Low MCAT scores that got you in to D.O. Schools??

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AntGod22

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Hi all current osteo students and ones to be. What was the lowest MCAT grades that got you accepted. The reason im asking is because I got a 20 on my MCAT and I ahve a 3.3 GPA. Im wondering which schools to apply to, im gonna retake them in april but if i cant do better then I dont know what to do. Any help from you guys will be greatly appreciated.

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Don't know if a 20 on the MCAT is gonna cut it. You might want to take it again. Shoot for 28 and above with your 3.3. good luck.
 
You should probably take it again in April, but don't lose faith. If you have some solid experience and show that you are a capable and hard-working applicant, I'm sure you will have a chance with your current score. I know of someone who got into an Osteopathic school with a 22 and a 3.3, so you are not far off. I say apply this year, shadow a DO (if you aren't already doing so), try to get some great letters of rec, and take the MCAT's again in April. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain! Good luck! :)
 
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I took the MCATs three times and got 6,7,8 8,7,6 6,7,10 and I had a 3.5 gpa. The first year I applied to 5 MD schools (didn?t know about DO) and didn?t get in. The second year I applied to 5 MD and 2 DO and got in at UHS. The funny thing is that even with those low MCAT scores I am in the top 10%(out of 249 students) of my class and I didn?t have to have my nose crammed in a book 24 hours a day for my first year to get there. I don?t think the MCAT is a good tool to gauge how you will do in med school at all. If you don?t already, you need to work in a patient care related job and do a little volunteering. Get good letters from Docs you shadow. And most importantly never give up. Perseverance pays!

good luck
UHS2005 MSII
 
There are quite a few people at AZCOM with sub 20 MCATS..

I really don't think ANYONE with less then 24 should get in anywhere, but they do...

Jason
 
I agree with UHS2005. I got a 21 on my MCAT; 3.4 gpa and a hell of a lot of healthcare experience and certifications. I do not think that MCAT is indicitive of how you will do in med school. Look at how much crap we have to learn in order to take the MCAT; vs. how much of it we actually use in medical school. From what I have heard from a variety of med students, you never use organic and hardly any of physics.
Just like the ACT, I only got a 22 on it in high school, and then in college, when I decided to care about my grades, I was on the Dean's honor roll, plus on the presidential honor roll and received many other academic awards.

Most of what the MCAT is about, at least to me, is how well you take tests, and are able to learn a huge amount of material for one shining moment in your career! Plus to put an ungodly amount of stress on us pre-meds to drive us to drink!

I will be attending UHS this fall, so a low MCAT score can get you places, as long as you have other things to help you out!

Chris
 
Jason_AZCOM:

So with my 6,7,10 (23) I should not have been accepted into school right, since I am below your 24 level. So how do you explain my top 10% standing? Surely I couldn't be in the top 10% with sub-standard MCATs, that?s reserved for you holier than thou people who think that the MCATs is the rule book to how one will succeed in medical school. Get off your high horse.
 
To the two of you that got into UHS, were you in- state residents? I'm just curious cuz I'm thinking about applying to UHS, but don't know if I'd be competitive as an out of state resident.
 
UHS is a private school so residence has no influence on admission. It is very diverse here, there are people from all over the US and Canada attending UHS.
 
Hey, thought I would join in the conversation. I got a 22 on the MCAT, but I had a 4.0 GPA.

I think UHS would be a great school for you to apply to as I think they look at other things in addition to the MCAT...life experience, clinical experience, grades, maturity, etc.

It was my first choice, so I was thrilled when I was accepted. But everyone has different first choices, so good luck in finding yours.
 
Thanks, I think I'll apply to UHS....what's their 2ndary like?
 
Originally posted by Jason_AZCOM:
[QB]There are quite a few people at AZCOM with sub 20 MCATS..

Where did you come by this information?
 
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Just thought I'd take a peak in the Osteopathic section, and I discovered one thing:

This whole conversation scares the crap out of me.

"What's the least I can do and still be a doctor."

Yeah, that's who I want taken (<----- BEWARE--SPELLING ERROR--BEWARE) care of me.

Good luck, guys.
 
Future GI guy, I know, you never, ever, see our colleagues over on the allopathic board talking about what scores will get them into what school.

Or wait a minute, actually, I see that all the time.

My cousin is an MD cardio-thoracic surgeon who got a 22 on his MCAT and graduated #1 in his class. DO students take the USMLE and do just as well as our MD counterparts. Give the holier-than-thou attitude a rest. I'd rather have a person caring for me with a lower mcat, which means jack s**t in the clinical world, than with a pessimistic attitude like yours. Are your bedside manners just as warm and supportive?
 
GI-guy (what a joke),
I have no idea what your talking about, all this thread is about is someone's chances with a low MCAT! I did great on the MCAT, made Presidents lists and Deans lists as an undergraduate, and forgive my lack of vanity, GI guy, for not listing my GPA. I will be attending UHS in the fall.

Back to the original subject of this post, you need to retake the MCAT and prepare more for the test format itself. The material alone is not that bad, just how they present it to you in the passages makes it difficult. Good luck and you can do it.

By the way (GI guy) it is TAKING CARE OF ME not TAKEN care of me.
 
Antgod,
I'm with Bradley P! My advice, which is what someone told me: Ace the MCAT. Just do the absolute best you can. Get it over with, and go be a doctor. Unfortunately for all the effort you put in, it's just a number. Someday when you are standing holding the hand of a very ill patient they are not going to ask you what your scores were.

As for the rest of you, (Jason), I work at a 1000 bed academic hospital that is affiliated with a top med school. There are some fantastic students over there. But there are also some real losers who, undoubtedly got 45 on the MCAT and can't even crack a warm smile when they are meeting a patient who is in their darkest hour. Get with the program, and learn how to spell. YOU scare me.
 
Hello again.

I always find it heartwarming that certain populations, when faced with some criticism, avoid the criticism and revert to tactics like attacking a simple spelling error.

It truly illustrates your mettle (yes, this is the correct spelling.)

And thanks for comments regarding my bedside manner. From 5 or 6 sentences, you've made a tremendous assumption that will force me to examine how I interact with patients! I'll take your advice and really dissect the problem, as, obviously I've been the worst medical student ever, and patient's are often left distraught upon my entry into their rooms. I don't know how I made it through my third year clinicals.

Thanks for the insight and for the spelling advice. (I find a LOT of irony in that).

After that little bit of sarcasm, let me readdress the problem.

The truth is, it's not the subject matter of this thread that I find worrisome. It's the 20-22 MCAT range that boggles my mind.

When I applied to medical school, I had what I considered to be a low score, one that I felt placed me behind my counterparts in terms of application quality. I got in, though, and I'm sure I lowered the mean MCAT for my class, if only slightly. That said, I think it has become increasingly obvious (and bothersome) that my definition of low MCAT and yours differ tremendously.

And I am not anti-osteopath, regardless of what you might think. My personal physician has always been a D.O. and I have much more confidence in his abilities than I do many other M.D.s.

However, the alarming nature of the original poster's question beckons another: what standards exist to find a place in Osteopathic Medical School?

Knowledge of Osteopathy? "Shadowing" an Osteopathic physician? Being able to pay outrageous tuition?

My point about the original poster is that I think his or her question should have been written differently. Instead of "what school can I get into," I wish the question had been, "how can I achieve a higher score?"

But that's just my mindset. It's not about how I can slide by; it's about how I better myself for my future patients.
 
If you're not going to offer any helpful advice than why even bother to write a reply. Like everyone has mentioned I have friends who got really low MCAT scores and rocked the USMLE exam as a DO student. The MCAT is meaningless. Just like memorizing the structures of the 20 amino acids, by the way which is something I have never been able to do. Some people are busy during undergrad trying to enlighten their mind and learn about a variety of subjects than to just focus their 4 years on a stupid exam. I also have friends with the opposite who had subpar gpas but excellent MCAT's. What does that tell you? You know what, they're both doing extremely well in school. Actually, we've all graduated and got into our first choice residencies. Patients and colleagues don't care what scores you got. What's more important is the way you treat your patients and staff. If you are ever in doubt in medicine, you can always refer to a specialist or ask for another's opinion. Doctors with too much ego are not what people want. There is a lot to a career in medicine than just how much knowlege you know. You need to have business savy, patience, people skills, ability to deal with all the paperwork, difficult patients/staff, politics. They don't test you or teach on that stuff which I believe count the most.
 
Doughboy,

It might surprise you that I totally agree with you. The MCAT is a meaningless test.

It gives ADD-COMs an "excuse" (for lack of a better word) to reject people who might be excellent candidates otherwise.

That said, like everything in Medicine, it is a rite of passage. Unfortunately, it's an exam we have to deal with and should aim to master.

What's not meaningless is a person's desire to achieve, to become better, to score higher, to invest more in the process of becoming a physician.

Those are things patients don't get to see, either. But they are fundamental assumptions the patient makes about his or her physician: that they cared enough to sacrifice for their learning.
 
Doughboy suggested that I should offer helpful advice, or not post at all. Here goes, some tips for retaking the MCAT.

1. Do as many practice questions and passages as possible, beforehand. This will not only increase your knowledge base, it'll do wonders for your stamina (which is so important for that exam.)

2. Do NOT re-read or attempt to re-study everything you learned in undergrad. This is futile and will not help. A good review book will do the trick and aim you in the right direction.

3. Bubble in as you go along. Waiting until the last minute to bubble your answers is not only stressful, it's dangerous. Don't make the same mistake I did and think the "5 minute warning" is enough.

4. Bring "power bars" to the exam. You're allowed to eat them during breaks and keep them by your desk when your taking your test. For me, the energy boost really picked me up, and it gave me a reward for getting through a grueling session.

5. Pray about it. Pray before. Pray during. Pray afterwards. Pray when your scores are going to arrive. Pray for admission to school. Ultimately, it's all a big crapshoot. So many candidates look identical on paper and have similar interview outcomes. You need God to be in this with you, and clearly this should be #1.

6. Take a break afterwards. A long one. I drove home after the exam, and I was so exhausted, I had a minor wreck with my car. I couldn't see straight.

7. Relax. It's just a test, one you can re-take if worse comes to worse.

8. Take the test at a neutral site. I didn't want to see all those competing pre-meds from my college, so I took the exam at another testing site and it really reduced my stress.

Good luck if you try to re-take the MCAT.

Good luck if you choose not to retake.
 
I agree with GI guy that we ought to strive for the best in whatever we do. Nevertheless, we need to remember that our overall goal is to be the best physians we can be, and not necessarily the best MCAT performers. The MCAT is simply a means to a much superior end, i.e., becoming an excellent physician.

When I got my MCAT scores back, I believed I could have done better even though my scores were good enough to be accepted to certain medical schools. Does this mean I should have kept retaking the MCAT so that I achieved the best scores I believed I could achieve? *Of course not* because otherwise I would have been treating the MCAT as my end goal when in fact being an excellent physician was my end goal. Accordingly I researched which schools had average MCAT scores around my scores and then applied to them. I think this was a legitimate act based on what my overall objective was, and I believe this is also a similar situation as the original poster.
 
GI Guy, that was very nice of you to post some helpful advice in taking the MCAT. A lot of people have a lot of anxiety and honestly don't know a lot about the process and what it takes to get into med school. Some of us who have been on this board for awhile can sometimes see the same posts as redundant and repetitive but the new people really want some advice and opinions that are more personal. If they can see success stories then it gives them more encouragement to continue on their path.
 
I disagree with the MCAT being 'meaningless.' It is a level playing field of knowledge - for how else could one compare an education from Harvard v. Joe-Small-College-Somewhere?

I also thought of the MCAT as testing skills that are essential requirements in becoming a successful physician. Namely, reading comprehension, data manipulation, and deductive logic all under a stressed (timed) enviroment.

Take a vast field of knowledge (medical school) in the context of patient symptoms (manipulation of information) to form a diagnosis (deductive logic) - all under a stressed enviroment (sometimes even life-and-death).

As was probably stated above, the MCAT is not the end-all for entrance into medical school.

Good luck!
-A
 
AMRA,

As someone who has completed all but one year of medical school, I can honestly say that the MCAT has been a meaningless test for my experience. MCAT scores have NOT predicted how people in my class have done. What's more, that test does not test students for the skills they need to be a practicing physician, in large part because medical school teaches you a new set of skills.

Don't kid yourself into believing medicine is all about deductive reasoning and finding the solution to a problem through purely logical and stressed thinking. Perhaps Emergency Medicine is one area that is like this, but consider internal medicine.

You have the same patient you've had in your office for years, and his Hypertension is totally refractory to the medicine regimen you have him on. In fact, it's refractory to all medicine regimens you've tried. Because you've investigated secondary causes of Hypertension, you know this patient has essential hypertension, but you just cannot control it.

So, what do you do?

No amount of logic or deduction will lead you down the answer to this question.

The Art of being a physician will help. If the patient is on a diuretic and a beta blocker, you might consider adding a third drug (perhaps an ACE inhibitor). If the patient doesn't want to take a "third pill" you can look for combination medicines which would add a third drug without adding a third pill.

Those aren't skills you develop by learning how to take an MCAT. They're skills you develop by interacting with patients and understanding the role of patient beliefs and wishes in the outcome of their management.

While it certainly is not cookbook medicine, there's an art to it, one that medical school, residency, and years of experience can only provide.
 
As your ahead of me in education, you'd have a different prespective than me on THAT part of your experience. However, the basic formula still applied even to your situation (we can chunk it up and call it 'scientific method').

I am not sharing the "End all, Golden Rule" for MCAT approach. Rather, I was sharing my insight on how I approached the test. It was successful for me (I got accepted to all the schools I applied). In addition, I have worked with of few of my students in helping them prep for the MCAT, and it helped them.

The BIGGEST problem I have seen with peeps taking the MCAT is NOT the material, nor the test itself. It is what the test represents ('Oh ****, I screw this, I'll never get into med school'). What if peeps where to take a different approach to the MCAT looking at it as a test of thinking ability instead of a test of "my worthiness in becoming a physician?" What if, people actually took the test and had fun doing it? (I did - I laughed at ever physics problem there) Can you imagine what a change of attitude towards the test might do for their scores?

I'll agree with you that the MCAT plays no role in the type of physician one becomes... Its kinda like the SAT - useless when it came to undergrad. I had a physician friend tell me this once (I'll paraphrase, as it was a long time ago and I cannot quote directly)... Undergrad education really does mean anything when it comes to medical school except in getting you in. The first two years of medical school are good for the boards. The last 2 years of medical school show you what's out there. And you finally get to learn how to be a doctor during residency...

If someone can extract something from my approach that will help them with their MCAT, then I'm happy.

-A
 
My advice:

Drink heavily while you study so if you drink before the test you are in the same mind set. HMM did I do that? I can't remember???? Good Luck! Seriously the test is a pain in the A** and like GI guy said do lots of practice tests.....
 
AntGod22,
I got a 21 on the MCAT and had a 3.49 GPA and got accepted to an osteopathic school my first try. I chalk this up to 1)Beneficial, unique and meaningful experience, 2)Getting valuable recommendations from a contact the school is affiliated with, and 3)Personable interview.
I applied to MD and DO schools, interviewed at 2 MDs and 1 DO and got accepted to the DO school. Overall, it's important to remember that DO schools look more on your overall personality, so even though you're an average applicant in numbers, plug your strong points every chance you get. Good luck!!
 
Doctordes,

I had a few questions for you (hope they're not personal).
1. Which MD schools did you interview at?
2. Do you go to UHS (if not, then where)?
3. What type of (beneficial, unique, and meaningful) experience did you have that contributed to your application?

Last note: Congratulations :)
 
Im new to this thread but I have a few points I would like to make. Im currently a fourth year student at a respected DO school and I am frankly ashamed of this kind of talk here. How can we be treated and considered equals of anyone else if we seek the lowest possible standards to squeak into medical school?
Every time I turn around, there is another person trying to say that DO schools look at the big picture and arent obsessed with the number game. This is true and justifiably so. However, when one makes this kind of remark, one assumes that people with higher stats have fewer of these intangibles than those with low stats. We all have unique,meaningful life experiences so that argument is not relevant, and things like good LORs and shadowing ought to supplement a file and not be the meat of the file. Im sorry to hurt anyones feelings or offend here, but there has to be a minimum standard in order to practice medicine. Trying to find the bottom of the barrel test standard is demeaning to the profession and to all of those who practice it.
In anticipation of those that will surely attack me for these comments by saying that a test does not a doctor make, I have one thing to say. YOURE RIGHT! I couldnt agree more! However, one must realize that it is a rite of passage through which we all pass. By the logic that the MCAT is a stupid, irrelevant exam, one would have to extend that same reasoning to Organic Chemistry, Physics, Calculus and all the way down the line. They are all irrelevant to our careers but we MUST OVERCOME THEM. I do not believe the MCAT is so much an aptitude test as it is a test to judge the ability to overcome a strict challenge. Where do we draw the line? It is a standardized exam that puts us all on the same field of play. If you cannot compete on the exam, then you have no business entering the same field in which others were able to overcome the obstacle.
SOME PEOPLE SIMPLY DO NOT BELONG IN MEDICAL SCHOOL, DESPITE THEIR FERVENT DESORE TO BE THERE. This is reality. I will never be a rock star even though I would like to be. Its life, not fun to hear, but cannot be denied.
I understand that it is difficult and can be quite disappointing. I apologize to anyone and this comment is not addressed to anyone individually. But if we are to be considered strong physicians, we must have BOTH the intangible experiences that have been discussed AND the stats to back it up. It is absolutely offensive to consider what is the minimum one can statistically do to enter school in the blind hope that some outside experience makes you superior to the next candidate. This applies equally well to the person that has stellar stats but no personality or experience. I would gladly accept a candidate that was middle of the road on stats and had some experience or personality ahead of anyone that is a stat genius with no intangibles or the most experienced around without some stat muscle to back it up.
Med school is far too important to be discussed in such ways. And please remember, there is no shame if youre not suited to being a physician. There are many great areas to devote ones life. owever, we cannot bend the system to the breaking point simply to fit some person's unrealistic goals.

This is my two cents worth. Ill sit back and wait for it to hit the fan and the unintended sparks to fly.
 
Totally agree with jimdo.

Although there are always exceptions, and a few people on this board will tell you that they got crappy MCAT scores and are now at the top of their class, most people in my class who struggled through the past 4 years had one thing in common: they came in with relatively lower MCAT scores than the rest of the class. Some of these people also struggled through their clinicals, it wasn't just the "textbook stuff".

Let's face it, you can be the most caring and compassionate physician in the world but you are of no use to your patient if you do not have the clinical knowledge to help him, which is what he came to see you for in the first place. One doesn't have to go to med school for 4 years plus residency on top of that to learn to "listen" and "hold hands". A good physician is one who can do both the knowledge part and the compassion part equally well.

I totally agree that a "burning desire" to become a physician doesn't necessarly mean that that person would make a good physician. I learned that from some of my classmates who truly had the ability to make the rest of us groan :rolleyes: with their constant displays of stupidity, ignorance and plain lack of common sense.
 
UHS2002,
I couldnt agree more with you!! There's is nothing more frustrating in medical school than someone who constantly and consistently shows their ignorance. We are all here to learn, but there has to be SOME level of basic knowledge. During my time at UHS, there have been some really brilliant people and some real *****s. Unfortunately, almost to the person, those that were commonly regarded as idiots were those with the lowest scores. Maybe they can go hold hands with each other in the corner or share "meaningful life experiences" that they try to wield without effect against those with higher stats. Sit down, stop complaining about exams,grades etc, accept its all part of the process and suck it up.
 
•••quote:•••Originally posted by jimdo:
•Im new to this thread but I have a few points I would like to make. Im currently a fourth year student at a respected DO school and I am frankly ashamed of this kind of talk here. How can we be treated and considered equals of anyone else if we seek the lowest possible standards to squeak into medical school?
Every time I turn around, there is another person trying to say that DO schools look at the big picture and arent obsessed with the number game. This is true and justifiably so. However, when one makes this kind of remark, one assumes that people with higher stats have fewer of these intangibles than those with low stats. We all have unique,meaningful life experiences so that argument is not relevant, and things like good LORs and shadowing ought to supplement a file and not be the meat of the file. Im sorry to hurt anyones feelings or offend here, but there has to be a minimum standard in order to practice medicine. Trying to find the bottom of the barrel test standard is demeaning to the profession and to all of those who practice it.
In anticipation of those that will surely attack me for these comments by saying that a test does not a doctor make, I have one thing to say. YOURE RIGHT! I couldnt agree more! However, one must realize that it is a rite of passage through which we all pass. By the logic that the MCAT is a stupid, irrelevant exam, one would have to extend that same reasoning to Organic Chemistry, Physics, Calculus and all the way down the line. They are all irrelevant to our careers but we MUST OVERCOME THEM. I do not believe the MCAT is so much an aptitude test as it is a test to judge the ability to overcome a strict challenge. Where do we draw the line? It is a standardized exam that puts us all on the same field of play. If you cannot compete on the exam, then you have no business entering the same field in which others were able to overcome the obstacle.
SOME PEOPLE SIMPLY DO NOT BELONG IN MEDICAL SCHOOL, DESPITE THEIR FERVENT DESORE TO BE THERE. This is reality. I will never be a rock star even though I would like to be. Its life, not fun to hear, but cannot be denied.
I understand that it is difficult and can be quite disappointing. I apologize to anyone and this comment is not addressed to anyone individually. But if we are to be considered strong physicians, we must have BOTH the intangible experiences that have been discussed AND the stats to back it up. It is absolutely offensive to consider what is the minimum one can statistically do to enter school in the blind hope that some outside experience makes you superior to the next candidate. This applies equally well to the person that has stellar stats but no personality or experience. I would gladly accept a candidate that was middle of the road on stats and had some experience or personality ahead of anyone that is a stat genius with no intangibles or the most experienced around without some stat muscle to back it up.
Med school is far too important to be discussed in such ways. And please remember, there is no shame if youre not suited to being a physician. There are many great areas to devote ones life. owever, we cannot bend the system to the breaking point simply to fit some person's unrealistic goals.

This is my two cents worth. Ill sit back and wait for it to hit the fan and the unintended sparks to fly.•••••Jimdo, good post!!!!!!!! I agree with what you had to say!
 
Thanks too sweet. I call em like I see em.
 
MCAT scores of less than 24? Is this less than 8 across the board? I applied to AZCOM with scores of 26 and 3.5 GPA, maybe my scores were too high to get an interview (although I was accepted to all other schools I applied to). I think you need to retake the MCAT after taking a class or two in your worst area, whatever that may be (English or Chemistry or Biology or Physics). Don't give up, even if you have to go to the Caribbean.
 
I'm not sure why people think it is such a bad thing to research which schools tend to take lower MCAT scores or GPA. Researching such a thing does not necessarily imply that a person is looking to see how little he/she can work to gain entrance to med school. It is simply a way to assess where one stands in the scheme of things. Remember, MCAT's and GPA's are simple a means to a greater end of becoming a great physician.
 
Simply put, it implies a lack of willingness to improve upon something in which they are obviously concerned. If it is that concerning to someone, the obvious choice is to retake. I dont believe "a great physician" would want to scrape into medical school with stats that are not their best. What ever happened to excelling and overcoming obstacles and challenges. Its true that these are not the only thisgs that make a "great doctor", but dont forget that empathy and hand holding only go so far. Hard work, dedication perseverence and yes...a standard of demonstrated performance/intelligence are vital. I think our point is not to degrade the person who posted the question, but to make clear in no uncertain terms that a retake is definitely in order and that we encourage it to be soon in order to demonstrate his proficiency.
 
(MCAT scores of less than 24? Is this less than 8 across the board? I applied to AZCOM with scores of 26 and 3.5 GPA, maybe my scores were too high to get an interview (although I was accepted to all other schools I applied to).)
Goldsalts-I was accepted to AZCOM with 28 MCAT and I know for sure I wasn't the highest. I don't think you didn't get and interview b/c your MCAT was too high. I also don't believe the sub 24 MCAT is relevant anymore at AZCOM.
I also agree with jimdo.
 
I can feel the love here!!!
 
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