Medical School Admissions: How can I improve my chances?

[REL]

Hi,

I am a non-trad that keeps flipping flopping on whether applying to allopathic programs would be for not.

My Story:

I have roughly 36 credits worth of "F"s my first 3 FT semesters of college (10 years ago). I signed up for a full course load, then would stop going to class and didn't even take the 10 minutes out of my day to drop these classes.

I then joined the air force, "fell" into the medical field and have been working as a clinical lab scientest ever since (got out of the Air Force after 4 years and have been doing this in the civilian sector)

Fast forward to 2 years ago I decided I HAD to go to medical school. I am now 2 semesters away from my UG degree and am sporting a ~3.9 and have not only retaken every one of my "Fs" but have recieved an "A" in each retake.

I will be applying to D.O. schools this spring and since only my last retakes count I will have roughly a 3.9 GPA, but also do to AMCAS's no retake policy I would have roughly a 3.05 cGPA and 3.3 sGPA. Assuming I score around a 35 on my MCAT, will I even be able to score an interview at an allopathic program?

Tuition and being able to not have to go to a satellite location for clinical years are the alluring factors of allopathic over osteopathic for me, otherwise I just want to be a primary care physician.

Thanks!

Time passes, people change. I would imagine that all medical programs would be happy to have a non-traditional applicant that is academic and committed. They will look at the your last academic effort, not the total sum for 10 years.....surely you cannot raise the total to a highly noticeable number. You will have to ensure that you contact each program with a short letter (or better yet a personal visit) to ensure that they know that you are there. Those that only look at numbers as the first cut may miss you. Of course you must show the consistency of med commitment (vol and some shad), comm svc vol, teamwork/leadership, and having a couple of semesters of basic science lab research involvement will be a plus if possible. Several MD programs are very non-trad friendly, and more are seeing the light. Work with your school's prehealth office and look at the AAMC/MSAR in their office to select your schools of interest. I wish you well.

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[REL]

Hi, I have a couple of questions.

I participate in a club sport and I was wondering what strength this lends to my application. I know a lot of people list stuff like intramural sports but I don't know about other schools but at mine intramurals are a joke. However, this isn't quite a varsity sport (which is usually the type of questions that I've seen answered). I dedicate around 11 hours a week in this sport not including the travel time and the weekends where I have to go away. This usually takes a day and a half of my weekend, sometimes the entire weekend. I don't do this for the prestige or for an adcom but nonetheless I'm still curious what strength it lends to my application? What kind of benefit does distinction within that sport (like awards and making regional all star teams) receive? Just as an added note, there is no "varsity" level of this sport at the collegiate level so what I compete in is the highest level a college student can participate in.

Secondly, if I applied my senior year so that I would have a year off before matriculating, what kind of expectations do medical schools have of me for that time off? I would really like to relax and spend time with my family and enjoy some aspects of life I might have missed before diving into my future career. Will there be specific expectations of things for me to do or would a school be understanding of my desire to just take a break for a bit (I wouldn't sit idly and twidle my thumbs but I certainly wouldn't be as involved/busy as I was in college).

Thanks for any help you can give!

Thank you for your inquiry. As for the club sport, it shows some teamwork and leadership traits, and maybe helps in showing time-management skills and commitment. Overall it would be one of many items that admissions committees would count in "what you did with your time, priorities, and what other time was there to do other things." As long as your commitment to medicine and people is strong you are fine. If you spent time on sports and do not have a strong record of showing commitment to "testing the medicine theory," that's where a question of commitment for medicine would occur. As for the extra year, do a draft of what your application would look like, evaluate for weaknesses, address them during your year off. Always continue the things which show a commitment to medicine and people (med and comm svc vol).

 

[REL]

Hi.

I'm planning on applying to med school for 2011. But i have a few problems with my GPA. My freshman year at college was bad. My Cummulative GPA for the whole year was a 2.0. That's horrible i know but i have reasons. First off i got screwed with letters of rec, so every college i applied to, i couldnt attend (long long story). So i got stuck going to a half way decent college. I got there, and it just wasn't for me. I hated the place, and the professors. I felt that the classes were a waste of my time, and the professors were horrible. It just wasn't the college for me and my grades reflected that. But also, early in the spring semester, my grandma had triple bypass surgery. I had to take care of her. This made it hard to keep up with grades, and i ended up having to drop two classes.

I talked to my advisor, explained my situation, and she told me she would take care of it, and drop me from the classes i couldn't attend. So i stopped attending those classes because i thought they were dropped (very stupid choice on my part, b/c i should've checked to make sure they were dropped). I found out after the semester was over that she didnt drop me from the classes. I called the advisor and her response was that she forgot.....and was deeply sorry. bullsh** if you ask me. So i transferred to my original first choice school, took honors classes and kept at 3.98 GPA. I've even retaken the classes that i got bad grades in, and ended up making high A's in all of them.

As for EC's, after my freshman year i didnt have to take care of my grandma anymore. I had plenty of time to volunteer and things like that. I've have 2.5 years of reasearch with 1 publication, and 2 co-authors, i was the president of my schools student government and pre-med society, I played as the #2 singles on my tennis team the first semester of freshman yr, and all of my soph, jr, and sr year (team captain sr yr), i've taught a tennis camp at Dartmouth college for 3 summers, im the co-founder of a tennis foundation that raises money to build tennis courts in underprivilaged communities (and have built 4 tennis courts in 3 underprivilaged communities), i've been a member of Big Brother/Big Sister for 2 years, i've been volunteering at a hospital, orphanage, and the Lord's kitchen for 2 years, i've tutored kids in AP chemistry at my old high school for 2 summers, i've job shadowed a cardiologist, thoracic surgeon, ophthalmologist, and orthopedic spine surgeon for about 4 hrs/week for 3 months each, i've been a member of a sorority for 2 yrs, ive worked in a nursing home in the dementia/altzheimers section for 4 yrs (around 15 hrs a week), i've taught CNA classes for 2 summers and ive studied overseas in Spain for a year. My MCAT score was a 37.

I know your thinking that i've done all of my EC's to make up for the bad GPA, but I can honestly say that i did them because i was genuinely interested in making a difference and helping out around my community. My mother and father have been involved in things like that their whole life, so it's kinda in the family.

So i was just wondering with the really bad GPA, even though ive retaken all the classes and got A's, if my EC's and MCAT will be good enough to get me into schools like UCSD or some other top medical schools. My LOR's are great as well ( or so i've been told)

So what are your opinions?? And is there anything else that you would reccommend that i do?

Thanks for all of your help

Thank you for your inquiry. If you have a turning point in your GPA, and it appears that you do, and if the semesters are substantial in solid course work with great outcomes you are on the right road. You will have to contact the admissions folks via letter or in person to let them know of your interest and your turn-around. You have participated in many things which are good, with consistency over time. I wonder about actual medical volunteerism in a clinical environment and physician shadowing consistency. You cannot afford any weaknesses beyond your GPA. Those schools that only look at numbers wont pay any attention to you unless you let them know that you exist, even then, if numbers are THE important factor your chances for that program are minimal. Apparently you have an attachment to California, as such you are aware that they have many well-numbered applicants for the seats available, you may have to look out-of-state. I recommend working closely with your prehealth advisor and using the AAMC/MSAR to carefully select schools that "understand" applicants in your position.

Finally, and I mean this to be helpful, I got a vibe from the information you provided regarding attitude. The way things were presented showed some bitterness for negative things that have occurred where MAYBE you did not follow-up or where you did not follow through. It also appeared that as long as you got what you wanted and you were in control, all was well. Make sure that these types of impressions are not included in your applications to medical schools. I do not know you and I could be completely wrong because you have done a lot of good for others. I wish you well.

 

[REL]

I am a Chemical Biology major. I have been doing research for 3 years in two different areas, one being my own research project. I am also a Belly Dancing instructor at my school, volunteer at a hospital, have been part of other volunteer activities, and creative clubs at my school. I have a 3.75 GPA and low 24R MCAT. I have already registered to take it again. If I want to become a DO, what MCAT score should I be aiming? (I will also apply to MD schools so I don't limit myself ).
Thank you for your help

Thank you for your inquiry. I deal mainly with MD programs and for them the MCAT continues to rise where the averages of entering classes now is around 29-34 so get as close to them as possible. Getting into an MD program with lower MCAT/GPA numbers (under ?26?) is more difficult unless you bring something to a class that helps to diversify the overall group and enhance the class in a strong way. Entering DO classes normally are a bit lower than MD programs on average. I recommend working closely with your prehealth advising office. They should have the AAMC/MSAR for MD programs and data regarding DO programs to help you understand which programs will be most likely to accept you.

 

[REL]

Hi, my name is David and I'm trying to make a decision. My current GPA, as it stands, is a mere 3.2 and is not enough for medical school and my MCAT is only a 35 which isn't enough to compensate for it. I recently applied for graduate school special masters program and got into the Boston University Special Masters of Medical Science and I've applied for a few more (Georgetown, Temple University, Rosalind Franklin, U. Penn, U. Cincinnati, Mount Sinai, Drexel, Loyola, Dartmouth and New York Medical College). My question now is are these programs actually beneficial to me? Some of these programs are Post-Bacc style programs while others offer me the opportunity to take the first year of medical school classes. Of the two, which one should I take and if I do demonstrate that I can academically perform (3.5 GPA or above) and I do reapply, would medical schools hold this against me? Secondly, since I already got into Boston University, should I reapply for medical school now and indicate that I was already accepted?

You show insight. The answer lies in your strength in the basic sciences. If you have taken a lot of basic sciences and feel confident that you can out-perform 2/3 of a med school class, then the med 1 type will help you. I consider this type of program as the final shot in your gun, do very well and you help yourself, do average or less and you will have to have a very strong application in every other way to have a glimmer of a chance. More often than not, I would recommend the solid basic science, full-time, MS in a basic science discipline to show an admissions committee that you have the science academic knowledge to perform strongly in medical academics. It also is not the final shot, so there is less pressure to perform -- it may allow you to do better. Your MCAT is a good one so you may have the basics to do the med 1 type program.

 

[REL]

im going to start my junior year and my advisor told me to switch from a pre med major to a psych major minoring in biology due to my grades. i transfered with a 3.6 to this university.. i took genchem here and received a C and a D for lab, for both 1 and 2, should i switch my major because of these two grades or continue onto orgo and genetics. i really want too, but my math wasnt strong enough for genchem. please help asap!

I'm cannot answer your question. If you received a C/D in genchem 1 and 2 for class/lab at a 4 year school after coming in from a community college it may mean that you need to look at your study habits and ratchet up your effort. It isnt unheard-of to hear the story like yours. I dont thing the major has anything to do with it. Orgo and physics may be more difficult than genchem. Getting in to a med program will require you to make some adjustments and reset your priorities to be competitive academically. You will have to make the call on this one because only you know what you are capable of doing.

 

[REL]

Not sure if this thread is still accepting questions, but for my situation, I did rather horrible at community college, complete with D's and F's, however at the moment, I transferred to a four-year university, and I'm doing MUCH better in my classes. Do you guys as admissions officers look at things like academic upward trends and EC's? Would you guys focus more on the marks that I earned at the four-year more than the sub-par ones that I earned at the community college?

Thanks.

More and more med programs say that they look at the entire application and look at trends in academics. It is easier to overlook one bad early year and chalk it up to adjusting in college. Two years is a little more difficult. You will have to pretty much ace your next two years and follow up with a strong MCAT score. If you are able to do that you will still have to make visits to your programs of interest to show your interest and have them keep their eye out for your application when it arrives. There is a good chance that you may have to follow up your BS degree with a very solid effort in a 1 year MS in a basic science discipline if you do not get in with your first application. Strong EC's, especially in the med and humanism areas are a must in your case if you are to have any chance at all. Make use of your premed advising office to find programs that will give you a chance........I wish you well.

 

[REL]

"I am a chiropractor that has been practicing two years and is planning on switching to a career in medicine for various reasons that I know I will have to explain in interviews. Regardless, my questions are concerning my candidacy. My GPA will be my weakness in the application. My GPAs are 3.1 and 3.1 for science and cumulative (AMCAS) and ~ 3.3 (AACOMAS), but I have yet to take organic chemistry.

I realize that the GPA is low and that it needs work, but I do not think I could benefit from an SMP because I already have two bachelor's degrees, one master's degree (GPA 3.7+), and a doctor of chiropractic degree (GPA 3.5+). With this many credits, getting new A's only raises the GPA marginally. Although my GPA is low cumulatively, I only experienced difficulty early in my bachelor's program, and early in the D.C. program.

With that in mind, I am focusing on retaking pre-reqs that I got C's in (to help boost the DO GPA) and focusing on strengthening the rest of my application.

1. Is this my best bet considering my GPA weakness?

My ECs include hundreds of hours of volunteering through my fraternity, 6 consecutive semesters serving in executive leadership roles in the fraternity, over 100 hours providing care for homeless and underprivileged patients in a free clinic, and hospital volunteering.

Clinical experience includes hospital volunteering and administering chiropractic care (history and consultation, physical examinations, assessment and diagnosis, developing treatment plans and administering care, developing "bedside" manner, gaining positive patient rapport, writing narratives, referring patients, ordering outside imaging studies and labs, participating in third party payer systems/medicare, CME, malpractice insurance). I have done all of those activities with thousands of patients. Aside from the obvious differences in treatment methods, I feel like I have had exposure to "work as a doctor".

I have not completed any shadowing as of right now, but am planning on it.

I am currently conducting research that will be submitted for publication later this year. Not being affiliated with a university as a student or paid researcher has made it difficult to conduct research (outside of submitting case reports), so this will likely be the only remarkable research portion of my application.

2. Is this going to be sufficient EC and clinical experience? If not, what else could I add?

I have not taken the MCAT, but have begun studying for it. Depending on how comfortable I feel, I may consider taking it next spring. I am not sure if I will be ready to apply for the 2011 season or not. I understand the importance of scoring very high on this examination for my chances of gaining an acceptance.

I plan to apply very broadly through AMCAS and AACOMAS.

As a non-traditional applicant, I am also predicting difficulty in finding a science LOR. I am hoping to make a good impression on my organic chemistry professor in order to accommodate this requirement.

3. With all things considered, is there anything else you would recommend to strengthen my application and improve my chances for admission?"

Thank you very much for your time and contribution to this section of the forum.[/QUOTE]

Well the good news is that your upper-level degrees and GPA's will compensate for your initial degree work. Retaking the requirements is a good move and should help you strengthen your foundation to do better on the MCAT...getting a 32+ on the MCAT will be helpful. Leadership from earlier should suffice. Research is a bonus that should help you. Now for the med motivation and humanism, you should have a consistent record of medical clinical and community service volunteerism over time, and a few days of physician shadowing will be helpful too. If you can work full-time basic science semesters in, that would be ideal, but if you cannot, try to take 2-3 classes per term. It all has to do with your time available and what you did with it....you will have ample opportunity in the AMCAS and secondary applications to explain all of these factors. Finally, get access to the AAMC/MSAR in a premed office (or purchase at www.aamc.org) to evaluate programs to which you would have the best chance as a non-traditional applicant.

 

[REL]

Another thing I forgot to address; On some of my institutions they disallowed the grade received in the class, meaning that it shows up on my transcript, but it has an allotment of 0.0 units. Must I report this to AMCAS, or can I omit it, since technically I didn't receive any credit whatsoever towards the school GPA.

I know that AMCAS will count all grades and courses in their computation. You must send an original transcript from every program to AMCAS. If you received a grade from that original program it will be counted by AMCAS regardless of whether another subsequent program accepted that course into their degree program. If this doesnt answer your question, contact AMCAS.

 

[REL]

Hello!

I got my B.S Degree at a 4 year college in Neurosciences, but before i went to the Univ i went to a Community College. I messed up big and the stupid calculus class that i took 2 times and other classes that i did bad in are weighing my overall science gpa down alot.. So my main question is, i went ahead and finished the physics gchem ochem and bio at the 4 year, i had started the gchem at the comunity college. I want to go back now and retake the gchem, and physics, and ochem at a community college to get A's in them and file my app to medical school while also taking some more upper division courses at a 4 year institution..

are taking classes at the Community college going to be frowned upon?

Thanks!

Without knowing a whole lot, my first thought is to go back to the 4-year institution and do what is called a 2nd bachelors degree (~60 hrs) on a full-time basis IF you can find some unique courses that you have not already taken. Normally I do not recommend retaking courses, but if you really, really need to, include them in the 60 hours. It will be important to stay away from the community college. You need to show academic strength in the basic sciences to an admissions committee. Do not do an MPH, do not do an SMP. If there not enuf unique course work at the BS level, then you may need to start at the MS level. Follow up very strong academics with a very strong MCAT to put yourself in the best possibile position. Of course also be very strong with the medical motivation and community service volunteerism, teamwork, and even some basic lab research if at all possible.

 

[REL]

Hi, I am a pharmacy student and will be applying to medical schools this June. I studied and took the MCAT this summer. I received a 29 O (10,8,11). I felt like I was really nervous, guessed on a lot of answers as I did not do during practice tests, and the noise bothered me. I would have 6 weeks to study this winter break. However, I am still concerned about the possibility of not improving or even decreasing the score. I really want to get into one of the top 30 MD schools. I am not sure if this is realistic. My gpa is 3.65, and I will be graduating with a pharmD. I have had a lot of leadership position, volunteering (international) experience, and clinical research experience (1st author publication). I really want to get into a good school. Should I retake the MCAT?

Thank you for your inquiry. The average MCAT score for the entering class of a majority of MD programs is above 30 and rising, a 29 is close, but it isnt a 30. Also in many cases the class average GPA is at or above a 3.65. I have seen many applicants with a PharmD who were not competitive for an MD program because many of their courses were not counted in the BPCM (Biology, Chem, Physics, Math departments) and their SGPAs were not otherwise strong. As for volunteerism you should have consistent medical volunteering in a clinical environment where MDs are present; as well a consistent record of community service volunteerism. You should assess whether your experiences might be concieved as stronger than many which may also have similar academic numbers. If you think that you can do better on the MCAT, I suspect you should consider doing so. Finally, since many consider a pharmacist to make a decently high wage, you might consider preparing to answer questions like.....Why MD now? Why not MD first? Why shouldnt you be considered a career student? I hope that this helps.

 

[REL]

Here is my situation. My current cGPA & sGPA is about 3.6. I just took the MCAT and got a 35Q. I will graduate with dual majors (biochem/biology) this May 2010. I will apply June 2010 for Med school. With my schooling, i had about a 2 year low point in my life and averaged slightly below a 3.00 gpa. 2007-2008 school years. Since then I have turned it around and averaged 3.9 gpa last year (hard classes), and this year should also average close to the same. So I will have a two year gpa upward trend. So I want to do a MD school and do whatever it takes to be the most competitive I can be. I have an opportunity to do a MS in neurobiology doing my gap year. I was wondering if that would help me be more competitive and show that I have what it takes,(continue an upward trent) or if something else would be more beneficial. Thanks! I just don't know how much going for a masters in for neurobiology would help or not.

I think you are doing this correctly. Continue to build the strong academics leaving no doubt about the past problems. Along the way continue to show the medical motivation (clinical vol, shadow) and humanity (comm svc vol), teamwork skills, and it seems to help to have couple of semesters of basic science bench research where you are actually doing something in that process. The academics you continue with in the MS year should be full-time and in a basic science discipline. Go forth and do well!

 

[REL]

What do you guys think of my application:

http://www.mdapplicants.com/profile.php?id=18510

I have looked at the AAMC 3-year averages from the CUNY's and from the ones that matriculate several into MD programs and their averages are ~30 MCAT and ~3.65 SGPA, ~3.75 GPA, so simply looking at the numbers you are not too far off. If your trend was a lower GPA in freshman year and strong climb thereafter, that is helpful. Working two jobs helps to mitigate the limited med vol (1 year --- if all in one year and then nothing, it would be a cause for concern --- looks like a "check box" whereas continuous med vol shows some form of commitment), I did not see any physician shadowing, nor basic science research (helpful to an application, but not required -- many do have it), I did not see a commitment to humanism (comm svc vol), again this should be something spanning time in college like med vol, finally the teamwork/leadership area also appeared to be lacking based on what you have provided. I do not have your app so I cannot be much more specific, so in a larger pool of applicants, based on what you have provided, it might be difficult to select your application for an interview over several others that have done more. My suggestion would be to carve out some time to address these issues in at least a modest way, while you are also working etc. If you have done some of these things and they are not in your application, I would recommend sending an update to the medical programs for their review.

 

[Dr Acula MD]

I applied this year and am extremely new to the process. My undergrad had no premed advisory committee so I didn't know that haste in returning complete secondary apps was as important as I've learned it to be. As a result, my average return time (secondary invitation to submission) was three weeks.

I applied to 17 schools initially but I added Boston in late July when my fellow premeds advised me to add more "safety schools". When I got rejected from Boston in early September, I added 4 more safety schools.

I have not received any interview invites from any school and am extremely worried about this cycle going down the drain. Is there anything I can do to up my chances (ex: send updates to school's that will accept them w/o giving an interview invite, calling in to check my app status, etc)?

My application is summarized at the link below:

http://mdapplicants.com/profile.php?id=18876

The only things I could update med schools on at this point are two new jobs I've taken up to help my recently laid off parents pay the bills (8 months clinical research at a hospital, 2 months internship for small industry biofuel company).

Other than the apparent, the only other negative thing on my app could be a withdrawal from a multivariable calculus class that I took the next semester and got a solid A in.

What should I do? Should I start sculpting a PS for the next cycle? Please help.

 

[dentist82]

Hello there,

Thank you very much for being so helpful. My situation is unique and would very appreciate advice from adcom people.

I have bachelors degree of dental surgery from outside the U.S., so yes I'm a dentist with a foreign degree. I'm a permenant resident of the U.S., I'm very interested in career change and being MD.

The problem is my GPA from my dental school is very low (2.53) and the reason behind that is not because I don't like dentistry but I graduated from Iraq and my college was in the middle of war zone. It was extraordinary circumstances that I had no control over. My transcripts and translated and evaluated by ECE.

I have called several medical schools and some told me I just need to take BCPM and MCAT then apply so at least they have a criteira to compate me with other applicants. I haven't started taking classes yet. I also joined the U.S. Army as LPN recently and will start my army training soon.

My question is for adcom persons, would you even consider my application with that low GPA and overlook my circumstances? What if I got a very good science GPA and scored very well on MCAT? Would it make any difference since I proved that it was not me it was the war and the violence that made my GPA that low. Would my military experince as military nurse be good to my application?

Thank you very much!

 

[premedk]

I have always been a poor standardized test taker(partly because I have ADHD) so I have never preformed remarkably well on those type of tests. But I am working very hard in my classes and have a 3.93 with 75 credits completed. I plan on studying very hard for the MCAT, but still don't think I will over a 26. What type of GPA/extracurricular would give me a good chance of getting in to a very competitive med school, despite my poor MCAT scores. Also, how are students who are marked as having "nonstandard testing conditions"(extra time) on the MCAT, looked at when considering admissions. Thanks for the help.

 

[mangopapaya]

I was hoping to get some advice on how to improve my application. I graduated in May 2008 with a degree in biology. My GPA at graduation was 3.4. I am currently working on an MPH and will graduate this spring, and my GPA is 3.8. My total GPA for medical school admission, when taking both schools into account, was a science GPA of 3.38 and a cumulative GPA of 3.51. My MCAT is low - only a 26Q, with a 7 in PS. I do have research experience as an undergraduate (5 months) and as a graduate student (4 months). As a graduate student, I also co-authored a poster for presentation at NAPCRG over the research I did. I have a lot of community service volunteering hours, and had two solid LORs, including one from a former medical school professor. However, I received no interviews after I sent in my application. Besides a stronger MCAT score, what should I focus on? Thank you.

 

[teodio]

Hello, I have some questions on whether or not I should repeat 2 courses.

I had a 3.8 Science GPA nearly all A's/a-'s in my science courses and non-science (3.6gpa).
This last recent semester, last before graduating, I received all C's in all my subjects including my two sciences: biochem and physiology. This had brough my science GPA down to 3.55 and non-science too a 3.2.

the reason why this happened is immediate family issues, which hindered my normal study habits. Should, I retake biochem/phyio and raise my GPA or not even bother?

I have 3 years research exp.
Been volunteering for 2 years,
traveled the world
I speak 3 languages (english, spanish and arabic)
hold many martial arts titles.
deans list past semesters.
Econ major.

I haven't yet taken the MCAT, but if I score around 30-35 range, should I still consider retaking those courses?

 

[saxfantastic]

Hello! I'm currently a sophomore pre-med student. I've been volunteering about 4 hours/week in my local Emergency Room for a little over 2 years. I'm wondering if I should "branch out" a little bit with my volunteer work. I'm a French major, and I have the opportunity to volunteer in local elementary school classrooms, mentoring students who are learning English as a second language. Would this qualify as "teaching experience" on a med school application (I'm told it's recommended)?

I've got a decent GPA (3.82), double-major in French and Biology, and a research fellowship. I guess I'm looking for more ways to make my app stand out.

Thanks for your time!

 

[Texannational]

I am a non-traditonal applicant and have a few questions.
I keep a beard because of my religious convictions, however, when i was shadowing a doctor he told me that i dont look like a doctor and should get read of the facial hair. I would like an honest opinion from the adcoms who reply to questions what they think of this. I know that nothing is free of biased and discrimination and so would like to know if this profession one where everyone wants to "serve humankind before self" does reject students based on their physical apperance regardless of how humble the reason may be for the slight deviation from the norm. Please anyone? if i posted in the wrond section i am really sorry (its my first time).
My reason for getting in to the medical field is so that i can benefit my patients by working on the problem in a wetlab and then coming up with solutions. this is my goal because i am a masters in Bioengineering and feel there is a big need for scientists involved in translational research. My question is that if i were to use this as the theme of my personal statement, would that sound like an unappealing reason for admitting me to medical school.

 

[Oxygen206]

I am curious about how my academic record will be viewed...here goes:

I began college at 16 and also started working full time as a medical receptionist. My first two years resulted in a not-so-pretty GPA of 3.04 (no science classes). In all honesty, at 16 it was too soon to know what I wanted to do or be mature about school. I was more concerned with working.

After the two years, I signed up for a CNA course and dropped it which left me with a quarter of W's on my transcript.

I realized CNA wasn't for me (I couldn't keep up with the 8 hours per day of class & working full time to support myself). So, I changed to medical vocational training (medical assistant - only 4 hours per day) all while still working full time as a medical receptionist.

During the medical assistant training I did okay (again, didn't realize the importance of GPA at 18 years old). I did the MA training through a community college that gave college credits for the classes and so I must report them. They don't exactly help, but they didn't lower my GPA. Overall it shows a 3.05.

Ok, so I got a job as an MA and after working closely with a few physicians I decided I wanted to be a physician. I enrolled at a University for premed, but I had not learned how to be successful in college, I earned a 2.7 for my first year (including some science courses)...ouch.

Starting my second year at the University I buckled down and have had a 3.98 GPA from then on (5 quarters total, all science courses). Average GPA at the University is 3.58, but when my courses from when I was very young are taken into account I have a 3.35 cGPA and a 3.72 sGPA.

I have calculated that with 4 quarters remaining I could possibly get it up to a 3.4, but with 180+ credits it's hard to get the cumulative to budge.

(I have not taken the MCAT yet, and I have been told my ECs are strong)

Sorry this was so long, but any advice as to how this will be viewed is greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance!!

 

[LiquidJazz89]

Hi, I'd like to thank everyone who posts a response. I'm entering my fourth semester in undergrad with a 4.0 GPA (A=4.0), have more than 100 hours volunteering in the hospital transport and patient services, and have been doing research in systems biology and genomics since June 2009 (hoping for a publication within the year). I am an Eagle Scout, treasurer in our American Chemical Society and Environmental Clubs (I really like these clubs), lab technician in the biology department, and math/physics tutor for the campus and for local high school kids. I also love playing music but I don't have time to take a class to put on my transcript, but I am playing for a religious retreat.

Should I try to volunteer more in the hospital? Should I concentrate more on one interest/club (becoming president of one of the clubs or follow music more because if i drop the responsibilities in the clubs i might be able to fit in a music class per semester)?

Thank You

 

[mooshika]

I would appreciate any feedback here! I have worked really hard in the past four years and I'm still not really sure what to expect and how competitive I really am.

I am an older non-trad applicant who always dreamed of a career in medicine but when in my first undergrad lacked the maturity to work hard even in the classes I disliked, and received A's in the classes I wanted to. However, I was a varsity athlete and a nationally ranked All-American (6th in springboard diving) athlete in my sport of choice. I was also very active in extracurriculars such as starting a poetry publication, a pottery club and with another group of students we started the first recycling program at any college in the east coast. I did a year abroad in England, and was extremely involved in the theatre and dance program and starred in the annual major production my senior year, but my GPA overall was a 2.7. I always scored in the 90-95th percentile in national exams, and had the ability to excell academically if I had focused more in that direction - but lacked the maturity. (did all AP classes in science in a private boarding school)

I went on to have a very successful career in TV and film, and always maintained volunteering and human service work along the way. Because of the low GPA and some struggles with depression, I felt that medical school was out of reach when years later I realized I really wanted to go in that direction. For years I kept looking to med school, but put it out of my mind because of the GPA. I became very successful in my job in theatre and TV, but once I reached certain goals I looked to a change in career. By that point I had travelled all over the world, earned an MFA in Theatre and a prestigious teaching fellowship and residency in playwriting at Brown University.

I looked at med school again, but ultimately choose to at least start going in the direction of Nurse Practitioner cause I still didn't think I had a chance for med school. I started taking the pre-reqs for nursing school and did extremely well, mostly all A's and scored high on the GRE. I was admitted to Columbia UNiversity NP program with a scholarship and Duke accelerated BSN/MSN NP program where I ultimately went. I was really focused on schools that would get me to the "practice part" of the NP. Turns out I was miserable in nursing school cause there was too much of the nursing and not enough of the practice part and I was bored and uninterested in the basic nursing. I had a real aptitude for assessment and diagnostic reasoning, patho and pharm and once in the hospital, I saw clearly that I would much rather be the physician and was not at all interested in the nursing job. Since I didn't want to waste my time any more, I took a leave of absence from Duke and really dug into the med school app process including all the science I had not taken and supported myself tutoring and freelancing as a medical writer.

It was really difficult to figure out what it takes to actually apply to med school. For instance I was not aware of the special "post-bac" programs offered specifically for med school and that they include a committee review panel and all the other things one needs to be even considered as a serious applicant. I also did not realize the extent to which I would have to study and prepare for the MCAT. Finally, I ended up taking pre reqs at a very good state school and ended up with A+'s in most of my classes including organic chemistry, physics and gen chem, all of which I now tutor for that schools chem and PY departments. Even though I had to keep my medical school aspirations a secret and could not ask for recommendations from my nursing school professors, I went back to finish three remaining semesters of nursing school and graduated from that accelerated program with a 3.65 plus a 3.9 from my pre-med program.

I took the MCAT while I was still at Duke and that was a mistake cause I only got a 27S (10PS 10VR 7BS) and I knew I could do much, much better. I applied that year to med school and got interviews at both of my state university med schools but ultimately did not get in. I have great travel and clinical experience, awesome (the highest) committee recommendations, I raised my GPA considerably and have a high science GPA. I was told at my first choice school that they just really wanted to see me raise my MCAT and to apply again. So I did. I got a 32R (11PS 10VR 11BS) and I am working as an RN and as a medical writer and still tutor Organic Chemistry and CHemistry and Physics.

I just had interviews at both in-state Uni med schools, the only schools I applied to this year, and I feel that overall they went fairly well. I am now writing a post interview letter of intent to my top choice because I feel that there were some red flag issues that i was not able to address properly during the interview. My interviewer from the committee was really, really tough on me at the top choice school. She demanded to know why I went to nursing school first if I really wanted to be a doctor, as though it was a ridiculous choice. Also "why now?" why so "late" and "how long of a career are you really going to have if you are going to only be starting your medical career now" (I am in my late 40's, but no one I know has ever imagined I was a day over 35, I am very healthy, do tons of yoga and am very youth culture oriented, I never felt out of place in my re-reqs or nursing school) I just said, "well, I don't plan on retiring any time before Im 90, and besides, who can really retire nowadays anyway? I never planned on retiring because the work I do is part of my life, not a job just to make money, I will be active making contributions until I can't anymore or until they drag me out..." (She laughed at that)

Anyway, I feel that now my MCAT is a solid 32S I could be competitive at some top tier schools, and if I don't get in here again, I can apply more broadly next year and have a good chance - what do you think? At this point, I feel like I am already a medical student, at my nursing job, I do my job but I also look at everything from a medical perspective, I try to make evaluations and see how well I do compared to the docs, and the docs often ask my opinion on a variety of patients that come into the ED where I was working, they respect my opinion and I love that.

I know this is long. Maybe part of it can help some others on this board. It is possible to be competitive for med school after years of suffering from a BAD UG GPA... I hope!

Thanks,
Mooshika

 

[REL]

Hello and thanks for all of your help so far! I'm so happy to have found these boards. First I'll give you a little background about me before asking my question (I'll try to keep it short for your sake).

Basically, I didn't know what I wanted to do (as much as I loved medicine, I didn't want to spend that much time in school). I took some time off to work for the Walt Disney Company and NBC/Universal for a few years, then returned back to school. I decided to major in Nursing. I wanted to get my bachelors and go on to be a Nurse Anesthetist. However, after realizing I'd need almost all of the same pre-reqs as Med School and it would also take four years of schooling, I decided to look back into the whole Med School thing. Well, now that I'm actually IN nursing school, I really don't feel right. I don't think like a nurse. I don't enjoy the lack of science knowledge needed in the profession. My science grades in the Bio department are fantastic and I've finally decided once and for all to pursue Medical School. I have lots of volunteering and clinical experience and am starting to shadow physicians.

My main question I guess is how do Admission Committees view Nursing as a major? I'm trying to decide to stay in Nursing and do Med School pre-reqs alongside it, or to just switch to a different major. Our pre-health advisor says that your major should be your Plan B...something you would want to do if you didn't make it in medicine. I love hospitals and learning about the human body and disease processes, so I would probably go back and get a nursing degree if all of my attempts at med school failed. I've heard that holding an RN can be seen as a positive and a negative depending on the school...but this has all been hear-say from Biology Pre-med majors.

So far my grades are above decent, especially in science. I have it planned out so that I'll have all of my med-school pre-reqs (plus some extra science) done by the time I've graduated with my degree in nursing, but I would hate to continue on if being in a Nursing program could hurt my chances.

Thanks so much for your help in advance.

Thank you for your inquiry. You need to be comfortable with answering the inevitable question during an interview: "So if you wanted to become a doctor why did you become a nurse?" As you pointed out the actual basic science academics of an nursing degree is often much "softer" in most circumstances which causes them to generally struggle on the MCAT. The biggest benefit of a nursing degree would be that you had some clinical experience, but usually that means that you have been a nurse for awhile in the field. Working as a nurse is a good thing for experience and understanding patient care. Most medical programs want to understand your capabilities in the clinic and your motivation for medicine with a consistency of medical volunteering in a clinical environment as well as some physician shadowing---nursing reduces the need for the shadowing, but not the volunteering. Also needed is a consistency of community volunteerism, teamwork, leadership, and some basic science lab research is very helpful but not usually a stated requirement. It would be good to bring strong academics (3.7 SGPA and overall are average entry stats of a med school class in Florida; and the MCAT usually averages over 30 for entering classes). So now, evaluate why nursing? If you can get the prereqs as well as other solid basic science course work in your nursing degree, and to the extra-curricular stuff, you might have a good experience for an admissions committee, but you'll still have to answer the question. There can be good answers to this question. I wish you well.

 

[REL]

Is kinesiology considered to be "a basic science discipline" or are you referring to sciences such as neuroscience, physiology, etc?

Also do adcomms see a difference between a specialized masters program (smp) vs. just a regular masters program in terms of showing a willingness and ability to do well in more challenging basic science coursework in order to make up for a very low undergraduate gpa?

You would best be served by a regular, full-time MS in a core science area where you are taking the course work that will help you on the MCAT as well as in medical school. I generally advise against the SMP's in your situation, especially IF that program is pitting you in the classroom with medical students. To me that is your last gasp, silver bullet attempt to show your value. If you outshine 2/3's of the med class you have helped yourself, if not it will be a long road.

 

[REL]

Hello, I guess I am just looking for some informed input about how much weight my "extra" stuff will carry when I apply to medical school. First I am a paramedic with some street work experience. I am also in the military and I work in special operations doing medicine only. I have a great deal of medical experience and when I am overseas I work close to the level of a PA. I have not yet taken my MCAT and my undergraduate grades are not stellar (my graduate MPH and undergrad paramedic gpa's are 3.9 though). Will this experience make any significant difference in my application? Any retired 18Deltas, Seal corpmen, PJs in med school out there with less than great grades? How much will my experience help? Could I pull off an admission with a 28 and 3.2? Just wondering?

First as a 21 year retiree of the military, I commend you for your service. Med schools will react differently to your application. You should look at the annual AAMC produced MSAR (Med School Admissions Reqs) to research programs that are non-traditional friendly for one. Your numbers are generally serviceable, though an MPH doesnt really do much for the core sciences --- great complimentary degree though. You would add diversity, leadership, and experience to a class, but weakness appears to be medical volunteerism and community service volunteerism. Begin to add these things and practice interview skills an you will increase your chances. You also probably should visit candidate programs to let them meet you and understand what your application is all about. The biggest thing you may need to demonstrate is compassion and tolerance of others. I wish you well.

 

[REL]

hi, I was wondering what my chances will be at medical school, after I complete a traditional MS degree iin biology and conduct research. I was accepted into an osteopathic SMP, but am deciding not to do it. This is because it is very high risk. It is $40,000+. Whereas a traditional masters degree (in the biological sciences) will be less than half of that. My undergrad GPA is 3.1 and MCAT is 20 O (9V 6P 5B). I was wondering if medical schools will take me seriously if I do well in the traditiona MS degree and do some research. I have already volunteerd at hospitals and used to tutor. My grades have a down trend, but this is due to some personal issues I finally resolved it in my last year of college (Went to therapy-it was expensive). Now I know I didn't do well in the MCAT, but I will definitely retake. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

You will have a harder road than many but if you do really well on a full-time basis in a basic science core curriculum your good trend will continue; follow it up with a solid 30+ MCAT and your chances increase. Consistence of continued medical clinical volunteerism, some physician shadowing show motivation for medicine; consistency of community service volunteering show compassion for others; bring strong teamwork/leadership skills, and if possible a couple of semesters of basic science research. Get letters from faculty and at least one physician in support of your application. Since entry is so competitive you do not have much margin for error. Work closely with your premed advising to select MD programs that fit your profile; visit those who look like the best fit. I wish you well.

 

[REL]

Mentors,

I am currently a freshman in college majoring in biomedical engineering (BME) with a minor in philosophy and sociology of science. My goal is to apply to medical school for a MD/PHD program.
I am attending Illinois Institute of Technology which is a major research university ( 3 semesters of research required for graduation). The biomedical engineering program (4 yrs) does not include all of the premed requirements, and has all BME classes in the last two years of undergrad. I can take the med preq's now in my undergrad years or hold off and take a post bac after getting an BME degree. Right now, I would like to maintain a good GPA should i do the post bac? will it hurt my chances for med school acceptance?

thanks!

Thank you for your inquiry. So it looks like your priority is sociology and philosophy over medical based on your minor. That may be a question asked at an interview? So, for my money, and maybe yours, put off taking a graduation requirement, extending graduation for a couple of semesters and get full-time science academics accomplished. This may also help in the cash department as you will probably still be eligible for free forms of financial assistance since you havent yet completed that first bachelor's degree. Once you complete that BS degree you lose all free forms of FA (Pell Grant, low interest Perkins, etc. if currently eligible.) Maybe add biology minor?? If you decide postbac, you should do it full time at a 4-year institution. If you are not degree-seeking you will be the last to register and that may make it difficult to get the course work that you really need. Hope that this helps.

 

[REL]

I'm a non-traditional student. Although med school web sites usually post a non-discrimination clause, indicating that they are not biased toward the age of an applicant, the class statistics at allopathic schools are very revealing. I'm not aware of many students in their late 30's at the top 50 med schools.

My bio: At age 37, I'm now applying to med schools (at least 30 of them). In my former career, I was an Assistant Professor in the Humanities (I have a B.A. and a Ph.D. in the Humanities, both from top Ivy League schools). My cumulative undergraduate GPA is 3.83 (this includes all of the post-bacc courses I've taken, which I was told by AMCAS would be included in the cum undergrad GPA). My science GPA is 3.92. I will be taking my first MCAT soon, but I'm not very optimistic about getting a decent score (based on the practice tests I've taken). What would my chances be if I were to get in the 28-30 range? I'm shooting for a 30, and anything above that would just be a dream come true.

Good question, thank you for asking. First, I am not sure what a top 50 med school is and what resource you are using to determine that. The commercial mags make a huge profit for using some fairly bogus information and some weird ranking systems. I would recommend that you visit a premed advising office and look at the latest MSAR produced by true stats from the AAMC. You can also order one at www.aamc.org. Also I am not aware of any school that discriminates against a qualified applicant of any age, in fact most of us blind ourself to your age; maybe the data that you are looking at is a reflection of a limited number of older applicants? Often older applicants do have some deficiencies in their application because they dont work closely with the premed office. Finally in my state I know that there are older students, 40-50's, admitted to the MD programs over the recent past. Regardless, back to your situation. I like your academic record and the basic science strength, presumably some of it is recent to show that you still "have it." A strong 28+ MCAT will be fine. Now if you have demonstrated a motivation for medicine (consistent med clin volunteering and some shadowing), compassion for others (consisten comm svc volunteering), teamwork/leadership skills, and some time doing bench research (since PhD, this shudnt be a problem.) You will be a competitive applicant at many programs in the nation. Use the MSAR to research the best programs for you. I hope that this helps.

 

[REL]

I just found out today from the last school that I was still being considered at that I most likely will not be matriculating this year in the fall. Needless to say, I felt like pulling my hair out when I found out. I definitely want to be a doctor and I don't think that passion has ever changed or been questioned. I was only able to get two interviews last year and I was hoping to get some thoughts on what to do next.

First, my stats:
MCAT: 33R (V:9, B:10, P:14) in 2008
Major: Biomedical Engineering
cGPA: 3.51
sGPA: 3.43
Residence: IL

Research: March '09 - October '09
I am an author on the paper that finally got done and should hopefully be published soon.

Shadowing: I've been shadowing a neonatologist at a local hospital since 2009

EC/Leadership: Vice President of a business fraternity in college (organizing and delegating responsibilities)

Volunteer: 1 year in high school at a local hospital

I actually graduated in June of 2009 and was fairly confident of the chances of getting into medical school for 2010. Clearly, I was wrong. However, because I was confident, I decided to take a well-paying corporate job working at a prestigious Technology Consulting firm starting in October 2009. The sole purpose of this was to save up for all the debt that accompanies medical school. I didn't even spend my signing bonus because I figured I'd have to return it when I left for medical school anyways. So unlike most reapplicants, I'm not doing a masters or taking some post-bac science classes. I still keep in touch with the researcher with whom I worked with and still continue the job shadowing on weekends. I want to know if taking this job will be held against me by schools or if they will understand why I did it. I also can't just quit and go back to school because a.) I don't have that kind of money and b.) if the medical school thing doesn't ever work out, I'd feel stupid for having quit a job that a lot of IE/Econ majors would kill for to start a career. I am really in a bind here and I was hoping to get some thoughts and advice from people from this forum. I don't post here much but I do read quite a bit and most of the people are usually empathetic and helpful.

Thank you for your inquiry. Your numbers are not the biggest problem. What I did not hear was any demonstrated motivation for medicine or compassion for others. Shadowing is a good thing, you are wondering the halls and seeing medicine from that angle, I refer to is as walking with god. So what have you done for the regular folks? Normally successful applicants have a lengthy and consistent history of medical clinical volunteering; ditto with community service volunteering. Med schools want to know that an applicant can survive the academics, but the also want to know that there is a real person there that can work with others, hence the volunteering. If your science academics are solid, or even a weaker start and a stronger finish, your numbers are not the big problem. I hope that this helps.

 

[REL]

Hello Mentors,

Great thread! I have read through the pertinent sections in this thread regarding my rather paranoid-based scenario, yet I could not find the appropriate post to convince me whether I am still ok.

After finishing my first year at McGill, I did decently well (not stupendous, or what I was specifically hoping for). I took a pretty rigorous course load (which, after reading the discussion boards and receiving NO ADVICE from my open-ended undergraduate advisor, I found that it is useless to take hard courses for no specific reason) and did well in some of the courses. I had a B+/A- for my Accelerated/Honours Gen Chem Course (Gen Chem 1+2 in 1 semester), a B in Mechanics and Waves for Physics+Engineers and a B+ for Electromagnetism and Optics; and A's for both my honours math classes (calc 1+2+3+part of linear algebra is the combined course load in 2 semesters).

My question is this... what happens if I received a D in philosophy of logic course (a second year course) and a C+ in my linear algebra course? This is still my first year, and I did have some pressing issues... if I can raise my GPA over the years to a 3.8 CGPA will i be fine? I am a little frightened...

Thank you.

The good news is that you are in your freshman year and taking difficult course work. This means that you have plenty of time to build a strong upward academic trend and prepare yourself for a strong MCAT. Make sure that you also work hard to show your medical motivation, humanism, and teamwork/leadership skills over the next few years. Do these things and you will probably be ready and competitive for a seat. Continue to work with your premed advising office and make yourself familiar with the MSAR that they can show you in that office. I guess that you are convinced that engineering is your future degree???

 

[REL]

Hi,

Please tell me which case would look better in the eyes of an admission officer. A student has a failing grade in one course but he or she repeated it and got an A. Another student has a C in one course, but he or she doesn't repeat and gets a lower GPA than the previous students. Suppose they both have good overall GPA, good community services, and good work experiences, which one would look better to an admission officer?

Thank you for your inquiry. Thankfully there is so much more to an application than a single grade so this is really not a terribly significant situation. I will say that I personally do not like to see a course repeated; what I would rather see is a 3rd course taken at a higher level with a strong outcome. I hope that this helps.

 

[REL]

Thank you very much for the reply REL.

I have done a lot of humanitarian work overseas during my high school years as well as a lot of clinical internship and volunteering in the Hospitals.

At first, I really wanted to do Biomedical Engineering. When I entered McGill, they closed the undergraduate biomedical engineering program, and made it a "Graduate-only Program".

My future goal is surrounding the MSTP or MD/PhD programs. I have a dream school, Johns Hopkins, and have been inspired by the legends who graduated from there, such as Harvey Cushing, Wilder Penfield, Walter Dandy, and other brilliant neurosurgeons/neurologists/neuropsychiatrists etc.

I potentially want to major in mathematics, while taking various interesting courses (neuroscience and some writing courses). The problem is, it seems I am just scared of messing up. It happens I guess. I mean, my future is fairly dependent on my GPA.

Thank you for the wise words, if I do have any other problems, I shall definitely post.

Thank you for the response. I like one who can work toward a very high level and one who has a dream. I wish you the best!

 

[REL]

Hello all,

I am a 23 year old who is almost done with transfer credits from a Community College to a UC. I will be majoring in Biochemistry-Microbiology. I currently am getting straight A's in all of my classes (Gen Chem, Anatomy, Cell Bio, Calc, Physics). I plan on taking the MCAT one year after I transfer.

I started college relatively late after high school, however I have opened my own cafe in that time, which was a huge endeavor for a 19-22 year old. Also, I have always taken care of my mother who is suffering from a degenerative motor neuron disease (PLS). She is completely bed bound and 99% dependent on me for daily needs.

I am beginning to do some research at my University, but because I take care of my mother most of the time outside of class, I have no time for volunteer/shadowing/extracurriculars. My question is, would this be a hindrance in applying to Med school one day, or will it count as clinical experience?

Thank you

William

Well William you sure do have your plate full, and a goal to boot. These days getting in to an MD program is very competitive, especially in CA. Your application will be strong academically if you continue your trend in the 4-year institution and also get a low 30's MCAT. These things will show an admissions committee that you should not struggle in the classroom academics. I am not sure that you will get an interview if you have not showed the motivations of medical clinical volunteerism and some physician shadowing --- many programs will wonder why med? You havent tried it, in fact you may not even like it. You should also have some community service volunteerism, teamwork, leadership also represented in your application. Finally some programs require some basic science research, many dont. I think you will not be invited to many interviews without these other things. Please work closely with the premed advising office at your 4-year institution, maybe even making contact now to get their guidance. Also look at the AAMC MSAR that should be available in the advisor's office. I wish you well.

 

[REL]

Hey Mentors,

I graduated last August and was planning on applying this summer. Just got my MCAT back and its a 27P. I feel like if I studied this whole summer I could make at least mid-30s by September, but by the time I apply next year I would have been out of full-time student status for almost two years. Would it help my application to take another year and make an MCAT score at least six points higher, take some upper level sciences to raise my 3.65 Science GPA and stay in class, and participate in a research project as well? Or would it hurt me too much to be out of full-time school that long?

Thank you.

I am sure that I do not have enough information here to provide an informed response. Taking time off is common, but during that time you need to continue showing medical motivation and humanism (clin med vol & comm svc). It is also a great idea to do repair work where necessary, such as MCAT and possibly GPA. If your SGPA is 3.65 and is based on at least 2-3 strong semesters of sciences, you should be fine in the academic side. Of course it is always fine to take some full-time semesters (3+ probably gets you a MS) if you feel that you can stay "sharp."

 

[REL]

Hello Adcoms,
Bear with me, for I have a very depressing story. I knew the moment I became an Paramedic that medicine was the career for me. Volunteering in the ER, and working with polio patients in my home country only furthered this resolve of mine. I came into college, MSAR in hand, fresh with advice from senior pre-medical students and former adcoms, and of course, handy information from SDN. My first semester, due to 40 AP credits, I took 18 credits, including organic chemistry, advanced spanish, engineering calculus, advanced biology, seminar in the life sciences, and an arts course. I had AP credits for one year of biology with lab, one year of calculus, and one year of general chemistry and english. At the same time, I was working 40 hours a week, assisting my parents, who had just lost a job, to set up a business, researching in a lab, and volunteering at the local rescue squad.

I ended this semester with an A in calculus, B+ in both organic chem/organic lab, biology and french, and As in my other courses. My gpa at the end of this semester was a dismal 3.44. My second semester I decided to take fewer credits, and took organic II, advanced genetics, an arts course, life sciences seminar, and research seminar.

I ended up with a B in genetics, C+ in organic II and As in my other courses. At this point, I had a 3.4 cumulative GPA. I knew that the job was preventing me from having enough time to study, so I cut down on hours drastically after freshmen year. To remedy my GPA, I retook spanish, organic and genetics, and the advanced biology course and received an A+ in all the second time through (I took them during summer school). IN addition, I was recruited to be the school's guided study session leader for teaching organic chemistry to freshmen and sophomores. I also took two advanced graduate level courses in Organic, that were several times more difficult than the introductory undergraduate courses, and earned the highest grade possible in both classes, earning a letter from the instructor. In addition, after completing my freshmen year with those dismal grades, I had a superb upward trend ever since. My sophomore year, my GPA was a 3.79, despite taking 20 credits a semester, and I earned an A in general chemistry II, graduate level cell biology and a B in graduate level biochemistry I. I am a really curious person, who wants to learn as much as possible. I decided to stay in college for a little while longer due to this.

After my sophomore year, I stayed in college for three more years, and only recently graduated. I took 24 semester units every semester starting my junior year, and took mostly science courses, with some very intriguing arts courses as well. Furthermore, I took 16 credits during the summer, of challenging graduate level biology and biochemistry courses. Every semester I earned a 4.0 with mostly A+ grades, including engineering physics, differential equations, and I am proud to have taken every single graduate and undergraduate biology and biochemistry course offered at my school. I graduate magna cum laude, phi beta kappa, with highest honors, and multiple degrees (I wont mention which for anonymity). My undergraduate GPA was a 3.97 science/overall and my AMCAS (I calculated) is a 3.889 overall/science and 3.97 AO.

You might be wondering, why I am telling you all of this; Well, to put it quite frankly, the grades that I earned freshmen year still haunt me. I want to be a physician for purely altruistic purposes, and my ECs show this with unbridled enthusiasm. But that grade in Organic Chemistry worries me. I would be glad to go to any medical school, but my "dream" school is (according to US News) "ranked" in the "Top 10" (research). My uGPA is quite simply inadequate (at least in my opinion) for these "top 10" schools. The only reason I still hold any hope is my MCAT score. I recently got my score back, and I scored a 40T. This was obviously due to the fact that I took so many intensely challenging courses in the university; the material on the MCAT was very easy to understand after having taking those rigorous courses. Looking at my story, my MCAT and my GPA, do you think that my freshmen year grades (specifically in Organic) and my "B" grade in Biochemistry I, will hold me back from gaining an acceptance into a research intensive school?

Thank You for your comments!

Thank you for your inquiry. Seems like you have a bit of an ego problem and you are putting too much emphasis on the bogus rankings that are printed to make mega-bucks for the companies selling the magazines, but that is not a unique problem to you. Academically you should be very competitive. For a research-based university you should have some extensive undergraduate basic science lab research to be most competitive. You should also have a resume which shows a consistent motivation for medicine (ie. med clinical volunteering over the last several semesters, and some physician shadowing), consistent humanism (consistent community service volunteering), teamwork/leadership skills, and display a genuine passion for medicine. Working as an paramedic is good experience, but it is not volunteering. Just relax and fully explain your medical motivations, humanism, etc. I wish you well.

 

[REL]

I posted earlier in this thread regarding my status and what I am doing. So, I would like to see if anyone has comments for me again, as advice on SDN has helped me over the past two years.

I am a Junior pursuing a B.S. in Biology and a B.A. in Polish with a minor in chem. I may switch the Polish major to a minor to start a new research project but we will see.

SGPA: 3.87
CGPA: 3.82
MCAT:30P Breakdown: 11 9 P 10 Overall 75th percentile.

EC's,
Over 40 hour ER shadowing
2 Open heart surgeries (12 hrs total)
1 Cath lab shadowing experience (6 hrs)
I am not going to shadow anymore, I knew within 5 minutes of being in the ER that this is what I want to do, and I feel as if I have done that sufficiently.

Volunteering:

4 Months volunteering at a free clinic in the Pharmacy with direct patient contact. I fill prescriptions, distribute them, and call pharmaceutical companies in order to get patients free meds. 70 hrs and counting

3 H4H trips, each 10 days long. Two of which I was a trip leader in and I organized getting 15 students from my school involved on a spring break trip. I went to Bogalusa LA to build homes for Katrina victims and the impoverished. Have 2 more trips planned out before application process begins. Made me realize I love serving people.


Research:

1 yr doing ecological disease research on zooplankton, Daphnia Dentifera & Metschnikowia fungus model system. Not the most exciting, but interesting nonetheless. Model systems for disease are tested, and we look at environmental modulators of disease outbreaks such as heavy metal poisoning.

School Organizations:
Peer tutor in Organic Chemistry and Physics (4 mo.): I love teaching, and this was the only way I could do it in the summer. Soon I will be TA'ing a bio class or two which will be fantastic. If I was to ever pursue a career in academic medicine I would definitely want to teach.

MAPS (Minority Association of Premedical Students, Chapter of the Year 2009, been involved since the creation of our chapter so one year): Have held two E-Board positions, helped organize medical school workshops, networking nights, and regional conference trips with nationals coming up soon! Currently treasurer, previously a student liaison. (basically an event coordinator who coordinated med students doctors and premed students to all talk to each other). No I am not a minority nor do I need to be one to care about people's rights. I love people and this was a great way to open my world up. Polish was my first language and my parents are immigrants if that counts for anything?

Any advice would be appreciated. I want to go M.D. and I figured since I am an Illinois resident then I have a pretty good shot at some Illinois schools, of which there are many. But I do go to undergrad out of state and keep Illinois residency. I was wondering what my chances at these Illinois state schools are for example: Rosalind Franklin (Chicago med) , Rush, U of I, Southern Illinois University. I am also going to apply to Loyola, Northwestern, and UofC but those are tougher programs and I doubt I will matriculate there. I am applying to other schools but Illinois is my focus.

Looks like you pretty much have it covered, although I would think getting some additional clinical med volunteerism in a more clinical area would be appropriate. Continue both medical clinical and community volunteerism; not necessarily quantity, but consistency.

 

[REL]

Do we have space on our application to list work exp. and if so are they contacted by the admissions commitee? I am debating having an old boss write me a LOR vs filling in that job on my application under work exp relying on the schools to contact my old boss. Is this somthing I should assume happening? I've been told there isnt even room for contact numbers.

Generally the work experience question is on the secondary application to a program, or at least a general area to provide additional information. Some schools are better than others at checking references. To be safe I would not depend upon the check so if you have something to say, make sure that it is said in the secondary app.

 

[REL]

I had some very bad quarters (5 quarters) during my first and second year at a UC school in California due to personal problems and surgery. I am going to be a 4th year in the Fall 2010. I have 11 C's on my current transcript, 5 of which are pre-med required courses. My college is on quarter system. For the second and third quarter of Biology, I got C+ and C-. For Organic Chemistry, I got B-, C- and C+. For the second quarter of physics, I got C-. I have one more year left at my school, do you suggest I retake the pre medical required courses in which I got a C-, C or C+ in? It won't change my UC gpa but it will certainly make a difference towards my BCPM gpa though. During that whole 5 quarters, I had a knee injury and didn't had the surgery until 1 year later. It certainly did affect me in my studies and during that time I was taking the pre-medical courses. Now that I recovered, I am getting B's and A's in my major courses. What do you suggest?

It is my opinion that retaking course work is not normally the answer unless your major requires higher grades. Also, AMCAS counts every course that you have ever taken, so retaking all of those courses wont do a lot for your total GPA. An admissions committee wants to see that you have "gotten it" in the sciences and often see some very slow starts followed by strong finishes. I would suggest taking heavy loads of solid upper level basic science course work in the remainder of your academic time and doing very well. Follow this with a very strong MCAT to give yourself a chance. While I do not have all of the details of your application, you should prepare to follow your BS with a 1 year full-time MS in a basic science discipline to show continued commitment and strength in the basic sciences. I am assuming that the rest of your application shows consistent commitment to clinical volunteerism, community service volunteerism, solid shadowing, teamwork, and probably even a strong year of basic science lab research (not required, but helpful at many institutions).

 

[REL]

Thanks for providing this thread. Hopefully I can get some good feedback here.

For a point of reference, I will elaborate briefly on myself:

I've been CRNA 2 years. I took all prereqs at CC before I knew I would move on to medicine. Currently, I lack chem II, Ochem I & II, physics I & II. I do have microbiology (B), anatomy & physiology I & II (A,B) from a 4 year and graduate courses in statistics, gross anatomy, 2 advanced pathophysiology courses, medical physiology (all A's). I did poorly in undergrad nursing, as my heart was not in it, with a 2.98 for those 2 years. No MCAT yet.

I have ~150 hours volunteer from undergrad teaching a fitness class in a nursing home, 1 year SGA senator, Organization Board committee, 2 semester undergrad TA for anatomy and physiology lab, and NO research. For fun I play guitar, build computers from kits, and very amateur carpentry.

My GPA (hopefully I calculated correctly):

Undergrad GPA: 3.4957
Grad GPA: 3.8
UG BCPM: 3.517
PB BCPM: 4.0
Grad BCPM 4.0
ALL BCPM GPA : 3.71
UG AO: 3.4375
Grad AO: 3.6789
ALL AO : 3.38
cumGPA : 3.56
Prereq GPA: 4.0

So for my questions:

Should I retake those prereqs I took at CC at 4 year, despite making all As in them? Should I get more current EC, such as more volunteering and research? Will the bad grades in UG nursing hurt me, or will my excellent grad grades help? Any other advice will be much appreciated! Also, any thoughts on UNE online for some of the prereqs would be helpful. I know it's "online," but it is a 4 year university with a medical school and it would be helpful since I am on call from time to time.

Sorry, I dont fully understand regarding the prereqs. If you took them ALL at CC and are now asking whether to repeat all again. My answer would be no, because they were probably done in the last 5-6 years at the CC and you have followed well in grad degree basic sciences. If you only took Biol I/II and Chem I at CC, and you still have others to take for first time, you should continue on with the ones that you have not taken.

You have worked as CRNA to show that you know how to work with patients and get paid for it. What have you done to help others clinically on your own time? You do need to do medical and community service volunteering consistently to make yourself competitive for a med seat. Most programs will give you a "pass" on the shadowing, and will assume some teamwork skills. Still it is good to show these things also. Finally, no to "on-line" course work, most programs do not want them and will not accept them. As you know via nursing, healthcare is a team sport and you need to do the course work in a team environment. Research is not required at most med schools, though a look at the MSAR will show you that a high percentage of those sitting in med seats right now did have some type of research experience -- so it is good to have if you can get everything else done too.

 

[REL]

Hi mentors,
I had spent most of my undergraduate time focusing on academics (I had a double major) and paid employment. On summer vacations I was buried in research work. As a result I did not get any volunteering or clinical work done.
I am now graduated and working as a lab tech while volunteering in the hospital ER as well as for a volunteer organization for elders. I'm wondering if it looks bad that I had no volunteering experience during college and only started volunteering afterward?

Thanks in advance for your help,
-Sharon

Yeah, looks real bad for answering the medical motivation question asked by every admissions committee while they are reading your application. Admissions committees see lots of strong numbers in their pools each year, and if they dont show the consistent compassion for others via medical and community service, teamwork, shadowing, etc., that app falls way behind the others that have similar numbers plus show the motivations.

 

[REL]

For MD Admission
Hey,
I don't necessarily want a "what are my chances?" thread to rise, I just don't know what else to do at this point. I think I have covered and tried to rectify ever problem I have from my undergraduate career thus far. I just want to know what else I should be doing at this point or if what I'm currently doing should suffice while I'm applying.

Okay, so let me explain what I've done thus far -
Graduated from my undergrad in 06 and applied but didn't get anywhere with a 3.2 gpa and very little experiences. I was aware that I wasn't a convincing applicant, so I took time to resolve what I could. I worked a bit as a pharmacy technician for a couple years, then moved to pharmaceuticals. I worked there for 2 years and also started volunteering at my local cancer center. After 2 years I realized I didn't enjoy pharmaceuticals and didn't want to stay with this anymore. So, I then enrolled at the IUPUI pre-pro masters program (the equivalent of an SMP) to basically prove that my undergrad gpa isn't what I can do. But to further prove that, I also took up a fulltime research position at the indiana clinical pharmacology department. I managed a 3.7 gpa while doing the fulltime work, which I think more than shows my ability to excel academically (but correct me if I'm wrong). Now, I'm currently working this same job while also volunteering with the American Cancer Society (Relay for Life). I retook my MCAT in 08 and got a 32Q (V- 10, PS - 10, B - 12). I have new LORs from professors that taught my program and from my PI. I just don't know what more I should be doing. I know I'm probably going all over the place, but I'm trying to see what more I should be doing. I also have a hobby I'm currently doing - writer/artist for a comic book - which I do in my spare time (which I have little time for).

So, in short -
32Q mcat
3.7 gpa from the IUPUI preprof masters (SMP) + Fulltime job
Currently working full time clin pharm research
Volunteer at ACS
Artist/writer for comic book

I think I've cleaned up my act really well, but I don't know if it's good enough for Med School.

You have come a long way while also maintaining fulltime employment. I guess the question I still have is why medicine? I dont think I see any clinical medical volunteering or physician shadowing. You might consider ditching the research in favor of clinical volunteerism since research is not required at too many medical programs.

 

[REL]

I shadowed a couple physicians while I was a) an undergrad and b) in the cancer center while working at Lilly. My main priority while doing research was seeing if it was what I wanted to do. I listend to what physicians told me and made sure I wanted to commit to the long and hard road of medicine instead of research. After all of that, I missed the interaction with people/patients. I enjoyed the diagnostic aspect of the cardiologist I shadowed and oncologist. Research has a lot to offer, but it misses out on the patient/people interaction I enjoyed. I can say I've crossed out research for sure and that medicine is what I want. I'm glad you pointed out the clinical volunteering because I was worried that about whether or not I should take it up in addition to my relay for life volunteering. Thank you!

Good news. Thank you for clarifying.

 

[Moebius]

Dear Mentors,

It is absolutely an honor and a privilege to be able to have the opportunity for you to read this. I know every mentor here is very busy and I would understand if I do not get a reply. I have read this thread thoroughly and a couple of others as well by other mentors. I hope you will be able to offer me some advice. After reading these threads and numerous MDprofiles, I am a bit confused. I am very committed to this goal and I won't give up regardless of the current situation. Please be brutally honest and not hold back. Every word and clear will help me reach my goal and be a good reference to future hopefuls.

I started to college as an idealist and completely unaware of the challenges it takes to develop self discipline and maintain a good GPA. I have improved my GPA every semester/year. However, due to two very poor grades in Chemistry I & Orgo I and a very weak start, I have a cum GPA of 2.9. My science GPA is even lower at 2.8.

I went from mostly Cs, first year to mostly Bs second and mostly B/B+ in my third year. However, I counted that I only had 2 As in my science courses and I did poorly in biochemistry. I know currently it is very poor 2.8/2.9, but I have signed up for 6 science classes [4 upper level and two others are cell biology and neuroscience] next semester and 1 non-science public internship totaling 20 credits. I plan also to take another 20 credits, all upper level science classes the following semester. If I do well, GPA>3.8 and a very high MCAT, would it be possible to offset the weak GPA for my first 2 years including 2 summer sessions. If I do well, I could raise it to around low 3.1/3.2. Would this be enough or would I still have to pursue a SMP? Thank you!

 

[avodemas]

Hello,
I am hoping to get some advice on how to improve my chances of getting into a medical school. This will be a little lengthy, so I apologize in advance.

First, a little about me. I immigrated to the US 12 years ago after completing 2.5 years of medical school abroad with excellent grades. The decision to abandon my dream of becoming a physician was difficult but my family had leave the country in order to save our lives. Both of my parents and my paternal grandparents were physicians. I was exposed to medicine from a very early age and, while I have contemplated other career options throughout high school, I found my true calling in medicine.

I transferred most of the credits to a state university and completed the remaining degree requirements as a full-time student within 2 years while working 3 jobs to support my family (my father was studying to confirm his MD and my mother battled a serious illness). I followed the premedical curriculum, however, my grades suffered due to the fact that I needed to work to support my family and pay out-of-state tuition. I received C- in Orgo I and II, C+ in Biochem and B- in Physics after having aced them in medical school. Overcoming early language difficulties, not having clear guidance on the process of medical school admissions and being new to the country, I thought that I could make up for a low undergrad GPA with a strong MCAT score. I was hoping to be able to continue my medical education a few years after my arrival into the US, but was unable to do so due to the fact that my application for permanent residency took 7 years to be processed.

At the time, I really thought that my dream of becoming an MD had been crushed and decided to pursue a career in public health. As a result, I completed a rigorous MPH program in 1 year with a 3.8 GPA and have worked in epidemiologic research for the past 8 years, coauthored a few papers, and am currently a lead on one. During that time I also started a family and almost accepted the fact that I could find fulfillment in my public health career. However, I simply cannot give up on my dream of becoming a physician. I interact with patients daily as part of my research work and enjoy that aspect of my job the most.

My stats:
Age: 30
2.5 years of medical school abroad
cGPA (excluding 2 years of transfer credit): 3.2 (improved from 2.9 to 3.9 b/w first and last semesters)
Master's GPA: 3.8
currently studying for MCAT.
Residence: NJ
Citizenship: USA

What are my best options for getting into a medical school?

Option 1: Complete a SMP (I was recently accepted into a Masters of Biomedical Science program and am slated to start in September) with a strong GPA, get a high MCAT score and explain my low undergrad science score in the application.

Option 2: go back to a community college and retake Chemistry and Physics courses, get a high MCAT score and apply then.

Option 3: Combine options 1 and 2 and do both.

I really do not want to go to a Caribbean medical school, but am willing to consider it as my absolute last resort.

Any of the above options would put me at 32-33 years old at the time of application. It doesn't leave much time for trial and error, I really want to make sure I am doing the right thing.

Thank you in advance for your time and I apologize for a lengthy message.

 

[lacicco3]

Hi,

I will be a junior in the fall of this year. I am pre-med and a member of the D1 womens lacrosse team at a Top 20 program. I am currently seeking guidance about the best time to take my MCATs and a reasonable time to apply to medical school that would offer me the best chance of getting in.

Going into college I thought that I had wanted to go to medical school but after four weeks or so I decided to stop doing what I was doing. I withdrew from calculus and stopped studying for my classes. Long story short, I chose to focus on more on lacrosse and going out then I did on my school work. As a result I think I ended that year with a 3.4 GPA.

The summer going into sophomore year I recomposed myself, realized my goals and set forth to continue to pursue my goal. I received A's in all of my classes except for Calculus. (Calc 1: b-, Calc 2: c, Calc 3: b+). No matter what I did I could not seem to perform well on my calculus tests and let me tell you, those C's will do a number on an already sub-par GPA. I foolishly tried to handle too much during lacrosse team. I currently have a 3.5 GPA.

This year I plan on taking my MCATs in january and I do not want to have to delay my application any more than I need to. (If practical I would really like to go right to medical school without waiting a year.) It does not make sense for me to take them in the spring or through June or July as my life will be consumed by lacrosse. This fall quarter I am only carrying three courses and research so dedicating those extra hours to study time for the MCAT (im hoping) will be doable.

As I said I jumped on this bandwagon towards the end of the summer going into my sophomore year. It was not practical for me to volunteer during the school year while juggling a full course load in the middle of lacrosse season. I have spent this summer volunteering in the SICU of a hospital 2 days a week and am shadowing a cardiothoracic and trauma surgeon. I am the entertainment chair and a team captain for relay for life and looking into becoming an advocate for the american cancer society. I am hoping to continue volunteering at the fall (even if it be 4 hours every two weeks) and over winter break I am hoping to gain more shadow and volunteer experience. As far as work work goes I work at Maggie Moos and have coached for what will be three years now.

I am stressing out that I am behind on everything and am just looking for some guidance as the best time to apply. Would it be best to wait a year? Could I gain acceptance to a medical school of my choice if I continue on my path now (especially if I, fingers crossed, receive a high score on my MCAT?)

 

[REL]

Hello Adcomms,

I just had a question. Throughout my undergraduate career so far, I have gotten all A's and B's and one C. The one C was in Honors Microeconomics. I'm a biology major with a minor in economics and chemistry. Should I retake Microeconomics so they know I tried or. . . . let it be because it isnt a major pre-med BCPM class. let me know. btw im an upcoming junior

Thanks.

Thank you for your inquiry. Just leave it alone, it is rarely a good idea to retake course work unless you can strongly justify it. One C should not be a problem. Make sure that you do well in the rest of your academics and also show consistency in your motivations etc.

 

[premedstudent8]

I graduated from an ivy league university with a 2.85 ugpa in bio. I decided that medical school was not for me and decided to explore other options. I did some research for the next 2 years while obtaining a biotech degree from Harvard Extension School. I graduated with straight A's. I am attending a top M.S./M.B.A. program originally wanting to continue on a biotechnology path (M.S. in biological engineering). I currently have a 4.0 gpa. I am entering my second and final year of the program. This past year I have become more interested in the original medical school path. I took the MCAT recently and scored a 44T. Over the past 3 years I have also taken a number of upper level math and science courses at the Harvard Extension School for undergraduate credit which raised my cGPA to a 3.14.

In summary my stats are:
UgGPA: 2.85
cGPA: 3.14
gradGPA: 4.0
MCAT: phys 15, bio 15, verb 14, Writ T

My extra stats (If they matter at all with the ugpa)
I have 23 research publications (mostly molecular biology some clinical research) and presented at 12 meetings, I went on 4 Doctors without Borders missions, have some EMT training/shadowing, 790 GMAT score, and am a award winning jazz musician. (my biggest issue in college was over extension).

I was just wondering if I had a shot at getting into a decent medical school. I really worked my butt off these past 3 years trying to open up my options. Should I take some of the premed courses that i didn't do well in at college over or should I just apply and see what happens? Should i just stay away from the med school path completely because of the UgGPA? Any advise would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks!

 

[TheHuggingDr]

Hi!

I graduated from a four-year, small, liberal arts college in May of '09. I'm a first generation college student, URM, and McNair Scholar. I'm a late bloomer when it comes to medical school. I always wanted to be a doctor, but I was always terrified of not being "good enough." Only during my senior year, did I decide to pursue medicine. My cGPA is 3.39, sGPA: 2.95, nonscience GPA: 3.72. My GPA trend shows that I started strong, fell during my sophomore year, and gradually climbed to a decent GPA my senior year. I did research for a professor every year and every summer of college. I was even hired to do cancer research for 3 months in Japan. I volunteered and shadowed a physical at an FQHC for 160+ hours my senior year, and was employed full time as the community outreach coordinator for the same clinic during the year after my graduation. I took the MCAT in May 2010, fully unprepared, and received a 23M (VR: 10, BS: 7, PS: 6). I'm absolutely certain that I can get within the 30 range of the MCAT with proper preparation. (I studied alone while working a full-time job and dealing with some heavy personal issues. It was a bad time -- but I've had MANY bad times during my undergraduate career, hence my sub-subpar GPA.) I decided to take some time off and "get myself together" mentally/emotionally, and moved to a new city to do some maturing.

My question is, what should my next steps be? I'm volunteering/working at the Boys and Girl's club, while seeking volunteer opportunities at senior centers and hospitals. I'm very low on funds, but I have some benefactors willing to fund a Kaplan course to help raise my MCAT. Other than getting my MCAT scores up, what else should I be doing? I have some professors who could write me stellar LORs, but I received less than an A in their class. (Most of my science courses are within the B- to B+ range with a few A's). These professors would be able to help explain my struggles during school as well as my aptitude for science and my passion for medicine. Do you think this will help? I can also get great LOR from the physicians I shadowed and worked with at the clinic.

I'm really at a loss --- I've called schools and contacted advisors, and I'm not able to get really specific or clear advice. I can't imagine doing anything else with my life... I don't just want to be a physician, I'm called to do this work. I just really need some guidance about how to get there. Thanks for taking the time to read this and respond.

 

[phantom2250]

I had a few questions in regards to volunteering, shadowing, and extracurriculars.

Is it okay to include non-medical related volunteer information? I currently volunteer at my old high school and help coach students on the speech and debate team. Speech and debate is something that I'm quite committed to (I still do it currently) so I thought it would be good to include this volunteer information, but I don't know if it's actually worthwhile listing this information.

In terms of medical related volunteering I haven't been able to do much during my undergraduate career so far. I plan on volunteering for a month (probably about 120 hours) or so next summer at a local hospital at which I volunteered for quite sometime when I was in high school. Is that amount of clinical volunteering enough? I would like to do more volunteer work, but I want to shadow the doctor that I shadowed this summer a few more times, which limits the time I have to spend volunteering. I found that shadowing was a much more meaningful experience than volunteering, which is why I'm more inclined to keep shadowing as opposed to volunteering at the hospital.