Misdemeanor report

[vvvv]

Hello all,
I was convicted twice 2 with class D misdemeanor 2 years ago (shoplifting). I was put on probation but it was expired. I don't want to hide this or anything because I know this will come up on a criminal check. My question is how should I report this to AMCAS? should I report my cases with some explaination or only report the cases? Can anyone give me some ideas how to report? I should wait until the secondary app or interview to explain my cases? I mean not explain but tell them liltle bit from that and the lesson I learned from that.

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[msundi83]

amcas asks for felony convictions. midemeanors are sometimes asked for on secondary apps. report them...don't lie if it is still on your record. many people have gotten in to schools with misdemeanors and as long as you don't have a ton of history with repeat offenses they are often surprisinly understanding depending on what schools you want to get in to.

 

[spicedmanna]

amcas asks for felony convictions. midemeanors are sometimes asked for on secondary apps. report them...don't lie if it is still on your record.

Hahaha... Not any more. Apparently, the word is that AMCAS now asks for misdemeanors, too. Nevertheless, I concur with your advice to report it.

 

[gary5]

Convicted for shoplifting TWICE? Wow, that means that you've probably stolen from stores maybe 20-50 times (when you didn't get caught). I'd choose a different career. Doctors are expected have some moral integrity.

 

[Noeljan]

Convicted for shoplifting TWICE? Wow, that means that you've probably stolen from stores maybe 20-50 times (when you didn't get caught). I'd choose a different career. Doctors are expected have some moral integrity.

How do you know that? Did you do a study? While I agree that repeat offending is far worse than an isolated incident, we don't know the OP's situation. Doctors don't have to be perfect their entire lives. For instance, where I grew up (basically the ghetto) even though no one really had much, my best friend's family was REALLY poor. We are talking she had to wait in the cheese line with her family quite often (no joke) She got caught shoplifting food from the grocery store once because she was hungry. I'm not saying that is what someone should do, but I doubt if she had been born with more food in her house she would have never tried to do that.
Anyways OP we are not lawyers here, but I am sure it would depend on the circumstance.

 

[gary5]

How do you know that? Did you do a study? While I agree that repeat offending is far worse than an isolated incident, we don't know the OP's situation. Doctors don't have to be perfect their entire lives. For instance, where I grew up (basically the ghetto) even though no one really had much, my best friend's family was REALLY poor. We are talking she had to wait in the cheese line with her family quite often (no joke) She got caught shoplifting food from the grocery store once because she was hungry. I'm not saying that is what someone should do, but I doubt if she had been born with more food in her house she would have never tried to do that.
Anyways OP we are not lawyers here, but I am sure it would depend on the circumstance.

Studies have been done on how many times people commit crimes versus how many times they get caught. I think I read once that, for example, for every speeding ticket a person gets, they've actually done so 300 times. So, I rounded down for my 20-50 estimate. Actually, I was thinking 100 times for getting caught twice, but I thought I'd be conservative. Anyway, if the OP was caught when they were 10 years old, that's one thing, but repeatedly stealing from stores during college is not excusable in terms of professional behavior. The OP never said that they were stealing food because they were hungry, so don't make that up.

 

[gotmeds?]

Convicted for shoplifting TWICE? Wow, that means that you've probably stolen from stores maybe 20-50 times (when you didn't get caught). I'd choose a different career. Doctors are expected have some moral integrity.

That's kinda harsh. Maybe it was a rebellious phase or something like that. Unfortunately, two theft convictions may prevent you from getting a medical license. You should check your state laws.

 

[Noeljan]

Studies have been done on how many times people commit crimes versus how many times they get caught. I think I read once that, for example, for every speeding ticket a person gets, they've actually done so 300 times. So, I rounded down for my 20-50 estimate. Actually, I was thinking 100 times for getting caught twice, but I thought I'd be conservative. Anyway, if the OP was caught when they were 10 years old, that's one thing, but repeatedly stealing from stores during college is not excusable in terms of professional behavior. I doubt they were stealing food to eat. Financial aid gives free rides to poor people in college these days, so they're not starving.

First of all, I agree that physicians do have to have professional behavior. Of course. However, I do not think that some mistakes should be held against someone forever. I also don't believe that you can compare shoplifting to speeding, in terms of amount. I also do agree with the repeat offender stuff as I said in my original post. People can make mistakes, but the true test comes after to see what they do about it
Second though, I really think your view of poor people "get free rides" etc. and that it is an advantage. Actually, your view is not alone, as I have heard many misinformed people claim similiar things
let me state it to you...my family is pretty poor compared to most students at secondary education. I believe our family income is in the 20,000 range for what was a family of 5 (now down to 4). I had to take out all loans for school, I got a silly TAP award of like 100 dollars a semester. One semester it was 23 bucks. Yep only 23 bucks!!!! Now, I also had to pay for my own food, rent, books, without help from anyone. I would think this is a disadvantage. Don't make blanket statements about something you have no experience with.

 

[dragonark]

First of all, I agree that physicians do have to have professional behavior. Of course. However, I do not think that some mistakes should be held against someone forever. I also don't believe that you can compare shoplifting to speeding, in terms of amount. I also do agree with the repeat offender stuff as I said in my original post. People can make mistakes, but the true test comes after to see what they do about it
Second though, I really think your view of poor people "get free rides" etc. and that it is an advantage. Actually, your view is not alone, as I have heard many misinformed people claim similiar things
let me state it to you...my family is pretty poor compared to most students at secondary education. I believe our family income is in the 20,000 range for what was a family of 5 (now down to 4). I had to take out all loans for school, I got a silly TAP award of like 100 dollars a semester. One semester it was 23 bucks. Yep only 23 bucks!!!! Now, I also had to pay for my own food, rent, books, without help from anyone. I would think this is a disadvantage. Don't make blanket statements about something you have no experience with.

But...that's what the interweb is all about! Come on...this is the only place where a citation like "I think I remember reading a study" is presented as solid proof! If you try to add accountability to this system, the interwebhypercompuglobalmeganet would explode.

 

[Noeljan]

But...that's what the interweb is all about! Come on...this is the only place where a citation like "I think I remember reading a study" is presented as solid proof! If you try to add accountability to this system, the interwebhypercompuglobalmeganet would explode.

thanks for making me smile.

 

[Cirrus83]

Noeljan, the OP never said they were poor, merely that they were convicted twice for shoplifting.

Also, someone who's college educated can only be so poor. Sure we have to take a lot of loans, but you're never starving, so there's no real justification for shoplifting.

And gary5 has a point, if you've been convicted twice you've definitely shoplifted more than 2 times, so more or less you've done it a lot. In fact, the fact that the OP continued to shoplift even after the first conviction is a pretty big deal.

If you're convicted twice it either means that you shoplifted plenty of times or that you're a horribly crappy thief (in which case you're probably not sharp enough to go to med school anyway).

Yeah maybe the OP just did it for thrills or whatever, but seriously, continuing to do it after already being convicted screams bad judgement and kleptomania.

Oh and being poor isn't really an excuse to shoplift, I remember when I was a kid I'd go around looking for empty soda cans to return for the nickels so I could go buy a comic book or a candy bar, and apparently my ex-roommie used to do the same thing

And you can always figure out some other way to make money, start your own little ebay business, get a part time job, whatever. Being a college student makes it very unlikely that your only possible resort for money is to shoplift. If you were born in some 3rd world country where they didn't have schools for you to go to and you couldn't get a job, then you could make a much better case for having to shoplift.

 

[Noeljan]

Noeljan, the OP never said they were poor, merely that they were convicted twice for shoplifting.

Also, someone who's college educated can only be so poor. Sure we have to take a lot of loans, but you're never starving, so there's no real justification for shoplifting.

And gary5 has a point, if you've been convicted twice you've definitely shoplifted more than 2 times, so more or less you've done it a lot. In fact, the fact that the OP continued to shoplift even after the first conviction is a pretty big deal.

If you're convicted twice it either means that you shoplifted plenty of times or that you're a horribly crappy thief (in which case you're probably not sharp enough to go to med school anyway).

Yeah maybe the OP just did it for thrills or whatever, but seriously, continuing to do it after already being convicted screams bad judgement and kleptomania.

Oh and being poor isn't really an excuse to shoplift, I remember when I was a kid I'd go around looking for empty soda cans to return for the nickels so I could go buy a comic book or a candy bar, and apparently my ex-roommie used to do the same thing

And you can always figure out some other way to make money, start your own little ebay business, get a part time job, whatever. Being a college student makes it very unlikely that your only possible resort for money is to shoplift. If you were born in some 3rd world country where they didn't have schools for you to go to and you couldn't get a job, then you could make a much better case for having to shoplift.

Ok Cirrius I totally agree with your whole post. Maybe it was the more harsh way gary wrote that made me defensive (not that he meant it) but you put it out there a different way.
Oh ps I also did the empty cans things, lol. My friends and I used to have contests to see who could get the most, then we would go to the corner store, return them and buy tons of junk food haha.

 

[vvvv]

Well, thanks for all the comments. I agree that I did stole more than 5 times, but not get over 30-50. There was not a good excuse for stealing instead of greedy. But the second time I was convicted was not really stealing. I and my brother after shopping at Walmart (CA), we took the shopping cart home instead of take all the shopping bags (we didn't have car). Honestly, why I wanted to steal a shopping cart? But walmart security caught us and call the cop. For that reason, we both had to go to court. We explained that we didn't intentionally steal the cart and the judge give us the minimum fine (class D of misdemeanor). I didn't refuse that I was guilty but I am here for advising not for arguing.

Thank you for all the comments. Hope someone can give me an idea what I should report in my application.

 

[lawnboy313]

Well, thanks for all the comments. I agree that I did stole more than 5 times, but not get over 30-50. There was not a good excuse for stealing instead of greedy. But the second time I was convicted was not really stealing. I and my brother after shopping at Walmart (CA), we took the shopping cart home instead of take all the shopping bags (we didn't have car). Honestly, why I wanted to steal a shopping cart? But walmart security caught us and call the cop. For that reason, we both had to go to court. We explained that we didn't intentionally steal the cart and the judge give us the minimum fine (class D of misdemeanor). I didn't refuse that I was guilty but I am here for advising not for arguing.

Thank you for all the comments. Hope someone can give me an idea what I should report in my application.

If you read the AMCAS wording carefully, you don't need to report misdemeanors if you get them expunged. However, expungement is costly and the likelihood of expungement in a repeat offense is low. So, first talk to a lawyer. If expungement doesn't work out, I would definitely put a carefully-worded short explanation of why along with your AMCAS case reports. Good luck--you'll need it.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Also, someone who's college educated can only be so poor.

You've never hung around with history majors then!

 

[Karnage]

Studies have been done on how many times people commit crimes versus how many times they get caught. I think I read once that, for example, for every speeding ticket a person gets, they've actually done so 300 times. So, I rounded down for my 20-50 estimate. Actually, I was thinking 100 times for getting caught twice, but I thought I'd be conservative. Anyway, if the OP was caught when they were 10 years old, that's one thing, but repeatedly stealing from stores during college is not excusable in terms of professional behavior. The OP never said that they were stealing food because they were hungry, so don't make that up.

So what you're saying is that it's safe to assume that every murderer has killed 10-20x the number of people they've been convicted of killing? Interesting.

 

[Tired]

Now, I also had to pay for my own food, rent, books, without help from anyone. I would think this is a disadvantage. Don't make blanket statements about something you have no experience with.

And you did all this without stealing ****, so why don't you just shut up already?

 

[vvvv]

If you read the AMCAS wording carefully, you don't need to report misdemeanors if you get them expunged. However, expungement is costly and the likelihood of expungement in a repeat offense is low. So, first talk to a lawyer. If expungement doesn't work out, I would definitely put a carefully-worded short explanation of why along with your AMCAS case reports. Good luck--you'll need it.

This is what exactly what written in AMCAS

Have you ever been convicted of, or pleaded guilty or no contest to, a Misdemeanor crime, excluding 1) any offense for which you were adjudicated as a juvenile, 2) any convictions which have been expunged or sealed by a court, or 3) any misdemeanor convictions for which any probation has been completed and the case dismissed by the court (in states where applicable)?
You need NOT disclose any instance where you:

• were arrested, but not charged;
• were arrested and charged, but the charges were dropped;
• were arrested and charged, but found not guilty by a judge or jury;
• were arrested and found guilty by a judge or jury, but the conviction was overturned on appeal; or
• received an executive pardon.

DO you think if I expunge them, I can disclose to report them? Do I really have that chance? Appreciate all your help

 

[Bacchus]

Well, thanks for all the comments. I agree that I did stole more than 5 times, but not get over 30-50. There was not a good excuse for stealing instead of greedy. But the second time I was convicted was not really stealing. I and my brother after shopping at Walmart (CA), we took the shopping cart home instead of take all the shopping bags (we didn't have car). Honestly, why I wanted to steal a shopping cart? But walmart security caught us and call the cop. For that reason, we both had to go to court. We explained that we didn't intentionally steal the cart and the judge give us the minimum fine (class D of misdemeanor). I didn't refuse that I was guilty but I am here for advising not for arguing.

Thank you for all the comments. Hope someone can give me an idea what I should report in my application.

I personally think its shows an unfortunate character flaw that medical schools are not going to want to take the risk on. If you said you were convicted twice but stole five times that shows that you don't want all the information to be known. In addition, from my opinion, I don't think you can rectify using the cart to take home bags. You walked to the store didn't you? With drug abuse prevalent, but not out of control, I don't think as an admissions representative I'd want you doing rounds in my hospital where drugs are easily accessible. I'm not saying you would steal controlled substances or that you even use them, but I wouldn't want the risk. I also would prefer going to a physician that has more integrity. Best of luck, I think you'll need it.

 

[Noeljan]

And you did all this without stealing ****, so why don't you just shut up already?

Yes but I wrote that not in response to stealing, but in response to the idea that poor people get everything paid for to go to school
Anyways the shopping cart thing reminds me, the people upstairs from my mom ALWAYS leave a shopping cart in the front lawn. It's really strange, we almost expect it every morning when we wake up.

 

[riceman04]

Convicted for shoplifting TWICE? Wow, that means that you've probably stolen from stores maybe 20-50 times (when you didn't get caught). I'd choose a different career. Doctors are expected have some moral integrity.

So typical of premeds to pass judgement on each other (and on others)

You might think you are only being honest....BELIEVE ME - you have gone far beyond that...to the point where someone might even question your maturity.

 

[lawnboy313]

This is what exactly what written in AMCAS

Have you ever been convicted of, or pleaded guilty or no contest to, a Misdemeanor crime, excluding 1) any offense for which you were adjudicated as a juvenile, 2) any convictions which have been expunged or sealed by a court, or 3) any misdemeanor convictions for which any probation has been completed and the case dismissed by the court (in states where applicable)?
You need NOT disclose any instance where you:

• were arrested, but not charged;
• were arrested and charged, but the charges were dropped;
• were arrested and charged, but found not guilty by a judge or jury;
• were arrested and found guilty by a judge or jury, but the conviction was overturned on appeal; or
• received an executive pardon.

DO you think if I expunge them, I can disclose to report them? Do I really have that chance? Appreciate all your help

I'm confused by "disclose to report them" in your question....to disclose means to report.

As written in the AMCAS question you posted, you do not need to report expunged misdemeanors ("excluding...any convictions which have been expunged or sealed by a court"). So yes, if you expunge them, you do NOT need to report them in your AMCAS application. You can then answer no to this question.

I'd consult a lawyer for verification.

 

[Smpco02]

Most states will let you expunge your "first" offense if you go a year without messing up again. Since you already have been convicted twice, by default, you probably can not get an expungment. Talk to a lawyer or find legal aid services in your area.

 

[alwaysaangel]

The fact that this happened in the past 2 years is pretty bad for you. This isn't something stupid you did when you were 16. You shoplifted - twice - at the age of what like 19 or 20. And the second one being a shopping cart was still stealing - no one's going to buy that it wasn't - I mean when you got home were you planning on turning around and bringing the cart back to the store?

If you cannot find a way to get it expunged, I would recommend getting a job and taking some time off of school so you can separate these misdemeanors from yourself. However you describe them (and greed definitely won't look good) they are far to recent for the adcomms to overlook and you will likely get your file trashed.

Wait awhile and try again in 3 years or so when you're older wise and can genuinely say "I was a kid then, I was stupid."

 

[pguin]

Well, thanks for all the comments. I agree that I did stole more than 5 times, but not get over 30-50. There was not a good excuse for stealing instead of greedy. But the second time I was convicted was not really stealing. I and my brother after shopping at Walmart (CA), we took the shopping cart home instead of take all the shopping bags (we didn't have car). Honestly, why I wanted to steal a shopping cart? But walmart security caught us and call the cop. For that reason, we both had to go to court. We explained that we didn't intentionally steal the cart and the judge give us the minimum fine (class D of misdemeanor). I didn't refuse that I was guilty but I am here for advising not for arguing.

Thank you for all the comments. Hope someone can give me an idea what I should report in my application.

First off, the worst thing is that you were caught robbing a wal-mart...that just shouldn't happen. I didn't even know they had security guards!

Joking aside, you definitely need to report this on your AMCAS and on any secondary application you get. Try to sugar coat it as much as you can - but they're not going to believe the shopping cart story...especially since it was your second time. It will probably keep you from getting into medical school immediately but given some time and a continued clean record you may have a chance in a few years.

Also, I'm not saying this in any derogatory manner and I am unaware of your nationality but you definitely should have a professional proof-read your essays and applications for grammar.

 

[Cirrus83]

First off, the worst thing is that you were caught robbing a wal-mart...that just shouldn't happen. I didn't even know they had security guards!

Actually, I spent some time in court (had to go a couple of different times [thanks partly to the fact that the prosecutor wasn't even always around] to take care of a traffic ticket but it was in a small town so regular criminal cases were also at the same court), and there were quite a few shoplifting cases. And every single last one of the people charged with shoplifting had gotten busted at Walmart. There are definitely other stores in the vicinity too, so it's not like people don't shop elsewhere (this is in the Rochester, NY area), but Walmart seems to be extremely aggressive in terms of going after shoplifters (I mean you know they mean business when they're the ONLY friggin' store with people in court for shoplifting...and a lot of people at that, I must have listened to the judge talk to 10 people about what they were being charged with stealing).

Anyways, I guess my point is that Walmart actually is very merciless in their fight against shrinkage, and it's probably one of the worst places to shoplift.