great to hear from someone who has actually gone through this all. Thank you I really do appreciate it.
You've definitely calmed me down. I was really worried that I wouldn't be able to get on with my life. I'm definitely not thinking about kids now, but I probably will want to have a family etc and a great career. It's a real concern for me, and most women I think. Damn biological clock!

 

[ifonlyifonly]

Your concern over your MCAT expiring is misinformed. It is 2013, and therefore you must enter medical school in the fall of 2016, and thus you must apply over the summer of 2015 for that score to stay valid at the majority of medical schools. I fail to see how this is a problem if you do an SMP or postbacc.

OK thanks! I just get confused a lot by the whole "matriculation" date and application date thing haha

 

[ifonlyifonly]

1. Apply Early
2. Apply to non traditional programs, such as Rural programs, or research or mdphd programs. These usually do NOT have MCAT or GPA cut offs, so they will guarantee that they will look at your app.
3. Apply broadly, do this no matter what scores you have, its stupid to apply narrowly unless you have a good safe state school which admits 80% of applicants. Myself as a CA resident I do not have this luxury and I thus applied to 30 schools.
4. Enroll in a post bac program, just in case you do not get into medical school this time around. Next time you will have a higher GPA, which will get your past screens.

I will definitely apply super broadly. I was under the assumption that MD/PhD programs are a lot more competitive than MD programs?

 

[Escape_Goat]

So was I.

 

[gyngyn]

I will definitely apply super broadly. I was under the assumption that MD/PhD programs are a lot more competitive than MD programs?

They are.

 

[Goro]

If you're that keen on the MD degree, then I'd go for an SMP offered by any MD school. they're a dime a dozen. Try, say, Drexel or Rosy F. The advantage is that they're back-doors into medical school, and the faculty get to know you.

I'd really like to apply next June, because I really don't want to waste anymore time and I don't want my MCAT score to expire. I was thinking that I would apply to SMPs after I get my fall semester grades in January, and apply to medical schools in June. I was thinking of Georgetown, Tufts, Cincinatti, Drexel, and NYMC.
Would this be a good plan? What SMPs are the best for getting in during your SMP year? Which ones are high linkage/interview? Should I apply to more?

 

[ifonlyifonly]

is it better to go to a more highly regarded SMP or to an SMP that may not be as highly regarded, but has a strong linkage?

 

[JustAKansasUnderGrad]

I have found more than often the ones who truly learn and graph the information do so at a slower rate but eventually it pays off in the long run. as in my case also

 

[BTC0821]

I have found more than often the ones who truly learn and graph the information do so at a slower rate but eventually it pays off in the long run. as in my case also

these posts are from 2013

 

[21Rush12]

I was confused when I saw a 45 breakdown posted as “I just got my MCAT back”