Mexican school approved for California dental licensure!

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blotterspotter

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http://bajio.delasalle.edu.mx/web3/contenidos/imagenes/index/odontologia_ingles.html

CODA has now approved a Mexican dental school for licensure of international dental students in California. This disturbing trend in international applicants comes from pressure to graduate those that will potentially work in "underserved " areas of the US. Please write your local politicians and the ADA because this trend will only increase the pool of dentists in the United States and make it even more difficult for dentists to volunteer and help the underserved as we struggle to pay back our student loans. These international students will not go to underserved areas, but will set up shop where they can make the biggest buck.
 
http://bajio.delasalle.edu.mx/web3/contenidos/imagenes/index/odontologia_ingles.html

CODA has now approved a Mexican dental school for licensure of international dental students in California. This disturbing trend in international applicants comes from pressure to graduate those that will potentially work in "underserved " areas of the US. Please write your local politicians and the ADA because this trend will only increase the pool of dentists in the United States and make it even more difficult for dentists to volunteer and help the underserved as we struggle to pay back our student loans. These international students will not go to underserved areas, but will set up shop where they can make the biggest buck.

pshhhh......like so many american dental student and dentist are rushing to work in undeserved areas 🙄...if that were the case there wouldn't be such a lack of dentist in those areas now would there?




i say more power to the mexican students....if american students aint gona do it ..well heck give some others a shot at it...they just might do it....



Side Note:
hey they got some niiccee looking facilities!
 
aa
pshhhh......like so many american dental student and dentist are rushing to work in undeserved areas 🙄...if that were the case there wouldn't be such a lack of dentist in those areas now would there?




i say more power to the mexican students....if american students aint gona do it ..well heck give some others a shot at it...they just might do it....

I think you are missing the point. International dental graduates will not go there either. These places are usually remove desolate areas that people just don't want to live in. No one will be able to survive given the patient pool and reimbursement from the government. You think that international graduates have a greater desire to serve? Show me the study. People are all the same - we look out for ourselves first. Part of the solution is to have mandated residency programs that are state-subsidized to help dental graduates pay back their loans, continue their educations, and serve the under served. International graduates will not make a dent in the problem - have you been to any major city lately? Count the number of international graduates - both medical and dental. Now go into rural America and count them.



Side Note:
hey they got some niiccee looking facilities!
aa
 
I wonder what the cost will be and also if they will see a flood of US applicants (kinda like Caribbean med schools).

I want to practice in CA anyways. Maybe I should drop my spot for the c/o 2012 and apply here instead!
 
The School of Dentistry started in 1975 and nowadays it is considered one of the best dental schools in the country, and since 2002 it's an ApprovedDentalSchoolby the Dental Board of California, as well as being member of the National Council of Dental Education (CONAEDO), since 2004.
In April 2006, the Dental Board approved Universidad De La Salle Bajio"International Dental Program", which is designed to meet the required educational process necessary to comply with the validation requirements of the State of California for dentists who graduated from schools outside the United States.Completion of the International Dental Program will allow the dentist to present the Dental Board examinations, whose passage will allow them to obtain a dental license that will enable them to practice dentistry in California.


i think you're alittle too late
 
ariba ariba andale andale!! 😀

Wow! Typical California mentality of opening up the borders.

I sure as hell would not want to practice in California with all these "competition" from south of the border.
 
Why would the ADA care? The school took out an ad in the last ADA newsletter so obviously the ADA is getting money for this. Usually all the GKAS coverage disgusts me, but this month it was the Mexican dental school that caused me to toss the newsletter in the recycle bin.
 
OP: "Make it even more difficult for dentists to volunteer and help the underserved as we struggle to pay back our student loans."

(1.) Underserved areas need dentists. Patients getting care is good, remember?

OP: "These international students will not go to underserved areas, but will set up shop where they can make the biggest buck."

(2.) Predicting the future is difficult. Perhaps you could help more people by telling the future to people or the world. Our current dentists are not serving a place if it is underserved. If proper numbers of doctors are serving patients, they are no longer underserved areas. Your stomping claim that these new dentists will not do something is ignorant, baseless, and contradicts actual doctor-practice placement research.

Poor OP, so ignorant.
 
They will serve mostly people in their ethnic group.
 
http://bajio.delasalle.edu.mx/web3/contenidos/imagenes/index/odontologia_ingles.html

CODA has now approved a Mexican dental school for licensure of international dental students in California. This disturbing trend in international applicants comes from pressure to graduate those that will potentially work in "underserved " areas of the US. Please write your local politicians and the ADA because this trend will only increase the pool of dentists in the United States and make it even more difficult for dentists to volunteer and help the underserved as we struggle to pay back our student loans. These international students will not go to underserved areas, but will set up shop where they can make the biggest buck.

Take it from a patient's perspective for a second. If you're an American looking for a dentist, would you go to a Mexico-trained dentist who likely don't speak good english? Nuh uh.

The big bucks are already in the underserved. Most dentists just care more about lifestyle and work in the metro.
 
Why would the ADA care? The school took out an ad in the last ADA newsletter so obviously the ADA is getting money for this. Usually all the GKAS coverage disgusts me, but this month it was the Mexican dental school that caused me to toss the newsletter in the recycle bin.

CODA is bowing to pressure from the California legislature. Now the clowns on CODA are looking at accrediting Manipal University in India.
 
OP: "Make it even more difficult for dentists to volunteer and help the underserved as we struggle to pay back our student loans."

(1.) Underserved areas need dentists. Patients getting care is good, remember?

OP: "These international students will not go to underserved areas, but will set up shop where they can make the biggest buck."

(2.) Predicting the future is difficult. Perhaps you could help more people by telling the future to people or the world. Our current dentists are not serving a place if it is underserved. If proper numbers of doctors are serving patients, they are no longer underserved areas. Your stomping claim that these new dentists will not do something is ignorant, baseless, and contradicts actual doctor-practice placement research.

Poor OP, so ignorant.

This guy is totally right. A couple of supporting examples I can bring to the table:

I got lost driving interstate 40 a couple of years ago and ended up in inner city Memphis. I noticed that no American born dentists were practicing down in the ghetto areas. Thankfully there were plenty of Indian, Mexican, and Eastern European immigrant dentists setting up shop down there out of appreciation for their new country.

Recently I was driving through rural Alabama and I was appalled at the lack of access to dental care. . . . until I noticed 3 or 4 Middle Eastern sounding dental clinics that had just opened up. I suppose after winning the visa lottery, those lucky immigrants decided to give back to the country that was welcoming them with open arms.

An then last summer I was checking out the southeast Arkansas Delta and was stunned at the lack of American born dentists practicing in those areas. Thankfully there were plenty of Chinese born dentists setting up shop.

And how could I ever forget the week I spent in the Appalacia. Some of the poorest, most rural counties in the US. I was blown away by sacrifice of this Antarctican contingent of foreign dentists who had rushed to set up a practice there to care for the poorest folks in those beautiful West Virginia mountains.

Thank you to CODA for starting to accredit foreign dental schools so that stories will become more commonplace. 👍
 
CODA is bowing to pressure from the California legislature. Now the clowns on CODA are looking at accrediting Manipal University in India.

Would these be the same clowns that thought opening 7 ortho residencies with 60 spots within 5 years would certainly help with all the access-to-straight-teeth problems we have in this country?
 
Take it from a patient's perspective for a second. If you're an American looking for a dentist, would you go to a Mexico-trained dentist who likely don't speak good english? Nuh uh.

The big bucks are already in the underserved. Most dentists just care more about lifestyle and work in the metro.

Now that is just an ignorant comment. In what universe will a Mexican trained dentists who takes a state dental licensure exam (in english) not speak good english.

I think the original poster is concerned about the competition by increasing the number of dentists. Ultimately, we have to consider the patients and many do not have access to quality dental care. And this is a way that some see to increase the number of dentists. Its competition guys, get used to it...you are living in a capitalistic country.
 
"Would these be the same clowns ... help with all ... problems we have in this country?

The above statement is rediculous.

Perhaps looking at the larger picture will provide something useful.

Consider:
-Physician Assistant similar idea to Oral Health Therapist.
-International Medical Graduate (IMG) fulfills need for Family Medicine physician, similar to dental IMG filling role of rural/underserved General Dentist.
-Now even Doctor of Nurse Practitioners are able to practice independently (did you notice that word) in 23 states, and have a sign out front that says, "DOCTOR." How many patients are going to question that one? How do you think Family Medicine Docs feel about these new rapid-formed Dr's stepping on their territory? If you read, you will quickly come across the topic of Family Medicine becoming a moot point, or headed the way of the Dodo bird.
-Do you think dentistry is immune to following this mechanism?

If dentists had paid attention to distribution and caring for underserved, there would not be a Oral Health Therapist (OHT). OHT is commonly spoken of as a huge threat to General Dentists. Dentists have themselves to blame for allowing the problem to persist for so many years that one day someone woke up at their desk in Washington and uttered something like, "maybe we should train an intermediate person in shorter time to do basic care things, maybe that would help, (thud) ZZzzZZZZ."

Family Medicine physicians (or those with the reigns on keeping more student numbers out of medical school classrooms) also 'asked for it' and the Physician Assistant position was developed in the 1960's.

Perhaps now it is time for the dental field to have OHT, IMG dentists, and other caregivers to work in the places General Dentists fear to tread.

AAFP article here (http://www.aafp.org/online/en/home/publications/news/news-now/professional-issues/20060823imgs.html) shows that:
1.) 49 percent of IMG family physicians were accepting all new Medicaid patients, compared with 40 percent of USMG family physicians.
2.) 73 percent of IMGs reported having adequate time to spend with patients versus 66 percent of USMGs
3.) International medical graduates (IMGs), who in 2004 made up 38 percent of first-year Family Medicine residencies.

Now trying to tease out why certain circles of people show disagreement with allowing IMG's to come work in the United States is more difficult.

-If race or land of initial origin makes IMG doctors seem unfit by your standards, many IMG's are from the US but study off of US soil (Ross, St. George's, Ben Gurion, etc.). Looking at the student profiles of these IMG's-in-training shows many from the US.
-If you can accept the fact that Family Medicine doctors are needed in the US (read: enormous problem from baby boomers), we need to fill this need for Family Doctors. Allopathic schools function with such a glacial rate that they will take decades to match the AAMC's calling to increase student classes by 30%.

If the US healthcare system continues to lure people into Family Medicine as it is now ($113,000 avg income, 60 hour avg hrs/wk), certainly we have only seen the beginning of this trend.

Family Medicine, like glaciers only shows about 10% that is immediately visible.

Perhaps being thoughtful, thinking, or even reading about topics before falling down into racist, juvenile, and otherwise pungently ignorant tones about how these people are bad for patients. Much of the dialogue in this thread is simply trembling about all that prescious & sacred money that your birthright entitles you to.

Patients should be cared for. If patients are being cared for--those in our profession are doing their job.

We have examples of other professions that show us what happens when from over indulging in the spoils, you lie asleep at the wheel for too long. Someone else may come along and eat your lunch.
 
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MONKEYBOY, you cut and pasted only part of what I said and went off on your spiel. My point was about the opening of all the new orthodontic residencies creating a surplus of residency spots under the guise of "access to care." People who need access to care usually need things like extractions and dentures, not straight teeth.

Your tirade doesn't really apply to dentistry. Plenty of dentists (IMGs and US trained) who work with Medicaid will tell you that they have some of the most chronic no-show rates affecting the flow and productivity of the office. Why would the patient value dentistry if it was given to you for free? On top of that, Medicaid has some of the worst reimbursement policies too. Why should I be convinced that an Oral Health Therapist is going to be so generous and treat those patients at a loss? Oral Health Therapists are going nowhere except shiny downtown buildings with plush carpeting and coffee bars in the waiting rooms.
 
This guy is totally right. A couple of supporting examples I can bring to the table:

I got lost driving interstate 40 a couple of years ago and ended up in inner city Memphis. I noticed that no American born dentists were practicing down in the ghetto areas. Thankfully there were plenty of Indian, Mexican, and Eastern European immigrant dentists setting up shop down there out of appreciation for their new country.

Recently I was driving through rural Alabama and I was appalled at the lack of access to dental care. . . . until I noticed 3 or 4 Middle Eastern sounding dental clinics that had just opened up. I suppose after winning the visa lottery, those lucky immigrants decided to give back to the country that was welcoming them with open arms.

An then last summer I was checking out the southeast Arkansas Delta and was stunned at the lack of American born dentists practicing in those areas. Thankfully there were plenty of Chinese born dentists setting up shop.

And how could I ever forget the week I spent in the Appalacia. Some of the poorest, most rural counties in the US. I was blown away by sacrifice of this Antarctican contingent of foreign dentists who had rushed to set up a practice there to care for the poorest folks in those beautiful West Virginia mountains.

Thank you to CODA for starting to accredit foreign dental schools so that stories will become more commonplace. 👍


Look at medicine. In my field, psychiatry, I was the ONLY white, American-born psychiatrist in two county CMH offices, and the only American male in the hospital where I practiced. In Michigan, even in the rural areas, most psychiatrists are Indian, East Asian, or Middle Eastern. Seeing a foreign-born dentist is one thing, but if you have a serious mental disorder, do you want a psychiatrist who has difficulty speaking and understanding your primary language? Do you want a psychiatrist who views your Western culture as weak and pathetic?

My point is not to be racist, but to point out that health care in general is being overrun by foreign grads. Medicine, pharmacy, dentistry, podiatry, and even PT is largely international, mostly Asian, ME, and Indian. What's that say about our health care system? What's that say about our college students?
 
The above statement is rediculous.

Perhaps looking at the larger picture will provide something useful.

Consider:
-Physician Assistant similar idea to Oral Health Therapist.
-International Medical Graduate (IMG) fulfills need for Family Medicine physician, similar to dental IMG filling role of rural/underserved General Dentist.
-Now even Doctor of Nurse Practitioners are able to practice independently (did you notice that word) in 23 states, and have a sign out front that says, "DOCTOR." How many patients are going to question that one? How do you think Family Medicine Docs feel about these new rapid-formed Dr's stepping on their territory? If you read, you will quickly come across the topic of Family Medicine becoming a moot point, or headed the way of the Dodo bird.
-Do you think dentistry is immune to following this mechanism?

If dentists had paid attention to distribution and caring for underserved, there would not be a Oral Health Therapist (OHT). OHT is commonly spoken of as a huge threat to General Dentists. Dentists have themselves to blame for allowing the problem to persist for so many years that one day someone woke up at their desk in Washington and uttered something like, "maybe we should train an intermediate person in shorter time to do basic care things, maybe that would help, (thud) ZZzzZZZZ."

Family Medicine physicians (or those with the reigns on keeping more student numbers out of medical school classrooms) also 'asked for it' and the Physician Assistant position was developed in the 1960's.

Perhaps now it is time for the dental field to have OHT, IMG dentists, and other caregivers to work in the places General Dentists fear to tread.

AAFP article here (http://www.aafp.org/online/en/home/publications/news/news-now/professional-issues/20060823imgs.html) shows that:
1.) 49 percent of IMG family physicians were accepting all new Medicaid patients, compared with 40 percent of USMG family physicians.
2.) 73 percent of IMGs reported having adequate time to spend with patients versus 66 percent of USMGs
3.) International medical graduates (IMGs), who in 2004 made up 38 percent of first-year Family Medicine residencies.

Now trying to tease out why certain circles of people show disagreement with allowing IMG's to come work in the United States is more difficult.

-If race or land of initial origin makes IMG doctors seem unfit by your standards, many IMG's are from the US but study off of US soil (Ross, St. George's, Ben Gurion, etc.). Looking at the student profiles of these IMG's-in-training shows many from the US.
-If you can accept the fact that Family Medicine doctors are needed in the US (read: enormous problem from baby boomers), we need to fill this need for Family Doctors. Allopathic schools function with such a glacial rate that they will take decades to match the AAMC's calling to increase student classes by 30%.

If the US healthcare system continues to lure people into Family Medicine as it is now ($113,000 avg income, 60 hour avg hrs/wk), certainly we have only seen the beginning of this trend.

Family Medicine, like glaciers only shows about 10% that is immediately visible.

Perhaps being thoughtful, thinking, or even reading about topics before falling down into racist, juvenile, and otherwise pungently ignorant tones about how these people are bad for patients. Much of the dialogue in this thread is simply trembling about all that prescious & sacred money that your birthright entitles you to.

Patients should be cared for. If patients are being cared for--those in our profession are doing their job.

We have examples of other professions that show us what happens when from over indulging in the spoils, you lie asleep at the wheel for too long. Someone else may come along and eat your lunch.


This is one of the reasons I left medicine! You are dead on correct. The proliferation of mid-levels, and the quest for expanded scope of practice by non-physicians providers (e.g., pharmacists, PhD/PsyD psychologists, NPs, PAs, optometrists, audiologists, chiros, and PTs) is growing by leaps and bounds. IMGs are dominating every specialty in the US and overrunning medicine, dentistry, and pharmacy. The Dr. Smith of the 1950s is now the Dr. Gupta or Dr. Patel of the 2000s.

Consider:

Pharmacy: the clinical pharmacy practitioner (CPP) is taking hold in many states. These PharmDs with residencies, can Rx under MD/DO protocols, do limited PEs, order labs, and treat patients for some conditions in specialty clinics and medically underserved areas (MUAs).

Psychology: in NM, LA, and I believe HI, PsyD/PhD fully licensed psychologists with additional training (usually a post doc master's) in psychopharm, and a special licensing exam, can prescribe from, I believe, all schedules to treat patients due to the lack of psychiatrists in those areas.

NPs: are now going toward the DNP (Dr of Nurse Practice) degrees and passing themselves off as primary care providers in ALL areas.

PAs: are increasing scope of practice in many states and are moving away from MD/DO supervision.

Optometrists are seeking full RxPs, surgical privis and residencies similar to OMFS, and wider scopes of practice to practice what they call optometric medicine.

Audiologists, who used to earn a master's degree, cried and whined that they do the same job as optos, but only earned a puny master's and wanted to be elevated to "doctor" status. Now, audiologists graduating from school earn an AuD (Doctor of Audiology) degree and are seeking equivalent type of scope of practice as optometrists have. Soon, they'll be looking to perform surgery on the ears, prescribe abx for otitis media, etc.

PTs are now earning a 3-year Doctor of Physical Therapy (DPT) degree. Some PTs even have residencies! They are seeking independent status to have direct access to patients and order imaging (MRI, CT, XR, etc.) to treat their patients. Soon, they'll be looking at practicing physiatry.

Nurse midwives are looking for expanded powers and would like to flood the OB-GYN market.

CRNAs are hoping to displace anesthesiologists.

Much of this growth is the fault of medicine. As an MD, I see the failure in the system and see why these professions are trying to expand. I can see why insurance companies are supporting them in their quest. In due time, it will hit you guys and the RDHs and other mid-levels will seek expansion and will win.
 
It is great to see points from different healthcare perspectives on this topic.
 
Look at medicine. In my field, psychiatry, I was the ONLY white, American-born psychiatrist in two county CMH offices, and the only American male in the hospital where I practiced. In Michigan, even in the rural areas, most psychiatrists are Indian, East Asian, or Middle Eastern. Seeing a foreign-born dentist is one thing, but if you have a serious mental disorder, do you want a psychiatrist who has difficulty speaking and understanding your primary language? Do you want a psychiatrist who views your Western culture as weak and pathetic?

My point is not to be racist, but to point out that health care in general is being overrun by foreign grads. Medicine, pharmacy, dentistry, podiatry, and even PT is largely international, mostly Asian, ME, and Indian. What's that say about our health care system? What's that say about our college students?

Well, there are still white-European "foreigners" like me that are going into dental, but I see what you mean. I took one look at UCSF dental class of '08, gasped twice, drank some water and nearly choked. I even saved the photo so I can look back at it. Seems to get scarier every time.

It's really a shame more Americans aren't going into such fields. I tried my best to convince many of my friends here, but they either don't care or think an associate's/bachelor's is sufficient in this world.
 
The Dr. Smith of the 1950s is now the Dr. Gupta or Dr. Patel of the 2000s.

I know what you're trying to say ProZachMI, however.. maybe its the phrasing here. But just keep in mind that ethnicity and nationality are 2 separate things. There are plenty of Dr. Patels who are US born and educated. Again, I know what you're trying to say.. but I think read in the wrong context.. some may take this the wrong way. 👍
 
California will practically become part of Mexico within 10 years anyway. I praise the legislature for having the foresight and courage to deal with the issue.:meanie:
 
Now that is just an ignorant comment. In what universe will a Mexican trained dentists who takes a state dental licensure exam (in english) not speak good english.

In this universe. Even students at American schools have poor english.

Take it from the perspective of the normal patient. Many have a stigma against those trained elsewhere. (Much like how we have a stigma against Carribbean doctors, even those with higher board scores.) This stigma'll exist for Mexico-trained dentists as well.
 
In this universe. Even students at American schools have poor english.

Take it from the perspective of the normal patient. Many have a stigma against those trained elsewhere. (Much like how we have a stigma against Carribbean doctors, even those with higher board scores.) This stigma'll exist for Mexico-trained dentists as well.
I'm still waiting to see some Mexican dentistry that couldn't be successfully sued for malpractice in America.
 
These international students will not go to underserved areas, but will set up shop where they can make the biggest buck.

Just look at affirmative action at work. When I was in school in a mostly "white" university, key minorities were given several very nice perks such as instate tuition etc. The hope was that these practitioners would return to their communities and serve the "underserved". Fact is everyone I knew in school in this situation had absolutely no plans on returning. While some of these foreign trained dentists may go to underserved areas, I'd guess that they would be a minority.:meanie:

I think it's opening a floodgate.
 
While some of these foreign trained dentists may go to underserved areas, I'd guess that they would be a minority.:meanie:

I think it's opening a floodgate.

Agreed.

However, you put more foreign trained dentists (or even oral health mid-level practitioners/dental health aide therapists/whatever the hell you want to call them) into the mix to set up shop in the metro I would think competition may increase to the point that more dentists may want/be willing to set up shop in more rural areas to save their bottom line.
 
WOW....
Very mature,professional,and ethical discussion,honestly I'm stunned by most of the posts in this thread.🙁
BY THE WAY I'M FROM THE IDP AT DE LASLLE SCHOOL.THANK YOU GUYS
 
People are not picking on the university specifically but how so many states can just pick and choose such random rules.

THIS WOULD NOT BE SO ANNOYING IF THESE STATES WOULD JUST BE CONSISTENT--- ACROSS THE BOARD!

I am so irritated with the ADA right now for their lack of organization in dental politics.
 
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If they are competent who cares? My physician growing up went to Med school in Mexico and he was great.
 
wow, you guys are brutal....seems like there is no space for foreigners or a chance for them to settle in the U.S....so much for the land of opportunity. Really makes me feel that there is no such thing as 'equal opportunity'....just because you belong to a 'NON WHITE' backround does not mean that you are not 'good enough'.....
 
wow, you guys are brutal....seems like there is no space for foreigners or a chance for them to settle in the U.S....so much for the land of opportunity. Really makes me feel that there is no such thing as 'equal opportunity'....just because you belong to a 'NON WHITE' backround does not mean that you are not 'good enough'.....

I dont care about the color of your skin or where your from. What I do care about is the quality of the education and skills taught where you went to school. I do resent somewhat the fact that many foreign dentists go to school 2 - 3 years less then we do (no matter how you add it up this equates to being less educated) and have a lot less debt then most of us educated here in the U.S.. But again the biggest problem I have is the quality and depth of training. Based on the experiences that I have had with most of the students in the international program at my old dental school that quality is lacking.
 
wow, you guys are brutal....seems like there is no space for foreigners or a chance for them to settle in the U.S....so much for the land of opportunity. Really makes me feel that there is no such thing as 'equal opportunity'....just because you belong to a 'NON WHITE' backround does not mean that you are not 'good enough'.....

There is plenty of space. Just complete a 2 or 3 year program for foreign dentists at a US dental school and you will have earned opportunity equal to any other US dental graduate. These programs are designed for foreign dental graduates so to say there is no room is just silly because these spots are held specifically for foreign dentists at a large number of dental schools in the US.
 
I think im being misunderstood....I didnt mean to imply that there is no room in the 'system' for foreign trained dentist, but more so that no matter even if we DO go to school for 2-3 years (which is mandatory and I agree a 110% that education is NEEDED) but that to an average 'american' we will still be FTD's who are not competent.
 
I dont care about the color of your skin or where your from. What I do care about is the quality of the education and skills taught where you went to school. I do resent somewhat the fact that many foreign dentists go to school 2 - 3 years less then we do (no matter how you add it up this equates to being less educated) and have a lot less debt then most of us educated here in the U.S.. But again the biggest problem I have is the quality and depth of training. Based on the experiences that I have had with most of the students in the international program at my old dental school that quality is lacking.

that is why there are licensure exams.
 
that is why there are licensure exams.

Your kidding me right? Licensure exams really only weed out the very worst performers (bottom 3-4%). Its not really about competency. It is not difficult to pass these exams. Its all about patient selection, and even if you don't get the best patients its still pretty hard to fail. Once again let me say that passing this exam does not say that you are competent.
 
Your kidding me right? Licensure exams really only weed out the very worst performers (bottom 3-4%). Its not really about competency. It is not difficult to pass these exams. Its all about patient selection, and even if you don't get the best patients its still pretty hard to fail. Once again let me say that passing this exam does not say that you are competent.

Dud,If NBDE part I and II,add to that licensure exam,make just 3-4 % of your knowledge ,SO I"M TALKING TO THE GOD FATHER OF WHOLE MEDICAL SICINCE.please try to make sense next time.
Best regards
 
I do resent somewhat the fact that many foreign dentists go to school 2 - 3 years less then we do (no matter how you add it up this equates to being less educated) and have a lot less debt then most of us educated here in the U.S.. But again the biggest problem I have is the quality and depth of training. Based on the experiences that I have had with most of the students in the international program at my old dental school that quality is lacking.



There are many ways to Rome...... hahaha

This thread cracks me up . So many people here like to keep the good ol' boys status right?

QCkid you should really do something about your snobby replies , are you saying that only Dental Schools in US have good quality and that schools outside of US dont....pfffff get your head out of your ass man really.

and btw I feel sorry for your school that has such poor admission test.. why don't you give them a hand and tell them to make their test harder.:laugh:
 
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are you saying that only Dental Schools in US have good quality and that schools outside of US dont
I guess I a hit nerve. Did you graduate from a Carribean dental school?
Did I say that schools here were the only good ones? No, where are most of the people from that want to practice here? Most of the countries with good schools tend to hold onto their graduates. Do I think our schools are better then most 3rd world countries schools? Yes, and it just so happens that most of the people trying to come here and practice are from places like India, the middle east, and Central/South America. Not only do I think that the schools are better here but that the quality of education is better here overall. That has been backed up by most of the People coming here to practice from those areas mentioned above both in what they have said to me and what I have personally experienced under Tx from doctors that recieved their educations in those countries. That being said, I have no problem with them practicing here as long as they go through one of the International dentist programs here in the states.
and btw I feel sorry for your school that has such poor admission test.. why don't you give them a hand and tell them to make their test harder.:laugh:
What are you talking about? Like I said, hows the Tajikistan School of Dentistry treating you?
 
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I guess I a hit nerve. Did you graduate from a Carribean dental school?
Did I say that schools here were the only good ones? No, where are most of the people from that want to practice here? Most of the countries with good schools tend to hold onto their graduates. Do I think our schools are better then most 3rd world countries schools? Yes, and it just so happens that most of the people trying to come here and practice are from places like India, the middle east, and Central/South America. Not only do I think that the schools are better here but that the quality of education is better here overall. That has been backed up by most of the People coming here to practice from those areas mentioned above both in what they have said to me and what I have personally experienced under Tx from doctors that recieved their educations in those countries. That being said, I have no problem with them practicing here as long as they go through one of the International dentist programs here in the states.
What are you talking about? Like I said, hows the Tajikistan School of Dentistry treating you?

You didn't say it captain obvious hahaha pleaseeeeee .....but you sure did a good job at insinuating it and then of course you confirmed it.

I think a map and a compass would help you out tons because you are completely lost , Can you please tell us what school in the world wants to retain their graduates??? uh? give me a break man , once you are done with school , nobody gives a s_h_i_t on what you do with your carreer from then on ... or what maybe your school has a special comission on keeping their graduates in the states oh really is that so? wow ! is your school still making sure you don't leave the states ??some school you have man ....could you tell all of us the name of it? :laugh:

Based on the experiences that I have had with most of the students in the international program at my old dental school that quality is lacking.

Sorry to hear that you school has such s_h_i_t_t_y admission test which is probably based on the amount of money these applicants carry in their pockets and accepts students that lack quality 🙁 could it be that it is really easy to get into your school😕


And finally but not least my school in Tajikistan is awsome we get money from a private enterprise that finances the school in many aspects putting everything regarding the program at an optimum level . The patients are very nice and willing to comply to any Tx you give them but also very poor so since their oral health is very bad we get exposed to way more "hands on practice" and rare cases than many schools in US .
Tx here are very cheap if they can't afford it we will help them out ... 🙂
 
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This is my first visit to this forum and i am in complete shock at the complete ignoarance of some of the posters here. the words bigots, racists are not far from the truth here. The reality is that America like most countries are no longer all white entities with colored people cleaning their homes.

I came onto this forum to look up advise on US residency for when i graduate next year. I am a final year dental student at a English dental school which makes me IMG and the rules which apply to all these "third world:laugh:" graduates applies to me. For me to practice in USA i would have to do a further 2yrs of training which is a my waste of time - i can tell you in no uncertain terms that the standard of education that i have recieved outside the US is not inferior to that recieved here. I have a BSc, MA and BDS(shortly).

I dont care about the color of your skin or where your from. What I do care about is the quality of the education and skills taught where you went to school. I do resent somewhat the fact that many foreign dentists go to school 2 - 3 years less then we do (no matter how you add it up this equates to being less educated) and have a lot less debt then most of us educated here in the U.S.. But again the biggest problem I have is the quality and depth of training. Based on the experiences that I have had with most of the students in the international program at my old dental school that quality is lacking.

I would also infer that the reason that US medical and dental students spend longer studying is because they do not have the subject specialization at age 18 that many countries including the "third world:laugh:" have. Hence in Europe you can be a fully qualified medic by the age of 23. Thus what an American pre med learns in the first years of university, UK students started learning at A level science (age 16-18) and this system goes for these "third world" countries too.


I dont care about the color of your skin or where your from.
:laugh:👍:laugh:

Some how i', sure if these IMG were all "preppy middle class English white speaking" you would not have a problem with them. Governments have immigrants for one simple reason the people in the country are not doing the jobs hence they have to get some in, simply outsourcing.

Do not be fooled that by making IMG study for another 2 years implies that they are any less skilled than their American counterparts it an economically sound process and it serves as a tool slow uptake of positions by IMG, allowing US educated graduates of the same calibre to get first dibbs on jobs.


Look at medicine. In my field, psychiatry, I was the ONLY white, American-born psychiatrist in two county CMH offices, and the only American male in the hospital where I practiced. In Michigan, even in the rural areas, most psychiatrists are Indian, East Asian, or Middle Eastern. Seeing a foreign-born dentist is one thing, but if you have a serious mental disorder, do you want a psychiatrist who has difficulty speaking and understanding your primary language? Do you want a psychiatrist who views your Western culture as weak and pathetic?

My point is not to be racist, but to point out that health care in general is being overrun by foreign grads. Medicine, pharmacy, dentistry, podiatry, and even PT is largely international, mostly Asian, ME, and Indian. What's that say about our health care system? What's that say about our college students?
This is horrendous, seriously read what u said, you were the only white american - so does that mean all the other non white american born students don't count. So to be american means to be white - i think you need to educate the rest of the nation on this fact.

So i am to assume that if i ever decided to practice dentisty in america, being a black international graduate, i am too find the slums with the poorest black people and open a practice there.😴😴 Give me a break, but then again as i can speak fluent english maybe you may find it okay if i upgrade to the inner city ghettos:laugh:
 
It's really scary and sad to see how many people here that are or will become a Dentist in USA think.

We , Oral health professionals are supposed to have high moral standards and be a good example in our society , all I see in this thread is people full of arrogance , greed and intolerance .

very sad...🙁
 
If we leave these unserved, or underserved areas sit and fester long enough -- someone who is not a dentist may band-aid the situation.

Personally, I think this is why dentists need to keep in control and do what we can to properly (not cheap temporary, substandard band-aid) get patients served.

Dentistry as a field is what it is, because state dental associations, ADA, etc keep dentists making decisions for dental care.

Let's work together and keep it this way -- patients will be best served when dentists are calling the shots for care in dentistry.
🙂
 
Hello,

I just got back from the Amer Dental Education Assoc(ADEA) where CODA was, and from doing a site visit for CODA.....

The ADA and CODA HAVE NOT accrediated any international school. Some have sought info, but none have applied.

California has done they own thing and it will apply only for their state.

Each state has their own rules. Each has policy on international grads.... best to check with the state boards.
 
This is my first visit to this forum and i am in complete shock at the complete ignoarance of some of the posters here. the words bigots, racists are not far from the truth here. The reality is that America like most countries are no longer all white entities with colored people cleaning their homes.

I came onto this forum to look up advise on US residency for when i graduate next year. I am a final year dental student at a English dental school which makes me IMG and the rules which apply to all these "third world:laugh:" graduates applies to me. For me to practice in USA i would have to do a further 2yrs of training which is a my waste of time - i can tell you in no uncertain terms that the standard of education that i have recieved outside the US is not inferior to that recieved here. I have a BSc, MA and BDS(shortly).



I would also infer that the reason that US medical and dental students spend longer studying is because they do not have the subject specialization at age 18 that many countries including the "third world:laugh:" have. Hence in Europe you can be a fully qualified medic by the age of 23. Thus what an American pre med learns in the first years of university, UK students started learning at A level science (age 16-18) and this system goes for these "third world" countries too.


:laugh:👍:laugh:

Some how i', sure if these IMG were all "preppy middle class English white speaking" you would not have a problem with them. Governments have immigrants for one simple reason the people in the country are not doing the jobs hence they have to get some in, simply outsourcing.

Their are no shortages of people from here who want to be dentists. Several states have passed laws restricting the rights of Illegal immigrants which has caused a mass exodus from those states. Yet somehow the lawns are still getting mowed and ditches dug.

Do not be fooled that by making IMG study for another 2 years implies that they are any less skilled than their American counterparts it an economically sound process and it serves as a tool slow uptake of positions by IMG, allowing US educated graduates of the same calibre to get first dibbs on jobs.

Im ok with that because THIS IS OUR COUNTRY!! We have the right to control who comes here. Im sick of foreigners trying to dictate to us how things should be done here. It seems to me that so many people in the world think that they have some stake in this country and therefore should have some say here. So many from other countries act and speak as if they have a right to be here. Many have strong opinions about our politics and elected leaders. Our general reaction is to try to be politically correct, to try not to offend anyone while they are taking advantage of us even though they are clearly not so concerned about offering us the same considerations. This should already be very clear to everyone but it stands to be repeated. If you are not a citizen of this country, you do not have the right to be here and your opinions mean very little.

On a side note, Im also sick of being so involved in other countries politics, giving money to other countries and so on. I really dont think we need to have troops in Germany or Japan or anywhere else for that matter. Lets mind our own business and leave everyone else to do the same.

Finally, my perception of foreign trained dentists is based on physical experience being treated by several, experiences with those in 2 year international programs and also the words that have come out of their mouths where they have told me that training in their home countries was inferior to here. Now, I'm not saying that it is that way in every foreign country not did I say that in my previous posts. But we do and should have the right to say that everyone who comes here should do a two year program. It just makes sense to make sure that everyone meets a minimum level of competency before they are unleashed on the public. At the end of the day the differences in quality of education are often related to funding. A school with considerably more funding will usually be able to provide a better education then a school with considerably less.
 
Im ok with that because THIS IS OUR COUNTRY!! We have the right to control who comes here. Im sick of foreigners trying to dictate to us how things should be done here.

Unfortunately, history repeats itself. 🙂
 
More power to them. Dentistry should stress ethics and it is unethical to neglect available treatment to people. DentiCal isn't enticing enough to CA dentists. I disagree that this is a matter of job security.

A similar case in Alaska I know of was Alaska granting licenses to workers for Inuit populations to go to New Zealand and get 18 months of training to pull teeth. ADA sued the state and really embarrassed themselves because there was no alternative for care to those areas, except the bi annual visit from IHS workers. Alaska won and I don't think Alaskan dentists are struggling.
 
A similar case in Alaska I know of was Alaska granting licenses to workers for Inuit populations to go to New Zealand and get 18 months of training to pull teeth.

I'm pretty sure it was a 3-year dental hygiene and therapy course (aka advance dental hygiene practitioner).
 
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