low sGPA...

[dmb129]

Hey guys,

So, i'm in a bit of a bind here, and I was just looking for some thoughts/suggestions.

I'm a senior engineering undergrad at a top 5 engineering school. I will be applying next summer, and taking the MCAT in the spring. I'm looking at an sGPA of 3.1. I know it's absolutely terrible. What is really killing me is two bad semesters that I had (second semester freshman, and first semester sophomore). I got a D in Calc 4 and C's in Phys 1 and 2. Since, I have retaken Calc 4 and received an A. I also took Physics 3 and got a B. During those two semesters I had health issues and just became completely apathetic about school. After a reality check, I got my health under control, and straightened out my life.

Just wanted to hear some thoughts on this. My AO GPA is 3.56. Do adcoms take into account at all that I am an engineering major so my classes not factored into BCPM are in fact upper level physics classes? Especially with my C's being in intro Phys 1 and 2....

I also have a significant upward trend in GPA. Since my last bad semester, which was my third semester of college, I have gotten 3.5 term GPA or above. I'm in my 9th semester now (including the two summer terms that i took classes). This semester I'm looking at 3.76-4.0 term.

Am I a lost cause for med school? I want nothing more than to become a doctor...

Thanks so much for everyone's help and opinions. You're all awesome!

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[apumic]

DO or bust.

A 3.1 will hurt you pretty bad although at least your cum is >3.5?
If you can get quite a bit above average (31.5) on the MCAT, you may be able to get some interviews at "lower" MD programs.

 

[Catalystik]

I count 31 allopathic med schools with a BCPM GPA bottom 10th percentile at or below 3.1. Most of those are state schools, but a few are places you could apply and have a chance with a strong MCAT score. You could spend an extra year doing unofficial postbac work in upper-level bio courses to raise it and give yourself a better chance at allopathic schools. Or you could apply to a mix of MD and DO schools at the onset.

Why not take a look at apumic's link (see above post) to a Med School Selection spreadsheet, enter your stats, and see where you stand. Take notes while the spreadsheet is still available.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

i'd recommend trying to raise your science gpa a bit if you pull out a 3.3
and a 30+ mcat
you'll be able to push into lower tier MD
otherwise..
i'd recommend doing DO

 

[TheMightySmiter]

Take an extra year and do some upper-division science courses outside of engineering. As the poster before me said, if you can get your sGPA up to 3.3 and your cGPA to 3.6, you'll have a better shot at MD programs. This combined with a stellar MCAT and great ECs will likely be enough to make you competitive.

Definitely consider applying to DO schools, though. Your sGPA will be significantly better there since your D will be replaced with an A.

 

[dmb129]

Thanks for all the feedback. I'm really trying to do stellar on the MCAT. I'd rather not do DO.

EC-wise, I think I'm pretty solid:
*100+ hours shadowing (combination of oncologist, pediatrician)
*300+ hours volunteer at Camp for children with cancer (includes overnight summer camp, and other weekend programs)
*6+ years Team Captain, Honorary Chairperson for Relay for Life
*President of student-run campus organization that is based on charity fundraising and volunteering
*3 year AMSA member
*7th and 8th Grade Math Tutor at Boys and Girls Club
*1 year research (no publications.... yet )
*I also work 10 hours/week in Spring/Fall and 20 hours/week in the Summer as a student assistant on campus.

I will try my best to get in some additional science classes before I graduate. That is probably going to do the most good. Is there anything else that I should be doing to make myself more competitive?

Thanks!

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Thanks for all the feedback. I'm really trying to do stellar on the MCAT. I'd rather not do DO.

EC-wise, I think I'm pretty solid:
*100+ hours shadowing (combination of oncologist, pediatrician)
*300+ hours volunteer at Camp for children with cancer (includes overnight summer camp, and other weekend programs)
*6+ years Team Captain, Honorary Chairperson for Relay for Life
*President of student-run campus organization that is based on charity fundraising and volunteering
*3 year AMSA member
*7th and 8th Grade Math Tutor at Boys and Girls Club
*1 year research (no publications.... yet )
*I also work 10 hours/week in Spring/Fall and 20 hours/week in the Summer as a student assistant on campus.

I will try my best to get in some additional science classes before I graduate. That is probably going to do the most good. Is there anything else that I should be doing to make myself more competitive?

Thanks!

your chances at md are like 40% with a 30 mcat
to do your more like 80%

 

[Catalystik]

I'm looking at an sGPA of 3.1.

Just wanted to hear some thoughts on this. My AO GPA is 3.56.

Do adcoms take into account at all that I am an engineering major so my classes not factored into BCPM are in fact upper level physics classes? Especially with my C's being in intro Phys 1 and 2.

When you say your AO GPA, I take it to mean your All Other than BCPM. If that is so, then your actual cumulative undergrad GPA is 3.3-3.4? Could you clarify? And more important, what cGPA do you think you'll be applying with?

A few schools might give you a bit of credit for an engineering major, but AMCAS stats overall suggest that is definitely not the case across the board. I'll quote apumic on this: (12/3/09):

While it may make sense that "harder" majors would make a lower GPA more attractive, the AMCAS data reveals no significant difference amongst majors. Social science majors actually get in with the lowest GPA (3.63). Engineering would be among the physical sciences for the purposes of AMCAS' classification and the physical sciences average a 3.52 for applicants (which is right in the middle) but average matriculants have a 3.66. The SDs between majors are also almost identical across the board. Sorry, your stand may be firm but it's not supported. As SD=0.27, a CE major w/ <3.39 probably wouldn't get in anywhere and <3.12 makes it even less likely (worse than 98% of matriculants on GPA alone). A 30 on the MCAT would also be quite a bit below the average score for a matriculant w/ a CE major (mean=32). For whatever reason, they are, if anything, actually harder on physical sciences people (the average PS applicant has a 29.7, btw).

 

[Catalystik]

EC-wise, I think I'm pretty solid:
*100+ hours shadowing (combination of oncologist, pediatrician)
*300+ hours volunteer at Camp for children with cancer (includes overnight summer camp, and other weekend programs)
*6+ years Team Captain, Honorary Chairperson for Relay for Life
*President of student-run campus organization that is based on charity fundraising and volunteering
*3 year AMSA member
*7th and 8th Grade Math Tutor at Boys and Girls Club
*1 year research (no publications.... yet )
*I also work 10 hours/week in Spring/Fall and 20 hours/week in the Summer as a student assistant on campus.

Is there anything else that I should be doing to make myself more competitive?

You are particularly strong in leadership and shadowing. You have an average amount of research. You have some teaching. Your community service is great.

I don't know what a student assistant does, can you explain?

My concern would be your clinical experience, since the Camp is not a typical clinical environment. Were docs and nurses present? What did you do at the camp that made you part of a therapeutic team? Were your duties the same as they would be at any summer camp, or did they go beyond that due to your special population?

 

[J ROD]

Thanks for all the feedback. I'm really trying to do stellar on the MCAT. I'd rather not do DO.

EC-wise, I think I'm pretty solid:
*100+ hours shadowing (combination of oncologist, pediatrician)
*300+ hours volunteer at Camp for children with cancer (includes overnight summer camp, and other weekend programs)
*6+ years Team Captain, Honorary Chairperson for Relay for Life
*President of student-run campus organization that is based on charity fundraising and volunteering
*3 year AMSA member
*7th and 8th Grade Math Tutor at Boys and Girls Club
*1 year research (no publications.... yet )
*I also work 10 hours/week in Spring/Fall and 20 hours/week in the Summer as a student assistant on campus.

I will try my best to get in some additional science classes before I graduate. That is probably going to do the most good. Is there anything else that I should be doing to make myself more competitive?

Thanks!

I think you need to get some volunteering in with patient contact.

It is the only thing I see and it is really needed.

 

[J ROD]

your chances at md are like 40% with a 30 mcat
to do your more like 80%

your percentages are too high with a 3.1 sGPA and 30 MCAT.

get the sGPA up to a 3.3 and get a 34+ MCAT for MD.

 

[dmb129]

Thanks Catalystik.

by AO i did mean All Other. By my time of application i'm looking at a cGPA of 3.39. :-( I'm hoping that a really strong upward trend, and the rest of my application would help.

In terms of the camp, it isn't typical clinical experience, but that is what makes it unique. Seeing as though many of the children are still on treatment, there is always an Oncologist present, and a full staff of nurses. I am a cancer survivor myself, which is why I love the camp so much, and can relate to the camper's situations. My responsibilities at camp include keeping up with all of the camper's medicine schedules, being a mentor to them, encouraging them to overcome physical and mental limitations, etc. Occasionally, I will have to sit with a camper during an IV transfusion. It is unlike any other summer camp, and one of my greatest passions is volunteering for the organization.

 

[Catalystik]

It sounds like a clinical experience to me. One thing I like about your ECs is that a common theme runs through a number of them.

And as a student assistant, you . . .?

 

[Catalystik]

By my time of application i'm looking at a cGPA of 3.39. :-( I'm hoping that a really strong upward trend, and the rest of my application would help.

With a ~3.4 cGPA you'll want to aim for an MCAT of 33+.

 

[stiffany]

I'd say do exceptionally well on the MCAT (take a prep class if you need to), find a way to incorporate that "health stuff" that led to lower grades in your app somehow, and apply broadly - including to reach schools. I had a lower science GPA, but with some interesting ECs, a good personal statement, and a great (albeit probably by SDN standards mediocre) MCAT score, I got into a great, well-ranked school.
I know it can be stressful. Just keep your head up and trying not to worry too much - if there's a will, there's usually a way or so the adage goes.

 

[dmb129]

Yeah, i was actually worried that my application might be labeled as "too centered" on the common theme. To be honest though, I really despise the idea of doing EC's just to put them on your resume. If I am going to becoming involved with something, or dedicate my time to it, I want to be passionate about it, and actually accomplish something.

With regard to my job as a student assistant.... Let's just say that I manage a few hundred confidential student files and work directly with the students with regard to the contents of their files. I don't want to give away too many details about what I do, or about myself. It's not just another, "make copies, and surf the internet" job. That's for sure. (although I do both of those things as well... haha)

 

[dmb129]

I'd say do exceptionally well on the MCAT (take a prep class if you need to), find a way to incorporate that "health stuff" that led to lower grades in your app somehow, and apply broadly - including to reach schools. I had a lower science GPA, but with some interesting ECs, a good personal statement, and a great (albeit probably by SDN standards mediocre) MCAT score, I got into a great, well-ranked school.
I know it can be stressful. Just keep your head up and trying not to worry too much - if there's a will, there's usually a way or so the adage goes.

I'm already in the midst of a prep class

Thank's for the encouraging post. It is definitely stressful, but it's the people like all of you that make it bearable and make SDN so great!

 

[Catalystik]

With regard to my job as a student assistant.... Let's just say that I manage a few hundred confidential student files

LOL, well, I misinterpreted that job description as maybe helping students with physical difficulties with tasks of daily living and thought it might be another clinical experience. I'm glad you explained.

 

[anxietypeaker]

DO or bust.

A 3.1 will hurt you pretty bad although at least your cum is >3.5?
If you can get quite a bit above average (31.5) on the MCAT, you may be able to get some interviews at "lower" MD programs.

This is not true (the "bust" part). You DO need though to ace the mcat. I know plenty of people (they were ALL engineering majors coincidentally haha) with low gpas but superstar mcats (~34-38) who got into top 5 MD programs as well as multiple cali school. Ec's will be critical also.