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Mention sports fandom in secondary?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by steeeeveo, Aug 18, 2015.

  1. steeeeveo

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    The question basically asks why this school/city. I am leaning towards no, but it seems like it could potentially be worthwhile. I'm curious to see if anyone has done something similar. If I was going to write something, it would probably be just a sentence.

    FWIW, I am a huge fan.
     
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  3. WingedOx

    WingedOx Unofficial Froopyland Forum Mod.
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    I wrote about watching sports in one of my secondaries, though it was unrelated to the city in question. Seemed to work for me, ironically enough.
     
  4. cardzkp

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    Hahahahaha I am a huge fan of a team that plays very close to the school I applied to. I mentioned it at the end of the essay in one sentence as a way to wrap it up. I have to imagine that the people who live there appreciate the honesty.
     
  5. 282NC

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    I think this is a good way to do it, if you end up including it.
     
  6. ac62994

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    "Why this city?" - Appropriate
    "Why this school?" - Not so appropriate
     
  7. cardzkp

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    I don't think mentioning it would harm his application at all... or maybe I'm just biased because I did it myself. ;)
     
  8. Cyberdyne 101

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    I live in NYC, yet I'm a fan of the Bay Area sports teams (Giants, Warriors, 49ers, etc). If I'm ever fortunate enough to land an interview at a Bay Area school (yeah I realize it's a pipe dream), I'll most likely mention this tidbit during the actual interview. I'm not sure how this would work in a secondary though.
     
  9. ac62994

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    I overlooked OP's line about just writing a sentence about it (I'm so gonna bomb CARS :().

    I stand corrected. I say go for it!
     
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  10. hemobrobin

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    One of the optional prompts for the U. of Miami Miller was about sports involvement and fandom, and I went into great detail about why the Pelicans and Saints are far superior sports teams in general compared to the Dolphins and Heat.
     
  11. steeeeveo

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    Definitely. I'll include it.


    It happens to the best of us!

    Seriously? Haha that's awesome. Also, the Pelicans have stunk for a long time, so that probably didn't go over very well! And the Aints will stink this year. (I'm a Panthers fan ;))
     
  12. Law2Doc

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    I'd be cautious about specifying a team because inevitably there will be a guy on adcom who is a fan of a rival team. He won't explicitly hold it against you but subconsciously he might associate you with some of the ill feelings he has for that opponent. Think about the guys who get shot outside of sports stadiums for wearing the "wrong" jersey each year -- it bothers people. Fan is derived from "fanatic" for a reason. So I think it's fine to enjoy sports, to play sports, to enter fantasy leagues and the like but in general it's best to keep your team allegiances under wraps.
     
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  13. Catalystik

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    I will agree that if the question was "Why this school?" then fandom should not be reason number 1 or 2, but would be OK in spot number 5 or 6.
     
  14. Law2Doc

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    If you have 4 better reasons I'd probably focus more on thoses and not even bother mentioning reasons 5 and 6.
     
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  15. Strudel19

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    I love this.
     
  16. Goro

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    Imagine you're an Adcom member, at, say, U Pitt reading this:
    Q: "Why attend U Pitt?"
    A: I'm a huge Steelers fan


    Don't you think the word "superficial" might be the first thing in the Adcom members mind???????

     
  17. steelersfan1243

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    WTF, now you tell me Goro???
     
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  18. steeeeveo

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    I didn't think it might come off as superficial until you said so. It does seem kind of superficial, now that you mention it. The only reason I was tempted to include it because I always read about schools wanting to know more about the individual. I thought it could be a nice change of pace from the usual "why this school/city" responses.

    Now I think I'll leave it out.
     
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  19. steeeeveo

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    LOL
     
  20. steeeeveo

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    Very good points here. Counterpoint: do you think an adcom can realize these are the dumbest of fans, and maybe some would appreciate the aspect of the applicant? I'm not sure they would link the most extreme/dumb fan with an applicant because they root for the same team. If they think this, then what other generalizations are they making? Also, I don't think educated fans harbor any ill will towards other team fans. One of my best friends is a fan of the rival team and we constantly give each other a hard time about our favorite teams.

    I don't mean to argue, I'm just playing devil's advocate.
     
  21. heebeejeebies

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    Let's say you're applying to a school in Boston and you love the Sox, but it just so happens the adcom reading this essay grew up in NY and is a die hard Yankees fan...
     
  22. beeboops

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    I think this is something that is more appropriate for an interview if and only if your interview is relaxed, your interviewer is open to that sort of thing and isn't too serious, and a million other variables. The reason why I say interviews and not secondary essays is because I see the interview as a chance to demonstrate how personable you are and talking about other interests you have outside of academics/medicine is a good way to showcase that. I've brought up my interest in soccer during interviews before when asked about my hobbies. I had one interviewer that played soccer in his youth at a fairly high level, so we were able to talk about it a little bit, and he asked if I had a team. Sadly, the school wasn't anywhere near my team (in fact, our sworn rivals were the closest team), but I thought being able to talk about my outside interests was nice. We're not all 4.0 GPA, 45 MCAT automatons after all :rolleyes:
     
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  23. steeeeveo

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    Ha! Very good points. I'll leave it out, but I'll be very eager to mention it if I am lucky to get any interviews.
     
  24. Law2Doc

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    Again, I don't think a guy would overtly have a problem with you being a fan. But a lot of his feeling about your application will come from his subconscious. And this could rub someone the wrong way.
     
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  25. Law2Doc

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    I still think you only mention your team interest in an interview if the guy starts selling the local team you root for as a benefit of the school/city, or if his office is full of pennants and bobble-heads.
     
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  26. WingedOx

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    I mean, let's be honest, would YOU let a Dallas Cowboys fan treat your mother?
     
  27. Cyberdyne 101

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    I'd be more trusting of a Lions fan because they'd have a deeper understanding of human suffering.
     
  28. chocoholicsoxfan

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    Is it bad that in one of the secondaries that asked what I want to do with my medical degree, I threw in that being a team doctor for the Sox organization would be a dream? Of course, I mentioned it more as sort of a pipe dream and talked mostly about the stuff that I think is actually achievable.
     
  29. ndafife

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    I set my "why this school?" Essays to flow from superficial to a more meaningful thing on the school...

    Basically: I like city X because reasons, so I looked at schools there. Upon looking at Med School I found I loved aspects Y and Z about it because...
     
  30. heebeejeebies

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    I avoided dream stuff. I figured those questions were there to judge if an applicant has the right mix of perspective and ambition.
     
  31. cardzkp

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    So further where I think this is appropriate, the question I had basically asked me how I know about city X, my support system, and comfortability with the area. I don't regret mentioning it.
     
  32. WingedOx

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    At least no one has said they want to be the team doc for Chelsea FC.
     
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  33. Cyberdyne 101

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    How does one actually become the team doc for a pro sports team? Does it always require completing a fancy academic fellowship (i.e. HSS, Rush, Kerlan Jobe, etc)?
     
    #32 Cyberdyne 101, Aug 20, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2015
  34. chocoholicsoxfan

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    If you look at the website, under the injury section, you'll find a list of doctors. Generally there are about 20-30 doctors affiliated with each team plus a handful of DPTs. My guess is that you start out by working with minor league affiliates and that sort of thing, and then seniority determines who gets to work with the actual team. I would think that you would apply for the job in the normal way, though of course people with prestigious fellowships are probably more competitive.
     
  35. steeeeveo

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    Hopefully the Sox won't stink by the time you become a doctor. :laugh:
     
  36. Cyberdyne 101

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    This article is a bit old, but it's still an excellent read.
     
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  37. Cyberdyne 101

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  38. Cyberdyne 101

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    @chocoholicsoxfan, here are some examples. As you can see, there isn't much variety here. It appears that training at programs like HSS, Pitt, Kerlan-Jobe, Rush, etc. play a huge role in getting this type of position. I realize this is only a small sample, but I'm pretty sure a more comprehensive list would produce similar results.

    SF Giants: Dr. Ken Akizuki-Lenox Hill, NY
    Warriors:Dr. Isono-Stanford
    Warriors: Dr. Geoff Abrams-Rush
    49ers: Dr. Timothy McAdams-Stanford, Santa Monica Orthopedic Group
    Oakland As: Dr. Jon Dickinson-UCSF
    Knicks: Dr. Answorth Allen- Pitt
    NY Giants: Dr. Russell Warren- Columbia
    NY Rangers: Dr. Bryan Kelly-HSS, Pitt and Austria
    Brooklyn Nets: Dr. Riley Williams-HSS
    Yankees: Dr. Chris Ahmad-Kerlan-Jobe
    Mets: Dr. David Altchek-HSS
    Lions: Dr. Kyle Anderson-HSS
    Tigers: Dr. Stephen Lemos-Kerlan-Jobe
    Packers:Dr.Patrick McKenzie-American Sports Medicine Institute-Birmingham, AL
    Bulls: Dr. Brian Cole-Pitt
    White Sox: Dr. Charles A. Bush-Joseph- Cincinnati
    Lakers: Dr. Stephen Lombardo-Kerlan-Jobe
    Cowboys (sorry @WingedOx :p): Dr. Dan Cooper-HSS
     
  39. WingedOx

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    I guess at HSS they teach a special type of rehab so that lineman are able to commit holding with superhuman strength.
     
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  40. Law2Doc

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    First, teams often market the rights for a hospital/group to be able to say they are the "official hospital of the" X team. Its big money for a hospital to put a sports teams logo onto their ads and website. So some of the fancier community hospitals often outbid the fancy academic centers for the job. Second, in this day and age of sub specialization, there's likely not going to be a single team doc for a team. There may be a renown orthopedist who primarily directs the care, maybe actually gets to be on the sidelines with his trainees/staff, but he's going to have a team of neurologists, radiologists, rehab docs, hand specialists, etc at multiple local hospitals he works with, all of whom can legitimately say/advertise they are official Y specialists for the X team. And none of whom will get to go work on the sidelines. And due to HIPAA that's really all you'll get to say -- you'll never get to come home and tell your wife, kids, friends, neighbors "I just took care of Peyton Manning's neck today, and boy is it jacked up". So that takes a lot of the fun out of it. If you specialize in a sports related specialty, you can try and interview at a Hospital with one of these big shot orthopods or one of the ancillary hospitals he works with, but it's going to take a lot of hard work and luck to actually work a game. Working with college and minor league and arena league athletes let's you do the same job function (and unless you are star struck ought to be enough), but probably doesn't lead to a major league job because of the hospital advertising rights/bidding aspects. I guess the best bet is to end up as a resident/fellow in orthopedics at or rotating through a hospital with one of the local sport team big shots and hope he takes a shine to you and brings you along to work a game or two. I've known quite a few residents who got to work the sidelines, but they didn't go on to be team doctors -- they finished residency and got jobs and had to buy tickets to games thereafter like the rest of us.
     
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  41. ChrisMack390

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    It seems like if you want to actually be employed directly by a team and present at practices and such it makes more sense to become an EMT or physical therapist than a physician.
     
  42. Law2Doc

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    The team doctors tend not to actually be employed by the team. They are independent contractors and often provide services to the team at a loss, because it let's them market better and charge more to their non-pro clients. But if you really wanted to pick a less saturated field to go into these days, I'd say neurology/nerosurg because the hottest issues in impact sports today revolve around concussions and brain damage. But again your role would not necessarily involve being on the sideline during game day, which I think some feel is the glamorous part of being a team doc.
     
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  43. chocoholicsoxfan

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    But would you get a ring if they won a championship? I know the sideline doctors get one, but I'm not sure about the others. As someone else mentioned, teams do have preferred orthodontists, psychologists/psychiatrists, etc. It would make sense that they would get a ring because they are contributing to the team's success.

    Personally, I don't care about being a sideline doc. I would just want to know that I was helping the team to victory in some way.

    But like I said, this is a pipe dream. Right now, my realistic dream is to go into children's rehabilitation.
     
  44. Law2Doc

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    No you don't get a ring unless some owner decides to give you one --The sideline or preferred or official doctors absolutely DON'T get them except if someone makes them a gift. These arent employees of the team, they are independent contractors. If you want to be a ring earning member of the team this isnt a good path. They bid for this contract, and are less a part of the team than the groundskeepers and equipment managers, even though they are certainly in some ways more vital in keeping the product on the field. but if the team wins you may get something financially better than a ring -- the ability to advertise to non-pro clients that you are the official orthopedist to "the world champion" X's. Just like people like to use the same plastic surgeon as the stars, they like to have their knees done by the same guy who worked on the local star athlete. So you'll earn more money and can buy yourself your own jewelry.
     
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  45. WingedOx

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    I did a rotation at Jefferson/Rothman and, yeah, you always knew when the pro athletes were there for surgery because those were the days when there were certain ORs where they didn't let the students get within 100 ft of the doors. The residents worked with the athletes in various limited capacities quite a bit.

    Probably the best story I heard was from one of the residents who was sleepily going through pre-op checks with his patients.

    "Hello sir, how are you today"
    "fine"
    "and what operation are you here for?"
    "[operation]
    "ok good, and what do you do for a living?"
    "I'm a baseball player."
    He looks down more closely at his chart and it's one of the highest profile players in MLB at the time.

    Of course after telling this story around the cafeteria table all the rest of the residents asked him if the chart diagnosis was "chronic asphyxiation."

    They also had a regular outpatient office on the site of the NovaCare facility in South Philly where the Eagles practice. The clinic staff get to eat in the team cafeteria. They let you take one of those clear plastic ~8x8 food containers and fill it with as much food will fit inside until you close the lid (this could be 7 burgers if you wanted it to be) for five bucks. Explains a lot about the NFL.
     
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  46. WingedOx

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    Depends on the team really. Some teams seem to give rings to anyone 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon away from the team. A family friend has a BCS Championship ring from his time doing sideline work as a fellow.
     
  47. Law2Doc

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    The owner can give rings to whomever he wants, but most see a difference in obligation toward their employees versus their contractors. I know former residents who worked with a guy who is the go to orthopedist for a particular recent championship team and was on the sidelines for every home game and he definitely didn't get a ring while the guy who paints the field did (and quickly sold it).
     
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  48. chocoholicsoxfan

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    So just out of curiosity, I looked at all the residencies and fellowships of the doctors affiliated with the White Sox, as an example. (These people were all listed under our front office).

    In addition to Dr. Bush-Joseph, there is
    Dr. Gregory P. Nicholson- University Hospitals of Cleveland, New York Orthopedic
    Dr. Bernard R. Bach Jr.- Harvard, HSS
    Dr. Kathleen M. Weber- Rush, UCSD
    Dr. Brian J. Cole- HSS, Pitt
    Dr. Anthony A. Romeo- Cleveland Clinic, UWashington
    Dr. Brian Forsythe- Harvard, Pitt
    Dr. Nik Verma- Rush, HSS
    Dr. David Orth (ophthalmologist)- Michael Reese Hospital and Medical Center, The Wilmer Ophthalmological Institute, Johns Hopkins Hospital

    A podiatrist and optometrist are also listed.

    I don't know a lot about the prestige of different fellowships and residencies. Are any of these particularly surprising?
     
  49. OllieDog

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    Nothing to add other than this made me choke on my drink. #EVA
     
  50. steeeeveo

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    [​IMG]
     
  51. Cyberdyne 101

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    They all look like brand names to me. I think it's safe to assume that the prestigious programs (in terms of pro sports) have some sort of team affiliation. :shrug:
     
    #50 Cyberdyne 101, Aug 21, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2015

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