Low GPA, Excellent Everywhere Else - Advice?

[DLove86]

Hey guys,

First and foremost, I am a realist... so no need to sugarcoat your responses.

Actually, this is my first post on SDN, my other posts have all been on ValueMD (Caribb. schools) since I know I have about a 1% chance of getting into a US medical school.

First things first, stats:

Undergrad - Biomedical Engineering BS from University of Miami
2.75 cGPA
2.5 sGPA (D in orgo I, D in physics III, D in calc II)

I basically had a rough two years my sophomore and junior years. I underwent five surgeries where I had to take significant time off from school and receive incompletes from many classes and make them up simultaneously.

My advisors in my dept. knew the trouble I went through and knew I was a great student otherwise so they accepted me into the Master's Program in Biomedical Engineering, where I currently have a 4.0. I did a "super senior" semester with neuro courses and a couple of other electives and pulled a 3.8.

I plan to take my MCAT in June. I've been getting 33-35 on my practice MCATs, very high in verbal (always been good in verbal, perfect SAT verbal score in HS).

I would love to attend University of Miami as my first choice, any other FL school next.

My questions are these:
(1) Should I even bother applying? I calculated what my cGPA is with my Master's credits and its about a 2.9, science still a bit lower.
(2) Should I retake Orgo, PhyIII and calc II? How does AMCAS figure out the new grade, averaging old + new?
(3) The UM application says that for Florida residents, 2.9+ still gets you a secondary application (if you are completing post Bacc). How many people have ever managed to get into med school with a 2.9, 3.0?

My strengths are going to be my MCAT and my research:
- I have 3 published papers/proposals
- I worked at the Miami Project to Cure Paralysis for 3 years, one years as a FORE-SCI scholar
- I have won several research awards, even an NIH grant for one of my projects
- Currently working on a patent for a medical device

I am also working as a full time engineer at one of the top 3 major biomedical device companies in the world.

I feel like if my application was actually LOOKED AT instead of screened based on GPA, I would be an excellent candidate. If I were to receive an interview, I know I could sell myself (I have before for my MS acceptance).

So, bottom line, I KNOW I wouldn't get in currently. What (or even, can I?) do I do to become even competitive?

I appreciate all comments (even "Dude, go to the Caribbean").

Thanks =)

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Daedra22]

Retaking those classes that you got D's in is not only a good idea, it's essential. You need a C or better to have those pre-reqs count at all (by the sound of it, you should be able to pull an A with those kinds of MCAT practice scores). AMCAS counts all of your grades into your average, so it would pull up your GPA some, but not necessarily a whole lot. You might have a shot at the MD schools after that, your work sounds very awesome, and you've clearly shown an upward trend.

I don't know if you've considered DO schools, but you could be a competitive candidate there with the retakes and a great MCAT score. Instead of averaging retakes, DO schools replace the grade, thereby boosting your GPA significantly. There are 2 very good DO schools in Florida (Nova Southeastern in Fort Lauderdale, and LECOM-Bradenton in Bradenton). I'm not saying you shouldn't apply MD as well--it's always worth a shot--but if you're sure you want to be a doctor, applying DO would give you that many more chances at getting in.

If you're curious about the DO thing feel free to PM me. I got interviews at both the Florida schools.

 

[Geekchick921]

This is going to get moved to the What Are My Chances sub-board, just letting you know.

Firstly, let me say that I'm sorry for the health problems you had. I hope you're fine now. Now, to answer your questions.

You can become a competitive applicant. The AMCAS calculates GPA for retaken courses by averaging old and new, you are correct. You should retake your courses either way, IMO. Do you have any idea what your sGPA would be if you retook the courses you got bad grades in, considering that AMCAS averages both courses?

On the other hand, the AAMCOS, the application for DO schools, does grade replacement when calculating your GPA. By retaking, you will see a much greater improvement in your GPA with the AAMCOS as opposed to the AMCAS. If it's very important to you to stay in Florida, there are two DO schools in the state (LECOM - Bradenton and NSU-COM in Fort Lauterdale). DO is often more non-trad friendly, and may be a very good option for you, and generally considered a much better choice than a Caribbean MD school based on scores and residency placement.

I can't answer your question about UM. It may be worth it to ask in the UM Application thread in the School Specific Discussions sub-board.

Your research is impressive! You should also show some interest in community service, and you need some kind of clinical experience as well. They want to see that you know what you're getting into by interacting with patients and hospital staff. Volunteering in a hospital in a clinical setting can kill both of those birds with one stone.

Good luck to you!

 

[MiniMoo]

My questions are these:
(1) Should I even bother applying? I calculated what my cGPA is with my Master's credits and its about a 2.9, science still a bit lower.
(2) Should I retake Orgo, PhyIII and calc II? How does AMCAS figure out the new grade, averaging old + new?
(3) The UM application says that for Florida residents, 2.9+ still gets you a secondary application (if you are completing post Bacc). How many people have ever managed to get into med school with a 2.9, 3.0?

Thanks =)

1. Unfortunately your master's credits are not going to be averaged in with your undergrad coursework. They are considered separately.
2. Yes you need to retake all prereqs in which you received a C- or lower. They won't be accepted otherwise.
3. There's an individual on SDN who got into one allipathic school with a 2.92 and 42 MCAT. But as the chances of getting 40+ on the MCAT are extremely slim, I'd recommend some post bacc work to raise your GPA. After that, you can consider DO schools (probably the easiest option since they do grade replacement and use only the most recent grade in GPA calculations) or a Special Masters Program.

 

[Yips]

Focus on your classes and raise the uGPA. Do you have any clinical experience as of now?

 

[DLove86]

Thanks for the advice guys...some answers:

My GPA would raise to about a 3.0 (both cGPA and sGPA) after I finish my Master's and slightly more when I retake orgo and physics.

Also, my clinical work: I shadowed a doctor of internal medicine for 2 years and will be shadowing surgeons as a technical consultant for the next year.

Community service I haven't really participated in unfortunately, due to me always being heavily involved in research.

 

[Yips]

Thanks for the advice guys...some answers:

My GPA would raise to about a 3.0 (both cGPA and sGPA) after I finish my Master's and slightly more when I retake orgo and physics.

Also, my clinical work: I shadowed a doctor of internal medicine for 2 years and will be shadowing surgeons as a technical consultant for the next year.

Community service I haven't really participated in unfortunately, due to me always being heavily involved in research.

Graduate courses are not counted towards your uGPA. You'll have to take post-bacc undergraduate classes to raise that GPA.

 

[Sammich117]

This is going to get moved to the What Are My Chances sub-board, just letting you know.

Yes it is

Your strengths are really quite great, but I agree that those classes need to be retaken.

Best of luck!

 

[Catalystik]

Do you have any contacts in your current grad program who think highly enough of you to make a personal call to the dean of the med school on yor behalf (asking for the entire application to be evaluated)? This would work best if done after you complete the prerequisite repeats creditably. And if you are going to do that, don't rush on taking the MCAT.

You need nonmedical community service and you need clinical experience working directly with patients rather than shadowing.

 

[startswithb]

Possible question for PS and/or interviews:

You seem like an awesome engineer; why med school?

 

[DLove86]

Possible question for PS and/or interviews:

You seem like an awesome engineer; why med school?

I became an engineer to enhance the technical component of practicing medicine. As a biomedical engineer it is my natural inclination to want to ameliorate current techniques and devices. I always thought that apart from being taught what to do and subsequently practicing the dame methods, physicians should seek to improve their field in an innovative capacity. I'm in a unique position where not only would I understand thetheory and techniques that I'd be implementing, I can also actively judge their efficacy and enhance them in novel fashion: I can engineer advancements in medical practice quite readily. Also, I yearn for that primary care environment where (maybe selfishly), I can directly impact patient outcomes, at the bedside rather than from some cubicle far away

 

[vc7777]

... I currently have a 4.0. I did a "super senior" semester with neuro courses and a couple of other electives and pulled a 3.8. ...

So how many years/semesters (as of the end of this semester) are out of your undergrad are you? Is your Master's program require a thesis? Will your master's be done before you enter med school?

 

[DLove86]

So how many years/semesters (as of the end of this semester) are out of your undergrad are you? Is your Master's program require a thesis? Will your master's be done before you enter med school?

This is my second masters semester. I am working on a thesis and a patent. I will be done next May; before med school sine presumably I would start August of '11.

 

[DLove86]

What I'm still having trouble understanding is: how does a master's factor in GPA wise? Not at all?

....then what is meant by Post-Bacc? Are my courses that I'm retaking post-bacc? Can I retake those at another college?

 

[Catalystik]

For AMCAS applications, grades are listed by year Fr, So, JR, SR, postbac. Under this is the cumulative undergrad GPA which includes college grades and additional courses taken after graduation when you are not a candidate for a graduate degree (postbac). Under that is graduate degree grades. They are not calculated together with the cumulative undergrad grades. They stay separate.

For DO applications (except TCOM) undergrad cumulative and grad GPA ARE merged into an overall GPA. But some DO schools also go primariily by the cumulative undergrad GPA.

 

[vc7777]

What I'm still having trouble understanding is: how does a master's factor in GPA wise? Not at all?

....then what is meant by Post-Bacc? Are my courses that I'm retaking post-bacc? Can I retake those at another college?

Since you are already a graduate student, I might suggest you mosey-on over to the non-trad forum and post a general question about your background, situation, and ask advice from people there who may have taken undergraduate courses as grad students.

I think you may be losing sight of the fact that you are already showing a strong upward trend in your GPA, and that the graduate work may stand on its own as proof of your fitness to medical school.

Good luck.

 

[Catalystik]

If you take classes during the time you are working toward your masters degree that are not required for the masters degree (like OChem and Physics), they should be listed as postbac classes and would be included in the undergrad cumulative GPA.

And it's fine to retake those classes at another college.

 

[drizzt3117]

At the University of Miami (and I believe Wayne State) there is a provision where they'll replace your science GPA from the science GPA from a masters. I can't remember what thread this was discussed in but I suggest you do a search.

 

[drizzt3117]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=9346836&postcount=1778

it was discussed here.

 

[Morsetlis]

I wish you success, as you seem to be a very smart and dedicated person. Unfortunately, uGPA repair takes a while unless you can somehow get accepted by an SMP.