Mayo Clinic vs. UNC-CH

[AnhydrousPond]

I posted a few days ago, but I've narrowed down my options to these two programs. I received some scholarship updates recently, and I need to decide ASAP. I can't believe it's already May, and I still don't know where I'll be in two to three months from now. Please help :/.


Mayo Clinic 2+2 MN/FL Program

+ Really liked the deans, staff, and doctors I met during my interview at the FL campus
+ Connected very well with prospective students during "Second Look," many of whom are attending Mayo for sure
+ Great facilities and amazing simulation center
+ Love the idea of "Selectives" in between most blocks, which is dedicated time to explore interests
+ Great Step 1 average and match list
+ Small class (50 students)
+ Students seemed so happy
+ Most prestigious of all three options

- Expensive (~$48K more expensive than UNC after four years)
- Weather (very cold, but at least I'll move to FL for clinical years)
- Mandatory 8am lectures (I'm a lecture-goer though, so this may be okay)
- Least diverse patient population (in Rochester; in Jacksonville it may be better)
- Rochester is SO small


UNC-Chapel Hill

+ Cheapest option ($48K cheaper than Mayo after 4 years)
+ Home institution/very familiar with the area
+ I love Chapel Hill, and I think it's a very special place
+ Many friends and mentors around
+ Diverse patient population
+ Great reputation

- Disorganized, and this may get worse since they're demolishing their main med school building
- Didn't go to Second Look so no idea how I will connect with classmates or how much support I'll receive from the school
- Step 1 averages dropped after changing the curriculum a few years back (they're buying study resources for their students now, and I think it has improved)
- Less opportunities to explore career interests compared to Mayo?


Thoughts:
I think Mayo may offer better opportunities for me and may be a better fit, but I'm also not sure. I tried not to think about UNC too much while I was on the WL. I feel I'm being stupid for considering saying no to UNC when they're such a great school while also being cheaper. Please comment below!!!

EDIT: Also, I have no idea what I want to do. I currently like peds, surgery, and sports medicine.

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[AnhydrousPond]

The big difference is location, no small matter, even if you only must spend two years in Rochester.

I visited in mid winter, but aside from its isolation and bleakness, I was left feeling that Rochester was an island with sick people flying onto and off of it. That is very uncharitable I know, but I haven't been able to shake this impression. I am OK with sick people, obviously, I've chosen to become a doctor, but at Mayo I felt as if I would be marooned with them.

Chapel Hill on the hand, is one of nicest places in the country to go to school, UG or graduate school, with a great airport close by that makes it easy to get in and out of. It also has fantastic college atheltic teams, a nice diversion for a med student.

Educationally I like the expansiveness of the UNC program, with its excellent Public Health School and its commitment to community health. Its campus is contiguous with the University's, opening up all kinds of social, artistic and educational opportunities. Fretting about one year lower Step scores is, well, fretting.

Finally, Mayo is obviously an excellent institution with a storied history, I just found it a tad cultish and would find attending it claustrophobic.

I appreciate your response. Location is definitely a huge factor, although for me it's not as important as money. Had the two schools given equal aid, I would choose Mayo with little hesitation (mainly because the opportunities I can take advantage of at Mayo). I really like Chapel Hill, and I may want to come back to NC for residency, so maybe it's a good idea to leave for a few years and get some fresh air. I feel like I'm a bit over Chapel Hill though for the many years living there, but I definitely agree this is an amazing campus with SO much to do. Did you withdraw from Mayo, if you don't mind me asking?

 

[AnhydrousPond]

Seems to me like your cons for Mayo are much more significant than your cons for UNC.

I'd go with UNC

Right, but I also feel like the pros for Mayo are more significant, haha.

 

[jessicajonesharvard]

Dude 50k is nothing .. go to Mayo

 

[Arsartium]

First of all, congratulations on your excellent choices! These are two extraordinary institutions where you'll receive superb training. You could flip a coin and be just fine (great in fact). That said, hopefully I can offer a few thoughts that might be helpful.

Finances. By most accounts, a COA difference of <$50K is insignificant if you really want to go to Mayo. Of course, I don't know your family situation or other financial obligations, but even as a pediatrician your attending salary will be able to accommodate fairly high debt burdens. Furthermore, Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF) can serve you well if you keep your ducks in a row. Many people on this forum are quite skeptical of PSLF, but the first year anyone could do it was only in 2017. Moreover, one of the Mayo financial aid planners told me it is very likely to be around for us. It is literally written into our federal loan contracts. The government can't cancel the contract all willy-nilly. (The American Bar Association has actually already sued the government for this--and won). PSLF is here to stay for at least the next 5-10 years, and by then our contracts will have already been signed for 4 years of loans.

Weather. I think everyone in our class is bracing themselves for this. I've known cold, but not Minnesota cold. All I can say is skyways and subways are a beautiful thing. I fully plan on being next to a pedestrian subway and walking to class everyday in a comfortable 72-75 degrees Fahrenheit, well-lit tunnel. BUT WAIT, you'll be in Florida for the last two years!?!? While I'll be stuck with selectives in AZ and FL during the winter months...so jealous.

Mandatory 8 am. Hey but you're a lecture-goer! And Dr. Bostwick tells me these aren't traditional lectures since the class is so small. Much more active and engaging. That remains to be seen. Moreover, Mayo is kind of keeping this info on the DL, but our year will have a much more flexible attendance policy. I think you get ~10 absences (no questions asked). I personally look forward to the camaraderie of mandatory attendance. (We'll suffer early, frigid mornings, but at least we're together!)

Patient diversity. Depends on the type of the diversity. People travel from all over the midwest, country, and world to seek care. You'll have patients across the economic spectrum, as Mayo provides plenty of "charity care." Ethnic and racial diversity may be less available. However, you'll be in Jacksonville for clerkship years. And Mayo has sites across the country and world. Furthermore, Dean Meyer is aggressively pursuing partnerships with Grady hospital, Hennepin County, and Cook County to strengthen the diversity of our clerkship experience.

Rochester...you so small. No getting around that. But I have heard physicians call it "Disneyland for Doctors." Think about it...we get to live in Disneyland! Mayo Clinic is interwoven into the very fabric of Rochester. It may be a problem that it doesn't really have an identity separate from Mayo. Or a "university atmosphere." My weak counter is Minneapolis is only 75 min away (though I can do it in 60 min). I plan on going at least twice a month (i heard some current students go every weekend.) And there's room in my car for a few more!

I didn't set out to talk only about your cons for Mayo...but I guess that's what it ended up being. Clearly, I'm biased. I want you to be my classmate!

TLDR : Go to Mayo! but UNC-Chapel Hill is cool too.

 

[Arsartium]

Few more things about this "Disneyland for Doctors" and Mayo culture.

1. Dual-governance. At every leadership rung, there is an administrative/business counterpart and an MD counterpart. This is so we never forget our duty to the patient at an institutional level.

2. 70th percentile salaries for all specialties. Physicians don't have to worry about squeezing in another procedure to make more money. No competition over procedures (e.g. ortho vs neurosurg for a spinal surgery). Only what is best for the patient. Short, rushed 15 min appts don't happen here. More time with patients, less time with paperwork. The other major hospital with physician salaries? Cleveland Clinic. That rounds out the #1 and #2 hospitals in the country.

3. Mayo-wear. No white coat. No barrier between patient and physician. Also, no clear hierarchy between students (short-coat) and doctor (long-coat). You're introduced as a member of the team.

I wonder if this makes for a better clinical experience?

It's definitely a cult.

 

[AnhydrousPond]

First of all, congratulations on your excellent choices! These are two extraordinary institutions where you'll receive superb training. You could flip a coin and be just fine (great in fact). That said, hopefully I can offer a few thoughts that might be helpful.

Finances. By most accounts, a COA difference of <$50K is insignificant if you really want to go to Mayo. Of course, I don't know your family situation or other financial obligations, but even as a pediatrician your attending salary will be able to accommodate fairly high debt burdens. Furthermore, Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF) can serve you well if you keep your ducks in a row. Many people on this forum are quite skeptical of PSLF, but the first year anyone could do it was only in 2017. Moreover, one of the Mayo financial aid planners told me it is very likely to be around for us. It is literally written into our federal loan contracts. The government can't cancel the contract all willy-nilly. (The American Bar Association has actually already sued the government for this--and won). PSLF is here to stay for at least the next 5-10 years, and by then our contracts will have already been signed for 4 years of loans.

Weather. I think everyone in our class is bracing themselves for this. I've known cold, but not Minnesota cold. All I can say is skyways and subways are a beautiful thing. I fully plan on being next to a pedestrian subway and walking to class everyday in a comfortable 72-75 degrees Fahrenheit, well-lit tunnel. BUT WAIT, you'll be in Florida for the last two years!?!? While I'll be stuck with selectives in AZ and FL during the winter months...so jealous.

Mandatory 8 am. Hey but you're a lecture-goer! And Dr. Bostwick tells me these aren't traditional lectures since the class is so small. Much more active and engaging. That remains to be seen. Moreover, Mayo is kind of keeping this info on the DL, but our year will have a much more flexible attendance policy. I think you get ~10 absences (no questions asked). I personally look forward to the camaraderie of mandatory attendance. (We'll suffer early, frigid mornings, but at least we're together!)

Patient diversity. Depends on the type of the diversity. People travel from all over the midwest, country, and world to seek care. You'll have patients across the economic spectrum, as Mayo provides plenty of "charity care." Ethnic and racial diversity may be less available. However, you'll be in Jacksonville for clerkship years. And Mayo has sites across the country and world. Furthermore, Dean Meyer is aggressively pursuing partnerships with Grady hospital, Hennepin County, and Cook County to strengthen the diversity of our clerkship experience.

Rochester...you so small. No getting around that. But I have heard physicians call it "Disneyland for Doctors." Think about it...we get to live in Disneyland! Mayo Clinic is interwoven into the very fabric of Rochester. It may be a problem that it doesn't really have an identity separate from Mayo. Or a "university atmosphere." My weak counter is Minneapolis is only 75 min away (though I can do it in 60 min). I plan on going at least twice a month (i heard some current students go every weekend.) And there's room in my car for a few more!

I didn't set out to talk only about your cons for Mayo...but I guess that's what it ended up being. Clearly, I'm biased. I want you to be my classmate!

TLDR : Go to Mayo! but UNC-Chapel Hill is cool too.

Thank you so much for the thoughtful response. I really really appreciate it. You've made very good points, and I definitely agree with most if not all of them.