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Men's Interview Clothing #2

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by Caesar, May 26, 2010.

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  1. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    [​IMG]

    Herringbone tweed suit for the cold weather. Can't really tell if that is herringbone, my eyes are dilated.
     
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  3. Kalyx

    Kalyx 5+ Year Member

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    Hmmm... that seems to be a skinny tie. But a good width, no?


    ~Kalyx
     
  4. FlowRate

    FlowRate 7+ Year Member

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    The skinny tie works because of the narrow lapels, skinny fit, and overall slim fellow. It's not going to be a deal breaker for anyone, but a more average tie width would always be the preferred advice for people seeking advice on this thread.
     
  5. Barney Stinson

    Barney Stinson Wait for it... 5+ Year Member

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    So I'm in the market for a suit (figured I ought to live up to my handle's namesake) heading into interview season for a job and life in general. I have my share of shirts/ties and a couple blazers but they're all "kid" stuff, and I'd like to start putting together a professional wardrobe.

    I'm thinking about a charcoal/navy suit - or one of each - because, frankly, I'm an adult and I need to start dressing like one, and only having one suit seems like it would get old fast. I'm on as much of a budget as I can be, but I also realize that this is an investment.

    As for the basics, I'm looking at one light blue and one white spread collar dress shirt - classics. Shoes/belt will most likely be black, though burgundy would go with both suits, correct?

    For ties, how do these look?

    http://www.josbank.com/menswear/shop/Product_11001_10050_282052
    http://www.josbank.com/menswear/shop/Product_11001_10050_254180 (in pink)

    The first is my alternative to a plain navy tie - is it too busy? I kind of like the "textured" look it ends up with. The second tie is less conservative, but I like it with a navy suit/light blue shirt a lot since both colors are there and it's a little "different." And all this navy/gray/white gets boring after a while.

    Am I terribly off-base? Any general suggestions given my situation?
     
  6. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    ^ the first tie is not too busy because the pattern is small enough to blend in from far away. The second is nice although I do not like pink ties with a pattern, especially a pattern that busy. By this, I mean pink generally works best plain. I also don't like pink silk. I think pink works best as a soft fabric while silk is a bit too sharp. Pink cashmere or wool.

    But all in all, both are acceptable. I think your choices in suit color, ties, and shirts are all sound investments.

    I personal don't like skinny lapels or skinny ties. The fabric is absolutely lovely, especially so since most people never dare wear this type of fabric. My only gripe is the button point could be slightly higher. But other than the lapel and skinny tie and button point, this is the s#!t. ANd I hate the tie bar.
     
  7. Barney Stinson

    Barney Stinson Wait for it... 5+ Year Member

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    You know, if I'm looking to get the "essentials" here... is there a tie other than a navy one that I should be investing in? Or anything else in general?

    Also, a charcoal topcoat would work with anything, I'm assuming? Or is black the safer bet?
     
  8. FlowRate

    FlowRate 7+ Year Member

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    Charcoal is better because it will pair with any color but a black overcoat/topcoat is harder to pair with navy and anything off of the gray scale, really.

    As for tie, I recommend a solid, light-medium blue, maybe with a simple stripe of some sort.
     
  9. Barney Stinson

    Barney Stinson Wait for it... 5+ Year Member

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    Charcoal with navy is better than black? Man, I really have some learning to do... :laugh:

    I've heard no on red ties, too, at least for interviews... does that extend to burgundy/darker reds as well?
     
  10. FlowRate

    FlowRate 7+ Year Member

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    I think it is. The problem is that navy looks a lot like black, so when people see the two together, it's clashes a little while the eye tries to figure out what's what. The lighter side of technical "navy" can look OK with black but I personally still hate the combo. Charcoal/grey on the other hand can be better distinguished from navy and doesn't blend like black.

    I like burgundy ties. Never really was a red power tie guy, although I do own one that I like. At that point, you're trying to game the subconscious tie color game. The idea is that red is associated with power, strength, and aggressiveness, whereas blue is empathetic, calm, etc.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2010
  11. indesertum

    indesertum 5+ Year Member

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    should i wear a suit?

    can i just wear well fitting blue blazer, dark charcoal pants, black captoes?

    i spy styleforum members here
     
  12. FlowRate

    FlowRate 7+ Year Member

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    I think that's acceptable, but not de rigeur--or really recommended, regardless of the standard.

    I lurk AAAC more than SF.
     
  13. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    If there's a tie that is absolutely required in any acceptable wardrobe, they are the following:

    navy silk with small white dots

    medium gray solid in cashmere or wool (blends with everything from white shirts, to blue shirts, to pink shirts, light purples, gingham shirts, herringbone shirts, houndstooth shirts, tattersall shirts, etc). Gray is the neutral base color to just about every shirt pattern. When I'm in a hurry, I go with this tie. The photo in the first post is probably a good example of gray in a wool/cashmere fabric. The wool can be herringbone if you want.

    navy with white stripes at a diagonal. Only two colors. White stripe skinny, navy portion fat (so fat that it is practically a navy tie with white stripes). If you don't like white, go with a purple stripe or a green stripe. But it should still be in that proportion where there's a skinny stripe on a solid background.

    Three ties, only four colors amongst them. You can't go wrong with that.

    All these geometric ties and tartan ties and flannel ties are a no no for a someone starting off a tie collection. No to paisley as well.

    For interviews and such, also no to gingham ties, houndstooth ties, etc. Unless you know what you're doing.
     
  14. texahn

    texahn Yes 7+ Year Member

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    MDApps:
    do good on your MCAT
     
  15. gettheleadout

    gettheleadout MS-3 Moderator Emeritus 7+ Year Member

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    Would a Mod please move to the active Men's Interview Attire thread?

    Search before you post, OP.
     
  16. MB333999

    MB333999 5+ Year Member

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    lol nice answer.

    i think the suit is fine, i wore a hugo boss shadow striped suit to my interviews. i think it looked sharp.
     
  17. Strawberries

    Strawberries 2+ Year Member

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    N/a
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2011
  18. integralx2

    integralx2 2+ Year Member

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    lol some people are really stupid, and should not be allowed to use a computer
     
  19. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It 7+ Year Member

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    Always Bespin
    I'm sorry, you're Pre-Pharm. We don't serve your kind here! You'll have to wait outside!

    [​IMG]
     
  20. Dude, just wear the suit. So what if it's pinstriped, or has "strong shoulder pads" or whatever. Its not like it's covered in rhinestones and tassels or anything. You'll look fine.
     
  21. Strawberries

    Strawberries 2+ Year Member

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    N/a
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2011
  22. chman

    chman 5+ Year Member

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    Anything less than Armani is an automatic rejection. JK.

    I think as long as you are presentable then you're cool. IMO, I think your goal should be that your clothes are not something they remember about you (good or bad).
     
  23. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    Some pinstripes and shoulder pads are the male version of rhinestones and tassels.
     
  24. SFO-IST

    SFO-IST 7+ Year Member

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    +1 for the skinny ties. They're back in.
     
  25. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    No, they're not actually.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2010
  26. FlowRate

    FlowRate 7+ Year Member

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    Didn't you just prove that they're "in"? The whole fashion v. style thing...
     
  27. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    They were in up until about a month ago. It died. I don't think the skinny tie can last the winter cold.

    I would laugh at my doctor if he wore a skinny tie. And then find another doctor.

    Having a mickey mouse tie says you're fun in that you don't care and you want to put your patients at ease or you have young children as patients. Having a skinny tie says you care but in the wrong direction. Or that you care but have no class.

    It says you put a lot of effort and still suck.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2010
  28. FlowRate

    FlowRate 7+ Year Member

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    Good to know it died.

    Don't take me wrong, I'm no proponent of the fad, which was probably inspired in large part by Mad Men. At least people who copy mad men will look a lot more appropriate than people who copy that 70's show!
     
  29. mishaS

    mishaS 2+ Year Member

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    This got me my first invite

    [​IMG]

    Jesus I hope you're being facetious, dammit I really hope you are. Seriously, if you place so much judgment in clothes on someone's ability to practice medicine, I'd have very serious questions about your judgment as a whole... One of the attending ED physicians at the trauma 1 hospital I volunteered at wore green corduroys that had holes in them regularly, now what is a bit on the extreme side, lacking professionalism, but he was still a good attending as far as I could tell and I'd have him take care of me over a douchebag in a fashionable power tie who knew more about what to wear than how to practice.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2010
  30. SFO-IST

    SFO-IST 7+ Year Member

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    I could not disagree with you more. That being said, I approached this with an open mind; perhaps the people I run into are in some sort of a bubble....

    I then went ahead and checked the GQ style yearbook here for 2010:

    http://www.gq.com/style/week-in-style/201012/style-yearbook-2010

    Every single tie here - except one out of the 30 or so I bothered to look at are skinny.

    I would concede that the photos you posted are of people who look like clowns. Yet I would point out that nobody here is going to attend a med school interview dressed in a pink shirt or a white tie. You seem to have selected for photos of people dressed poorly in order present that as what people in skinny ties look like.

    I'll throw my lot in with the people I see walking the streets of Amsterdam, Berlin, Rome, Istanbul, and the pages of GQ.

    Edit: even the one you posted yourself above is a skinny tie! Do we have the same definition of skinny? I'm not talking as skinny as that one you just posted, but somewhere along the lines of the "herringbone" photo you posted above. maybe even a little skinnier.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2010
  31. BaronVonZ

    BaronVonZ The -$200,000 man 5+ Year Member

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  32. Ventric

    Ventric 7+ Year Member

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    Birthday suit.
     
  33. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    I already said I hated the skinny tie in the herringbone suit. I also hate the skinny lapels.

    The problem with emulating celebrities is that you're emulating people who really don't know much or are doing things with celebrity-dom in mind. I don't think wearing meat dresses and dead swans will catch on. Unfortunately for men, the fads in men's clothing is a little more toned down and people actually do emulate male celebrities.

    If you want to own ties that will last a season, go ahead and buy skinny ties. If you want to look like an adult, stick with normal ties.

    I would also stop reading GQ. Or just read it for the entertainment value. GQ must survive on the "fashion" industry. That means they will advertise for whatever crap that Giorgio Armani is trying to sell for this season. If everyone bought the classics, Armani would go out of business since everyone would own the classics and then stop buying.

    And this is where the skinny tie comes in. The beauty of the skinny tie is that it has a short shelf life. Just like plaid will have a short shelf life. Or those GAP sweaters with the stripe across the chest (remember those?). The industry will give free skinny ties to celebrities that will take them (young celebrities). Then people will buy skinny ties. Then next year, the industry will give free skinny bow ties. And kids will buy that up. And next year, it will be bolo ties. Then it will be fat knots. Remember fat knots and fat ties? And GQ will be there to sell you whatever the industry wants to sell you.

    Even if these items don't have a short shelf life in the fashion industry, they may have a short shelf life in your own personal wardrobe. Sure, skinny ties may look good (in your opinion) when you're young and obnoxious. But what happens when you make partner at a law firm? (If that's possible. Given the personality that generally wears skinny ties and other fad items, I think it far-fetched that such a person would make partner at a law firm). Eventually, you will age and see the follies of your old ways.

    Here's my advice: instead of following fads, why not start them? Wear your pants as a scarf. Instead of ties, try tying a belt around your neck. Hell, why not carry a snake around your neck?
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2010
  34. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    I already said I hated the skinny tie in the herringbone suit. I also hate the skinny lapels.

    The problem with emulating celebrities is that you're emulating people who really don't know much or are doing things with celebrity-dom in mind. I don't think wearing meat dresses and dead swans will catch on. Unfortunately for men, the fads in men's clothing is a little more toned down and people actually do emulate male celebrities.

    If you want to own ties that will last a season, go ahead and buy skinny ties. If you want to look like an adult, stick with normal ties.

    I would also stop reading GQ. Or just read it for the entertainment value. GQ must survive on the "fashion" industry. That means they will advertise for whatever crap that Giorgio Armani is trying to sell for this season. If everyone bought the classics, Armani would go out of business since everyone would own the classics and then stop buying.

    And this is where the skinny tie comes in. The beauty of the skinny tie is that it has a short shelf life. Just like plaid will have a short shelf life. Or those GAP sweaters with the stripe across the chest (remember those?). The industry will give free skinny ties to celebrities that will take them (young celebrities). Then people will buy skinny ties. Then next year, the industry will give free skinny bow ties. And kids will buy that up. And next year, it will be bolo ties. Then it will be fat knots. Remember fat knots and fat ties? And GQ will be there to sell you whatever the industry wants to sell you.

    Even if these items don't have a short shelf life in the fashion industry, they may have a short shelf life in your own personal wardrobe. Sure, skinny ties may look good (in your opinion) when you're young and obnoxious. But what happens when you make partner at a law firm? (If that's possible. Given the personality that generally wears skinny ties and other fad items, I think it far-fetched that such a person would make partner at a law firm). Eventually, you will age and see the follies of your old ways.

    Here's my advice: instead of following fads, why not start them? Wear your pants as a scarf. Instead of ties, try tying a belt around your neck. Hell, why not carry a snake around your neck?
     
  35. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    Like I said earlier, there's nothing wrong with not putting in effort once you're already a doctor. If you want to wear a mickey mouse tie, that's fine. But putting in lots of effort and still failing is just sad. Especially when the effort is so wrongheadedly wrong. If the concern is how to dress for an interview, I expect a bit of effort. And that's what this thread and most of my advice is geared towards.

    If the concern is about coming to work on a daily basis, I expect almost no effort and still look professional. The key is to put no effort and still look good. The only way to accomplish this is simple common sense. And to ignore fashion.

    I think I've already said this in an earlier post but I actually don't care about clothes as you guys think. In fact, I probably own less clothes than every single one of you guys here. I don't even own a jacket and up to about a month ago, I wore the same shoes to class every day. For some reason, being knowledgeable about clothes is somehow considered superficial or shallow. And yet, it is my knowledge about clothes that keeps me from the superficial consumption that most Americans are notorious for.

    What's funny about this thread is that I get a lot of questions and PMs about what to wear. Very few questions are about how to wear it. This means that people are more concerned about tastes but not about the technical aspects of professional attire.

    Taste should be a no brainer. We shouldn't be discussing skinny ties. Or Air Force Ones. The tough questions should be about fit. Or fabric.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2010
  36. armybound

    armybound future urologist. Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    captainnerd, I think the issue is more about how you come across than any advice you're giving.

    I'm an active member on styleforum also, so I know where all of your advice is coming from. I know the members on there who dress really nicely. I also know that the average medical school applicant doesn't have to look anywhere near that nice to be completely adequate. The SF groupthink is not the only acceptable clothing standard out there, especially for people who can't drop $5,000 on a pair of bespoke shoes.

    I see plenty of people on interview day who really aren't dressing well. If we kept it simple and gave them tips that they could all follow, we'd do a lot of good. But going overboard and trying to push 2" cuffs and MTM shirts as mandatory is a bit too much.

    it's hard to get into a sartorial debate with people who don't have the interest or means to follow through with it.
     
  37. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    All my advice is geared towards the admissions process. Everything else is commentary about the sad state of affairs of American consumption practices (aka, skinny ties, Air Force Ones, etc).

    Trust me, if you think kids can't afford MTM, you haven't been playing with their PS3s, designer jeans, Burburry pen case, and their white suits. These are just a few of the funny things I observe at school. I can see the technical aspects of Japanese denim, but the price is still phenomenal especially for marginal returns in quality.

    Did I mention I saw a plaid suit? A green and pink plaid suit. And he wasn't wearing it sarcastically.

    If you read the entire thread, it appears the tough questions have been answered. White, light blue shirts. No red ties. Etc, etc, blah blah.

    Everything else is just commentary and a few still confused people who are pushing the sartorial envelope by asking "are you sure green shirts aren't acceptable?"
     
  38. MeowMeowCAT

    MeowMeowCAT 2+ Year Member

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    Ugh, StyleForum and those people's deep pockets.

    *dreams of having an MD paycheck*

    :oops:
     
  39. armybound

    armybound future urologist. Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    I saw a kid not long ago who did that tie knot where you take the skinny end and reverse-tie the knot. It looked absolutely horrible and stuck out in a really awful way.

    I agree with you that the average American guy doesn't dress well at all. On another forum I post on I was ridiculed for suggesting that black pants, black slip-on loafers, and a black, striped Express shirt wasn't really the height of current men's fashion.

    But on the other hand, SF takes fashion a bit more to the extreme. There are guys who are very traditionally dressed and then there are the Spoos who wear blue shoes and what not.
     
  40. armybound

    armybound future urologist. Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    funny thing is that they almost all seem to be lawyers. my perception of lawyers is that they all make money hand-over-fist for sitting at their desk all day surfing SF and taking pictures of their $30,000 watches.
     
  41. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    They are incredibly successful people. You can only assume that they were all young once and wore abominations like skinny ties and black suits. Then became successful and started buying the good stuff.

    Or they dressed in the classics at each price level that they could afford at each stage of their careers.

    If you read the threads about their homes or architecture or furniture or stereos or food or wine, you'll find that they are just refined people in all aspects of their life. And judging by their fluency in latin, philosophy, art, music, SF is just a place of above average intelligence in a more broad and classical nature.

    Styleforum is definitely not the hoi polloi of pre-med students. Or optometry students.

    And I've sold to many of them and I've Google mapped the addresses that they provide. Some of the addresses are for consulting businesses, doctors offices, lots of financial firms. One was a biotech CEO who had a ridiculously large home not far from my home (but in a much more affluent area). So they're not all lawyers. Lots of iBankers.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2010
  42. snowtoday

    snowtoday Banned

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    whole fashion style??
     
  43. Perimeter

    Perimeter 5+ Year Member

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    Lol @ captainnerd. Clothes are meant to cover the body, keep you warm and prevent you from getting arrested. Your logic that people should be dressing a certain way because other people have to look at them is so outrageous, I don't even have the time to embarrass you.
    I can't believe I actually read these crazy people's posts. :laugh::laugh::laugh:
     
  44. FlowRate

    FlowRate 7+ Year Member

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    Fashion - trends
    Style - classic

    Clothes are social power. It's an important concept in business, medicine, and polite society.
     
  45. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    Is that why we wear tunics of wool all the time? Why not ride a horse? Instead of filet mignon, why not grind it up with the cartilage and eat hamburger patties all day? Cartilage has nutritional value.

    I love the ultra-rationalists. Science people...

    Does your neighbor come over to your yard and sh!t in it? Why invent the toilet when sh!tting in your neighbors' yard has the same economic value? It doesn't hurt me and I have more free time than time sitting around inventing the toilet.


    Polite society, what is that? Is that like when you decide to NOT sh!t on your neighbor's yard?
     
  46. Hah

    Hah 5+ Year Member

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    Gosh that suit is a little too tight... It looks like the button is going to pop off like a bullet if you move even an inch.

     
  47. FlowRate

    FlowRate 7+ Year Member

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    Something like that. We even clean up our own crap sometimes.
     
  48. Kalyx

    Kalyx 5+ Year Member

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    I would just like to put in my 2 cents for NOT wearing a black suit, if possible! Of course, if you have a black suit that makes you feel like a million bucks, by all means wear it, as your self-confidence on interview day is what's most important. However, I was shocked to see the number of people wearing black suits and those who didn't stood out in a good way.

    There was one gentleman who was wearing a medium-gray suit that looked great, but unfortunately his shirt and tie choice weren't so sound. I also saw a fellow with a nice navy suit, but he had on this strange club-pattern tie that did not seem at all appropriate for the suit (or purpose of the occasion).

    And ladies, please make sure to wear blazers and skirts of matching material if you're going to mix different separates.

    ~Kalyx
     
  49. KickedOut

    KickedOut Really Worried 2+ Year Member

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    MDApps:
    So, for Christmas I received 3 new suits (part of the Jos A. Bank buy 1 get 2 free deal). Gray, navy, and black and all part of the Traveler's series (tapered jacket, plain front pants). So, 3 questions:

    1) Where should my pants sit when I get them tailored? The last suit I had tailored I was with my dad. They pants were pleated and, honestly, I feel like a man in his 40s with them on (no offense to anyone is their 40s!). I don't want them "low" but also don't want them too high. What's a good rule of thumb on where they should sit?

    2) Suspenders? Yes or no? I like them under certain instances, but all the suits I received are two button. Will obviously being able to see the fact that I don't have a belt on be a problem? Where should the buttons go (inside or out)? Is there a rule when pairing suspenders and a tie (or even a pocket square too)?

    3) Navy suit shoe color. I'm former Air Force and our dress uniform was navy slacks with black shoes. I'd like to break out of that every now and again. How dark should brown shoes be (if they are allowed at all)?

    Bonus question: If I were to go to Brooks Bros. and get 3 new shirts I was thinking (1) white (needed for black suit), (2) light blue, and don't know what my third selection should be. Any input?

    I'm just now learning how much I like looking sharp when I need to, so thanks for any input!
     
  50. armybound

    armybound future urologist. Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    your pants should sit on your natural hip. basically just put them wherever they're comfortable. if the rise isn't long enough you'll know and you'll have to sag them a little.

    you can wear suspenders if you want. or a belt. nobody will care, though I do believe your pants will have belt loops but no buttons for suspenders, so that might look weird without a belt. I'd hope you wouldn't wear anything that really sticks out in a negative way. I haven't seen anybody wear a pocket square yet but it's not like you couldn't as long as you don't do a crazy fold and it's not something that sticks out. white linen would probably be a good idea.

    I prefer dark brown or shell shoes with navy.

    White and light blue shirts are good and would go well with any of your suits, though the light blue/navy combo wouldn't be my favorite. I personally buy shirts in either white or light blue and that's it. Then I buy ties in colors that I know will go well with either (red, maroon, navy, blue, brown, etc) so color coordination is really easy. So in your case I'd probably buy a white one and a couple light blue, though I'd probably wear the white one at the interviews.

    if I were you I'd try to wait until BB has their next sale. they just moved their shirts up to $88 a piece / 3 for $210. It's not uncommon for them to go on sale for 3 for $160 or less. I just bought 3 for $135 during their after-Christmas sale. I also would say to look at their Ainsley collar... but mainly because I hate point collars
     
  51. captainnerd

    captainnerd 2+ Year Member

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    1
    Aug 20, 2008

    If you have to get a third shirt color, get light pink. But if I were you and just starting off, get another white. You'd be amazed at how nice white is. Try to get white oxford, which is the thick weave. It looks and feels heavy and looks so much better than pinpoint or broadcloth. It is also much less translucent. In fact, try to get the light blue and light pink in oxford cloth as well. The cloth looks like a basketweave pattern upon close examination.

    Suspenders should only be worn on pants made for them (split-back and internal suspender buttons). If it has belt loops, wear belts.

    As for blue, blue should be worn with brown exclusively. Or with gray suede if you're feeling adventurous.
     

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