MD/Ph.D

[I'm No Superman]

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I have a few questions about MD/Ph.D programs.

1) If you have completed, or are pursuing, or have an interest in a MD/Ph.D program, why did you choose to do so, what do you like about it, and what do you dislike about it?

2)Is it possible to enter a schools MD/Ph.D program if you enrolled in MD only? if not would you have to do Ph.D separately(applying to a bunch of schools, and the interview process all over again), or are there other options?

3) As an MD/Ph.D, do you still get the patient interaction that MDs/DOs do, or is it much more research based?

Thanks.

 

[TheBigPicture]

I have a few questions about MD/Ph.D programs.

1) If you have completed, or are pursuing, or have an interest in a MD/Ph.D program, why did you choose to do so, what do you like about it, and what do you dislike about it?

2)Is it possible to enter a schools MD/Ph.D program if you enrolled in MD only? if not would you have to do Ph.D separately(applying to a bunch of schools, and the interview process all over again), or are there other options?

3) As an MD/Ph.D, do you still get the patient interaction that MDs/DOs do, or is it much more research based?

Thanks.

Check out the physician scientist forum for a bunch of information about MD/PhD. The stickies have some great information 🙂

1) I am currently an undergrad who is very interested in pursuing a MD/PhD because I am interested in both research and seeing patients. The niche for a physician-scientist is to bring their work from the bench to the bedside (translational research) by developing basic biology discoveries into medical therapies. A career just seeing patients or just doing research would not be entirely fulfilling for me.

2) Yes, you can usually apply in the first or second year of medical school, but you would still waste one or two years of tuition and living expenses, and you may not get into a funded program at all. But, if you know that you want to do it ahead of time, why not apply for MD/PhD originally so you can have funding every year? You should do a large amount of research in undergrad so you are an attractive candidate for both MD/PhD and MD programs.

3) You almost definitely do not get the time that an MD/DO does. The MD/PhD programs train you for an "80/20" career, meaning that you are doing research about 80% of the time, and the other 20% you are seeing patients, teaching, and doing administration work. Some people become fed up with research or are attracted to the higher pay in being solely a physician, so they ultimately drop their research and practice medicine exclusively. This would be the only scenario when an MD/PhD gets the same amount of patient interaction as an MD/DO.

 

[DrYoda]

2)Is it possible to enter a schools MD/Ph.D program if you enrolled in MD only? if not would you have to do Ph.D separately(applying to a bunch of schools, and the interview process all over again), or are there other options?

At some schools it is possible to switch from MD to MD/PhD, but as mentioned above that track will cost you more money.

Some residency/fellowship programs also have tracks that allows you to pursue a graduate degree, an example of this would be the STAR program at UCLA internal med.

3) As an MD/Ph.D, do you still get the patient interaction that MDs/DOs do, or is it much more research based?

You can tailor your practice however you want (as an MD or MD/PhD), but in general MD/PhDs spend a larger portion of their time on research.

 

[I'm No Superman]

Thanks for all the info everyone, I may have to look into these programs a bit more, they seem interesting.

 

[Lil Mick]

I'm a current student in an MD/PhD program.

1) I decided on this because I knew that I wanted to be a medical researcher, and there were parts of medicine that intrigued me. Right now, I am thinking of only pursuing research and teaching in my career, but I will be dealing with clinical trial data, medical phenomena... in my research, so having the medical background will help me better design studies involving patients and their physicians.

2) At my school, it doesn't happen very often, and the student is usually unfunded (just the scholarship).

3) Some people in my program are focusing more on the clinical (80-20 in the MD favor); others like me plan to focus exclusively on research and teaching.

PM me if you want to chat more or have other questions. My school's pre-med advising didn't know much about this option, and I've put together most of the needed advising for that school on MD/PhD programs 🙂

 

[deleted357625]

I have a few questions about MD/Ph.D programs.

1) If you have completed, or are pursuing, or have an interest in a MD/Ph.D program, why did you choose to do so, what do you like about it, and what do you dislike about it?

2)Is it possible to enter a schools MD/Ph.D program if you enrolled in MD only? if not would you have to do Ph.D separately applying to a bunch of schools, and the interview process all over again), or are there other options?

3) As an MD/Ph.D, do you still get the patient interaction that MDs/DOs do, or is it much more research based?

Thanks.

1.)Most ppl enter it because they like research basically. But, on top of that it helps you when it comes to residency. For example, for competitive specialties it's ideal to do research, if your a M.D/PhD applicant your already at an advantage because most likely you will get published etc.

2.) You can apply to schools M.D and M.D/PhD. Sometimes depending on the school ppl apply to both programs at the same school, and if they see that they might just deny you from both programs, but I've seen many ppl do that and get accepted so..

3.) Yes, after you graduated M.D/PhD you can do the same things M.D/D.O's do. You can open up your own private practice or work in hospital etc. The M.D/PhD program mainly in my opinion helps you out in med school if you desire to get into a competitive specialty.

Also, these programs are a lot harder to get into then M.D programs. You will need research experience and on average a higher GPA/MCAT than others.

 

[Lil Mick]

1.)Most ppl enter it because they like research basically. But, on top of that it helps you when it comes to residency. For example, for competitive specialties it's ideal to do research, if your a M.D/PhD applicant your already at an advantage because most likely you will get published etc.

2.) You can apply to schools M.D and M.D/PhD. Sometimes depending on the school ppl apply to both programs at the same school, and if they see that they might just deny you from both programs, but I've seen many ppl do that and get accepted so..

3.) Yes, after you graduated M.D/PhD you can do the same things M.D/D.O's do. You can open up your own private practice or work in hospital etc. The M.D/PhD program mainly in my opinion helps you out in med school if you desire to get into a competitive specialty.

Also, these programs are a lot harder to get into then M.D programs. You will need research experience and on average a higher GPA/MCAT than others.

This hasn't been my experience. My program doesn't have many people gunning for a competitive residency--most of us are trying for K awards so that we can start our labs and begin careers in academia either in lieu of residency or during residency.

I don't think that those programs are harder to get into than MD programs. The gpa/MCAT seems to reflect that we are passionate about science, spend a lot of time doing it, and coincidentally are able to score higher/do better because of our research and outside involvement in the field. Most people in my program spent their extra time in college doing research, rather than volunteering or shadowing--just different priorities than your typical MD.

Also, some schools don't allow you to apply MD and MD/PhD (separate admissions departments, like Hopkins)...

 

[URHere]

I have a few questions about MD/Ph.D programs.

1) If you have completed, or are pursuing, or have an interest in a MD/Ph.D program, why did you choose to do so, what do you like about it, and what do you dislike about it?

Even before I applied to MD/PhD programs, I knew that my interests were a bit eclectic and unlikely to fit into a single career box. My personal interest is in pharmacology (drug design, drug effects, drug resistance, etc), which clearly spans both the medical and research arenas. Ultimately, I applied to MD/PhD programs because I knew that I needed a lot more training before I could work independently as a medicinal chemist (and pharmacokineticist, etc) and I just couldn't see myself picking up that kind of expertise during a fellowship.

Now that I'm here, I appreciate a few things: the ultimate freedom and responsibility I have for my own education, the ability to network with just about anyone in my field, and the gift of working with some seriously brilliant chemists on some really cutting-edge research. On a lighter note, I also really appreciate my ability to balance my work schedule with my martial arts training. However, I don't enjoy all of the red tape (having to interrupt work days to give throw-away grad school presentations, having to take classes on things I already learned in medical school), the uncertainty (will I really get my PhD in 3/4 years?), and the fact that I see my clinical knowledge all but disappearing as the days go by. But, you have to take the good with the bad, and I still believe it was the best choice for me.

That being said, my advice to anyone considering an MD/PhD program is to evaluate your career goals before you choose this path. If you want to conduct clinical research, or bench research that is technically-light, you may very well save yourself some time by getting just an MD and pursuing research during residency/fellowship. Only go for the PhD if you need it for some reason - it is too much time and frustration to do just for the stipend or prestige.

2)Is it possible to enter a schools MD/Ph.D program if you enrolled in MD only? if not would you have to do Ph.D separately(applying to a bunch of schools, and the interview process all over again), or are there other options?

This depends on the school. Many schools will tell you that it's possible, but in reality only a few will make a common practice of doing this. It is usually a good idea to ask current students how often internal applicants are accepted - they have no reason to lie to you.

If you want to pursue the MD and the PhD separately, you should really get the PhD first. Once you graduate with your MD, you will be expected to go directly through residency AND you will have a large amount of debt to pay off. Both of those things would complicate graduate school plans. Honestly, though, if you end up with an MD and you still want to do research, apply for research-heavy fellowships and get your training done then.

3) As an MD/Ph.D, do you still get the patient interaction that MDs/DOs do, or is it much more research based?

This depends on the person. Some MD/PhD graduates end up working exclusively with patients. Others work only in lab, and some will attempt to balance the two. How much patient interaction you have depends on your own priorities, your grants/lab demands, and the place where you end up working.