Military Medicine and Non-Combatant Status

[back2skewl]

Hello! I will be applying to medical school this summer and I'm really interested in both USU and the HPSP. Seeing the work of the Navy responding to the coronavirus has even furthered my interest. I see the military as a way of serving my country and the world. I am especially eager to be a part of humanitarian missions overseas. That being said, I want to know if I would be compromising my beliefs/values as I join. From what I understand, military doctors are non-combatants. I feel uncomfortable with the idea that I would be armed, or that I would ever have to shoot another person. Frankly, I consider myself a pacifist. The reason military medicine is appealing though is that physicians are the ones who treat the injured and dying in times of war, regardless of nationality. Becoming a physician for the military would work towards resolving the issues I have with war leading to senseless death. Sorry for the long-winded post. But I'm just hoping to better understand how military doctors relate to their colleagues and whether or not you think this would be a good fit for me.

TLDR; Am I crazy for wanting to join the military as a pacifist physician?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[armytrainingsir]

TLDR; Am I crazy for wanting to join the military as a pacifist physician?

IMO, yes.

But I’m sure others will be along soon that disagree with me.

 

[DocSurgeon]

There are better options out there for you to do humanitarian work.

 

[DrMetal]

TLDR; Am I crazy for wanting to join the military as a pacifist physician?

Yes, you are absolutely crazy. If you were sitting in front of me, I'd admit you to a psych ward.

Although it doesn't happen often, physicians are armed in combat to protect themselves, their colleagues, and their patients. If you were in Fallujah circa 2004, you'd be expected to shoot to kill the enemy if they blew up your convoy or tried to overrun your aid station.

Don't join if you're a pacifist. There's a reason why it's called the 'Armed Forces'. There's plenty of other ways to do humanitarian work.

 

[CABG patch]

The line already barely tolerates doctors. I can't imagine sitting down with a BN commander and telling them I'm not carrying a weapon and then having anything resembling a working relationship with them.

 

[TheEarDoc]

Hello! I will be applying to medical school this summer and I'm really interested in both USU and the HPSP. Seeing the work of the Navy responding to the coronavirus has even furthered my interest. I see the military as a way of serving my country and the world. I am especially eager to be a part of humanitarian missions overseas. That being said, I want to know if I would be compromising my beliefs/values as I join. From what I understand, military doctors are non-combatants. I feel uncomfortable with the idea that I would be armed, or that I would ever have to shoot another person. Frankly, I consider myself a pacifist. The reason military medicine is appealing though is that physicians are the ones who treat the injured and dying in times of war, regardless of nationality. Becoming a physician for the military would work towards resolving the issues I have with war leading to senseless death. Sorry for the long-winded post. But I'm just hoping to better understand how military doctors relate to their colleagues and whether or not you think this would be a good fit for me.

TLDR; Am I crazy for wanting to join the military as a pacifist physician?

No the military is not for you.

You will be expected to be a soldier/sailor/airman first and a medical provider second.

You will be expected to know how to use a rifle and pistol. You will be expected to kill the enemy should it come to that. Period.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

The likelihood of you having to shoot someone as a doctor is exceedingly low. However, you will be armed on a boots on ground deployment, and you have to be okay with being armed and using it if necessary. I wouldn’t want to be deployed with someone who wouldn’t shoot back if we were in a firefight. This isn’t Hacksaw Ridge.

 

[deleted480308]

Join doctors without borders. I couldn’t imagine joining a unit that I wouldn’t fight for

 

[militaryPHYS]

There are many options to serve your country and the world without joining the military. i.e. Doctors without Borders, etc.

If you have done your homework on HPSP/USU and still feel this is a viable option for you then I would look in to the Public Health Service. They have a small presence at USUHS (~3-4 per year). Not sure of their numbers for HPSP. Your required payback will typically be serving the underserved areas of the U.S. (Indian Health System, Bureau of prisons) as well as the FDA, NIH, etc.

https://usphs.gov/profession/healthservices/clinicalcare/activities.aspx

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

They have a small presence at USUHS (~3-4 per year).

Last two years there have only been 1. Very competitive to get it but still worth a shot. The PHS student in my class was a PHS pharmacist for years.

 

[HighPriest]

Yeah. Echo everyone else. This is a terrible decision for you. The chances you’re going to have to actually shoot someone are low. If you, the doc, is firing a rifle at the enemy (and it’s not something you actively tried to do) then things have gone terribly wrong.

But, it is still a bad idea for you. I had this same conversation with a Navy student while I was in HPSP. He was also a pacifist. Which is fine, generally speaking. No criticism there. But the SOLE purpose of the United States military is to seek out and destroy the enemies of the United States. Period. Everything else exists in support of that effort, whether you’re an infantryman, marine, like cook, nurse, or cleaning the latrines. You’re just making sure the military is ready and able to go kill people when they need to do it.

If you’re doing a humanitarian mission, the main reason you’re doing it is to earn brownie points with a foreign nation or region so that they don’t look so poorly upon you if, at a later date, you have to blow up one of their neighbors or one of their allies. Period.

Now there are collateral benefits to be sure. And I’m not saying that #2 line item on the list isn’t “so some good for people.” I think it is. I think the faces and boots involved in projects like mission work are primarily concerned with completing the mission, which in the small picture is to do some good and help some people. But the big picture is that the military is a killing machine. All else is secondary.

If the military had to list everything it does in descending order from “would give up without hesitation” to “cannot give up without ceasing to function in current capacity,” “destroying the enemy would be at the bottom of the list.

So, even if you don’t have to actually shoot a man in the face, you have to do some serious mental gymnastics to get around the fact that you’re working for an entity who’s primary goal is to actually shoot men in the face. It’s like being an avid anti-smoking advocate but being ok working for a subsidiary of Phillip Morris that only makes cigarette filters. Yeah, technically you’re making the safest part of the cigarette.

 

[orbitsurgMD]

If you are a committed pacifist, don't join. USUHS and HPSP are meant to supply and support combat elements of the armed forces in their missions. That means anything from Marine Corps battalions to Navy ballistic missile submarine squadrons to attack drone controllers. You will possibly deploy to hostile areas and may required to carry and use arms for your defense and for the defense of your unit. You should be OK with all of that.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Gotta give the OP credit for managing to unify us. Agree with above

 

[militaryPHYS]

The USPHS does not deploy to hostile areas and doesn’t require mental gymnastics around shooting people in the face.

 

[notdeadyet]

agree with all the above. Consider USPHS, which will have many similar programs and benefits of military service. Alternately, become a physician on your own and volunteer for many amazing NGOs that you could choose based on your beliefs and their mission and who would be delighted to have you.

If you are a true pacifist, you shouldn't join the military. It's main mechanism for achieving its sole mission is based on the killing and destruction of others. If you really are a true pacifist, you shouldn't want anything to do with the military regardless of any (very questionable) accommodations they might make for you.

 

[HighPriest]

The USPHS does not deploy to hostile areas and doesn’t require mental gymnastics around shooting people in the face.

-yet-

 

[Mad Jack]

The USPHS does not deploy to hostile areas and doesn’t require mental gymnastics around shooting people in the face.

Was also going to recommend the USPHS CC as an option

-yet-

While they can technically be shifted to the armed services in certain situations, it's not something that would happen short of a major conflict the likes of which we haven't seen in 70 years

 

[HighPriest]

Was also going to recommend the USPHS CC as an option

While they can technically be shifted to the armed services in certain situations, it's not something that would happen short of a major conflict the likes of which we haven't seen in 70 years

 

[numberwunn]

I'm a pacifist too.