Masters vs Psy D.

[smithfield2020]

I am currently a senior undergrad and am applying to graduate schools. I've applied to Psy D. programs for clinical and masters for clinical/clinical mental health counseling programs. I have interviewed at William James for the Psy D and will be hearing from them my the middle of this month. I also applied to University of New Haven and University of Saint Joseph for their clinical mental health counseling, and Montclair State for their clinical masters. My end goal is to diagnose and treat mental illnesses in children/adolescents, I especially want to work with substance abuse users. I'm not sure about what to do if I get into William James (loved when I visited, but know its expensive/doesn't have great reviews) and if I get into New Haven (really loved when I visited). What would you do if you were in my shoes? Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks.

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[PsyDuck90]

Read up on the recent posts about William James. If it's between them and a master's, I'd go with the master's.

Also, double check, but I'm pretty sure the clinical psychology master's at Montclair isn't license eligible. Check the laws of the state you want to work in. For example, NJ requires that the graduate program be 60 credit hours. Montclair's is 36.

I don't know anything about the other programs, but your best bet is to go with a good quality state school over a private one as they are usually cheaper. Less tuition/debt for the same future salary.

 

[WisNeuro]

If you want to work with SUD/co-occurring, check into SW programs. Not sure how it is over on the coast, but we have the largest SUD program in the state, provider and bed-wise here, and 95% of the therapy providers are midlevels, most of those SW. If it's between 6 figure debt and the SW path which will be much cheaper and shorter, go the SW path.

 

[deleted343839]

I agree with WisNeuro's suggestion to look into clinical social work programs. If you want to stay in the northeast, check out BU: School of Social Work

 

[WisNeuro]

Yeah, it's all about the money. Typically, SUD treatment programs (unless it's schwanky cash pay resort type Tx) lose a good deal of money for healthcare systems. I don't see this trend changing anytime soon. As a result, these programs are looking to save money wherever they can. So, why hire a psychologist, when you can hire 2-3 midlevels for the same salary. If you want to do research in this area, by all means, look into a (hopefully funded) doctoral program. But, if you only want to do treatment, look at the midlevel training tracks, this is where most of the job openings here are anyway.

 

[smithfield2020]

Thanks for all your advice. I am not interested in social work, and not only addicts. Substance abuse diagnosis/treatment is just one part of what Im interested in. Overall, any mental illness/disorder is what Im interested in.

 

[Sanman]

Thanks for all your advice. I am not interested in social work, and not only addicts. Substance abuse diagnosis/treatment is just one part of what Im interested in. Overall, any mental illness/disorder is what Im interested in.

I'm having a bit of difficulty understanding what it is you exactly want to do and others may be as well. There are different paths whether you want to primarily work with children, substance abuse, or mental health. Care to elaborate a bit more on your goals?

 

[ClinicalABA]

Thanks for all your advice. I am not interested in social work, and not only addicts. Substance abuse diagnosis/treatment is just one part of what Im interested in. Overall, any mental illness/disorder is what Im interested in.

Interesting. You may not be aware of the full scope of social work practice- particularly related to a degree in clinical social work. In my geographic region (Western Mass) the majority of therapists are clinical social workers. They work directly with clients in both inpatient and outpatient settings, delivering a variety of therapies for a wide range of mental health conditions.

 

[SportsNeuroPsych]

Thanks for all your advice. I am not interested in social work, and not only addicts. Substance abuse diagnosis/treatment is just one part of what Im interested in. Overall, any mental illness/disorder is what Im interested in.

You can conduct "therapy" with a SW (depending on where you want to practice) or with a master's program that is license eligible. Another reason why it would make sense to pursue a clinical psych doctorate is if you want to conduct assessments/testing and in that case, maybe consider other options than WJ for reasons that have been discussed on this board already. If you are unclear with exactly what you want to get out of your graduate school and how to achieve it, you may want to wait a year, get some research experience under your belt, shadow clinians, and then apply to the multitude of programs in the NE.

 

[smithfield2020]

I'm having a bit of difficulty understanding what it is you exactly want to do and others may be as well. There are different paths whether you want to primarily work with children, substance abuse, or mental health. Care to elaborate a bit more on your goals?

Work with children/adolescents in a clinical setting (preferably a hospital). For example, a 17 year old comes to me experiencing anorexic behaviors. I want to be able to meet with her, discuss what she is experiencing, give a diagnose, then follow through with a treatment plan for her.

 

[psychlife19]

Work with children/adolescents in a clinical setting (preferably a hospital). For example, a 17 year old comes to me experiencing anorexic behaviors. I want to be able to meet with her, discuss what she is experiencing, give a diagnose, then follow through with a treatment plan for her.

It’s also okay if you don’t know what you like or want to do yet. When I did my first practicum in an eating disorder inpatient clinic, I had no idea if I wanted to do inpatient or eating disorders- I just needed a site lol
And then after 9 months I reflected and realized I like inpatient but eating disorders was not something I wanted to specialize in. And how would I have known that without trying? I think the nice thing about a doctorate is that you do so many practicums/pre internships/externships, you can try a lot of different settings and populations.

And I think masters you have classes and then just one “internship” correct?

 

[smithfield2020]

It’s also okay if you don’t know what you like or want to do yet. When I did my first practicum in an eating disorder inpatient clinic, I had no idea if I wanted to do inpatient or eating disorders- I just needed a site lol
And then after 9 months I reflected and realized I like inpatient but eating disorders was not something I wanted to specialize in. And how would I have known that without trying? I think the nice thing about a doctorate is that you do so many practicums/pre internships/externships, you can try a lot of different settings and populations.

And I think masters you have classes and then just one “internship” correct?

For the masters program I'm looking at it's a counseling practicum, then counseling internship one, then counseling internship two

 

[deleted343839]

Work with children/adolescents in a clinical setting (preferably a hospital). For example, a 17 year old comes to me experiencing anorexic behaviors. I want to be able to meet with her, discuss what she is experiencing, give a diagnose, then follow through with a treatment plan for her.

Child/adolescent psychiatry, clinical child psychology, and social work are all paths that fit with that goal depending on the specific role you want to play (ie, assessment, medication management, psychotherapy, etc.). Often in hospital settings you are working as a team to provide assessment and treatment. Among master's level professionals, social workers do seem to have the upper hand in getting positions on inpatient teams compared to counselors. Not that the latter is impossible, it's just that healthcare systems seem to favor social workers.

As an aside, I know a social worker who used to work on an eating disorders unit at a children's hospital and now has a private psychotherapy practice. Make sure you understand the profession before ruling it out because you might be doing yourself a great disservice.

 

[R. Matey]

For the masters program I'm looking at it's a counseling practicum, then counseling internship one, then counseling internship two

Social Workers usually have better opportunities than folks with master’s in counseling. As many have said, you can do many of the same things with both degrees.


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[Craklin]

If you're wanting to stay in New England, check out Springfield college. Has both a Psy.D and a CMHC program that is soon to be CACREP accredited. Great people running the CMHC program.

 

[WisNeuro]

Springfield is newer, I'd want to see them bring their match rates up consistently first

 

[marcopolo0919]

Montclair's Masters doesn't lead to anything. You can add on a certificate in school psychology to practice in NJ or Forensic certificate I believe. But the masters is either for people who want to do school psych or people who want to boost their chances of getting into a Ph D program

 

[smithfield2020]

I was accepted into William James Psy D program, but will be attending the University of Saint Joseph's (in West Hartford, CT) CMHC M.A. program

 

[ClinicalABA]

Congratulations on making your decision. Best of luck with your studies!