Michigan vs USC

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

LizardKing

Veteran Member
7+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
20+ Year Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2001
Messages
549
Reaction score
1
I am deciding between these two schools, and would like your perspective on this.

Location: USC nudges out Michigan because of LA's activities, weather, and diversity. Ann Arbor isn't that bad though.

Residency Placement: I would prefer to match in CA, and USC would be helpful in this respect. But I think Michigan would put me in a better position to match for highly competitive residencies regardless of whether these are in CA or New York, for example.

Teaching: I've heard Michigan's is tops.

Curriculum: P/F first year at USC, grades at Michigan all throughout.

Campus: Michigan has a nice campus, USC med has none.

Any other thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Members don't see this ad.
 
I can't compare Michigan to USC for you since I don't know much about USC, but I can tell you about Michigan if it helps. I am a california resident so the only bad thing about michigan for me has been the weather and being far from california. Other than that I love the school. Also it is not grades all throughout. The first year is pass/fail.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
LizardKing:

I doubt that going to USC would give you an edge over UMich in terms of matching to California residencies. I can't see how going to UMich would put you at a disadvantage for residency placement anywhere.

If you think you can hack the weather and the intensity of UMich (they basically have exams or quizzes every week, which destroys the weekend), then I would say go to UMich.

Cheers
-a.
 
as far as i know, first year at michigan is p/f. and as someone headed to ann arbor in august, i vote for michigan. : ) go blue!!
 
And as I'm sitting here studying for boards am I ever glad I had all those quizes :wink:
 
Straight from the Trojan's mouth...

Your info is inaccurate. USC is P/F without honors the first 2 years. Last I heard we are considering removing the honors in the clincal years to coincide with the first 2 years.

Maybe you forgot since your interview, but we do have a campus at SC--it's just not all that nice. It's not like we're one building in the middle of East LA.

I don't know anything about Michigan, but I can tell you that in the 4th year class that just graduated, everyone matched in CA except for the few out-of-staters that wanted to go back. Then again, USC is mostly CA residents. Are you non-Cali? I don't know what affect that might have on getting a residency here if you don't attend school in this state.

I can't make a fair assessment on the teaching because we're in transition. We're the guinea pigs for the switch from traditional to organ-systems-based curriculum. There are a lot of rough edges still in the administrative department. Some lecturers are awesome and some really suck. It's going to be like that everywhere.

That said, SC's huge selling point has to be County General. We have an Introduction to Clincal Medicine course the first 2 years where we learn history and physical and then practice on patients at County. I'm sure Michigan probably has something comperable, but the patient interaction at LAC is incredible. For the most part, they are so cooperative and so willing to help you learn--all because of the white coat. I've heard from upperclassmen that rotating med students have wide latitude in patient care, plus the degree of pathology is just amazing. Oh, and I think you're basically forced to learn "surival medical Spanish" in a trial-by-fire method. Sounds bad, but it will be a plus in the long-run.

Don't let cost deter you, but I think we're top 5 in the nation. I'll be about $160K in debt at the end of it, and so will about 75% of my classmates (total guesstimate).

As for competitiveness, I'm still not convinced how much the name of your school matters when it comes to residencies. It's your own performance on Step I as well as your letters that will dictate most of that.

Lastly, location. Yes, being in So Cal is nice, but I think it's overrated. Then again, maybe I take it for granted. I've been here my whole life...

Good luck in your decision.
 
USC all the way.
 
Michigan has an introduction to the patient class that has been expanding rapidly. In fact they added so many experiences for us the second year that we asked them to cut it back, it was getting too much. (which they did) We do have grades the second year and on but I wouldn't call it competetive. Honestly while I got mostly 80's on the first year exams my scores were mostly in the high 90's for the second year because of the grades so I think it helped me study more. I need that little bit of pressure to push me through but if you're more self motivated it should be nice to not have any kind of pressure on you.

I think the white coat thing is true everywhere. I remember being a volunteer in the ER where I wore a coat as part of my uniform and the patients would always mistake me for a doctor and start telling me about thier problems.
 
Thanks DodgeThis and others who posted. I actually know a great deal about USC Med because I've been in their 8-yr B/MD program since freshman year of college. I've worked, done research, and even took classes there already. I do think their campus is extremely limited. Housing on campus is not a good option, and there aren't any recreational facilities. On top of that, a lot of students seem frustrated with the lack of support from the faculty there.

Nonetheless, like you said, nothing beats SC's clinical. But for some reason, it still doesn't seem like residency directors view SC's training as highly as they do Michigan's. I don't think that should be the case, but that's what it seems to be.

I'm not a CA resident either so I'm not sure of what my chances of getting a CA residency are from Michigan or from USC. I guess I would switch over to CA residency if I went to USC so that would help. But I'm leaning toward Michigan because I can't imagine how going there would be a drawback.

Thanks again everyone, you've been real helpful.

•••quote:•••Originally posted by Dodge This:
•Straight from the Trojan's mouth...

Your info is inaccurate. USC is P/F without honors the first 2 years. Last I heard we are considering removing the honors in the clincal years to coincide with the first 2 years.

Maybe you forgot since your interview, but we do have a campus at SC--it's just not all that nice. It's not like we're one building in the middle of East LA.

I don't know anything about Michigan, but I can tell you that in the 4th year class that just graduated, everyone matched in CA except for the few out-of-staters that wanted to go back. Then again, USC is mostly CA residents. Are you non-Cali? I don't know what affect that might have on getting a residency here if you don't attend school in this state.

I can't make a fair assessment on the teaching because we're in transition. We're the guinea pigs for the switch from traditional to organ-systems-based curriculum. There are a lot of rough edges still in the administrative department. Some lecturers are awesome and some really suck. It's going to be like that everywhere.

That said, SC's huge selling point has to be County General. We have an Introduction to Clincal Medicine course the first 2 years where we learn history and physical and then practice on patients at County. I'm sure Michigan probably has something comperable, but the patient interaction at LAC is incredible. For the most part, they are so cooperative and so willing to help you learn--all because of the white coat. I've heard from upperclassmen that rotating med students have wide latitude in patient care, plus the degree of pathology is just amazing. Oh, and I think you're basically forced to learn "surival medical Spanish" in a trial-by-fire method. Sounds bad, but it will be a plus in the long-run.

Don't let cost deter you, but I think we're top 5 in the nation. I'll be about $160K in debt at the end of it, and so will about 75% of my classmates (total guesstimate).

As for competitiveness, I'm still not convinced how much the name of your school matters when it comes to residencies. It's your own performance on Step I as well as your letters that will dictate most of that.

Lastly, location. Yes, being in So Cal is nice, but I think it's overrated. Then again, maybe I take it for granted. I've been here my whole life...

Good luck in your decision.•••••
 
•••quote:•••Originally posted by LizardKing:
•On top of that, a lot of students seem frustrated with the lack of support from the faculty there.
•••••Did you talk to current first years about this? I feel we've had nothing but the utmost support from the faculty. I know there is frustration because of the new curriculum, but the faculty have been working with us to meet our needs.

Looks like your biggest decision is lifestyle versus reputation. Very tough call...
 
Hi - I don't know if this is already too late, but I have some input about Michigan (I just took USMLE Step 1 last week and haven't visited this board in over a year)...

Michigan is P/F the first year, with 75% being a pass. Second year is honors/HP/P/F, with 94% being honors, 86% being high pass. The curriculum is currently still lecture-based, with some small groups. Next year's entering class (Class of 2007) will be started on a new curriculum, the details of which are still being worked out but the Dean told us that third year would most likely start in April (vs. July) to allow for more elective time. Our pre-clinical course Introduction to the Patient is well-run although they're still trying to work out the kinks in that system. This year, the scheduling was so bad that some of my classmates had to do an SPI (Standardized Patient Instructor) abdominal exam and a full practice H&P the same week as a final exam... Each student is also assigned a resident or faculty member for the year where you must perform five H&P's, present them, and write them up. The amount of clinical skills teaching is highly variable, though. Some instructors went through each step of the H&P in detail each time, others just sent the student in alone with a patient to fend for himself. Overall, however, I feel Michigan does an adequate job of teaching the very basic clinical skills. Besides, you'll probably learn more clinical medicine your first year on the wards than the entire first two years of med school.

As for the "name" factor, we've been told time and time again that having "Michigan" on your transcript will open doors for you when it comes time to apply for residency. While I think this is true to some extent, I'm certainly not going to bank on it. However, Michigan is a strong school that is only getting stronger. New buildings for medical education and research are going up left and right (although we're losing more and more parking space as it is...) and if the USNews rankings are any crude measure, we've steadily climbed the chart for the past few years.

In response to Dodge This, I can't imagine anyone wanting to leave SoCal :) I've been in the Northeast and Midwest my entire life and would kill to get a chance to do a residency in CA :)
 
I think the vast majority of Southern Californians take Southern CA weather for granted.
 
Top